Problem with one of my gun safes.

Dog&Jeep · Nov 4, 2024

One of my gun safes is a little Sentry 16 gun with a dial combination. A while back I went to open it, dialed in the combo, and cranked the latch a partial turn when everything seized up. The latch lever won't open or close. The combo dial won't turn in either direction. There's a lot of guns inside I can't get to.

I know I could solve this issue with an angle grinder and a prybar, but I would rather not do that.

I've tried, very gently, using a rubber mallet around the door to jar whatever's jammed into letting loose. This didn't help.

I've watched various UTube videos, and from those I get the sense that gravity plays a role in how the combination/tumbler mechanism works. This makes me wonder if inverting the safe (Again, very gently. There one hell of a lot of investments inside.) might let me get things freed up.

Obviously, once I get it open all guns are getting removed until after I've had a Locksmith make sure the lock mechanisms properly fixed. Failing that, I'll get a new safe.

Has anyone else had this sort of thing happen? If so, how did you resolve it.
Thanks

Rocketvapor · Nov 4, 2024

Could you have triggered a "relocker"?

Im2bent · Nov 4, 2024

Jump to 2:30. I would do this. If you flip the safe upside down won't your shit inside get mangled?

Aftermath · Nov 4, 2024

I'd just take a grinder to it rather than have all of that "one hell of a lot of investments inside" get jumbled around.

Have you contacted the manufacturer? What about a locksmith? State prison?

reelserious · Nov 4, 2024

Ask a lock smith first before doing anything

MCHOG · Nov 4, 2024

Does the combination dial spin freely, or is it still in the unlocked state it is in when the door is fully open?

I'm guessing that the dial does not spin freely since the locking lever is in a half-locked position. If that is the case, then it has nothing to do with the "tumblers" a/k/a wheel pack. It would then involve the linkage connecting the lever and the locking lugs. It could be a relocker. But what you are describing doesn't cleanly fit a relocker scenario. Do not continue to try to force the locking lever. They are made to break away. Once it breaks off, you will be probably relegated to destroying the safe. Again, assuming the combination dial is in the unlocked state, I would suggest shaking the locking lever back and forth quickly and lightly. If that doesn't work, I would suggest a locksmith. Not Pop-A-Lock type locksmith. A real locksmith, preferably one that sells safes.

jwSubMOA · Nov 4, 2024

No help on getting it open, not exactly. Bet it is like my friend's safe recently. Same thing, had to get a lock smith and drill a hole. Wound up being the actual bracket that pushes and pulls the locking bolts. Real shitty weld and it finally broke. Five minutes to fix but a pain to open.

Simonsza1 · Nov 4, 2024

reelserious said:
Ask a lock smith first before doing anything

This!!!!! I had a safe malfunction and the safe company was going to send me a new one and sent me videos to cut it open. I called a reputable locksmith and he opened it in five minutes, repaired for just under $500 and the manufacturer had already shipped the new safe so I ended up with a new one also. Couldn’t believe how easily a real pro can get into a broken safe with zero damage. Call a locksmith!

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ · Nov 4, 2024

Saw you were knee deep in enemy territory. No way I’d call a locksmith to rat me out.

I’d take an angle grinder to it and buy a much better safe moving forward.

This is not legal advice or even a suggestion. I’m not a lawyer and I don’t stay at Holiday Inn.

Dog&Jeep · Nov 4, 2024

Rocketvapor said:
Could you have triggered a "relocker"?

I don't know, but I doubtt it. I just went to open the safe the same as I have for a couple decades now.

Dog&Jeep · Nov 4, 2024

Aftermath said:
I'd just take a grinder to it rather than have all of that "one hell of a lot of investments inside" get jumbled around.

Have you contacted the manufacturer? What about a locksmith? State prison?

I know I may have to do that, but then I would need to figure out how to get rid of the carcass. I live in CA. If I show up at the dump or recyclers with a forcibly hacked safe, it will raise questions and unwanted scrutiny.

Dog&Jeep · Nov 4, 2024

D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷ said:
View attachment 8539097

Saw you were knee deep in enemy territory. No way I’d call a locksmith to rat me out.

I’d take an angle grinder to it and buy a much better safe moving forward.

This is not legal advice or even a suggestion. I’m not a lawyer and I don’t stay at Holiday Inn.

You're not wrong. But there's nothing inside of it that shouldn't be.

A little over 10 years ago, I had to shoot a burgler. During the course of that night's events, the police reviewed the contents of the safe. when I offerred to open it for them. They were very respectful and appreciative. As far as they were concerned, everything was just as it should be.

Aftermath · Nov 4, 2024

Dog&Jeep said:
I know I may have to do that, but then I would need to figure out how to get rid of the carcass. I live in CA. If I show up at the dump or recyclers with a forcibly hacked safe, it will raise questions and unwanted scrutiny.

No...I meant that I'd go ahead and cut it open in place rather than try to turn it upside down or throw it on its back but what I'd really be doing is contacting the maker of the safe, a locksmith or a safe cracker.

m1match · Nov 4, 2024

reelserious said:
Ask a lock smith first before doing anything

Ditto on this. I had a Liberty Safe with S&G electronic lock and something in the lock mechanism broke and I couldn't get it open. I called a local safe company in San Diego and the tech had a book with precisely where to drill to get it open. Opened it in about 2 hours and replaced the lock mechanism. It cost about $700 for the fix and lock replacement but better than destroying the safe and/or damaging the contents.

Downtown · Nov 4, 2024

A locksmith should have no problem opening your safe. A good locksmith is usually able to open even a TL30 and a Sentry "safe" is very much less secure than that.

cas6969 · Nov 4, 2024

Downtown said:
A locksmith should have no problem opening your safe. A good locksmith is usually able to open even a TL30 and a Sentry "safe" is very much less secure than that.

I was about to post that a locksmith will probably cost more than buying a new Sentry.
(I guess I just did)

davsco · Nov 4, 2024

Dog&Jeep said:
I know I may have to do that, but then I would need to figure out how to get rid of the carcass. I live in CA. If I show up at the dump or recyclers with a forcibly hacked safe, it will raise questions and unwanted scrutiny.

cut it up into smaller pieces. just put a piece in the trash every week. or if getting a replacement, have them haul away the old one.

Rocketvapor · Nov 4, 2024

Cut a big hole in the back.
Remove guns one at a time to make room to work on the lock from the back.
Maybe you can fix it.
Tack a piece of steel sheet over the hole.
It will still look like a Sentry from the front.

Modoc · Nov 4, 2024

I also vote for a good locksmith that deals with safes. Check your local gun club for a trusted one.

Is the Swiss Rifle Club still active? They would be a good point of reference.

AccuSol-ERN · Nov 4, 2024

Rocketvapor said:
Cut a big hole in the back.
Remove guns one at a time to make room to work on the lock from the back.
Maybe you can fix it.
Tack a piece of steel sheet over the hole.
It will still look like a Sentry from the front.

If you are a decent welder, you may be able to cut the entire back panel off at the edges with a thin blade and re-weld it back on.

Ern

jrhtx · Nov 5, 2024

m1match said:
Ditto on this. I had a Liberty Safe with S&G electronic lock and something in the lock mechanism broke and I couldn't get it open. I called a local safe company in San Diego and the tech had a book with precisely where to drill to get it open. Opened it in about 2 hours and replaced the lock mechanism. It cost about $700 for the fix and lock replacement but better than destroying the safe and/or damaging the contents. Don't know if this is true, but I was told that if you have you drill your safe to get it open, the locksmith installs a hardened steel plug in the hole. It can't be drilled again if the lock fails. Then you have to cut it open.

I don't know if this sis true, but I was told that if you have to drill the safe because of a lock failure, it is a 1 time open. The locksmith installs a hardened steel plug in hole. If it fails again, you have to cut the safe open.

AccuSol-ERN · Nov 5, 2024

jrhtx said:
I don't know if this sis true, but I was told that if you have to drill the safe because of a lock failure, it is a 1 time open. The locksmith installs a hardened steel plug in hole. If it fails again, you have to cut the safe open.

I am not a locksmith.......but unless that hardened steel plug is made of carbide.......a carbide drill bit with adequate pressure and coolant will eat it up.

Ern

cas6969 · Nov 5, 2024

Calling Sentry isn't a bad idea. There's a chance they might be able to help, this could be a common issue with a simple fix.
I did deal with them a little on an office safe once.

Dog&Jeep · Nov 5, 2024

Modoc said:
I also vote for a good locksmith that deals with safes. Check your local gun club for a trusted one.

Is the Swiss Rifle Club still active? They would be a good point of reference.

Yes, they are. That's a good tip. Thanks

m1match · Nov 5, 2024

jrhtx said:
I don't know if this sis true, but I was told that if you have to drill the safe because of a lock failure, it is a 1 time open. The locksmith installs a hardened steel plug in hole. If it fails again, you have to cut the safe open.

Generally you are probably right. My locksmith filled the hole he drilled by epoxying in two sections of hardened drill bit with ball bearings between them, so that very well might be impractical to drill again if the lock failed again. However he replaced my S&G lock with an AMSEC lock, which he felt was more durable and reliable than the S&G electronic lock and the AMSEC has a different drill point.

mewillis · Nov 5, 2024

I've said this here and other "my safe failed" posts. Ft Knox is the only company that warrants the lock also not just the box. Think about that for a minute, how is the box going to fail unless it's cut open?? It's not, the lock will fail. My E lock failed on my Ft Knox and it was some weird failure of the gizmo that moves by the solenoid after you put your combo in. Had to be drilled and Ft Knox paid the entire locksmith bill.

Simonsza1 · Nov 5, 2024

Only company isn’t true. Ftknox is definitely one of the best hands down but my safe company was going above and beyond to warranty my safe and it was roughly 20 years old. Only reason they gave me the option I took is that the supplied locksmith from them was possibly 3-4 weeks out cause I’m so rural. I told them that I make a living out of that safe and could not wait that long. So they gave me the next best option. Everything about it was going to be covered under warranty though including the brand new free safes that arrived at my house just a couple weeks later.

mewillis · Nov 5, 2024

And what company was that? You mentioned it twice without saying.

Simonsza1 · Nov 5, 2024

Cannon
Wasn’t leaving the name out for any reason

mewillis · Nov 6, 2024

Actually it is true.
From the Canon website;
This Limited Lifetime Warranty is for residential use. This warranty covers defects in workmanship and materials, as well as damage resulting from attempted break-ins, actual break-ins, natural floods, and fires.
Cannon Security Products Inc. may, at its discretion, repair or replace any defective or damaged parts, or replace the entire safe. Whenever possible, we will arrange for local repair. In the event that Cannon Security Products Inc. determines the safe needs to be returned, we will cover the return freight costs. The purchaser must ensure that the safe is emptied, packaged, palletized, and available for curb-side pickup at their own expense. Labor costs for opening, removal, or installation of the safe and its contents are not covered by this warranty. Personal property stored inside the safe is not covered by this warranty. Electronic and mechanical locks carry a one-year warranty for labor and a lifetime warranty for parts

From the Ft. Knox website;
Fort Knox is proud to offer superior home and gun safes that are known for their quality, craftsmanship, and protection. We are so confident of this fact, that we are the only manufacturer to offer a true comprehensive lifetime warranty for your safe. This includes the lock, interior, handle/bolt work, mechanism, clutch, and body of the vault.

Simonsza1 · Nov 6, 2024

Nice find. Well then what I will say is that from my experience there customer service was outstanding and they made me feel like I had the same warranty listed by ft Knox above. Im surely not arguing the fact that ft knox is not the cats ass but I’m just letting you all know my experience. Really what I was trying to do before throwing names out was to let the op know that calling a locksmith is probably the best approach and that one fixed me up in a matter of minutes.

mewillis · Nov 6, 2024

Yeah I understand because I had a failure which would have screwed me big time I'm sure, but FN came through without batting an eye, I also learned the hazards of the digital lock and FN sent a combo lock to replace the digital that failed. I will never again use a digital ie; keypad lock. The odd failure of the mechanism made this a several hour drilling, pounding and cursing to open, despite the locksmith company having every certification known to the industry and was chosen by Ft Knox to do the job because of that.
Looks like Canon is a standup company, just pointing out the fact that I found Ft Knox to warranty more than just the box which is huge in my opinion. Locks fail, it's a fact and the digital locks fail way more often than combination despite what the internet says.

smoothy8500 · Nov 6, 2024

mewillis said:
it's a fact and the digital locks fail way more often than combination despite what the internet says.

At least dial locks might give an indication that something is going wrong right before they fail; dial feels "gritty/rough" or suddenly it took two tries to unlock.

chevy_man · Nov 7, 2024

m1match said:
Generally you are probably right. My locksmith filled the hole he drilled by epoxying in two sections of hardened drill bit with ball bearings between them, so that very well might be impractical to drill again if the lock failed again. However he replaced my S&G lock with an AMSEC lock, which he felt was more durable and reliable than the S&G electronic lock and the AMSEC has a different drill point.

Annular cutter on a mag drill will cut right around all of it.

It'll only defeat the local idiot with a hss drill bit in a cordless drill.

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