Hornady seemed to keep this pretty quiet. I’ll be interested to find out more as people get experience with it.
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I can see a smaller market for this. If you essentially want an 8.6 Blackout in a small frame AR, I think this will be the ticket.
I still think that there are better options if you are in the small frame AR market for hunting, but this one will probably be king of the subsonic performers for a little while.
I haven't watched the video yet, so know nothing at this point about magazine/bolt compatibility.
@Ledzep
How do pressures compare to a subsonic .300BO?
Curious if suppressors rated for subsonic .300BO will be able to handle this cartridge (i.e. Octane 45HD).
Really happy to see this. 8.6 BLK supers don’t really do anything special, and 8.6 BLK sub capability has long been possible in small frames with cartridges like 338 Spectre.
The only problem was lack of support for the small frame 338 subs. Hopefully that is fixed with this.
I realize this will always be a fairly niche cartridge, but I think it is a great addition to Hornady’s lineup.
Looking keenly towards discreet ballistics for them to load 280gr expanding solids in this new caliber.
And a bolt.Quite niche. But it’s exactly what I want. My can is 36 cal and I want a thumper subsonic cartridge for shorter range hunting. Just (hopefully) need to swap a barrel, gas tube, and probably a buffer.
And maybe reloading components will be plentiful
Damn. And a bolt.And a bolt.
Hornady is first and foremost a bullet company. As they say in the podcast intros "We Make Bullets".
That said they have been designing cartridges with advanced/modern features for quite a while now. I watched the podcast quoted above (#150) and it goes into great detail as to the when, why and what for they developed this cartridge. They actually started this in 2017 and shelved it until new technologies came about that made it possible to build what they wanted. Two loads available: a supersonic 175gr HP and a 307gr subsonic round plastic nose. No gas adjustments needed. Sub 307gr will work fine with 9mm/45ACP pistol suppressors.
Posting here without watching the detailed podcast above is just farting at the Moon. That said, you can watch the cliff notes by watching the first 3-minutes of their New Releases for 2025 post. Great for attention deficit people . It wont answer all questions like podcast #150 but it will give you an idea of the what and why.
Here's the link to the cliff notes:
I think it could be a great hog thumper! I guess I just like the idea of a slinging a heavy weight in an AR platform if a mad minute situation arises. Defiantely not gonna reach out but that's what the 22 ARC is for. You will need an ARC bolt and everything I am hearing says Grendel mags are the way to avoid headaches. I have Duramag steel units for the incoming 22 ARC. The hard question for me... 16.1" barrel or 10.5" barrel?I can see a smaller market for this. If you essentially want an 8.6 Blackout in a small frame AR, I think this will be the ticket.
I still think that there are better options if you are in the small frame AR market for hunting, but this one will probably be king of the subsonic performers for a little while.
I haven't watched the video yet, so know nothing at this point about magazine/bolt compatibility.
Hornady specs the supers at 2075FPS and the subs at 1050FPS.Looks like a better mouse trap for what I'd use it for than the 8.6. It's usable in an AR-15, doesn't have a corkscrew speed twist that limits you to only the most expensive bullets. I'm sure the super load is going to be slow, I'd be surprised if it breaks 2k, but the sub load might merit a barrel to give it a try on woods deer.
That’s not how gravity works.…the .300 BLK will actually have less drop and drift (lighter bullet, less RPM twist rate).
Yeah, because we need to only gain 30 lbs. KE more over a 220 sub .300BLK after spending a few thousand dollars on new brass, dies, .338 Sub-X bullets, and a new barrel with a special twist rate & bolt... This is getting a bit on the retarded side.
Did everyone lose their boner for the 8.6 BLK already, despite it being a retarded idea to begin with? Then again, do we really expect anything more from Kevin? He always has to do something similar, but different, just to say "I did this..."
I mean, they'll probably sell a ton of these, but the sad reality is, it's nothing special, and if you want to shoot that size case, you might as well just buy some Hornady Sub-X ammo for your 7.62x39...It will cycle in an AK with a can on it just fine. At the functional distances you can shoot subsonic ammo to, there will be almost zero advantage to this or the 8.6 BLK over a .300 BLK... And the .300 BLK will actually have less drop and drift (lighter bullet, less RPM twist rate).
Well that's interesting, I watched a couple of the videos last night and heard them say that the .338 supers would be a little slower than 300 supers, but didn't catch a velocity.Hornady specs the supers at 2075FPS and the subs at 1050FPS.
The 510 Whisper does seem neat. But the 338 ARC does not appear to merely be necked up. From the pictures, until we get actual measurements, it seems to be a good bit shorter.….
Last but not least ...A serious flaw with the 338 ARC . I necked up a 6mm ARC to 338 ...It will not fit 300 gr Bergers or the 285 or 300 ge Atip in the magazine of an AR 15. ...or any other if desirable readily available long match bullets in 338.
It appears you'll be stuck with short 338 bullets made specifically by Hornady for the 338 ARC.
For that reason alone its a no go, for me.
Unless its way shorter than the 6mm ARC.
Want an AR 15 338 sub gun...Check the 338 Spectre for sub 338s they were shooting 300 gr SMK & Bergers I believe.
Definately, Check it out before buying this what appears to be a very limited Round...do some research.
They changed the video URL - found it and replaced it. Should work now.Footnotes!
It’s 53 minutes!!!
This says 1.293”The 510 Whisper does seem neat. But the 338 ARC does not appear to merely be necked up. From the pictures, until we get actual measurements, it seems to be a good bit shorter.
Also, Discreet Ballistics says they may be trying to put their 280gr expanding solid in 338 ARC.
Pictures for size reference. I’m on my phone, otherwise I’d paste them together, to scale.
View attachment 8526204
View attachment 8526205
Twist rate 1:8? That seems slow for bullets that long. I think for really heavy/ long .300 BO bullets you need a 1:5. I'm using 1:6.5 in 338 nowThis says 1.293”
View attachment 8526218
It appears Hornady altered the aspect ratio of their picture.This says 1.293”
View attachment 8526218
I’ll let the general population test it, manufacturers tweak it, then I’ll give in.Getting an upper as soon as they are available.
Snip from the video I posted above:
View attachment 8526224
Agree. Hilarious that the 8.6 stuff seems fast as hell and this seems slow as hell.Twist rate 1:8? That seems slow for bullets that long. I think for really heavy/ long .300 BO bullets you need a 1:5. I'm using 1:6.5 in 338 now
Who ordered hotdogs?338 Spectre is a SPC bolt face. 1.252 case length. With something like a .275" long neck. Below are loaded with a 300gr Maker at 2.3". 1050fps with 9 GR of Lil Gun in a 12" barrel.
View attachment 8526229
As far as comparison to 300 BO, most people probably shoot 200gr bullets. All things being equal the 338 subs are going to add energy commensurate with the additional bullet weight. Sure you could try to stuff a 245gr EOL in a BO but you could also try to stuff a 350gr SMK in a Spectre. Realistically the comparison from BO, to Spectre, to 375 Raptor is 200gr, 300gr, and 400gr.
I just hope they did something to that 307gr SUBX bullet bc if it's a standard SUBX the expansion is anemic compared to Maker REX.
Thousands of dollars? More like $700.r spending a few thousand dollars on new brass, dies, .338 Sub-X bullets, and a new barrel with a special twist rate & bolt... This is getting a bit on the retarded side.
You forgot the ridiculous cost of .338 projectiles…Thousands of dollars? More like $700.
500pcs of new Spectre brass is $230. A die set is $70. A barrel and bolt is $385. $685 total.
And you could save half the brass cost by forming it from pistol brass if you want. Realistically the component costs between these and 300BO is more like a 15 - 20% increase.
I didn't. They are just consumables that don't figure into the cost of tooling up imo. But if you want to figure that in because I can see where people do think it's a cost worth comparing then it's real easy.You forgot the ridiculous cost of .338 projectiles…
But overall, it still doesn’t make it any less retarded and basically useless and more expensive compared to a .300 BLK with 220 subs. There’s an old saying that more people need to understand these days… “Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.”