Help: My First AR15 Rifle

2011Nomad · Jul 5, 2024

Hi guys
Im in scandinavia and we are extremly limited with both rules allowing us to get ar15 as well as there is not much to chose from. But i have found 2 to chose from i just need some feedback review since i barley know nothing about ar15s.
First i stood between DI and Gas Piston.

I have decided DI is just fine as long as i clean it often and dont shoot silenced to often.

Right now it stands between these two:
1: Schmeisser Dynamic vs DD M4 V7 Pro

2: LWRC short piston & HK mr223

First two are same price while other two are same as well to eachother about 1000$ more than first choice.

I can also get some other brands like
Sig sauer, s&w, colt, springfield, radient arms, pof, faxxon, black rain, cmmg and some other.

Thanks for all help

M4orturnate · Jul 5, 2024

Never heard of schmeisser but I'm sure any of those 4 will be fine. You don't need to clean a di gun anymore than a piston. I once put 6000 suppressed rounds in a row without cleaning on a AR-15 to see if it would stop. It never did. I will say the bolt was pretty nasty as well as the fde receiver but it cleaned up easier than I thought it would. It's a great platform and I know at least 3 of your choices are good
Edit to say it took me about 4 months worth of shooting to get that round count and I oiled the bcg every 500-1000 rounds but that was the only maintenance. It was a 14.5" mid length gas gun and still is running great

dms416 · Jul 5, 2024

As someone who started out with Colts in the 90's and 2000's, went to Knights guns, then ran almost exclusively HK 416's for about a decade (even had one up 30k plus rounds), and has come full circle back to ALL DI guns in Hodges, Ridgeline, etc....I say this. The DI is just fine.

But since you're Euro...Of what you have listed, the MR223a3 by far is one the one I would pick (and yes, I was one of the dudes that picked up the AU imported MR223 "pistols" when they hit the US market for stupid high prices).

While I have a few good cherry-picked Daniel Defense and FN/Hodge barrels, I have NEVER had barrel outside of a custom Bartlein or Krieger shoot as good as some of the HK barrels...the MR223a3 in particular.

Another US shooter got this out of his MR223a3:

Here was my first outing:

ut755ln · Jul 5, 2024

M4orturnate said:
You don't need to clean a di gun anymore than a piston.

clean or oil and lube, my piston guns are less gunky but I have never shot any AR to the point of failure.

saddlerocker · Jul 5, 2024

Just run the DI well lubed. I personally wouldn't pay more for piston (more parts and weight)

I am guessing things like Rails/Grips/sights/stock are harder to come by as well?
If so, whatever is setup how you like (mainly the rail if you cannot easily swap parts?)

2011Nomad · Jul 5, 2024

Thanks so far guys
Just to mention DD & Schmeisser are about 3000 usd while hk & Lwrc are 4000us

I would rather take DD or SCM and spend 1000$ on ammo and attachments

2011Nomad · Jul 5, 2024

saddlerocker said:
Just run the DI well lubed. I personally wouldn't pay more for piston (more parts and weight)

I am guessing things like Rails/Grips/sights/stock are harder to come by as well?
If so, whatever is setup how you like (mainly the rail if you cannot easily swap parts?)

Im using brownells mostly but its maybe 1/4 of what you guys over in US can get.
But im fine with that, its all about being creative when you have less parts to choose from

Redlion · Jul 5, 2024

2011Nomad said:
Thanks so far guys
Just to mention DD & Schmeisser are about 3000 usd while hk & Lwrc are 4000us

I would rather take DD or SCM and spend 1000$ on ammo and attachments

Seems you have narrowed down to two. As already stated, I know nothing about Schmeisser AR's, so would lean DD.

saddlerocker · Jul 5, 2024

Looks like the Schmeisser is a 1:9 twist?
The 1:9 twist probably won't shoot 75/77gr stuff.

Barrel is also a consideration.
Do you want chrome lined or not? Stainless?

2011Nomad · Jul 5, 2024

Im surprised you guys dont know schmeisser, they made first ever machine pistol MP40 and STG44

TonyTheTiger · Jul 5, 2024

2011Nomad said:
Hi guys
Im in scandinavia and we are extremly limited with both rules allowing us to get ar15 as well as there is not much to chose from.

Why not buy local?

https://www.asejaosa.fi/index.php?id_category=25&controller=category&id_lang=1

Redlion · Jul 5, 2024

2011Nomad said:
Im surprised you guys dont know schmeisser, they made first ever machine pistol MP40 and STG44

I know that and so do others. Does not mean that they just inherently make a quality AR.

Milf Dots · Jul 5, 2024

My preference is for piston over Di because the objective facts are they run cleaner both suppressed & unsuppressed, and usually only require a quick wipe down of the piston rod assembly. HK, LWRC, Sig, and LMT make great piston guns. PoF for 5.56 nato guns are decent.

LWRCi, LMT, Sig, DD, BCM, Geissele, Colt, are very good Di guns.

If it's "Radian"- they're very good guns. But I'm not familiar with "Radient".

Unless the Schmeisser is actually stamped "Made in Germany", I wouldn't even consider it. Many Schmeisser guns are actually stamped "made in Turkey". I could be wrong but it's possible a Turkish company bought the business name "Schmeisser", which would mean they're not even a German company anymore.

M4orturnate · Jul 5, 2024

ut755ln said:
clean or oil and lube, my piston guns are less gunky but I have never shot any AR to the point of failure.

Clean. I couldn't getine to fail either. Even with light reloads and dirty powders. It just kept chugging along

W54/XM-388 · Jul 5, 2024

I'd get the H&K one if I was in your place.
If you are only going to get 1 and not a whole closet full of them, then the H&K one would be the one I would pick.

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

yes i will be getting only ONE

I watched a video of ‘colinoir’ he said v7 pro is the way to go if you want only one DI gun

ut755ln · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
yes i will be getting only ONE

I watched a video of ‘colinoir’ he said v7 pro is the way to go if you want only one DI gun

As a point of disclosure, he is a lawyer who made a name for himself working for the NRA and appearing on their television channel. He left and now is what I would call a guntube celebrity. While I listen to him about the law, I pay no attention to his gun reviews because he is a paid shill for whatever manufacturer ends up on his channel.

I bought a DD MK18 2010/11 and now have more than 20k rounds through it. Over time I replaced the barrel (I went to 11.5"), I replaced the trigger to a Giessele SSA-E. When I started shooting it suppressed, I replaced the muzzle device to match and ended up needing to put in a heavier buffer weight to slow the action down with the increased back pressure. I think that DD makes a quality rifle.

I own multiple iterations of the HK 223. I have a 416 upper that I bought from a police auction that is far and away my favorite SBR. I have a MR 556 that I had quite a bit of work done to that I had re-barreled to 14.5", adjustable gas block, ect. I have a 3rd that I am going to try and clone the USMC M27 with.

While I don't own one anymore, I had a one off LWRC piston rifle and it was fine. It has now morphed into one of the HK rifles over time after I sold it.

dms416 · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
yes i will be getting only ONE

I watched a video of ‘colinoir’ he said v7 pro is the way to go if you want only one DI gun

If this is where you're at on purchasing...it no longer matters what you select.

The only thing DD does that is still relevant are moderately affordable CHF barrels that are somewhat reasonably gassed (at least in 14.5/16" middy). At one time they could boast that their rails were some of the industry front-runners...unless you're a cloner trying to get your block 2 or Mk18 game on.

Short of that the only good thing DD does is those fucking awful grips and stocks that show me which people at the range have more money than sense and probably make purchases off of internet talking heads.

And if I'm being honest, there's only a few types of LWRC piston gun owners in 2024
1 - Those that are still lost in the piston > DI debate but are too cheap or stubborn to go HK
2 - Those who were #1 but are just going to ride it out
3 - Those who turn to folks like #1 for advice and have to get the most bougie shit (before DD became the go-to) and buy an LWRC

And not to play favorites of all 4x options....they're all to damn much money!

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

so far im getting a vibe that most of you vote for hk and it is indeed a good rifle and the one im most familiar with but feels kinda bulky for ipsc

dms416 · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
so far im getting a vibe that most of you vote for hk and it is indeed a good rifle and the one im most familiar with but feels kinda bulky for ipsc

If you're in it to win IPSC, you're in the wrong place. And you're probably not going to be making a living winning IPSC.
Take that and the whole "DI vs Piston" nonsense out of the equation.

Yeah, the HK is inherently bulky, has proprietary parts, a stiffer recoil impulse (though later itterations like the A3/A5 are better than the earlier 416s), and they cost more. But it's a blaster that will shoot pretty much EVERYTHING well (or as well as said cartridge cans shoot), require only rudimentary service on your part, and likely last longer than the average person's interest in said firearm.

smoothy8500 · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
the one im most familiar with but feels kinda bulky for ipsc

So what is everyone else using for IPSC? Maybe get their opinion at the next match since what is available to you is limited.

TheHorta · Jul 6, 2024

In this day and age, I would not buy a 1/9 twist unless it was just for plinking/training with 55-62gr ammo.

Aside from that, any of those should serve you well.

Curious as to what hoops you had to jump through to be able to buy such dreadful assault weapons of mass destruction? Can you keep them at home? What caveats are there to ownership?

TonyTheTiger · Jul 6, 2024

smoothy8500 said:
So what is everyone else using for IPSC? Maybe get their opinion at the next match since what is available to you is limited.

JP.

Coffee_and_Pipes · Jul 6, 2024

How interested are you in tinkering and changing things? I know you mentioned spending less money in order to be able to add attachments. Does that mean optics/lights/lasers, or do you mean changing out parts (i.e. trigger, rail, stock, etc.)?

In the U.S., buying a rifle that is closer to (U.S. armed forces) mil spec means you will have an easier time finding replacement/upgrade parts. I don’t know what that market looks like for you because of our export regulations and Scandinavian gun laws, but that might be the path to go if you feel the need to change things out on a regular basis.

If you’re not compelled to mess with things, the HK seems like to way to go. You won’t find as many aftermarket parts for it, but it has a reputation for being a robust gun, and your Teutonic neighbors might look favorably on you and offer rifle options that we don’t have in the States.

If I had HK money, I would buy an HK rifle.

BCP · Jul 6, 2024

I think the idea is that if you can only have one AR and you're in Europe then HK is an obvious choice if you can afford it. Also you might be able to get an HK MR223 configuration that we cannot.

That DDefense one is their 3gun rifle so its probably closer to what you're looking for. Pretty sure it's 18" rifle gas, muzzle brake, 15" handguard, geissele 3gun trigger. But it's not an HK either.

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

TheHorta said:
In this day and age, I would not buy a 1/9 twist unless it was just for plinking/training with 55-62gr ammo.

Aside from that, any of those should serve you well.

Curious as to what hoops you had to jump through to be able to buy such dreadful assault weapons of mass destruction? Can you keep them at home? What caveats are there to ownership?

haha you are on to something
First you have to be a member of military/ipsc club for more than 2 years than you have to participate on at least 10 organized trainings and at least 10 level 3 competition 24months. And than we wait for about 6month for approvement from police.

I feel this is ok to make sure not just anyone can get an AR, but yea we can keep this at our home.

Just to get back OT
I forgot to mention i have also considered european rifle so its easier to get parts for it rather than usa since the dollar is strong these days and is very expensive for us to buy from us. The DD rifle cost now 3500usd

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

BCP said:
That DDefense one is their 3gun rifle so its probably closer to what you're looking for. Pretty sure it's 18" rifle gas, muzzle brake, 15" handguard, geissele 3gun trigger. But it's not an HK either.

Iv heard about this 3gun
What does that mean?

And yes i do agreed that going for european rifle might be a good idea regarding parts and accesories

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

Coffee_and_Pipes said:
How interested are you in tinkering and changing things? I know you mentioned spending less money in order to be able to add attachments. Does that mean optics/lights/lasers, or do you mean changing out parts (i.e. trigger, rail, stock, etc.)?

In the U.S., buying a rifle that is closer to (U.S. armed forces) mil spec means you will have an easier time finding replacement/upgrade parts. I don’t know what that market looks like for you because of our export regulations and Scandinavian gun laws, but that might be the path to go if you feel the need to change things out on a regular basis.

If you’re not compelled to mess with things, the HK seems like to way to go. You won’t find as many aftermarket parts for it, but it has a reputation for being a robust gun, and your Teutonic neighbors might look favorably on you and offer rifle options that we don’t have in the States.

If I had HK money, I would buy an HK rifle.

Thank you for great reply sir
Im not into changing to much internals mainly just attachments like supressor, light, sight, grip handle and stuff

TheHorta · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
I feel this is ok to make sure not just anyone can get an AR, but yea we can keep this at our home.

We are definitely on opposite ends of the spectrum on this particular issue…

2011Nomad · Jul 6, 2024

TheHorta said:
We are definitely on opposite ends of the spectrum on this particular issue…

Haha God bless america right?

Coffee_and_Pipes · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
Just to get back OT
I forgot to mention i have also considered european rifle so its easier to get parts for it rather than usa since the dollar is strong these days and is very expensive for us to buy from us. The DD rifle cost now 3500usd

Who know what the future holds, but at this point in time, I couldn’t encourage anyone to spend $3,500 on a Daniel Defense AR-15.

BCP · Jul 6, 2024

3500 for a DD is too much, I'd get the HK if it's similarly priced, especially if you can get the legit quad rail and 14" barrel etc. Here in the USA they are both about 2500ish.

BCP · Jul 6, 2024

2011Nomad said:
Iv heard about this 3gun
What does that mean?

And yes i do agreed that going for european rifle might be a good idea regarding parts and accesories

IPSC type shooting with a carbine, pistol and shotgun.

2011Nomad · Aug 24, 2024

Anyone here that got POF Renegade + ?

How reliable is that thing? Any weakness?
Really like the look of that and it is piston, pluss the roller on the bolt seems clever

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