New 4 oz. AIR BRACE Cantilever Mount, American Rifle Company Black Friday Sale

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Earth Folk,

Over the years, many people have asked me to design a cantilever scope mount optimized for AR-15 platforms. We'll I finally got around to it and here it is. We're calling it the AIR BRACE because the emphasis is on ultra-light weight while trying to keep the cantilever as stiff and strong as possible. The 30mm diameter x 38mm high mount weighs in at 4 ounces making it among the lightest in the industry, especially if one actually cares about the stiffness of the cantilever section. The mount also includes a level vial at the aft end that is back-lit through a hole that runs through the entire length of it, however, it is likely useful only for the young or those older folks lucky enough to see clearly up close. I used to be young.

Note that the images below are renderings. I'll post a picture of the real thing on a rifle soon. Torque values are 35 and 55 lb-in for the scope and rail respectively. I decided to go with one M4x0.7 screw for each scope clamp because it can handle torque in excess of 40 lb-in. Bear in mind that most mounts have at least two screws per side per ring to which 15-20 lb-in of torque is typically applied. Since we're doing the same job with one screw, twice as much torque must be applied, about 35 lb-in, to result in similar clamping force.

Should a two-screw version of the scope ring ever be required, we can easily and quickly introduced retrofit-able caps but I doubt that will be necessary. I used the AIR BRACE to hold a Schmidt & Bender 5-25x56 PM II on top of an old 10.2 lb Sako TRG-42 through which I put about 100 rounds of 338 LM. The experience was generally unpleasant because I really don't like recoil, but the AIR BRACE did its job maintaining and returning to zero. That said, our M-BRACE rings and mount are better choices for big stuff.

We're pricing the AIR BRACE at $349 but, since tomorrow is Black Friday, we're offering it at $279 though Monday.

Enjoy and have a happy Thanksgiving.


Ted
 

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Earth Folk,

Over the years, many people have asked me to design a cantilever scope mount optimized for AR-15 platforms. We'll I finally got around to it and here it is. We're calling it the AIR BRACE because the emphasis is on ultra-light weight while trying to keep the cantilever as stiff and strong as possible. The 30mm diameter x 38mm high mount weighs in at 4 ounces making it among the lightest in the industry, especially if one actually cares about the stiffness of the cantilever section. The mount also includes a level vial at the aft end that is back-lit through a hole that runs through the entire length of it, however, it is likely useful only for the young or those older folks lucky enough to see clearly up close. I used to be young.

Note that the images below are renderings. I'll post a picture of the real thing on a rifle soon. Also, the torque values have been updated since the images were created. The new values are 35 and 55 lb-in for the scope and rail respectively. I decided to go with one M4x0.7 screw for each scope clamp because it can handle torque in excess of 40 lb-in. Bear in mind that most mounts have at least two screws per side per ring to which 15-20 lb-in of torque is typically applied. Since we're doing the same job with one screw, twice as much torque must be applied, about 35 lb-in, to result in similar clamping force.

Should a two-screw version of the scope ring ever be required, we can easily and quickly introduced retrofit-able caps but I doubt that will be necessary. I used the AIR BRACE to hold a Schmidt & Bender 5-25x56 PM II on top of an old 10.2 lb Sako TRG-42 through which I put about 100 rounds of 338 LM. The experience was generally unpleasant because I really don't like recoil, but the AIR BRACE did its job maintaining and returning to zero. That said, our M-BRACE rings and mount are better choices for big stuff.

We're pricing the AIR BRACE at $349 but, since tomorrow is Black Friday, we're offering it at $279 though Monday.

Enjoy and have a happy Thanksgiving.


Ted

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Absolutely brilliant! Any chance at a QD version with the thumb wheels of the M10 QD-L, I know it'll add a little more weight but should still be very light given the 4oz starting point. Also, any chance for the M-BRACE accessory sides up front, again, I know it will add a little weight but I am piggybacking almost everything AR these days and having an accessory mount would be ideal...

One last thing, you advertise only 20 in-lb for the ring screw, on all your other rings mounts it's always been 55 in-lb, a large frame AR can put a wallop on both recoil and return, I'd be a bit concerned about scope slippage with only one screw at 20 in-lb (in fairness you are marketing this scope for AR-15, but many will also be interested for AR-10).
 
Absolutely brilliant! Any chance at a QD version with the thumb wheels of the M10 QD-L, I know it'll add a little more weight but should still be very light given the 4oz starting point. Also, any chance for the M-BRACE accessory sides up front, again, I know it will add a little weight but I am piggybacking almost everything AR these days and having an accessory mount would be ideal...

One last thing, you advertise only 20 in-lb for the ring screw, on all your other rings mounts it's always been 55 in-lb, a large frame AR can put a wallop on both recoil and return, I'd be a bit concerned about scope slippage with only one screw at 20 in-lb (in fairness you are marketing this scope for AR-15, but many will also be interested for AR-10).
I love your method. Generously complement his work and then hit him up for more features. That's smart and hard to ignore.

In regards to screw torque, 35 lb-in is what I'm recommending. The original renderings were created before updating the torque value and have since been replaced to reflect recommended torque. Sorry about the confusion.

Regarding QD and accessories, we knew someone, actually lots of people, would ask. Thumb-wheel screws are something we can definitely offer as an option. Need to pick a machine and check availability but its something we can likely offer very soon.

Accessory attach points were also considered but I decided against them because I wanted to keep the weight down. Not everyone will want to add a red dot and those who do can use dedicated red do mounts. There are some good ones out there, better than anything that attaches to a mount, as far as I know. But I hear you. Your heart wants what it wants an who am I to tell it otherwise. Perhaps we can offer and accessorize-able option in the near future.

Ted
 
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I love your method. Generously complement his work and then hit him up for more features. That's smart and hard to ignore.

In regards to screw torque, 35 lb-in is what I'm recommending. The original renderings were created before updating the torque value and have since been replaced to reflect recommended torque. Sorry about the confusion.

Regarding QD and accessories, we knew someone, actually lots of people, would ask. Thumb-wheel screws are something we can definitely offer as an option. Need to pick a machine and check availability but its something we can likely offer very soon.

Accessory attach points were also considered but I decided against them because I wanted to keep the weight down. Not everyone will want to add a red dot and those who do can use dedicated red do mounts. There are some good ones out there, better than anything that attaches to a mount, as far as I know. But I hear you. Your heart wants what it wants an who am I to tell it otherwise. Perhaps we can offer and accessorize-able option in the near future.

Ted
I love innovation and trying new things, been a fan of ARC rings and mounts from the beginning so think this is a great new design.

If you’re able to accommodate QD with your thumb wheel design that would be great, this is going to be a big seller either way I feel.
 
Assuming the thumb wheel screws is something we can add on later? Big fan of QD myself.
I'm not sure it will work that way, the current QD-L (thumbwheel) uses a swivel spring clamp that is different from the current torque on clamp nut. Not sure if return to zero (RTZ) is affected by the design (a simple thumbscrew replacement of existing nut?), but that would be something for ARC engineers to determine. It would be great if it was as simple as a QD kit that could be purchased after the fact, just not sure if that is feasible (with adequate RTZ) given the design vs. a new design altogether. 🤷‍♂️
 
I'm not sure it will work that way, the current QD-L (thumbwheel) uses a swivel spring clamp that is different from the current torque on clamp nut. Not sure if return to zero (RTZ) is affected by the design (a simple thumbscrew replacement of existing nut?), but that would be something for ARC engineers to determine. It would be great if it was as simple as a QD kit that could be purchased after the fact, just not sure if that is feasible (with adequate RTZ) given the design vs. a new design altogether. 🤷‍♂️
Makes sense. I just purchased a Tier One cantilever QD mount (before the ARC came out) and you're able to purchase that mount with or without the QD. And you can purchase the QD conversion at a later time if you opt for the non-QD version. Probably the slickest, smoothest QD I've ever used too. Very precise and RTZ is pretty much spot-on with it.
 
Only dislike is that the screws are different sizes. Having one bit was nice on the M10 QD-L
I agree. Ted mentioned earlier in this thread that it is likely there will be a QD-L version coming. I too appreciated that one 4mm bit did everything on M10 and QD-L, even though QD-L offered thumbwheel tightening it also has a 4mm slot which I could torque if I really wanted to (y)
 
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Thanks Ted
I would like to withdraw my thanks for this product. Now that I've got it and opened the box and started to install it I find that it in no way meets my expectations for an arc product.

1) the written sheet that comes with it says scope clamp screws 55inlb. But printed on the side of the air brace it says 35lbin. Wtf!

2) the finish on the screws looks poor and inconsistent. The scope clamp screws are some stupid looking bronze and black. The rail clamp screws look like a 10 year old finished them with a can of spray blue. Ok that's just the way heat treat comes out. But it looks like shit. But that's not the worst of it. They designed the rail clamp screws with a hex bolt head outside of the socket cap. I guess incase rather than a torque wrench, Ted must feel some people can get away using a Cresent wrench.

Ok what ever, to each there own. But be advised that (in my opinion) the points on the bolt head are too sharp. And if ever some how they scrape the back of my hand they could leave a nasty mark.

One) Ted should explain why it has 35lbin printed on the side!

Two) he should send everyone who bought one of these some screws that look as nice as the screws in his m10 mounts look. Torx head for mine please.
 
I agree. Ted mentioned earlier in this thread that it is likely there will be a QD-L version coming. I too appreciated that one 4mm bit did everything on M10 and QD-L, even though QD-L offered thumbwheel tightening it also has a 4mm slot which I could torque if I really wanted to (y)
This is a 3mm for scope, 4mm for rail.
The nice thing is that the scope screw is smaller diameter. That makes the scope cap is ~1.5mm shorter than the M10 so it obstructs less of the turret.

I can't tell if the finish on the screws is a real complaint or sarcasm. Mine just look like heat treated steel. Much nicer than normal black oxide hardware that rust and look like shit.
I do agree the 8mm (5/16) bolt heads are sharper than they need to be. They are smaller and stick out much less than other brands 1/2" nuts though.
 
I would like to withdraw my thanks for this product. Now that I've got it and opened the box and started to install it I find that it in no way meets my expectations for an arc product.

1) the written sheet that comes with it says scope clamp screws 55inlb. But printed on the side of the air brace it says 35lbin. Wtf!

2) the finish on the screws looks poor and inconsistent. The scope clamp screws are some stupid looking bronze and black. The rail clamp screws look like a 10 year old finished them with a can of spray blue. Ok that's just the way heat treat comes out. But it looks like shit. But that's not the worst of it. They designed the rail clamp screws with a hex bolt head outside of the socket cap. I guess incase rather than a torque wrench, Ted must feel some people can get away using a Cresent wrench.

Ok what ever, to each there own. But be advised that (in my opinion) the points on the bolt head are too sharp. And if ever some how they scrape the back of my hand they could leave a nasty mark.

One) Ted should explain why it has 35lbin printed on the side!

Two) he should send everyone who bought one of these some screws that look as nice as the screws in his m10 mounts look. Torx head for mine please.
Why didn’t you just send it back for a refund instead of coming here and being a cunt? Who the fuck do you think you are?
 
Use some mouthwash your breath smells like cock.
That’s the best you got? You are the type of customer that nobody wants. When I have to deal with some entitled cunt like you, I immediately issue a refund. You aren’t worth dealing with. You come into this thread demanding something from a manufacturer? As if you are someone of any importance? Bitching about the shade of some small screw or a rough surface that might leave a “nasty mark” on your creamy little paw? Bless your heart….
 
That’s the best you got? You are the type of customer that nobody wants. When I have to deal with some entitled cunt like you, I immediately issue a refund. You aren’t worth dealing with. You come into this thread demanding something from a manufacturer? As if you are someone of any importance? Bitching about the shade of some small screw or a rough surface that might leave a “nasty mark” on your creamy little paw? Bless your heart….
Please advise what companies you clerk for and I'll insure I don't trouble you with my business. Now about that mouth wash...
 
I am about mount an American Rifle Company M-Brace scope mount on my NightForce ATACR 7-35 with 60 MOA cant and it is beautiful and looks like it's made fine. This post might not fit here but this mount calls for 55 inch pounds on the rings. I am getting a pucker factor and before I do this has anyone used these mounts at 55 in-lbs. I've never heard of such a torque on a scope. Please reply.

M-BRACE SCOPE MOUNT​

 
I am about mount an American Rifle Company M-Brace scope mount on my NightForce ATACR 7-35 with 60 MOA cant and it is beautiful and looks like it's made fine. This post might not fit here but this mount calls for 55 inch pounds on the rings. I am getting a pucker factor and before I do this has anyone used these mounts at 55 in-lbs. I've never heard of such a torque on a scope. Please reply.

M-BRACE SCOPE MOUNT​

Absolutely. 55in lbs.
Even on your most dogshit Chinesium Vortex you will not bind the tube at 55in lbs on this mount.
 
I am about mount an American Rifle Company M-Brace scope mount on my NightForce ATACR 7-35 with 60 MOA cant and it is beautiful and looks like it's made fine. This post might not fit here but this mount calls for 55 inch pounds on the rings. I am getting a pucker factor and before I do this has anyone used these mounts at 55 in-lbs. I've never heard of such a torque on a scope. Please reply.

M-BRACE SCOPE MOUNT​

Traditional ring - 4 screws at 15-20 in-lbs
ARC - 1 screw at 55
... Fear not.
 
Traditional ring - 4 screws at 15-20 in-lbs
ARC - 1 screw at 55
... Fear not.
Thanks Bill,
I definitely had the pucker factor (big time) once I started going above 30. I also needed a Picatinny riser because my M-Brace is canted 60 MOA and the front of my scope was hitting the rail. I got the ScalarWorks Kick/01 and it was a beautiful thing. Both pieces made in USA and the ScalarWorks picatinny riser had torque in-lbs on the mount. I bought one of these things back in the 90's and it was for an AK. I am definitely going to keep my eyes on these two companies for product.
 
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Hey Bill, since I have your ear, I thought I'd ask about the BS I went through today with the KESTREL 5700 Elite's compass, the Vortex 4000 GB range finder and iphone. Today was very windy at my range and I decided to tackle using my equip to deal with it. The problem was 3x when I created a target in the kestrel and captured the wind. I lased the target with Vortex their compass readings were way different and when I tried my iphone, it was way different. So there I am calibrating them all in 36 Deg and windy. What do you think about the fact that I'm going to buy a great compass and just manually enter all directional data.
I calibrated 3 times with each and they closed in. The Kestrel cal, instead of turning it in your hand, I extended my arms straight out and turned my body. LOL. I got that from this site.
 
I am brand new to using forums and have no experience of the structure of methods to accomplish anything. However, from reading posts and having a shooting buddy advise me to join this forum, I'm all in.

I need help navigating in this forum. I want to start by upgrading my membership and I have no idea how to do that.

But my 100% main reason to get started using this forum is I'm on a quest to shoot a mile. I don't want to ramble too much but this is my start to this forum. I went to Coleman's creek last October and shot a target at 1270 yards with my LWRC REPR 308 and saw that light go on. I'm hooked and have 2 much better rifles to start this journey. My idea is to create a post that I will use and ask advice from you fine people. I just want to know how to do it and where to post it. So here goes my start.

I have purchased and been testing with the Kestrel 5700 Elite and the Vortex Razor 4000 GB. I started with Geoballistics app and take Kestrel for wind and weather only. But then I have read about Applied Ballistics and their Custom Curves and watched some videos about all the data they created. I need this forum because I want to avoid chasing my tail or going down rabbit holes.

What the heck, I'll put my first question out there.

I was in 36 deg weather 1/15/25 and switched to Applied Ballistics custom curves and it gave me my hold over at 500 yards (that's all I have unless anyone knows any private ranges near Myrtle Beach that go to 1000. Anyways the shot was 1.5 MOA off. So I was disappointed and went home, but then I thought that when AB created the curve it probably wasn't 36 degrees.

So would that have been the time to re calibrate DSF at 500 with my hold over that worked.

I'm hoping for a yes.

Long Ramble.......
Please help. I will be a great student.
 
I am brand new to using forums and have no experience of the structure of methods to accomplish anything. However, from reading posts and having a shooting buddy advise me to join this forum, I'm all in.

I need help navigating in this forum. I want to start by upgrading my membership and I have no idea how to do that.

But my 100% main reason to get started using this forum is I'm on a quest to shoot a mile. I don't want to ramble too much but this is my start to this forum. I went to Coleman's creek last October and shot a target at 1270 yards with my LWRC REPR 308 and saw that light go on. I'm hooked and have 2 much better rifles to start this journey. My idea is to create a post that I will use and ask advice from you fine people. I just want to know how to do it and where to post it. So here goes my start.

I have purchased and been testing with the Kestrel 5700 Elite and the Vortex Razor 4000 GB. I started with Geoballistics app and take Kestrel for wind and weather only. But then I have read about Applied Ballistics and their Custom Curves and watched some videos about all the data they created. I need this forum because I want to avoid chasing my tail or going down rabbit holes.

What the heck, I'll put my first question out there.

I was in 36 deg weather 1/15/25 and switched to Applied Ballistics custom curves and it gave me my hold over at 500 yards (that's all I have unless anyone knows any private ranges near Myrtle Beach that go to 1000. Anyways the shot was 1.5 MOA off. So I was disappointed and went home, but then I thought that when AB created the curve it probably wasn't 36 degrees.

So would that have been the time to re calibrate DSF at 500 with my hold over that worked.

I'm hoping for a yes.

Long Ramble.......
Please help. I will be a great student.
You don't state what projectile or velocity but guessing typical 175 gr Sierra numbers. You are no where near needing to use DSF at 500 yards, the velocity is too high.


Sign up for the free online classes that Kestrel offers. Also look at the stuff available with a paid membership here.
 
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Your inputs are incorrect somewhere and you’re overthinking things right now. There’s no need for a custom curve to be dead on that 500, even with a simple G1 BC you’d be within .25 moa.
1.5 moa off at 500y is a massive error.
Even with my 223 slinging 80.5 at 2875fps when I clear a KYL at 550y at my local range I don’t even bother to get the kestrel out or get any weather from my phone. I’ll be roughly 3mils in fall and spring, 3.1 mils on a super cold day and 2.9 on a super hot summer day.

Just make sure your height over bore is correct, use the published G7 bc (or multi g1) and make sure you have an accurate velocity (use a garmin xero).

Also make sure that your 100y zero hasn’t drifted and that your shooting fundamentals are on point.

Once you’ve figured out your ballistic calculator to match your real life conditions at 500y then go to 1000 and then only if you’re off, start thinking about using a custom drag curve.
 
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Wow, I’m where I hoped this site would take me.
Thanks for replying!!!

The details are LWRC REPR with 60 MOA cant scope mount on a NF ATACR 7-35 and Garmin was 2575. At 500 I was holding down 4.5 MOA and using iphone/spotter to video for recall later at home. the hit was way high OVER 5” so I changed to hold down to 6 and it was perfect elevation. My thoughts were that I’m trying to prepare for 1 mile so I’m trying to use the tools as I would at Coleman’s Creek. To help even more I am using a buddy’s 22 and putting a NF scope on it LOL to go out to subsonic range and see how I do.

Also, I tried to attach a video of POI because I shot 2 rounds and they were tight and together, is it my membership needs to be upgraded in order to attach a video?






I just tried
 
Wow, I’m where I hoped this site would take me.
Thanks for replying!!!

The details are LWRC REPR with 60 MOA cant scope mount on a NF ATACR 7-35 and Garmin was 2575. At 500 I was holding down 4.5 MOA and using iphone/spotter to video for recall later at home. the hit was way high OVER 5” so I changed to hold down to 6 and it was perfect elevation. My thoughts were that I’m trying to prepare for 1 mile so I’m trying to use the tools as I would at Coleman’s Creek. To help even more I am using a buddy’s 22 and putting a NF scope on it LOL to go out to subsonic range and see how I do.

Also, I tried to attach a video of POI because I shot 2 rounds and they were tight and together, is it my membership needs to be upgraded in order to attach a video?






I just tried
You still haven't mentioned what bullet. That's like the most important part ...

Also what do you mean holding down 4.5 moa? was your zero at 600yard ? That's a terrible idea. Or is that that you can't zero your rifle at 100y because of the 60 MOA of cant ? You might have to go down to a 45 moa cant if you can't zero at 100

Start with a 100y zero and dial UP whatever your ballistic calculator will tell you for a 500y shot for your specific bullet at 2575 fps
 
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Also these tools will be useful down the road when you're going in the transonic range past 1200 yards, especially on a 308@2575fps but you need to establish a proper baseline with a 100y zero and a proper solution at 500 without changing curves or BCs or velocity to make the prediction/solution match the reality
 
You still haven't mentioned what bullet. That's like the most important part ...

Also what do you mean holding down 4.5 moa? was your zero at 600yard ? That's a terrible idea. Or is that that you can't zero your rifle at 100y because of the 60 MOA of cant ? You might have to go down to a 45 moa cant if you can't zero at 100

Start with a 100y zero and dial UP whatever your ballistic calculator will tell you for a 500y shot for your specific bullet at 2575 fps
Think this is it right here, is ~10 MOA more down than his scope can adjust. No mention of offset for his 100 yard zero.
 
I am very happy that my post received responses from all you fine people. My 94 yard zero is +16.5 inches and even though I have the 338 and 50BMG I want to make my LWRC 308 my work horse so that I can shoot many rounds and continue to learn and exercise my equipment at 1200 Meter range and 1 mile range without breaking the bank.

Then (I hope) I can hit the ground running with 338 and 50 BMG.

I do have another quick question. I settled on Federal Sierra Matchking 168 grain and it did fine at 1270 but I have a strong feeling that I’m shorting myself by not finding out if there’s a burger round or something else that I should switch to. I don’t have any friends that shoot rifle to the level that I want to take it. All my shooting buddies shoot three gun and I’m too old to keep doing that.

All your responses are deeply appreciated more than you know
 
I am very happy that my post received responses from all you fine people. My 94 yard zero is +16.5 inches and even though I have the 338 and 50BMG I want to make my LWRC 308 my work horse so that I can shoot many rounds and continue to learn and exercise my equipment at 1200 Meter range and 1 mile range without breaking the bank.

Then (I hope) I can hit the ground running with 338 and 50 BMG.

I do have another quick question. I settled on Federal Sierra Matchking 168 grain and it did fine at 1270 but I have a strong feeling that I’m shorting myself by not finding out if there’s a burger round or something else that I should switch to. I don’t have any friends that shoot rifle to the level that I want to take it. All my shooting buddies shoot three gun and I’m too old to keep doing that.

All your responses are deeply appreciated more than you know
Sierra match 168 isn’t the best round for the transonic range. It’s been well documented for at least 15 years. If you can, go with either the 175tmk/ 175 smk/178 eldm or even better, the federal 185 Berger. I’ve had good luck with my 16in 308 with all of these well past subsonic. Regardless, that’s not why you’re having issues.

Your issue is your +16.5in zero offset at 94y. Don’t do that.
You’re asking for problems. Just set yourself up for success with a true zero at 100y (or 94y - doesn’t matter) with no offsets. Super duper important. Then use either applied ballistic/your kestrel/ballistic geo/jbm whatever to get a solution at 500y. It needs to match real life. If it doesn’t, verify that your inputs are correct (correct bullet BC, correct velocity, correct height over bore). Also make sure that your slope angle is correct, most range finder will give you the corrected distance - so say at your range the slope is 10deg and your range finder gives you 500y AMR - that is a corrected value, do not enter 10deg in your ballistic app otherwise you’re doing the correction twice. Lots of little mistakes can add up at long range.

ELR is about doing a ton of little things perfectly to minimize the overall sums of errors. If you’re inexperienced and don’t understand the process and rely sorely on tech, then you’re bound to make mistakes and not understand why you’re not getting the expected results. It’s a marathon, not a sprint and it can’t be learned from a 8min YouTube video and you can’t really “buy” your way into immediate success, although deep pockets certainly helps as this is an expensive hobby.

Good luck
 
Will there be a 36mm mount coming?
Oddly enough I just heard back on that question and the answer is they do not have plans for that at this time. Good news, ZCO is coming out with their own lighter weight cantilever mount but only in 1.30" height, maybe with riser on AR but might as well get the block mount at that point.