I’m toying with the idea of purchasing the program, mainly to see how certain factors influence the shot more than others. I already have a Kestrel Elite 5700 with Applied Ballistics. Is it worth it to purchase the program or just dump some more money into ammo?
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AB Analytics
- Thread starter USMC22
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I have the program but don't know how much it costs. It was bundled in one of the seminar packages. That was worth the money!
Anyway, I like the program. There is a little bit of a learning curve to overcome. It's useful for making a dope chart in a spreadsheet format.
I use the spreadsheets as a backup to the firing solution that my rangefinder gives me.
Hope that helps.
Anyway, I like the program. There is a little bit of a learning curve to overcome. It's useful for making a dope chart in a spreadsheet format.
I use the spreadsheets as a backup to the firing solution that my rangefinder gives me.
Hope that helps.
Hadn’t hear of it but a search is showing 2014 information, nothing recent. You’d still pick it over AB?
I have both. Coldbore is probably more technical but not as user friendly.
I too received analytics from the seminar. It’s decent and works well with the AB platforms.
If I had to choose between the two I would probably say coldbore, but it’s taken a long time to get comfortable with it. AB is pretty easy.
I too received analytics from the seminar. It’s decent and works well with the AB platforms.
If I had to choose between the two I would probably say coldbore, but it’s taken a long time to get comfortable with it. AB is pretty easy.
2014? odd. I get updates regularly ( the latest just a few months ago). And yes, I too have both. AB is basically an overpriced JBM. You can't really compare them side by side, CB wins hands down in all departments.
I've always found CB very straightforward and easy to use. AB is pretty easy but pretty basic though and lacking too when compared to CB.
I’m not saying the app doesn’t get updates regularly I’m saying the reviews I’d seen were from that era. Will do some more looking into Cold Bore...
About two days ago, the FCSA Longest shot record was achieved running CB.
If you'd like to see what ELR competitors are using, check out the stats that Brian Wink maintains in the "Safety First Tactical ELR" group on Facebook. Shows all gear including ballistic solver used for longest shots in competition. Lots of useful data points there.
AB Analytics is backed through our ballistics laboratory. In all reality building a working ballistic solver isn't very difficult. It is the data that it can provide is key, and having a state of the art ballistics lab to provide that bullet data is at the heart of our systems. Certainly not an overprice JBM system, as ours uses ballistics laboratory verified computations. The current ELR World Record holder used AB along with a PDM just recently to set a new World Record. Here is the data that was mentioned above as to popularity and what is trusted most:
I just wish there was a “lite” version of AB. I just want to see stats on variable input i.e. wind uncertainty, range etc. and what the probability of a hit outcome is in a percentage. EVERYTHING else that AB Analytics does (besides the wind from 10 different directions) I can do on my Kestrel. It feels like you’re buying the same thing again which is only unlocking an additional feature.
Those and having a very accurate and feature rich package made me go to Patagonia CB
This has been in discussion, the Tactical version does this and we are working on a major update to that. Implementing it into the general solver is still something we are discussing, but as for a "light" version. The free online solver on our website will give you a generalized hit percentage output.
This. Ballistics solvers are free at this point. JBM's CGI and the GNU library are open source so you don't even need to understand the math.
I wrote a solver using MATLAB in college and still ended up buying AB Analytics. The valuable part for me is the projectile library. Worth every penny.
A variety of methods are actually used not just Kestrels. But neither here nor there the data still stands as valid.
Right on the money for as long as you run Point Mass. FFS and Patagonia's Coldbore are the two most accurate solvers out there, and both are based on proprietary engines. It's not only about having accurate data, you also need an accurate engine.
Biggest downfall for FFS is you have to buy another device to run it. Only runs on windows mobile so you need nomad or Juno device
The good news is that a new app called Genesis is coming soon. It runs on top of Patagonia's engine so the accuracy is guaranteed
Also, and as a side note. If you run AB Analytics and you end up attending an event where our mobile lab is present then we can generate a PDM for your software. This is something we have been offering as a free service where we show up with our mobile Radar laboratory to events around the country and allow users to shoot their own rifle/ammunition combinations and we upload a drag model in real time for them. This provides users with the most accurate system available on the market. This PDM is then distributed via our cloud based server across nearly all platforms. So you will have it on your desktop software, in your mobile app, and if you end up pairing to any devices it will show up there as well.
Which would also be available on a Kestrel Elite. Not native to AB Analytics... AB Analytics in that example doesn’t offer anything in addition to what you pay for when buying a Kestrel Elite but costs nearly 1/3rd of a Kestrel Elite.
AB Analytics only advantage (to me) seems to be if you DO NOT own a KESTREL ELITE and do not plan on purchasing one. The seminars that used to be offered (pre-covid) for around $500 included the books and AB Analytics which seemed like a good value considering you got some training on the program and theories for a better understanding that also helped with the learning curve.
If you have a Kestrel Elite and want to “run the numbers” on AB Analytics you’re essentially buying all the same information and bullet profiles to get a minimal amount of data in return.
It would be nice if a version came out that when linked with your kestrel elite had access to those profiles and you got the remaining functionality NOT already included in the kestrel for a cheaper price.
If you have a Kestrel Elite and want to “run the numbers” on AB Analytics you’re essentially buying all the same information and bullet profiles to get a minimal amount of data in return.
It would be nice if a version came out that when linked with your kestrel elite had access to those profiles and you got the remaining functionality NOT already included in the kestrel for a cheaper price.
The seminars will return, once the laws stabilize and travel is a bit more predictable. We do plan to hold them again.
That will be likely how I end up with AB Analytics. I just can’t justify the cost any other way. I imagine I’m not alone in thinking that. Perhaps it’s time for a seminar via zoom and AB Analytics package... you save on a venue and travel, host a few hours of going over the program and pass the discount on. No having to ship books, print slides etc.
Kestrel has been killing it with the free classes they’ve been offering and the HUGE online training section they’ve been updating for FREE. Seriously some of the best stuff out there right not that is at or above most sites who are charging for the training...
Kestrel has been killing it with the free classes they’ve been offering and the HUGE online training section they’ve been updating for FREE. Seriously some of the best stuff out there right not that is at or above most sites who are charging for the training...
The Applied Ballistics Analytics Covid 2020 Package deal. A brief tutorial followed by a brief period of answering questions and a discounted program.
I attended a seminar in Salt Lake City, last year. Yes, it cost me extra money in transportation costs and lodging. IMHO, it was worth it.
It's true that AB Analytics could host a "virtual" seminar however, I really appreciated the opportunity to ask questions and look over some other toys that they had there.
The other thing that I appreciated from the experts was the smaller group sessions after dinner in the evening. Depending on your interests, these smaller group sessions added a lot of value to the entire package.
Many thanks to the folks that put this seminar on for all of your extra efforts and hard work. I learned a lot!
It's true that AB Analytics could host a "virtual" seminar however, I really appreciated the opportunity to ask questions and look over some other toys that they had there.
The other thing that I appreciated from the experts was the smaller group sessions after dinner in the evening. Depending on your interests, these smaller group sessions added a lot of value to the entire package.
Many thanks to the folks that put this seminar on for all of your extra efforts and hard work. I learned a lot!
I’m sure it was awesome, but its not realistic right now. I think it would benefit everyone to offer an online feature and include the program at a discount. I’m done beating the horse. My comment about the savings on a venue was aimed at Applied Ballistics who would have to rent the space... not the person traveling.
Understood. Whatever way they decide to put on another seminar, I'm sure it will be a good one.
i just want to clarify something. It sounds to me what you are truly comparing and deciding between is AB mobile or tactical for say your phone vs a kestrel. AB analytics is a little bigger than what the kestrel offers (most noteably WEZ analysis). If you are choosing beween a kestrel and a phone app, id say the kestrel is a better choice becasue it is all in one. HOWEVER, the kestrel is a royal pain in the ass to build profiles in, so be sure you get the free profile loader desktop companion if you go down that road. I dont think the decision bewtween Analytics and a kestrel is a fair one. Kestrel is a field tool, analytics is a desktop application. most of us aren't dragging laptops or tablets in the field.
I’m not deciding between the two, I own a Kestrel 5700 Elite w/ Link.
When @DocUSMCRetired mentioned you could download a PDM in AB Analytics it was worded like that was the only way.
You‘re correct that I’m mainly after the WEZ analysis.
Most of the other things AB Analytics does my Kestrel can do - and in the field as you mentioned. It makes about as much sense as buying two pairs of shoes (One for inside and the other for outside)... When you pay the premium for the Applied Ballistics Elite and then they look for that premium again when you want to run a WEZ tool it seems a bit much. Offering it FREE and the rest of the books when you take a seminar with them kind of shows the markup.
My point has always been why not allow folks who have already purchased that technology (the AB library) with the Kestrel a way to unlock it in the app and get the remaining additional features at a discounted price. It would make it more competitive with Cold Bore which everyone has mentioned and they’d probably sell a lot more to the folks who already own a Kestrel Elite but want to run the WEZ.
Copy that. Just wanted to be sure. I highly recommend the seminar as well. I learned a ton.
@TacticalDillhole, would love to do one of the seminars. In the past life commitments or finances didn’t line up. As soon as we come out the other side on this I plan on attending. I’ve got most of the books over time so I’ll likely pass those along from the seminar. Hopefully it’ll all be behind us soon enough.
How does the AB for the Kestrel 5700 Elite compare with the AB mobile apps (iOS and Android) and the Analytics? Does the Analytics just offer the full CDM library access and the WEZ feature? Do I need to buy individual CDMs when I use the mobile apps and the Kestrel?
I don’t know what you mean by how does it compare? If you put in everything the same you should get the same solutions.
Analytics gives you a better UI access to the Wez and as far as the CDMS go I’m not 100% sure I think you get them but I’m not sure.
@DocUSMCRetired can give you full answer
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So by "how does it compare", I am asking about the features (just like how I wrote it). Does the mobile app and Kestrel offer the WEZ and full access to the entire CDM library? Or am I buying individual CDMs for the Kestrel and the mobile apps?
Yes so for CDM's on mobile and kestrel you have to buy the ones you want. WEZ is only on analytics.
Thanks. Are the Mobile AB app and Kestrel app essentially the same (operationally/features)? Any idea on how much the CDMs cost? I am guessing if I buy CDMs for the Kestrel App, they can't be used on the Mobile AB app?
Yeah, I’ll be honest all the continuity between all of the and AB software‘s mobile apps
instruments, kestrels. Lrfs etc. they don’t jive very well together so yeah you’re correct. If you bite on the kestrel it won’t work in the mobile app and I believe the CDms are fairly inexpensive a couple bucks maybe not terribly so it’s not like the end of the world, but it’s still one of those things. I’m hoping someday they can bring them all together and everything just talks to everything and you only have to purchase it once but some of the stuff you buy with them like the Garmin watch that has AB on board has all of the CDM‘s. That’s part of why they’re so expensive
Analytics isn’t worth the money honestly. It’s a good program with a very simple windows 3.5 feel and has a purpose but isn’t a necessary tool IMo.
The CDMs are $10 per caliber.
WEZ and WPA (Wind Profile Analysist) is currently only in AB Analytics. It is not on the Kestrel. But the Kestrel does have the rest of the ballistic profile output information.
The Kestrel has access to the library via its Mobile App.
Analytics also has the entire CDM library (it does require manual update periodically) included with it.
The mobile app is the only one that is slightly different.
Thank you. So if I want to forego the WEZ and WPA, I can buy the CDMs individually with the $30 Mobile App, or I can go with the Kestrel Elite and its app to access the entire library?
I watched Chad Heckler's video and I think I have a better understanding - the AB solver is on the Kestrel Elite itself. The Kestrel Link app is mainly to store and set up gun profiles. I saw a Target Card option but Chad never went into it in the video. He did a thorough job with the Kestrel itself, and the device itself allows you to play with the different target ranges / obtain a range card, but obviously the main selling point is the weather/environmental data it records.
The Kestrel menu and UI is really old. It's reminding me of the Magnetospeed/Labradar days before the Garmin Xero C1 came around.
The Kestrel menu and UI is really old. It's reminding me of the Magnetospeed/Labradar days before the Garmin Xero C1 came around.
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