New to PRS and looking into 2 specific brands of actions for a 6mm dasher build. What are the thoughts and opinions of you folks on the Terminus Zeus vs Impact Precision 737R actions? Thanks.
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If you're looking for reliability in adverse conditions I'm not sure anyone would recommend something over the Impact in the R700 pattern family of custom actions. Though to clarify I think there are other actions AS reliable as an Impact.Is the terminus as reliable in adverse conditions, and is it harder to lift bolt after firing?
Does CRF really gain anything in practical reliability though if it's still within the R700 pattern custom footprint? Unless he's going to be hunting cape buffalo with the 6 Dasher I'm not sure CRF is any benefit.Both are pushfeeds
It was just the same joke I’ve always made.Does CRF really gain anything in practical reliability though if it's still within the R700 pattern custom footprint? Unless he's going to be hunting cape buffalo with the 6 Dasher I'm not sure CRF is any benefit.
Is a mercury basically a ford? Is a Honda basically an Acura? I’m mean, there’s Impact and then there’s some other stuff that’s not as good is what I’m saying.what about the Lone Peak Fuzion? Is is basically the Impact?
It was just the same joke I’ve always made.
But yes, I would expect a control round feed to work better for the shorter dasher case than pushed.
But really it’s spring ejection in combination with the extractor that can allow the shorter case to rotate prematurely and release inside the action where as manual ejection won’t rotate the case out from under the extractor until the end of the bolt travel.
What does the Impact do better than LP unless he's really into trigger hangers or wants a 75 degree bolt? I went with a Fuzion instead of an Impact for my latest build because everything I read indicated they're nearly identical. With the LP allegedly having slightly nicer bolt feel.Is a mercury basically a ford? Is a Honda basically an Acura? I’m mean, there’s Impact and then there’s some other stuff that’s not as good is what I’m saying.
Probably nothing. But there’s something to be said for using the most common action in the PRS…wether it’s the customer support, the fact that every problem you might encounter has already been solved, the total ubiquity of spare parts and extra bits and bobs at every match in case something does break, endless support from manufacturers of every accessory part, the fact that Tate himself is at a handful of matches every year ready to help. So, maybe the tenon print is the same, maybe the bolt pattern is the same, but it’s not the same and when you over pressure a load and break your firing pin, and the squad asks what action you are using, when you say Lone Peak, they are all going to be thinking, “wouldn’t have happened if you had an Impact”.What does the Impact do better than LP unless he's really into trigger hangers or wants a 75 degree bolt? I went with a Fuzion instead of an Impact for my latest build because everything I read indicated they're nearly identical. With the LP allegedly having slightly nicer bolt feel.
I get the vibes based angle but can't get over the fact that almost everyone who owns both (and have posted about it) prefer the LP Fuzion. Also it was years ago but there's a thread on here where @MikeRTacOps was saying he preferred the LP over the Impacts. Not sure if that's changed in the interim time though, or why he said it in the first place but I'd love to know. I'll probably grab an Impact when I build a .223 just to try it but that's what caused me to go with the LP first.So, maybe the tenon print is the same, maybe the bolt pattern is the same, but it’s not the same and when you over pressure a load and break your firing pin, and the squad asks what action you are using, when you say Lone Peak, they are all going to be thinking, “wouldn’t have happened if you had an Impact”.
Mike makes a different product designed for a very different purpose than PRS. I don’t doubt he could turn any action into a rifle worthy of his price-point. I also don’t think there’s a functional difference between a 737r and a Fuzion. I have a combined 30000 rounds on three different Impacts and at this point the bolts on all of them feel like they are falling open and closed. I haven’t spent enough time with a well broken in Fuzion to compare how they feel. My criteria for an action include: 2 lug, push feed, r700 footprint, integral rail and lug (no fasteners on the lug or rail), immediate availability and customer support, and total pre-fit availability for barrels….and that’s pretty much it. I’m sure the Zuess is a fine action too and I’d own one for curiosities sake if I owned rifles to satisfy my curiosity. At this point though, I don’t and the Zuess fails on my criteria above.I get the vibes based angle but can't get over the fact that almost everyone who owns both (and have posted about it) prefer the LP Fuzion. Also it was years ago but there's a thread on here where @MikeRTacOps was saying he preferred the LP over the Impacts. Not sure if that's changed in the interim time though, or why he said it in the first place I'd love to know. I'll probably grab an Impact when I build a .223 just to try it but that's what caused me to go with the LP first.
Yeah. The shorter cases can be knocked free from extractor, prematurely, with a spring loaded plunger style ejector. 1 fix is decreasing the spring rate, but thats a bandaid that can cause issues the other way. Mechanical ejector are best for br based cartridges.Truth
Wasn’t trying to lecture dood.“Dood” and “upon” and you’re lecturing us?
That was because Impact didn't suck his balls and he cried about it like a little baby. It had nothing to do with the quality of the action.I get the vibes based angle but can't get over the fact that almost everyone who owns both (and have posted about it) prefer the LP Fuzion. Also it was years ago but there's a thread on here where @MikeRTacOps was saying he preferred the LP over the Impacts. Not sure if that's changed in the interim time though, or why he said it in the first place but I'd love to know. I'll probably grab an Impact when I build a .223 just to try it but that's what caused me to go with the LP first.
I’ve only ran 1 CDG, but at its price point it’s amazing. The only thing I didn’t like was of the 3 at the last match I RO’d they were the only action ejecting forward of the firing line in tall grass and losing majority of the brass.I have owned both. Sold the Terminus. It was a rougher action and took more force to run the bolt.
If buying new today, Impact, Lone Peak or the new ARC CDG would be my choice. And honestly, for $900, the ARC action is very hard to beat.
Well, Zuess is funnier to read to me. Especially when I’m up on my high whores about how much better Impacts are than any three lug action.Wasn’t trying to lecture dood.
Dood is simply funnier to read. To me, anyway.
However, one meaning of “upon” is, uh, on. It’s more formal, and, oh, my butler just informed me my car is waiting…ta ta!
Lol this whole paragraph pretty funny man! High whores < snort giggle >Well, Zuess is funnier to read to me. Especially when I’m up on my high whores about how much better Impacts are than any three lug action.
Just imagine the line delivered with a posh British accent…I do and it’s fun.So, I guess technically, you aren’t wrong. It just sounds odd.
That was because Impact didn't suck his balls and he cried about it like a little baby. It had nothing to do with the quality of the action.
Impact still makes up more actions than all others combined for registered shooters.
There are guys who like every action out there for different reasons. Only real way to know is to get out and try them all.
Define shooters. Registered shooters by and by shoot way more rounds than non competitors.In all fairness, registered PRS shooters make up a very, very small percentage of shooters.
There are far more people that play dungeons and dragons at a competitive level than there is PRS shooters.
The fact that Impact makes up a large percentage of actions in PRS is almost meaningless.
Define shooters. Registered shooters by and by shoot way more rounds than non competitors.
So while they may be a smaller percentage of shooters...they are shooting the majority of actual rounds downrange.
The people putting the most rounds down range choose impact and it's not even close.
The Impact isn't anything special. It's another push feed R700 in a sea of push feed R700's.
It's popularity in PRS has more to do with the cliquish nature and follow the herd mentality of PRS more so than anything else.
Don't get me wrong, it's not that I don't think they are great actions nor would I ever fault someone for buying one.
But there also isn't any major reason to choose Impact over LP, Kelbly, Zermatt, ARC, BAT, Defiance and a plethora of other action makers. A bunch of jersey shooters using them certainly is not a strong argument, unless you want to just be part of the PRS herd.
That's kinda not true.
The impact is the successor to the Surgeon 591, which dominated before it. You had places like GAP that also pushed defiance since they would private label an action for you but Surgeon was the GOLD standard for hard use actions. Impact has alot of similar features, you could almost call it a evolution of that action.
Actions like defiance at the time were so tight, once they got dust/dirt in them, they would bind up. You also had the issue with trigger timing, which the hangers solved so you no longer needed a gunsmith to time the trigger to the action. Also none of them were pre-fit capable. It wasn't until many years after other guys were doing it and taking market share, they started releasing prefit action. And their legacy actions are still not prefit capable. For comparison, Surgeons from 15-20 years ago are technically prefit capable, thats how well consistent they were machined.
Kelbly has been around forever, and no one cares about them. BAT makes good actions but are super tight (they came out with a PRS type action recently. I shot a match with a guy that had the non integral rail and it was loose as shit which was funny)
ARC has made a bunch of shitty actions before finally getting it right with the CDG. The mausingfield was a cool design but its not really for PRS type shooting. The nucleus was a turd so 5 times a charm.
Yes you can run any action, including a remington 700, savage, howa or what the fuck ever.
In a sport where guns are run hard and fast, out in the elements with dust, dirt, mud, snow and rain getting in the action; Impact dominates the field and its not even close. It has nothing to do with cliques and everything to do with them working. They just work, all the time. I have had tikkas and a nuke bind up shooting dusty matches but the impact doesn't give a fuck.... it just keeps running.
You can win with anything but for people who spend their own money, they overwhelmingly pick that action. I am sure other actions will take market share over time, but today that is why there are so many impacts and why people like them. They just work. You can abuse the shit out of them and they just keep going.
You said the impact isn't anything special. Over the last 10 years or so, I explained why it dominated and still dominates today. I also said its likely other actions will take more market share over time, as the competition has caught up. But they aren't doing anything new that is better than impact, the way impact did it better than everyone and propelled them forward. The opinion of the majority of match shooters still seem to think they are either the best or equal to the best.
It really is the Indian and not the arrow….but some people are way to dense to ever understand that conceptThere was a lot of hype around the release of the Impact. At the time of its release, Impact wasn't really doing anything that really set itself apart from the competition in a tangible sense, but aligning with certain members of the PRS crowd helped to sky rocket it's popularity.
It's one of many well executed push feed R700s, and a nice update on the Surgeon 591. But it wasn't ground breaking or a step change in any real meaningful way. Lone Peak Fuzion came out around a similar time as the Impact, with very similar features. And similar/same features as a long line of actions that preceded them.
I'm not convinced that the people winning with Impacts would have any less success if they shot a Kelbly Prometheus, LP Fuzion, ARC CDG, BAT TR, Defiance Deviant, Surgeon 591 or a host of other actions.
I mean Kahl Harmon won the PRS overall with a Terminus Zeus so that kind of blows the whole Impact supremacy thing up anyway.I'm not convinced that the people winning with Impacts would have any less success if they shot a Kelbly Prometheus, LP Fuzion, ARC CDG, BAT TR, Defiance Deviant, Surgeon 591 or a host of other actions.
It really is the Indian and not the arrow….but some people are way to dense to ever understand that concept
Gonna need a bit of clarification on this. My nuke 2.0, and most other 2.0 are damn solid and smooth running. In fact, if you take away the jersey shooter dudes that can't handle more than 2# bolt lift that kept putting in too light fp spring as a crutch, the 1.1 nuke was just fine also. I've used my nuke in the field and in winter conditions that would turn most people away and it did just fine.ARC has made a bunch of shitty actions before finally getting it right with the CDG. The mausingfield was a cool design but its not really for PRS type shooting. The nucleus was a turd so 5 times a charm.
Gonna need a bit of clarification on this. My nuke 2.0, and most other 2.0 are damn solid and smooth running. In fact, if you take away the jersey shooter dudes that can't handle more than 2# bolt lift that kept putting in too light fp spring as a crutch, the 1.1 nuke was just fine also. I've used my nuke in the field and in winter conditions that would turn most people away and it did just fine.
Yes and not really.Is the terminus as reliable in adverse conditions, and is it harder to lift bolt after firing?
I wish the Zeus had a 6 o’clock-ish bolt lug for better AW shenanigans. I don’t think it does. Don’t have a Zeus, but I’ve read it’s not ideal for easy AW mag use. Def correct me if I’m dead wrong.
Of course the Impact doesn’t have such a lug there either…
Works just fine with AW. It’s the same if you ran an impact with AW’s. Mess with the mag catch and feed lips a little bit. It’s not a CDG. But it works just fine and I wouldn’t say it’s not ideal.I wish the Zeus had a 6 o’clock-ish bolt lug for better AW shenanigans. I don’t think it does. Don’t have a Zeus, but I’ve read it’s not ideal for easy AW mag use. Def correct me if I’m dead wrong.
Of course the Impact doesn’t have such a lug there either…
Pretty much no action does, besides the AI actions.
For general knowledge, the CDG thread usually just mentions a 6 o’clock lug position but to illustrate here’s a pic I scraped from this post in that thread. Couldn’t find a better pic in the time I had to search.The only current aftermarket action that I'm aware of that's actually designed for use specifically with AW mags in mind is the ARC CDG, though I'm a bit ignorant as to the lug positions.
You double negative SOB you lolWorks just fine with AW. It’s the same if you ran an impact with AW’s. Mess with the mag catch and feed lips a little bit. It’s not a CDG. But it works just fine and I wouldn’t say it’s not ideal.