1:8" twist in a .308 Win. short barreled rifle - will it work?
- Thread starter Jayjay1
- Start date
Hi,
That is jacketed bullets spinning the lead out from being spun too fast.
Sincerely,
Theis
That is jacketed bullets spinning the lead out from being spun too fast.
Sincerely,
Theis
You gonna spin a 175 SMK or 185 JUG out of its jacket from a .308 case? Probably not.
If all the OP wants to do is launch 150’s then the 1-8” makes no sense.
Heavies is the ONLY reason I’d go with a 1-8”
When I had a 1-8 308 it was prone to throwing fliers on me.
It was really the only rifle I ever sold since starting the site
I have seen some do very well, others not so much., and for sure you can see SD appear in the 1-8 requiring you to manage it better at distance.
It was really the only rifle I ever sold since starting the site
I have seen some do very well, others not so much., and for sure you can see SD appear in the 1-8 requiring you to manage it better at distance.
OP here:
Well, this will be my first hunting rifle, and it will be the most expensive rifle I´ve ever bought as well.
A buddy of mine has this type of rifle now for three years, and I was hooked since the day I saw it.
I´ve seen and handled really a lot of rifles in my life, but this one is outstanding above all of them.
So I never got this rifle out of my brain and every time we met, he let me handle and shoot his if I wanted to, and this made it worse.
And because of the availability of components and ammo over here it has to be the .308 Winchester.
For supressor use in our woods here, I want to have it short and handy.
So you can have barrels with 1:12 from 20" up to 24", but this will make it heavy and nose-heavy, and I don´t trust the 20" barrel in the 1:12 twist - because of understabilization in this short barrel.
But you can have another barrel in .308 Win., this 18" with a 1:8" twist.
bergerbullets.com
You have to know, that changing barrels from a barrel maker is a very expensive and cumbersome thing (officials and documents).
And this rifle, which has an interchangeable barrel option, needs some very special connection points, which will not be made by every barrel maker easy.
So I called the manufacturer and asked him, if there is no other option, like a 1:10 in an 18 or 20" barrel or so.
And he said, they have tested their standard 1:12" barrel down to 16" and some have shot and others were all over the place.
So they talked to their barrel maker, which is Lothar Walther, and out came this 18" barrel in 1:8.
The sales manager told me, that he himself uses this rifle with exact this barrel and it shoots outstanding.
That´s the long story.
Wanting this rifle like I´ve never wanted one before, having to choose between 20" in 1:12 and 18" in 1:8.
And it must take solids as well as jacketed bullets.
www.hms-strasser.com
www.strasser-usa.com
Well, this will be my first hunting rifle, and it will be the most expensive rifle I´ve ever bought as well.
A buddy of mine has this type of rifle now for three years, and I was hooked since the day I saw it.
I´ve seen and handled really a lot of rifles in my life, but this one is outstanding above all of them.
So I never got this rifle out of my brain and every time we met, he let me handle and shoot his if I wanted to, and this made it worse.
And because of the availability of components and ammo over here it has to be the .308 Winchester.
For supressor use in our woods here, I want to have it short and handy.
So you can have barrels with 1:12 from 20" up to 24", but this will make it heavy and nose-heavy, and I don´t trust the 20" barrel in the 1:12 twist - because of understabilization in this short barrel.
But you can have another barrel in .308 Win., this 18" with a 1:8" twist.
Twist Rate Stability Calculator
Our newly updated Twist Rate Stability Calculator not only tells you what your SG is, but it also lets you know if you are reaching your optimized BC.
bergerbullets.com
You have to know, that changing barrels from a barrel maker is a very expensive and cumbersome thing (officials and documents).
And this rifle, which has an interchangeable barrel option, needs some very special connection points, which will not be made by every barrel maker easy.
So I called the manufacturer and asked him, if there is no other option, like a 1:10 in an 18 or 20" barrel or so.
And he said, they have tested their standard 1:12" barrel down to 16" and some have shot and others were all over the place.
So they talked to their barrel maker, which is Lothar Walther, and out came this 18" barrel in 1:8.
The sales manager told me, that he himself uses this rifle with exact this barrel and it shoots outstanding.
That´s the long story.
Wanting this rifle like I´ve never wanted one before, having to choose between 20" in 1:12 and 18" in 1:8.
And it must take solids as well as jacketed bullets.
Die STRASSER RS 14 EVOLUTION Jagdgewehre | Die Gewehre für Jagd & Sport
STRASSER Jagdgewehre und Sportgewehre der zuverlässige Begleiter für die Jagd & Schießsport ✔ Mehr Infos >>
www.hms-strasser.com
Strasser USA - Strasser USA
Classic features combined with modern European design
www.strasser-usa.com
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I think many missed the first line in the OP "I want to buy a hunting rifle in .308 Winchester which will be shot both, supressed and unsupressed."
He is not looking for the ultimate F-Class or BR rifle. It is an off the shelf hunting rifle to be used suppressed and unsuppressed. An 1:8 twist, 18" 308 will be absolutely fine, and as a bonus will stabilize 220+ grain bullets at subsonic velocities. He's not going to be blowing up bullets.
He is not looking for the ultimate F-Class or BR rifle. It is an off the shelf hunting rifle to be used suppressed and unsuppressed. An 1:8 twist, 18" 308 will be absolutely fine, and as a bonus will stabilize 220+ grain bullets at subsonic velocities. He's not going to be blowing up bullets.
^^^^^
This. I didn't miss it.
20" barrel in 1-12" won't understabilize unless you are shooting subsonic. You don't have to shoot subsonic though, to use a suppressor.
This. I didn't miss it.
20" barrel in 1-12" won't understabilize unless you are shooting subsonic. You don't have to shoot subsonic though, to use a suppressor.
The context helps. FWIW, a 20 inch 1:12 will easily stabilize anything up to 175 grain bullets, but if you are interested in solids or subsonic rounds then you may indeed need more twist. However, those are still what I would consider niche cases, and for general purpose use in a 308 there would be no need to go past 1:10 even with a 16 inch barrel.OP here:
Well, this will be my first hunting rifle, and it will be the most expensive rifle I´ve ever bought as well.
A buddy of mine has this type of rifle now for three years, and I was hooked since the day I saw it.
I´ve seen and handled really a lot of rifles in my life, but this one is outstanding above all of them.
So I never got this rifle out of my brain and every time we met, he let me handle and shoot his if I wanted to, and this made it worse.
And because of the availability of components and ammo over here it has to be the .308 Winchester.
For supressor use in our woods here, I want to have it short and handy.
So you can have barrels with 1:12 from 20" up to 24", but this will make it heavy and nose-heavy, and I don´t trust the 20" barrel in the 1:12 twist - because of understabilization in this short barrel.
But you can have another barrel in .308 Win., this 18" with a 1:8" twist.
Twist Rate Stability Calculator
Our newly updated Twist Rate Stability Calculator not only tells you what your SG is, but it also lets you know if you are reaching your optimized BC.
You have to know, that changing barrels from a barrel maker is a very expensive and cumbersome thing (officials and documents).
And this rifle, which has an interchangeable barrel option, needs some very special connection points, which will not be made by every barrel maker easy.
So I called the manufacturer and asked him, if there is no other option, like a 1:10 in an 18 or 20" barrel or so.
And he said, they have tested their standard 1:12" barrel down to 16" and some have shot and others were all over the place.
So they talked to their barrel maker, which is Lothar Walther, and out came this 18" barrel in 1:8.
The sales manager told me, that he himself uses this rifle with exact this barrel and it shoots outstanding.
That´s the long story.
Wanting this rifle like I´ve never wanted one before, having to choose between 20" in 1:12 and 18" in 1:8.
And it must take solids as well as jacketed bullets.
Die STRASSER RS 14 EVOLUTION Jagdgewehre | Die Gewehre für Jagd & Sport
STRASSER Jagdgewehre und Sportgewehre der zuverlässige Begleiter für die Jagd & Schießsport ✔ Mehr Infos >>
Strasser USA - Strasser USA
Classic features combined with modern European design
And that´s the point, there are two options from which I have to choose.
20" with a 1:12" twist or
18" with a 1:8" twist
for hunting
supressed and unsupressed
solids and jacketed bullets
I would do 1/8 if you ever plan to handload subsonics and don't mind shooting mostly 175-185 gr supersonics or plan to experiment and handload with heavies (ie: Berger 200s - Hornady 208s).
Otherwise 1:12 if you plan to shoot 147-175grs.
There is really right or wrong answers, it depends what kind of shooting. For most people here, 1:10. If you plan to shoot mostly factory ammo ? 1:12 would be better than 1:8.
You won't have much issue shooting the 150 gr class solids but the heavier 168 Barnes they recommend 1:11 or faster, so you'd have to stay with 150s.
Hornady says you're fine with 1:8 to 1:12 twist for their 165 GMX
Otherwise 1:12 if you plan to shoot 147-175grs.
There is really right or wrong answers, it depends what kind of shooting. For most people here, 1:10. If you plan to shoot mostly factory ammo ? 1:12 would be better than 1:8.
You won't have much issue shooting the 150 gr class solids but the heavier 168 Barnes they recommend 1:11 or faster, so you'd have to stay with 150s.
Hornady says you're fine with 1:8 to 1:12 twist for their 165 GMX
A solid copper or brass bullet is less dense than lead. As such to make an equal mass you need to add more material. You are limited by the bore diameter for a given caliber so the only way to get more copper in is to make it longer.
Length is really what twist rate is fighting, not mass. The longer the bullet the more the center of gravity and air resistance can move away from the center and thus it starts to pitch and yaw and if it yaws too much and catches the air resistance it starts to tumble. Spinning it faster let’s it’s rotational velocity cause the bullet to fall back into its center of gravity/axis of travel and thus not tumble as easily, or at least as soon. The forces sorta cancel each other out.
Yaws too much and it turns into a sail but if it spins back to the opposite side fast enough it will right itself and cancel out staying stabile in flight.
Spin it faster and it will have less time to yaw before it spins and the force turn the opposite direction so basically you just keep it falling into itself.
So that’s why solids are generally needing a faster twist rate than a lead bullet at a given weight. If you took a copper and lead bullet that are the same length and profile they will take the same twist, it’s just the copper won’t be as heavy.
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Does the length of the bullet become an issue with a twist so fast that you begin to impart different twist forces at the front and rear of the bullet bearing surfaces?
Im guessing the the rifling would have to resemble machine screw thread to have the front of the bearing surface entering a whole different stage of rotation than the rear.
At some point pressure is going to win and just skid the bullet over the rifling.
Apologies for my thoughts if non applicable to the OPs question.
Just learning shit through smarter people.
My little experiment is not going to be on an ultra short barrel at 21 inches, nor is my twist drastic. with gain twist I guess Im hedging my bet and with only 21 inches to get the gain in how much will it matter?
If you listen to Frank Green on the EDS Podcasts,
He talks about bullet length as a bigger factor than weight when it comes to twisting the barrel correctly
We default to weight, but length is really the bigger issue at play
He talks about bullet length as a bigger factor than weight when it comes to twisting the barrel correctly
We default to weight, but length is really the bigger issue at play
So, regarding this, what confirms what I was guessing, back to topic and to the starting question.
Should I go with the 18" barrel in a 1:8" twist or with the 20" barrel in a 1:12" twist?
This are the two options I have, which way should I go?
Should I go with the 18" barrel in a 1:8" twist or with the 20" barrel in a 1:12" twist?
This are the two options I have, which way should I go?
It is really going to depend on the specific solids you want to shoot. Either will work for lead bullets but you will get better performance from the 20 inch.
Im sure. Thats generally why people say to start development over at the bottom when switching to a solid.
And thats also why people say to avoid over spinning lead core bullets, eventually its more than the lead innards can take and its gonna shift inside of the jacket and be unbalanced then.
As to how much it takes to skid itself through the lands and stop being properly engraved? No idea. I imagine it would take way more than normal pressures for the bullets acceleration to be more than the engraving forces can manage.
You had said "Jacketed from around 150 to 180grs., solids from 130 to 165grs. I guess."
Honestly, until you start trying to push 190+ grain bullets I dont think it will make a bit of difference. For what you described Id get whats in stock where its cheapest personally. I say it will be more of a toss up between the individual barrels which shoots better and thats just a roll of the dice.
Well, that´s what I have guessed what´s common, isn´t it?
It is actually my first hunting rilfe and my first .308 Win..
I would love to hear other experiences.
Regarding the twist rate calculator from Berger, a 20" barrel in a 1:12" twist everything above 168gr. is "Marginal Stability" or "Unstable".
But that´s just a calculator, practice beats theory, so it would be a blast for me to learn from you guys.
What velocity are you putting in? You should be fine up to 185 grain lead bullets in a 1:12. Or are you talking about solids.
I honestly have to say, I have no idea.
I just played around with the berger bullet weights, velocities and the twist rate 1:12" in that calculator.
Those are all jacketed, right?
So what is your guess?
I think solid bullets will have less weight, but are longer.
I have no idea or experience with those twists in this caliber, that´s why I´m asking.
I just played around with the berger bullet weights, velocities and the twist rate 1:12" in that calculator.
Those are all jacketed, right?
So what is your guess?
I think solid bullets will have less weight, but are longer.
I have no idea or experience with those twists in this caliber, that´s why I´m asking.
For several years I was shooting a Rem700 LTR with a 20 inch 1in12 barrel. Main load was a 178 Amax handload or 175 FGMM. Both shot very well out past 900 yards.
Thanks guys, I highly appreciate your input and help with my decision.
So I will go with the 20"/1:12 twist.
Yes, it is a switch barrel rifle and I´m planing to get other barrels but in other calibers in the future.
But the .308 Win barrel will be my starting point and "one for all" in the beginning.
Thanks again, I really had no clue how to decide on my own.
So I will go with the 20"/1:12 twist.
Yes, it is a switch barrel rifle and I´m planing to get other barrels but in other calibers in the future.
But the .308 Win barrel will be my starting point and "one for all" in the beginning.
Thanks again, I really had no clue how to decide on my own.
What was the load data? 185 Berger at 2700 FPS from a 20 inch barrel sounds pretty good for my upcoming 20 inch 308.
Per Mr. Greenhill:
It's NOT the WEIGHT, it's the LENGTH, which is a function of the weight / sectional density. A solid Tungsten 220gn bullet would be quite shot, and so would the life if teh rifling in any barrel launching one. A 220 gn Aluminium bullet would be ludicrously long and require a suitably ludicrously fast twist-rate. There is a VERY good reason Lead is used in bullets,; jacketed or not!
Take the classic .30-06.
It started out as the .30-03 with 220-ish gn round-nosed, thick (nickel) jacketed bullets. It took a 1:10" twist to stabilize that bullet at all temperatures, from the standard barrel length.
Enter the Mauser "S" bullet of approx 154gn, but fired in M-98 Mausers previously shooting the industry-standard "torpedoes"..
Yes, several astute ballisticians around the world were switched on to pointy , lighter-weight bullets, but uptake was slow at first..
All "service" .30-06 barrels of my acquaintance have 1:10" twist barrels.
When 7.62 NATO came on the scene, it STARTED with a lighter, SHORTER bullet that woulld happily stabilize in 1:12" twists out of barrels as short as 18". (The G-3 has a 19" barrel as standard, as compared to 22" on the M-14 and 24 on the FAL / L1A1).
ALL of these shoot "standardized" factory ammo that performs within very tight parameters.
The problem with shooting a LONG, heavy bullet from a standard (1:12") .308 is two-fold. Firstly; slinky VLD type projectiles are LONG for weight (mass, if you prefer). This means that they must be seated well out to get a reasonable propellant load in the compact case. Seating LONG, secant-ogive bullets back into the case WILL greatly reduce powder space AND cause dramas with the engagement between the neck and the bullet.
Then we get to Mr. Greenhill and his formula. Yes, it is old and was developed in the late days of black-powder, but it is a pretty good guide for bullets travelling below 3000 feet per second..
Essentially: For a given mass, the longer the bullet, the FASTER it must be spun to correctly stabilize.
The classic "modern" lesson in this appeared with the .300 Whisper / Blackout. 1: 8" twist or tighter barrels are pretty standard in these.
This is simply because the projectile MUST be spun at or above a defined rotational speed or it will "go walkies" as soon as it leaves the muzzle. A 220gn jacketed spitzer tumbling through a muffler would not b a pretty sight.
There WILL be a practical maximum muzzle velocity achievable from a 16" barrel. The heavier the bullet, the lower will be this velocity. However, for a given rifling twist rate, the rotational rate of the bullet is inexorably tied to muzzle velocity.
If you MUST have a 16" barreled .308, it would be best to stick to 150gn or lighter-bullets loaded for velocity.
I cleaned up a LOT of feral pigs in these parts with an old Spanish carbine in .308 (probably a 7.62NATO chamber) with 130gn HPs stoked pretty hard. LOUD, but the pests fell over on command and I never felt too worried about that little carbine that was originally built around the 7 57 cartridge in the 1890's.
It's NOT the WEIGHT, it's the LENGTH, which is a function of the weight / sectional density. A solid Tungsten 220gn bullet would be quite shot, and so would the life if teh rifling in any barrel launching one. A 220 gn Aluminium bullet would be ludicrously long and require a suitably ludicrously fast twist-rate. There is a VERY good reason Lead is used in bullets,; jacketed or not!
Take the classic .30-06.
It started out as the .30-03 with 220-ish gn round-nosed, thick (nickel) jacketed bullets. It took a 1:10" twist to stabilize that bullet at all temperatures, from the standard barrel length.
Enter the Mauser "S" bullet of approx 154gn, but fired in M-98 Mausers previously shooting the industry-standard "torpedoes"..
Yes, several astute ballisticians around the world were switched on to pointy , lighter-weight bullets, but uptake was slow at first..
All "service" .30-06 barrels of my acquaintance have 1:10" twist barrels.
When 7.62 NATO came on the scene, it STARTED with a lighter, SHORTER bullet that woulld happily stabilize in 1:12" twists out of barrels as short as 18". (The G-3 has a 19" barrel as standard, as compared to 22" on the M-14 and 24 on the FAL / L1A1).
ALL of these shoot "standardized" factory ammo that performs within very tight parameters.
The problem with shooting a LONG, heavy bullet from a standard (1:12") .308 is two-fold. Firstly; slinky VLD type projectiles are LONG for weight (mass, if you prefer). This means that they must be seated well out to get a reasonable propellant load in the compact case. Seating LONG, secant-ogive bullets back into the case WILL greatly reduce powder space AND cause dramas with the engagement between the neck and the bullet.
Then we get to Mr. Greenhill and his formula. Yes, it is old and was developed in the late days of black-powder, but it is a pretty good guide for bullets travelling below 3000 feet per second..
Essentially: For a given mass, the longer the bullet, the FASTER it must be spun to correctly stabilize.
The classic "modern" lesson in this appeared with the .300 Whisper / Blackout. 1: 8" twist or tighter barrels are pretty standard in these.
This is simply because the projectile MUST be spun at or above a defined rotational speed or it will "go walkies" as soon as it leaves the muzzle. A 220gn jacketed spitzer tumbling through a muffler would not b a pretty sight.
There WILL be a practical maximum muzzle velocity achievable from a 16" barrel. The heavier the bullet, the lower will be this velocity. However, for a given rifling twist rate, the rotational rate of the bullet is inexorably tied to muzzle velocity.
If you MUST have a 16" barreled .308, it would be best to stick to 150gn or lighter-bullets loaded for velocity.
I cleaned up a LOT of feral pigs in these parts with an old Spanish carbine in .308 (probably a 7.62NATO chamber) with 130gn HPs stoked pretty hard. LOUD, but the pests fell over on command and I never felt too worried about that little carbine that was originally built around the 7 57 cartridge in the 1890's.
A friend of mine who is a smith in the UK builds an 18" 308 with a 1 in 10 twist shooting 180-185 bullets, I have shot a couple of them, they are accurate and a very handy size. Both times I used one I had a quarter inch 5 round group at one hundred
In the case of overtwisting tearing the bullet apart, it's the length of the bearing surface, not overall length of the bullet. The bearing surface on a high BC bullet isn't all that different from a standard length bullet, i.e. a 147 FMJBT. A 220-250gr. standard ogive will have a long bearing surface. Which shouldn't be an issue at subsonic speeds.
I've never been a fan of especially deliberately shortened barrels, then trying to get the heavy bullet to get and keep velocity, while running up the twist for whatever reason. I also don't do suppressors, and my preferred shooting is LR, which favors the longer barrel. That part is changing, checking/repairing/changing targets at 1000yd is getting pretty tiring at my age.
That's a good recipe for subsonics, without the velocity. With the velocity, it's a pretty good way to damage the bullets at their interface with the rifling.
Accept the 18" length, it's very likely about as far into your plan as you can get with a reasonable expectation of success. These makers know their barrels.
The 1:8" twist is not a big issue, especially if the maker is offering it right up front. Just understand that if you drive thin jackets at high twist, and high velocity, you can lose those jackets, as some varmint shooters have found out the hard way.
Greg
That's a good recipe for subsonics, without the velocity. With the velocity, it's a pretty good way to damage the bullets at their interface with the rifling.
Accept the 18" length, it's very likely about as far into your plan as you can get with a reasonable expectation of success. These makers know their barrels.
The 1:8" twist is not a big issue, especially if the maker is offering it right up front. Just understand that if you drive thin jackets at high twist, and high velocity, you can lose those jackets, as some varmint shooters have found out the hard way.
Greg
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Regarding the risk of thinly-jacketed bullets coming apart because of the stress / deformation caused by rifling, consider the use of a "polygonal" rifling type.
There are NO sharp edges in a polygon bore. There is a "native" US version called "5R", initially, I think, from Bartlein barrels.
"5R" forms have an odd number of "grooves' five seems to be most common but three is pretty popular. "3R"??
Remember that the original Lee Metford used SEVEN-"grooved", polygonal rifling, and that was 1888. With single-tooth cutters doing the rifling work. Buttoning was a bit in he future and hammer forging was several decades away. The advent of hotter-burning Cordite and heavier Nickel jackets saw them burning out quite quickly, to be replaced by the more conventional Enfield 5-groove pattern.
Heckler and Koch have produced MILLIONS of polygonal-bored arms over the decades; they seemed to work OK in service weapons, under service conditions. Also handy is the simple fact that polygonal rifling, with NO sharp internal or external corners, is a relative breeze to properly apply hard chrome. The absence of sharp corners means the deposition thickness of the chrome is very even on the steel substrate.
There are NO sharp edges in a polygon bore. There is a "native" US version called "5R", initially, I think, from Bartlein barrels.
"5R" forms have an odd number of "grooves' five seems to be most common but three is pretty popular. "3R"??
Remember that the original Lee Metford used SEVEN-"grooved", polygonal rifling, and that was 1888. With single-tooth cutters doing the rifling work. Buttoning was a bit in he future and hammer forging was several decades away. The advent of hotter-burning Cordite and heavier Nickel jackets saw them burning out quite quickly, to be replaced by the more conventional Enfield 5-groove pattern.
Heckler and Koch have produced MILLIONS of polygonal-bored arms over the decades; they seemed to work OK in service weapons, under service conditions. Also handy is the simple fact that polygonal rifling, with NO sharp internal or external corners, is a relative breeze to properly apply hard chrome. The absence of sharp corners means the deposition thickness of the chrome is very even on the steel substrate.
Feedback FWIW:
After a lot of research and discussing in different forums, playing around with QL and twist rate calculators, I decided to give the 18" - 1:8" twist barrel a shot, because why not?
I´m a reloader and have all options to bring it to shoot.
I now have the option to do some hunting loads, maybe with a bit heavier bullets though, but as well to bastel some subsonic-kinda-300BC-loads.
A 1:10" twist would been more versatile, but is not to have from this manufacturer, so be it.
The salesman from the manufacturer told me, he has the 1:8" - 18" version himself and is very satisfied with it, he even emailed me a target disc from him with three different ammos from 136 up to 185 gr. and they looked ok.
After all I trusted the 1:8" short version more than the 1:12" short version.
The regional trader doesn´t have this version in stock, he does have the 22" - 1:12" version but that was to long and heavy for my taste, so it will take a while.
Thanks to all of you, bringing in your ideas, meanings and experiences.
I have learned a lot.
Best wishes,
Jay
After a lot of research and discussing in different forums, playing around with QL and twist rate calculators, I decided to give the 18" - 1:8" twist barrel a shot, because why not?
I´m a reloader and have all options to bring it to shoot.
I now have the option to do some hunting loads, maybe with a bit heavier bullets though, but as well to bastel some subsonic-kinda-300BC-loads.
A 1:10" twist would been more versatile, but is not to have from this manufacturer, so be it.
The salesman from the manufacturer told me, he has the 1:8" - 18" version himself and is very satisfied with it, he even emailed me a target disc from him with three different ammos from 136 up to 185 gr. and they looked ok.
After all I trusted the 1:8" short version more than the 1:12" short version.
The regional trader doesn´t have this version in stock, he does have the 22" - 1:12" version but that was to long and heavy for my taste, so it will take a while.
Thanks to all of you, bringing in your ideas, meanings and experiences.
I have learned a lot.
Best wishes,
Jay
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I run a 16 inch 1/8 twist. Overall, I'm satisfied with the performance. I think you will be as well.
I have had experience with a rifle very similar, 1:8 twist tack driver bolt gun(pic below)
I have since had X Caliber build me a 16” 1:8 twist barrel for an AR build and it shoots good as well.
Attachments
Yeah I put out 2475 FPS out of 175gr with 44gr of varget and Lapua brass. Maybe there’s a magic powder out there ?
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