Kash Patel tapped to head ATF
- Thread starter TimC in KY
- Start date
New FBI leader Kash Patel tapped to run ATF as acting director
Newly-sworn in FBI Director Kash Patel will be tapped to run the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives as acting director, according to sources.
www.foxnews.com
"I joined government, to destroy government"
--Ron Swanson
--Ron Swanson
This could work. Breath of fresh air after that fat slob Dettelbach.
I'm going to post some speculation about the future. These are just my first thoughts.
The ATF is going to get a massive restructuring. All of the actual law enforcement functions are going to be moved to the FBI. That is the people actually chasing bad guys that have arrest power. Alcohol and Tobacco will be under the FDA or something else like that. The tax collection part will be at the Treasury or could be made point of sale even.
What would be left would be basically the OIG of the gun industry. It could be auditors that have no arrest power or power to unilaterally make rules or to even arrest or charge anyone. At best they could write a strongly worded report that would be sent elsewhere for final determination. If an FFL is selling guns to gangs, they can refer it up the chain. If they uncover some spelling issues in the FFL books they would have to refer the case outside of the agency for enforcement action.
My hunch is that something along those lines is the ultimate outcome (for now).
If they do (or don't) remove the NFA or some or all of it is kind of a side story to the reform I am talking about. Don't get me wrong, I'm all about removing the NFA. But absent that a new structure like I mentioned will still be far superior to what we've been seeing previously.
The ATF is going to get a massive restructuring. All of the actual law enforcement functions are going to be moved to the FBI. That is the people actually chasing bad guys that have arrest power. Alcohol and Tobacco will be under the FDA or something else like that. The tax collection part will be at the Treasury or could be made point of sale even.
What would be left would be basically the OIG of the gun industry. It could be auditors that have no arrest power or power to unilaterally make rules or to even arrest or charge anyone. At best they could write a strongly worded report that would be sent elsewhere for final determination. If an FFL is selling guns to gangs, they can refer it up the chain. If they uncover some spelling issues in the FFL books they would have to refer the case outside of the agency for enforcement action.
My hunch is that something along those lines is the ultimate outcome (for now).
If they do (or don't) remove the NFA or some or all of it is kind of a side story to the reform I am talking about. Don't get me wrong, I'm all about removing the NFA. But absent that a new structure like I mentioned will still be far superior to what we've been seeing previously.
I think the purpose of putting Kash in there is just toclear out the woke gun haters..
Then he can replace it with somebody else. I think one of the GOA lawyers that got the injunction on Bidens private firearms sale EO along with Bailey and Paxton might be a good fit.
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I started to start a thread earlier about this but didn't know enough.
I do know if he;s confirmed for the head position for the FBI, which he already has been, he doesn't have to be confirmed again for head guy at the ATF. Not sure why.
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Is it a good thing one person can control two agencies? In the immediate future, maybe yes.
In the long term, fuck no.
I do know if he;s confirmed for the head position for the FBI, which he already has been, he doesn't have to be confirmed again for head guy at the ATF. Not sure why.
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Is it a good thing one person can control two agencies? In the immediate future, maybe yes.
In the long term, fuck no.
He's in there as an interim director which is temporary by nature, hence it doesn't require confirmation.
Given the UPMC York Hospital shooting today, we are going to need to address "gun free" zones, whereas the very Liberal Governor Josh Shapiro is pushing for gun control.
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The absolute first new rule should be ALL federal agents are required to wear body cameras and muting/turning off is an automatic felony charge
The wearing of body cams will need to become law for any of that to happen. Right now, body cams are just policy.
And and he was confirmed at or above the rank of the ATF director. Which is also required.
The FBI Director does not hold a traditional civil service rank in the way that career federal employees do under the U.S. civil service system. Instead, the position of FBI Director is a politically appointed role, nominated by the President of the United States and confirmed by the Senate. It falls outside the standard General Schedule (GS) pay scale or the Senior Executive Service (SES) framework that applies to most federal civil servants.
The FBI Director does not hold a traditional civil service rank in the way that career federal employees do under the U.S. civil service system. Instead, the position of FBI Director is a politically appointed role, nominated by the President of the United States and confirmed by the Senate. It falls outside the standard General Schedule (GS) pay scale or the Senior Executive Service (SES) framework that applies to most federal civil servants.
You fail to address who will just break down people's doors to murder them or their family in the middle of the night.
Is it safe to get another dog?? asking for a friend...
I’ve been a fan of body cams since they came out… they have protected more good officers than they have “put away” bad ones.
But if you are in the latter category and do shit deserving of getting put away… well there ya go.
Sirhr
Unless the goal is to get rid of the ATF….I doubt that will happen though. So your concern is VERY warranted.
I’m just glad they didn’t put Kristi Noem in……
Trump should put you in charge of ATF, and task the agency with pet adoption.
I’m just glad they didn’t put Kristi Noem in……
And now, to start off your week with a bang… Dan Bongino as Deputy Director!
I felt a huge disturbance in the Force… like thousands of corrupt government employees all screaming out in terror….
Can we rename the Hoover Building Alderaan for the next few weeks?
I felt a huge disturbance in the Force… like thousands of corrupt government employees all screaming out in terror….
Can we rename the Hoover Building Alderaan for the next few weeks?
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Blah, blah blah...will you still be required to register a suppressor with ATF?
Can you swap an arm brace for a real stock?
A few comments on the cries for abolishing the ATF :
I have regular interactions with ATF on the explosives side. My personal experience and what I heard unequivocally from colleagues and ISEE members show the ATF IOIs (Industry Operations Investigators) as collaborative and cooperative rather than vindictive.
The four IOIs I personally dealt with over the years have all supported(!) me in satisfying the pertinent laws and rules with the minimum costs and efforts while increasing the level of safety in terms of use and abuse (i.e theft) of the regulated materials.
The current IOI also predicted that the brace ban would be struck down and voiced his discontent about the ill conceived ruling affecting his 2A rights.
He chose to register as SBR and I chose to go plain buffer tube. That's how we left it.
Coincidentally but related to the topic, I met an ATF criminal investigator in the local Sheriff's office. Similar story there. He was adamantly against the edicts from Biden, Garland and Dettelbach that just made it more difficult for him to find and put out of business the real bad guys. In the old days a lot of the tips came from FFLs but this pipeline dried up quickly once the Biden regime started a war on FFLs.
He mentioned a case from the 'old days' where an FFL died and his widow continued the store. A later inspection revealed a total mess in the books and in the store. They convinced the old lady to close shop instead of hauling her in front of a judge. Problem solved without alienating customers and employers (i.e. taxpayers). No more of these simple and fair solutions under crooked Biden.
I know that these accounts may not be what some people prefer to hear on this forum but it is nevertheless the true account of my experiences.
Coming back to the E in ATFE, the days when you could, should and would buy Dynamite sticks in the local hardware store are over, most certainly after we have been invaded by the Aloa Snackbar crowd. Who is going to keep the sale, storage and use of 'energetic materials' somewhat sane after you abolish the ATF?
I have the feeling that Trump is going to shift most of the enforcement activities out of ATF and have them focus on the administrative side. But time will tell.
All the NFA nonsense (SBRs and SBS were defined to close a loophole around a proposed handgun ban. The handgun ban was fortunately struck down but the SBR and SBS rules remained) has to be dealt with on the legislative side i.e Congress.
ATF does not have the power to change the existing law as confirmed in the SCOTUS ruling that ended the Chevron deference.
While Kash and Dan are hopefully dealing with the tyrants and their thugs it is up to us pushing for the desired legislative changes. How about Hearing Protection Act v2 0?
I have regular interactions with ATF on the explosives side. My personal experience and what I heard unequivocally from colleagues and ISEE members show the ATF IOIs (Industry Operations Investigators) as collaborative and cooperative rather than vindictive.
The four IOIs I personally dealt with over the years have all supported(!) me in satisfying the pertinent laws and rules with the minimum costs and efforts while increasing the level of safety in terms of use and abuse (i.e theft) of the regulated materials.
The current IOI also predicted that the brace ban would be struck down and voiced his discontent about the ill conceived ruling affecting his 2A rights.
He chose to register as SBR and I chose to go plain buffer tube. That's how we left it.
Coincidentally but related to the topic, I met an ATF criminal investigator in the local Sheriff's office. Similar story there. He was adamantly against the edicts from Biden, Garland and Dettelbach that just made it more difficult for him to find and put out of business the real bad guys. In the old days a lot of the tips came from FFLs but this pipeline dried up quickly once the Biden regime started a war on FFLs.
He mentioned a case from the 'old days' where an FFL died and his widow continued the store. A later inspection revealed a total mess in the books and in the store. They convinced the old lady to close shop instead of hauling her in front of a judge. Problem solved without alienating customers and employers (i.e. taxpayers). No more of these simple and fair solutions under crooked Biden.
I know that these accounts may not be what some people prefer to hear on this forum but it is nevertheless the true account of my experiences.
Coming back to the E in ATFE, the days when you could, should and would buy Dynamite sticks in the local hardware store are over, most certainly after we have been invaded by the Aloa Snackbar crowd. Who is going to keep the sale, storage and use of 'energetic materials' somewhat sane after you abolish the ATF?
I have the feeling that Trump is going to shift most of the enforcement activities out of ATF and have them focus on the administrative side. But time will tell.
All the NFA nonsense (SBRs and SBS were defined to close a loophole around a proposed handgun ban. The handgun ban was fortunately struck down but the SBR and SBS rules remained) has to be dealt with on the legislative side i.e Congress.
ATF does not have the power to change the existing law as confirmed in the SCOTUS ruling that ended the Chevron deference.
While Kash and Dan are hopefully dealing with the tyrants and their thugs it is up to us pushing for the desired legislative changes. How about Hearing Protection Act v2 0?
I will assume on an individual level this is probably the case in a whole lot of entities not just the ATF.
What we are talking about here is NOT just removing the bad apples. We are talking about major structural reform that are sorely needed so that people don't have to just hope and pray that they "get a nice agent".
If you have any agency that can make up rules on their own (ie Chevron deference) and have a literal police force of their own under the same roof, and they can hand out unilateral punishment to whomever they want... that structure is a problem regardless if some or most people working there are nice people or not.
Furthermore 'checks and balances' can work in hundreds of different ways. As it sits now they can drag you into court any time they please or they can conduct a midnight raid at your house regardless of the actual situation.
A few million dollars and several years later you might win in court, or your surviving spouse could win a huge settlement.
On the flip side, if they have to appeal to a completely different outside agency to either get you to court or conduct that raid, then at least in theory the checks and balances are preventative rather than a form of repair.
A few million dollars and several years later you might win in court, or your surviving spouse could win a huge settlement.
On the flip side, if they have to appeal to a completely different outside agency to either get you to court or conduct that raid, then at least in theory the checks and balances are preventative rather than a form of repair.
as far as i am concerned, all they've ever done is restrict my rights. and i have ZERO respect for any of that.
Well, then someone needs to explain this better to them, because they sure don’t think that way.
Kash took his out on the Bhagavad Gita instead of a Bible.
I agree completely.
Chevron is gone. My bet is that Trump will demilitarize ATF and several other agencies. There was also a recent challenge to the power of administrative judges. So we are heading in the right direction.
Kash and Dan cleaning out the ranks of the ATF leadership and certain SACs running the field offices, should get us much closer to the constitutional intent of limited government that protects our rights rather than trampling on them.
The challenge is to make this reform so lasting that a future hostile administration cannot quickly subvert it again.
But in any case, throwing the baby out with the bathwater and reverting to practical anarchy is not a realistic option.
As much as I hate to mention it, there is a valid use case for ATF if properly and responsibly led.
The conversation is about a new head of FBI and the ATF. I'm wondering if they'll alleviate the brace / no brace registration roller coaster gun owners had to put up with during the Biden administration plus will they do away with having to register a suppressor.
should be the same for state and locals-body cam-forgot,broke,lost=fired,loss of pension,felony charges,permanent black ball in the LE world. EVERYTHING recorded and stored forever. EVERY LE interaction with civs-speeding ticket,jaywalking gun fight,everything.
Which hopefully results in doing away with their nonsense laws that the ATF just arbitrarily made up, like registering and shouldering guns with arm braces.
which seems would eliminate the SBR "law" which would be great IMHO.
While I agree wholeheartedly, those are individual laws or policies or whatever. Without the SBR law the brace rule wouldn't exist. That said those are different fights. Even if we got the biggest best gun loving pro 2A people in the history of the world to fill every slot at the ATF they STILL couldn't change the SBR law. To me that's a Congress thing not an ATF thing. Same with suppressors.
