Phoenix Custom Rifles pics, reviews, lead times

Keith Johns · Oct 23, 2022

1-2 week turn around on brake installs, Cerakote, bedding, etc.

2-4 weeks on full builds if all parts are in-hand.

Thanks guys. We appreciate everything.

Keith Johns · Dec 17, 2022

Short wait times right now guys. Got past the hunting rifle rush and doing mostly PRS rifle rebarreling for guys getting ready for the next season.

With all parts in hand, full builds can be as short as 1-2 weeks.
Single service jobs like brake installs, Cerakote, bedding, etc. are about 1 week.

Thanks everyone. We got started here on the hide in 2009 and without Snipershide, meaning you guys, we wouldn’t have been able to do what we do. So a big and sincere THANK YOU.

Keith, 4804678090
Phoenix Custom Rifles

Abbey · Dec 18, 2022

I’m loving the 6.5 CM you built for me last year. I have all the parts for my .338 LM project except still waiting on the Defiance action (going on 7 months now) and AXSR chassis. (If anyone has an Elite Sand right-hand they want to unload…). As soon as the action is in, I’ll give you a call. Planning to cerakote this one.

I’ll try to do my part to keep you busy if supply chains can hook me up. Given how long it’s taken for parts to arrive, I’m already planning my “next next” project. Thinking of a light “short mag” in 6.5 PRC or .300 WSM.

Keith Johns · Dec 18, 2022

Very glad to hear it and eager to build you another rifle. It’s a bummer it’s so hard to get actions right now.

I’m very interested to see what changes, if anything, hearing that Defiance was sold to the same new owner of Mcmillan. I use a lot of McMillan stocks and they have always been my preferred stock maker, and I can’t say I disagree with any of the changes I’ve noticed there since it was sold.

Abbey · Dec 18, 2022

I'm told my .338 action (Deviant Tactical) should be "any day now". We'll see. The chassis is another story. They were in stock this spring and I should have just bought one. Now I'm hearing it could be another 6+ months for the next shipment from AI. So I might change plans & go the stock route with something like a McMillan U10-7. We'll see. Need to figure that out before I Cerakote the barreled action though.

For the lightweight short mag, I was thinking of a Defiance AntiX but with current availability (not sure if they're taking new orders), I'm starting to look at other options. The Impact NBK looks interesting but I'm not sure I want to go 3-lug 60 deg throw.

Keith Johns · Dec 18, 2022

Mentioning the McMillan thing, I want to make a couple comments… which are just my opinion so, please, no one get their feelings hurt.

McMillan doesn’t do Savage or Browning inlets anymore. They’ll still mold the stock, but won’t do the inlet work. I assume they’ll soon stop offering stocks for those brands, and some others, all together.
I agree with this decision. The more products a company offers, the more difficult quality control must be. Just look at PTG as an example for that.

Now the part that may hurt some feelings…. Savages are designed like toys and some aftermarket parts for them are incompatible with other aftermarket parts made for them. I don’t like working on them, because I like to be proud of my work, and I can’t blame McMillan for no longer making stocks for them.

To hurt some more feelings with my opinions…
Factory actions all together, with the exception of Tikkas, aren’t really worth using anymore. The cost difference between two nearly identical rifles with the only difference being the action, let’s say one uses a Rem700 and the other a Defiance Tenacity, is a few hundred dollars. Remember the Rem700 gets trued, gets a new lug, needs a quality scope rail, maybe a bolt knob, a side bolt stop or 8-40 scope base holes if you really want to splurge… add all that up and when all is said n done, the 700 build didn’t save much money, if any, over the aftermarket action build.
The quality difference between a reworked 700 action and a Tenacity is huge. Not even comparable.

Back when aftermarket actions were fewer, rifle standards were lower, and ammo didn’t cost a fortune, hell ya it made sense to build off factory actions. But times have changed. Ammo costs a fortune. Gas costs more now and most of us have to drive an hour or more to go shoot. Is saving a couple hundred bucks on your rifle, when it vastly changes the end product, really worth it?

In conclusion, depending on your budget, either build a full blown custom rifle(with a good aftermarket action) or just go buy a Tikka and add to it over time. A Tikka in a Mcmillan stock is hard to beat.

Keith Johns · Dec 21, 2022

Well except for this, mcmillan isn’t offering 50cal stocks anymore. What a kick in the balls.

Keith Johns · Dec 21, 2022

McMillan Game Warden bedded, with a cabron cross-bolt, and painted/sealed inside.

The cross-bolt is in front of the trigger/behind the mag area. And the “paint” used to seal and beautify the inside of the stock is C series Cerakote.

Keith Johns · Jan 30, 2023

I’m sorry to see the price of Tenacity actions go up so much. Those things were too good to be true at the old price.

kcsmith · Jan 30, 2023

K. Johns said:
Not sure if I ever posted this, probably did, but here it is as a reminder we build them.... 375 CheyTac. ...with a custom made extractor that actually works(the Stiller extractor was too thin or was incredibly soft for some reason. You could bend it by looking at it).

I dont have a Cheytac, but what is the extractor made from ?

Keith Johns · Mar 22, 2023

kcsmith said:
I dont have a Cheytac, but what is the extractor made from ?

If you mean the extractor I made, it’s been a while since I made it but I used tool steel and can’t remember which kind. I didn’t heat treat it after machining, I’ll admit, but I tested the shit out of it and I’m pretty sure it would’ve towed my truck. It was overkill strong but after bending 3 or 4 extractors form stiller I decided to make it as strong as possible.

If you’re asking what the stiller extractor was made of I have no idea. I’m not a metallurgist but they were soft.

Keith Johns · Mar 22, 2023

Here’s a 788 we built up pretty nice. Had to fully inlet a flat top Mcmillan game warden for it. Then did our camp pattern on it.
I should’ve gotten better pictures of it. It’s gotta be one of the nicest 788s in the world lol. BRUX barrel chambered in 6.5creedmoor. Feeds like the magazines were made for 6.5creed. Came out great. There are some concerns I have about those 788 actions but I think this one will be sweet rifle.

Keith Johns · Mar 22, 2023

I’m trying to make a list of great actions around the $1000 mark to suggest to customers. I used to just tell everyone to get a Tenacity. Prices are going up but the Zermatt Origin can still be had for $1000 last I saw and hopefully a couple others stay around that price mark.

Anyone have any action suggestions that still cost around $1000 and are top notch?

6.5SH · Mar 22, 2023

K. Johns said:
I’m trying to make a list of great actions around the $1000 mark to suggest to customers. I used to just tell everyone to get a Tenacity. Prices are going up but the Zermatt Origin can still be had for $1000 last I saw and hopefully a couple others stay around that price mark.

Anyone have any action suggestions that still cost around $1000 and are top notch?

Not in the wild but looked at the ARC CDG yet?

kcsmith · Mar 22, 2023

K. Johns said:
If you mean the extractor I made, it’s been a while since I made it but I used tool steel and can’t remember which kind. I didn’t heat treat it after machining, I’ll admit, but I tested the shit out of it and I’m pretty sure it would’ve towed my truck. It was overkill strong but after bending 3 or 4 extractors form stiller I decided to make it as strong as possible.

If you’re asking what the stiller extractor was made of I have no idea. I’m not a metallurgist but they were soft.

I had asked because I had considered making an extractor for the 700 I had and my shop has a good amount of A2 lying around.

Keith Johns · Mar 26, 2023

I believe it was A2 coincidentally. I can look when I get into the shop tomorrow.

Keith Johns · May 14, 2024

Been a while since I’ve posted anything. Building some great rifles and have some new products.

Nice 6.5PRC

New Garmin Chrono tripod/rifle mounts

And some thumb rests / side rails that have been working great

Thanks for checkin it out.

Satterlee · May 17, 2024

Question:
When you time the barrel runout does this mean that prior to threading and chambering you first determine the high and low in the center of the barrel radially then index the high or low to 6 or 12 O'clock with the receiver.
As an exaggerated example, the large majority of rifle barrels are like a jump rope with more runout in the center of the barrel vs the breech and muzzle end.
With barrel on centers determine the high and low in the center of the blank. Transfer that information to the breech end via marking method, set up once again thru the headstock dialed on both ends, thread and chamber indexing the high, low mark to 6 and 12 to the receiver.
I find this interesting and just want to ensure I'm understanding what you mean by "timing runout".

Keith Johns · May 17, 2024

Ya pretty much. Runout doesn’t always make a jump rope or rainbow shape though, sometimes it makes a ski ramp, and sometimes it seems to corkscrew through the barrel. But yes the goal result is for the end of the bore being worked on to be indicated in so it is as straight as that bore will allow(without bending/flexing the barrel obviously). Sometimes bores are very straight and simply indicating the last few inches of the working end is enough… sometimes there’s enough runout that I have to focus only on the throat area, then pre-bore the first 1-1.5” with a boring bar.

I use a 2.625” long stem indicator to measure the bore, but have dual piloted range rods if needed. I trust the indicator more.

Using an indicator also shows me the exact shape of the grooves, and allows me to read off the lands or grooves as needed(or both).

Then of course the muzzle end of the barrel gets timed so it’ll be at 12:00 when on the receiver.

I also use JGS and PTG floating reamer holders(mostly the JGS holder now). I don’t believe in RIGID reamer set-ups… to be honest I think it’s absolutely insane.

All reamers are from JGS, carbide preferably but if it’s a reamer I don’t think I’ll use a lot I’ll buy HSS… I get talked into buying some dumb reamers sometimes lol.

Keith Johns · May 17, 2024

Oh it’s probably worth mentioning what I find in terms of runout.

Bartlein barrels I must say have been the straightest. BRUX is a very close second and I’m really splitting hairs here. Proof goes through periods of being impressively straight, and periods of being not so straight but still acceptable. These seem to be the best three brands from my experience.

For numbers… I’d say a good barrel has less than .010 deviation from Z axis when measured at muzzle. Average is .010 to .020.
“Bad” barrels to me have .030” or more of runout and in some situations I’ll pull the barrel and send it back when it’s more than .030”.

But, I have to add trying to describe bore curvature with one number like that is a little dumb. As I said I see different shaped, drill movement/curvature/runout, whatever we want to call it. I’ll admit I’ve had curvature that I couldn’t make sense of. I was still obviously able to get the throat area straight, and the muzzle at 12:00 center, but what the rest of the bore was doing was quite puzzling to me. I’ve been through that a few times. I guess what matters, is what matters, and not what you can’t control.

Buy only the best barrels. It is the last component to ever save money on or refuse to wait for the right one.

Button pulled barrels(usually cheaper than cut rifled) seem pretty atrocious in terms of both runout and bore size consistency at the bore ends. I’ve work with some great button pulled barrels but overwhelmingly the cut rifled barrels are better in every way.

Keith Johns · May 17, 2024

I just recorded some video of today’s barreling job. I’ll put it up on our YouTube channel under the name “barrel indicating steps”.

Today was an m24 proof .308(not carbon wrapped)
Very straight barrel.

And indicating must be done with the spider bolts finger tight, then snugged up tighter and tighter slowly, while watching what it’s doing. Even these narrow, brass tipped, spider bolts can’t manipulate(bend to put it crudely) thin barrels. You’d have a hard time bending an m24 or larger but you can definitely induce some unnatural curvature to it if you aren’t careful.

I plan to add the true-bore-alignment chuck to my arsenal but I have my complaints about the way they work. Not necessarily due to the chuck design itself but things you must do to use it in any practical manner with all the various barrel contours out there.

Terry Cross · May 17, 2024

Keith Johns said:
I plan to add the true-bore-alignment chuck to my arsenal but I have my complaints about the way they work. Not necessarily due to the chuck design itself but things you must do to use it in any practical manner with all the various barrel contours out there.

It's not a problem.
Call the shop Monday and I will be happy to explain what I worked out for holding tapers in the TBAS chuck. I have been using my method for the last 8 or 9 years and am totally happy with the results.

Keith Johns · May 18, 2024

Terry Cross said:
It's not a problem.
Call the shop Monday and I will be happy to explain what I worked out for holding tapers in the TBAS chuck. I have been using my method for the last 8 or 9 years and am totally happy with the results.

I’ll definitely be buying one eventually.
Two things worry me about it.. It seems obvious I’ll still need an outboard spider or some type of support on the non-working end which brings up some minor cocnerns for me. And on smaller contour barrels I imagine most guys use bushings that fit around the swoop of the barrel, or even in front of that, and the chuck grabs onto the bushings…. I can see how that works but I don’t love it.

I’d love some advice on how you’re using it. I have no doubt it’s working for you. Once I get around to buying one I’ll reach out.
Thanks very much

Keith Johns · May 18, 2024

Might sound crazy but I’m going to try 3D printing barrel bushings for my barrel vise, rather than using aluminum. I can CAD the 3D printed bushings and make a ton of small variations way easier than machining them all from aluminum.
There are some pretty impressive filaments to choose from but I have PET-CF so I’ll try that first.
Being able to make bushings like that may make the true bore chuck more appealing to me.

Plus this material might be nicer to use for this than aluminum. It might grip better while scratching less, and I’m pretty confident it’s plenty rigid.. especially under containment pressure. It’s like magic black aluminum lol.

Terry Cross · May 18, 2024

Keith Johns said:
It seems obvious I’ll still need an outboard spider or some type of support on the non-working end which brings up some minor cocnerns for me.

You absolutely don't need an outboard spider unless your lathe is super lightweight. That's one of the efficiencies of the setup.

Keith Johns said:
I’d love some advice on how you’re using it. I have no doubt it’s working for you. Once I get around to buying one I’ll reach out.
Thanks very much

You're welcome. Any time.

ChiefSillyHorse · May 19, 2024

Terry Cross said:
You absolutely don't need an outboard spider unless your lathe is super lightweight. That's one of the efficiencies of the setup.

You're welcome. Any time.

I’m very happy to say I have rifles built by both of you, and both are two of the nicest rifles I own. Oh, and you’re both great people too!

Keith Johns · Jun 3, 2024

Quick turn around times right now, and I keep a good amount of BRUX barrels in stock.

fatmat27 · Jun 3, 2024

last few parts coming in, should be able to bring it all down this weekend!

Mj1995 · Jun 4, 2024

Just talked to you on the phone the other day about a 300 norma. I'll be bringing it over soon as well.

Keith Johns · Jun 8, 2024

Thanks guys. We’re trying to stay caught up and be doing work as it comes in the door, meaning no real wait time. We’ve been hovering around a 3 week build time lately, if not waiting on parts, but I’m nearly starting builds as they come through the door now.

Once my large order of BRUX barrels comes in this year I’ll have twice the barrel supply and should have anything a guy needs(except in .25 and .27)

I’ve been considering offering prefits for certain actions but if I can get chamber jobs done in a week I’d rather do that. I’m not a big fan of prefits. Having the action in-hand when doing the chambering lets me set headspace to the half thou of where I want it, and ensures barrel timing like I spoke about a few posts ago. The prefits people bring in, from the best of companies, that I install on actions for them are not headpaced or timed as precisely as the barrel install I do.

Keith Johns · Jun 15, 2024

Redoing our website a bit and having trouble with the mobile version. If you can use it on desktop it works fine, and if on mobile device, try to switch to desktop version at the bottom of the page.

fatmat27 · Jun 22, 2024

Been wanting to build a M24(ish) clone for a while. I don't think I'll ever go pre-fit again!

Remington 700 SA/ Proof 24” M24 contour in .308 Blueprinted and spun by PCR
TriggerTech Special (flat)
Custom PCR bolt knob
HS Precision stock inletted for Hawkins M5 DBM/M24 contour and cerakoted by PCR
Nightforce NX8 2.5-20X50 in NF rings

image_cropper_7BA34EBD-E4CC-4500-B631-B3165955C463-461-00000003B7D57598.jpeg

Keith Johns · Jun 25, 2024

We are now offering prefits for RimX actions.
Chambers are cut with JGS Match 22 Rimfire reamer. Barrels are BRUX M24 contour 1-16 stainless, which ill be leaving 24” after chambering so guys can specify barrel length and muzzle threads(if any) when ordering so they get exactly what they want, with no wait time. I’d expect to ship prefits within 48 hours of order being placed.

Keith Johns · Aug 13, 2024

We’re building rifles as they come in the door guys… almost no wait time.

BRUX barrels in stock too, from 22rimfire to 338 bore sizes.

I’ve been using the post office for shipping over the last 12 months or so. They’ve been cheaper and more reliable than UPS or FedEx.

When shipping rifles, I can include an AirTag with the rifle when I ship it back to you… if you want. This helps track the shipment and all you have to do is drop it back in the mail(it would already be in a bubble-mailer with postage taken care of).

Thanks!

Keith Johns · Aug 16, 2024

Couple nice rifles finished up.

We’ve got two builds in the queue. Keeping wait times down. I expect to have jobs done in two weeks.

Keith Johns · Aug 16, 2024

M24 “clone” barreled action

Keith Johns · Aug 23, 2024

www.phoenixcustomrifles.com

Shipping through the post office has been much better than FedEx or ups. Lately the average cost to ship has only been like $65.

If anyone needs anything for their rifle, that can be 3D printed, I’m happy to give it a go.

Made this recoil pad spacer for my wife’s youth MPA comp chassis. Things like this are perfect to print, rather than making one from aluminum.

Coejro · Aug 24, 2024

Keith Johns said:
M24 “clone” barreled action
View attachment 8480954

View attachment 8480960
View attachment 8480962

And how it turned out fully assembled. Keith was great to work with throughout!

Keith Johns · Sep 4, 2024

The best way to contact me is to call and text. It takes me a week sometimes to check messages on here.

Few side notes:

We’re offering Howa chamber jobs now.

When we bed Tikka T3s, and CZ 22s, both of which have that loose recoil lug that is nearly useless the way it comes from the factory…. We make a new lug from A2 tool steel and replace the factory lug with that. It fits the lug slot on the action perfectly and comes out beautifully with perfect lug positioning.

We just had two CZ22 bed jobs leave the shop that I wish I had gotten some good pics of, but man are they beautifully done.

Our wait times are very low right now. We’re staying pretty well caught up.

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ · Sep 4, 2024

Keith Johns said:
The best way to contact me is to call and text. It takes me a week sometimes to check messages on here.

Few side notes:

We’re offering Howa chamber jobs now.

When we bed Tikka T3s, and CZ 22s, both of which have that loose recoil lug that is nearly useless the way it comes from the factory…. We make a new lug from A2 tool steel and replace the factory lug with that. It fits the lug slot on the action perfectly and comes out beautifully with perfect lug positioning.

We just had two CZ22 bed jobs leave the shop that I wish I had gotten some good pics of, but man are they beautifully done.

Our wait times are very low right now. We’re staying pretty well caught up.

Of all my bedding jobs my PCR looks the best. It’s flawless. Look at the area circled. Even that skinny sliver of stock is bedded.

Everyone talks about “tolerance stacking” well the same goes for ALL the little details, they add up too.

Keith Johns · Sep 9, 2024

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ said:
Of all my bedding jobs my PCR looks the best. It’s flawless. Look at the area circled. Even that skinny sliver of stock is bedded.

Everyone talks about “tolerance stacking” well the same goes for ALL the little details, they add up too.

View attachment 8494374

Is that one of the flat-top A5s from back in the day?

Keith Johns · Sep 9, 2024

www.phoenixcustomrifles.com

Google isn’t being too kind to us right now, some are telling me, so there’s our website link.

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ · Sep 9, 2024

Keith Johns said:
Is that one of the flat-top A5s from back in the day?

Yes sir! It was a flat top you worked your magic on.

drglock · Sep 9, 2024

Keith Johns said:
The best way to contact me is to call and text. It takes me a week sometimes to check messages on here.

Few side notes:

We’re offering Howa chamber jobs now.

When we bed Tikka T3s, and CZ 22s, both of which have that loose recoil lug that is nearly useless the way it comes from the factory…. We make a new lug from A2 tool steel and replace the factory lug with that. It fits the lug slot on the action perfectly and comes out beautifully with perfect lug positioning.

We just had two CZ22 bed jobs leave the shop that I wish I had gotten some good pics of, but man are they beautifully done.

Our wait times are very low right now. We’re staying pretty well caught up.

Several years ago Keith did this on my CZ457. Work was impeccable as always.

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ · Sep 15, 2024

Took my PCR out, never disappoints me.

I had to look up the build date……it’s been a decade already! I found some old pics of this build. @Keith Johns let me drop in and see how it was progressing. The thing I remember most was all the finishing that went into the stock. The beading, profiling the flat top, pillars, barrel channel, magazine well. All of it cut out by a man and a machine. No computers. I was amazed.

Lwood · Sep 15, 2024

Quarter MOA, nice...

Keith Johns · Sep 17, 2024

We have no wait time right now.
I’m not sure why we’ve been slow the last month or so but we’re doing work as it comes in the door, so if you want something done fast now seems to be the time.

Might be having some website visibility issues. Some guys are telling me they can’t find our website, but I haven’t been able to confirm it. It shows up for me from any/every device.

Keith Johns · Sep 25, 2024

Hey everyone I have a favor to ask. Our listing was removed from Google Maps and now that it’s back up, we have zero reviews. If anyone wants to leave an honest review on Google, I’d GREATLY appreciate it.

Thanks!

Keith Johns · Sep 25, 2024

I’ve been posting here for so long, off and on, that I forget not everyone has heard of us. So here’s a little bio..

Phoenix Custom Rifles is owned by me, Keith Johns. The entire company consists of my father and I, who both attended and graduated Yavapai gunsmithing 15 year ago. Bolt action rifles are all we do. These days I do all the machine work at PCR, while my Dad does our beautiful stock work and Cerakote. We’re a small low volume shop that does high quality work with low wait times(usually). Our company phone number is a direct line to me personally 24/7.

We can’t thank all our past and present customers enough, and I hope we get to build some great rifles for those of you who don’t yet know us.

Keith Johns
www.phoenixcustomrifles.com

MPrimo · Sep 26, 2024

I again will offer effusive praise for these guys. They built my first custom rifle many years ago and I have not had one since that has shot as well. They do excellent work!

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