1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

[cybersniper]

hello:
Any experiences on shooting 1000 yards with a 24" barrel 308 would be appreciated.
EDuardo

 

[Two Shoes]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Sure,, No problemo.............what ya wanna know...............
24" is plenty.

 

[cybersniper]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I have tested the issue commercial ammunitions i use (Spain DOD) and the speeds i have obtained are on a new 1:12 barrel:
M80 147gr : 790ms
Norma Diamon Line Sierra SMK 168gr : 746ms
Lapua lock base 170gr: 767ms

that is a little on the slow side to be supersonic at 1000 yards, so i may need to reload.

What are your recommendations of realoading for 1000yard competition.

.308 1000 yard realoding is a new game for me.
Thanks for your help
Eduardo

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Your velocities for the bullet weights listed seem very low. Unless those bullets have BC values in excess of .650, none of these bullets will be supersonic at 1000 yards/900 meters. You need a velocity in excess of 850 m/s for those bullets, especially the 168gr. I don't know that you can get the M80 supersonic at 1000 yards with any .308 load. The Lapua 170 would have the most chance of being supersonic, especially if you shot at an elevation over 1000 meters above sea level.

I see handloading in your future.

I am not ready to talk about my 1000 yard .308 load until I have done some more testing but others will be happy to chime in.

 

[cybersniper]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sig685</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Your velocities for the bullet weights listed seem very low. Unless those bullets have BC values in excess of .650, none of these bullets will be supersonic at 1000 yards/900 meters. You need a velocity in excess of 850 m/s for those bullets, especially the 168gr. I don't know that you can get the M80 supersonic at 1000 yards with any .308 load. The Lapua 170 would have the most chance of being supersonic, especially if you shot at an elevation over 1000 meters above sea level.

I see handloading in your future.

I am not ready to talk about my 1000 yard .308 load until I have done some more testing but others will be happy to chime in. </div></div>

I will recheck speeds with a different chrongraph and after the barrel has shot a few hundred rounds. Those where the first 30 rounds ever shot though it and always cleaning after each shot, so the barrel conditions where non standard in any way.

You have confirmed my ideas but have you shot the 155 palmas?

That is the bullet that supposedly would more easily get past 1000yards supersonic, and with a high BC it will keep its speed and cope the wind nicely too. I will try Berger 155 VLC first than the 175 VLD.

What kind of speeds do you get from them?

Thanks
eduardo

 

[Criver600]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

99.9% of my 1000 yard shooting with a 308 is with my palma rifles. 32/34 inch barrels with iron sights. (yes 34 inches)
I have a 24 inch Obermeyer barreled 308 and frankly I'm impressed with how well it shoots at 1000 yards. I'm getting 2706 out of 175smk's

 

[cybersniper]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">99.9% of my 1000 yard shooting with a 308 is with my palma rifles. 32/34 inch barrels with iron sights. (yes 34 inches)
I have a 24 inch Obermeyer barreled 308 and frankly I'm impressed with how well it shoots at 1000 yards. I'm getting 2706 out of 175smk's </div></div>

What loads you have with that overmeyer??? looks promising

Thanks
ed

 

[kraigWY]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I dont have a 24 in 308, my across the course gun is 26", but I've shoot a heck of a lot of 1000 yard (service rifle) matches with M14/M1As, with the 22 in barrel. They do fine.

I shot a 1000 yard team match at 29 Plams shooting next to the AMU team. They were shooting M14s. I'm not gonna say what our team shoot but the AMUs score was 799 with a poop pot full of Xs. Again they were using 22" barrels. They didn't appear to have any problems, except for that poor guy who dropped a point, He caught Holy He!!. Shoot I always figured a 199 out of 200 at 1000 yards was a respectible score, Apparently not for the AMU.

Anyway if one cant shoot a 24 in barrel I it isnt the gun.

 

[mp45acp]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

We shoot a 20" howa, a 24" savage and a 26" remington all to 1000 yards pretty regularly.

Its more the choice of ammo and the scope clarity to SEE at 1000 yards.

Once you know your rifle and obtain some dope cards or make your own, its just a matter of discipline.

 

[Two Shoes]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

What rifle/ barrel do you have, and what cases, powder do you have ready access to?.

 

[Jicko]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cybersniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">hello:
Any experiences on shooting 1000 yards with a 24" barrel 308 would be appreciated.
EDuardo </div></div>

In terms of bullets, your best bet is 175SMK and 155Scenar... and a couple of others..

For commercial ammo, FGMM175SMK is your best bet...

Try those first.... 24" .308WIN should get you to 1k....

 

[Criver600]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

175 SMK, Winchester brass, Federal 210GM, 45 grains of Varget, 2.8 oal. Reduce 10% and work up carefully. 5R barrels can be significantly faster than conventionally rifled barrels.

 

[echotango]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> 175 SMK, Winchester brass, Federal 210GM, 45 grains of Varget, 2.8 oal. Reduce 10% and work up carefully. 5R barrels can be significantly faster than conventionally rifled barrels.</div></div>

I've shot 1000 yards with the above load out of a 22" barreled Remington 700 PSS with no problems.

 

[McCrazy]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I have shot a little past 1,000 meters (about 1,100 yards) with no problem using a 24 inch barreled M24 in 7.62x51mm (.308 Win) using the M118LR ammo (with the 175gr SMK).

The combination you mention will get you out to 1,000 yards no problem.

 

[Jon Lester]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

46g of Varget behind 155 Lapuas @ 2900 through a Bartline gives excellent results at 1000

Thanks Patriot Arms

 

[lane223]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

cyber,

Are you shooting 1000 yards in Spain? If so, where are you hiding it?

.

 

[lane223]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Anyone use Tubal 3000, 5000 or 7000 for 308 loads. It's the most common powder I've found in Spain (when you can find it).

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I was banging a 10"x12" steel plate at 1020 yards Saturday with a 23.5" barreled 308 and the old Sierra Palma bullet (.450 BC) running them 2850 FPS. It helps to be at 8300" ASL.

The newer high BC 155s (Berger Fullbore and Sierra 2156) need to be driven 2900 FPS in order to remain supersonic at 1k at any altitude under any atmospheric conditions. Many locales can get by with a slightly slower 155 or a moderate speed 175 (.505 BC) out of a 24" barrel.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

 

[[email protected]]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Corbon 175 SMK's out of a 24" Obermeyer is just fine out to 1000.

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

Oh, I don't know. I kinda like the 200SMKs going out at over 2700FPS in my little .308.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sig685</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

Oh, I don't know. I kinda like the 200SMKs going out at over 2700FPS in my little .308. </div></div>

Ive been there as well and its a 308 trying to be a 30-06 it has preasure on the raged edge..I can push 155's IN A 18.5" BARREL at 2920 if I wanted to,but that would be a 18.5" trying to be a 24" barrel..

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Actually, it's faster than a 30-06, but there are no pressure signs, the brass is nice and bolt lifts easily. In fact, I am not even at max load according to the book. The trick of course, is a good long barrel.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

All,

I earned my LR HM Club pin with a 24 inch barreled .308 shooting with irons. I didn't win every tournment; and, certainly, there are better guns/ammo out there for LR; nevertheless, with skill, it may get the job done.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sig685</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Actually, it's faster than a 30-06, but there are no pressure signs, the brass is nice and bolt lifts easily. In fact, I am not even at max load according to the book. The trick of course, is a good long barrel. </div></div>

A 24" barrel ?

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Oh Good God, now. It's a 32 inch barrel. F-T/R is already difficult enough with the minuscule targets, why would I make it even more difficult shooting it with a low BC bullet like the 155 or 175SMK as I graduate, so to speak, to .308?

I love the discussions here where people are trying to use the shortest barrel possible to get to 1000 yards. In actually think the better way is to go in the opposite direction and let the barrel use more of those lovely hot gases generated by the powder instead of generating a nasty, bullet-buffeting, blinding muzzle blast.

I consider 24 inches the bare minimum for .308 at 1000, and more is better.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sig685</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh Good God, now. It's a 32 inch barrel. F-T/R is already difficult enough with the minuscule targets, why would I make it even more difficult shooting it with a low BC bullet like the 155 or 175SMK as I graduate, so to speak, to .308?

I love the discussions here where people are trying to use the shortest barrel possible to get to 1000 yards. In actually think the better way is to go in the opposite direction and let the barrel use more of those lovely hot gases generated by the powder instead of generating a nasty, bullet-buffeting, blinding muzzle blast.

I consider 24 inches the bare minimum for .308 at 1000, and more is better. </div></div>

Just wondering sence the thread was about 24" barrels and 1k,I would think the discusion would consider shorter than 24 before longer.

some can do well with less some need all the help they can get,bring that long pole to our mountain and see how you like it after a hump and fast shoot at 600 to 1100,Doors always open friend.

I have a CAN so blast is not an issue and its fast atach to keep it nemble ..

If an FTR class and stay in one spot then I would see the longer barrel option would help..

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All,

I earned my LR HM Club pin with a 24 inch barreled .308 shooting with irons. I didn't win every tournment; and, certainly, there are better guns/ammo out there for LR; nevertheless, with skill, it may get the job done. </div></div>

How many of those strings were shot at 600 under the old LR rules before the mid-range classification came out Skip?

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just wondering sence the thread was about 24" barrels and 1k,I would think the discusion would consider shorter than 24 before longer.

some can do well with less some need all the help they can get,bring that long pole to our mountain and see how you like it after a hump and fast shoot at 600 to 1100,Doors always open friend.

I have a CAN so blast is not an issue and its fast atach to keep it nemble ..

If an FTR class and stay in one spot then I would see the longer barrel option would help.. </div></div>

Thanks for the invite, but I am too old for that kind of running around. I do appreciate the invite however. F-class is about as much excitement and movement I can deal with.

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NineHotel</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All,

I earned my LR HM Club pin with a 24 inch barreled .308 shooting with irons. I didn't win every tournament; and, certainly, there are better guns/ammo out there for LR; nevertheless, with skill, it may get the job done. </div></div>

How many of those strings were shot at 600 under the old LR rules before the mid-range classification came out Skip?</div></div>

I shot a 600 x 3 at Oakridge in late 2002, my last tournament for the season. And, little doubt, those 600 yard events were used to compile my HM rating, as before any shooting in 2003 I had received my HM card.

Sometime, early in 2003, I began shooting a 6.5/284, and shot about 1200 rounds through it, of which about 160 were spent for (8) 600 yard events and the rest at 1000-HM scores in most, with one notable exception, a 1000 yard event where a bullet came apart before it reached the target, concluding in a score of 186 as I recall.

In late 2004, not having the financial resources to continue to compete at the HM level in Match Rifle division, I began shooting in Service Rifle division, and, at this time, I think I've got somewhere around a 90% average from an 8 or 9 match string at Ft. Knox.

At any rate that's an account of my recent LR shooting. BTW, when the LR championships included (3) 600 yard events did not all participants risk LR HM status?

 

[Criver600]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

HA HA, Depending on where you is in Abalama............ Show up at Oak Ridge some day with your 18.5 inch barreled 308 and shoot some scores against some longer barreled 308's

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

All,

In addition to basic prone skills, there are numerous strategies, tactics, and even some gamesmanship considerations which can come to the aid of the LR shooter. Just one of these considerations is barrel length. Obviously, when barrel length is not a weight or handling issue, longer is better, for the added velocity it inspires. My suggestion, look at the big picture, and put a plan together that takes into account everything important to getting the job done. Hint, for new shooters: Learn to call your shots, it maybe the most important LR skill for a multitude of reasons starting with shooter/target analysis.

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I think that a lot of people have fallen for the idea that a shorter barrel is a stiffer barrel and therefore more accurate. They then apply that concept to the accuracy that is required to do well at 1000 yards and then the game is on. How short can my barrel be and still allow me to reach 1000 yards.

A heavy 16 inch barrel may be more accurate that the same contour 24 or 32 inch barrel at 100 yards and maybe even 200 or 300 yards, but beyond that, muzzle velocity has a quality all of its own.

When you need to load your short barrel at max or beyond max and then inflict a humongous muzzle blast on yourself, your fellow shooters and your bullets, something is not making sense.

Your highly accurate 200 yard rifle simply can't keep up with the longer barreled rfiles. Whatever perceived accuracy increase you thought the shorter, stiffer barrel brought, is totally negated after a few hundred yards and the short barrel is now working against you.

Let me add to the list that Sterling Shooter has up above this post and say that if you intend to shoot at long distances, you need the tools to do that. Surprisingly enough, shortchanging yourself on the tools will cause less than stellar results. Yes, a longer barrel is more difficult to handle and weighs more, on the other hand, the results may well be worth the extra hassle. Only you can decide for yourself where the tradeoff is for your application.

I would think that dragging a rifle that weighs a few pounds less and is shorter by several inches but does not allow you to fulfill the mission (whatever the mission is,) is not a very defensible approach. But that's just me.

 

[Boomholzer]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I'd also throw in the load. I can easily better FGMM 175 dope from a 24" custom barrel or 26" factory Rem out of a 21" and that's certainly not a extreme case. Then consider what can be gained with say a 155 Lapua. Then what; reap the gains at length or gain utility with rifle?

give or take a few inches and say 80fps is going to make much difference if you can not judge the wind or environmentals.

As stated it's all a compromise, I would'nt dismiss shorter barrels. Depends on what shots/positions you want to make. I don't dislike length, I just don't have a specific favorite (all 20-24") or dismiss shorter tubes, especially with suppressors. Depends on what I am *trying to accomplish with one rifle. Perhaps a more ill trend in ultility is with real heavy/large contour vs the shorter length.

With a generic 175 SMK bullet, 80fps (rought 4" bbl length) difference is 0.4MOA (used 2600 vs 2680 since BC is dynamic) or 99.5" wind drift vs 103.9" (generic 10mph calculation). Now consider 0.2 MOA difference at 100yrds precision brought out to 1000yards with zero wind (easy hold error at 1,000, near twice the retical thickness with a 2FP). One half the MOA in example, both inside a common knob click of each other. Now consider untested/untrusted dope, environmentals, no clue on wind or your bad day. The example is well within the wash. Minimizing the range of windage for error in your wind call (vs ability) certainly helps but also consider slinging, humping rifle muzzle down, positional shooting, etc vs real difference in ballistics.

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Boomholzer, those are good thoughts. However consider this; whatever you do to the load to make a 21" act like a 24 inch, you can also do the same with the longer barrel. You bring up the 155 Scenars, well guess what with a 30 inch barrel, these bullets are leaving at 3000 FPS. I am not talking about a few inches of difference in barrel length, I am talking about 8 to 10 inches or more.

In terms of bullet performance for the long distance, it is my experience that you need both the muzzle velocity and the BC. It is useless to start a low BC bullet at high velocity as the latter will be shed at a prodigious rate and still come up short at long distance. On the other hand, pushing a high BC bullet at a low velocity does not accomplish the task either as you still need some type of velocity to conserve, if you know what I mean.

So, if I can start a high BC bullet at a high velocity, the time of flight will be shorter and the deviation due to atmospheric will be correspondingly less. In my case, I am pushing a 200gr SMK at 2700FPS, I would like to see you try that in a 21 inch .308. I think the difference will be closer to 400-500FPS, which at a 1000 yards represents a difference in drop of 12MOAs and 20 inches of your mythical steady 10MPH wind.

I was thinking that instead of cutting off inches of barrels on a .308, it might be better to use a more powerful caliber such as the .300WM if one really needs a short rifle for the long distance or perhaps something in a 6.5 or 7mm non-belted magnum.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

HA HA, Depending on where you is in Abalama............ Show up at Oak Ridge some day with your 18.5 inch barreled 308 and shoot some scores against some longer barreled 308's </div></div>

No thanks been to a match like it before F class type targets right?
I was told my rig I had at one time wasn't what was hot Kinda like your saying now,, I went shot 397 out of 400 20x windy day not bragging just telling the facts .. having someone pull the target and putting a big plug on it so you know where you are isn't the type of shooting I am interested in and don't think its uncool its just a different way of shooting with different equipment needs this is a tactical shooting hang out BTW..


Anyone is welcome to show me up at my range anytime for a friendly fun day,but only bring what you can carry by your person..

 

[Bacarrat]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

ASM1 what is your barrel specs to get those speeds out of the 155s? I am thinking about doing a similar setup. I have another caliber that will shoot to 1k without a problem, but if I could those speeds out of a .308 it would be a huge plus.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

factory 1/10 savage nothing special except its bore is on the tight side luck of the draw ? If I used the better powder for my aplication over the RL15 I have I would be at 2900+ at the same pressure..


9.8 MILLS TO 1K...or 35.28MOA

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

I read someone said muzzle flash was bad on a shorty ? I dont have any issue can off with blast or flash..

LL with his little stick hit the vid..


http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...true#Post775365

 

[Bacarrat]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

What can is that? SCAR H?

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

No,, its the 7.62SD fast attach ...

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

More vids of gladius going the distance..

scroll down

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1006178&page=1

 

[Criver600]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Sounds like you got it all figgered out........

 

[Sterling Shooter]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

HA HA, Depending on where you is in Abalama............ Show up at Oak Ridge some day with your 18.5 inch barreled 308 and shoot some scores against some longer barreled 308's </div></div>

No thanks been to a match like it before F class type targets right?
I was told my rig I had at one time wasn't what was hot Kinda like your saying now,, I went shot 397 out of 400 20x windy day not bragging just telling the facts .. having someone pull the target and putting a big plug on it so you know where you are isn't the type of shooting I am interested in and don't think its uncool its just a different way of shooting with different equipment needs this is a tactical shooting hang out BTW..


Anyone is welcome to show me up at my range anytime for a friendly fun day,but only bring what you can carry by your person..</div></div>

You shot a 397-20 on the current F-Class target with a .308? Wow!

 

[Sig685]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

HA HA, Depending on where you is in Abalama............ Show up at Oak Ridge some day with your 18.5 inch barreled 308 and shoot some scores against some longer barreled 308's </div></div>

No thanks been to a match like it before F class type targets right?
I was told my rig I had at one time wasn't what was hot Kinda like your saying now,, I went shot 397 out of 400 20x windy day not bragging just telling the facts .. having someone pull the target and putting a big plug on it so you know where you are isn't the type of shooting I am interested in and don't think its uncool its just a different way of shooting with different equipment needs this is a tactical shooting hang out BTW..


Anyone is welcome to show me up at my range anytime for a friendly fun day,but only bring what you can carry by your person..</div></div>

You shot a 397-20 on the current F-Class target with a .308? Wow! </div></div>

That was my reaction also. 397-20X is one heck of a score on the current F-class targets, for any range. Well done!

 

[Boomholzer]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sig685</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Boomholzer, those are good thoughts. However consider this; whatever you do to the load to make a 21" act like a 24 inch, you can also do the same with the longer barrel. You bring up the 155 Scenars, well guess what with a 30 inch barrel, these bullets are leaving at 3000 FPS. I am not talking about a few inches of difference in barrel length, I am talking about 8 to 10 inches or more.

In terms of bullet performance for the long distance, it is my experience that you need both the muzzle velocity and the BC. It is useless to start a low BC bullet at high velocity as the latter will be shed at a prodigious rate and still come up short at long distance. On the other hand, pushing a high BC bullet at a low velocity does not accomplish the task either as you still need some type of velocity to conserve, if you know what I mean.

So, if I can start a high BC bullet at a high velocity, the time of flight will be shorter and the deviation due to atmospheric will be correspondingly less. In my case, I am pushing a 200gr SMK at 2700FPS, I would like to see you try that in a 21 inch .308. I think the difference will be closer to 400-500FPS, which at a 1000 yards represents a difference in drop of 12MOAs and 20 inches of your mythical steady 10MPH wind.

I was thinking that instead of cutting off inches of barrels on a .308, it might be better to use a more powerful caliber such as the .300WM if one really needs a short rifle for the long distance or perhaps something in a 6.5 or 7mm non-belted magnum. </div></div>

I understand what can be achieved ballistically and the factors at play. I push the 24"s as well with hand loads and shoot different bullets to best the rifle that fits the function and utility. I impliment this in practice. 3-4" at the end of the tube makes a big difference in hand, my point was to place this against ballistics: not make comparison to the absolute best ballistics capable in .308.

One has to start somewhere with wind. 10MPH cross wind seems a practical example to grasp the effects. Its not mythical when a factory 700 or 10Fp outshoots a nut on a 300WM or 338LM and it happens often.

To your counter-point: Same reason I built a .260 to take advantage of higher BC and alittle higher V in a same size package with nill recoil. I prefer that to a 300WM, hell I even prefer the 308s. Especially with timed strings, multiple targets, and follow-ups. Then consider humping the rifle under time. Personally, I think any barrel length above 24" is impractical for the kind of shooting I do (yes, to 1k) and mirrors the utility within function of this website the the venues it supports.

Other rigs will obviously spank ballistically but I can shoot them with body support and they all will thread a suppressor and keep reasonable OAL length.

In the context of the original poster who sounded newbie-ish; my point is valid across popular barrels lengths and loads where folks seem to get bent out of shape with sub 24" lengths.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ASM1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">18.5" 308 and can get to 1000 yards no problem 155 scenars at 2800 easy on the brass..

long barrel 308's are so yesterday

</div></div>

HA HA, Depending on where you is in Abalama............ Show up at Oak Ridge some day with your 18.5 inch barreled 308 and shoot some scores against some longer barreled 308's </div></div>

No thanks been to a match like it before F class type targets right?
I was told my rig I had at one time wasn't what was hot Kinda like your saying now,, I went shot 397 out of 400 20x windy day not bragging just telling the facts .. having someone pull the target and putting a big plug on it so you know where you are isn't the type of shooting I am interested in and don't think its uncool its just a different way of shooting with different equipment needs this is a tactical shooting hang out BTW..


Anyone is welcome to show me up at my range anytime for a friendly fun day,but only bring what you can carry by your person..</div></div>

You shot a 397-20 on the current F-Class target with a .308? Wow! </div></div>

whatever was current 3 years AGO I did help put up the targets with fatboy they seem large to me,I shoot 90% of the time at my range at my 14"x30" gong and they where way bigger than that .. It was a factory P 300WM at tullahoma if that is the correct spelling there where hide members there if one has dout and I have the score card as well..
The caliber was diffrent ,but the argument was the same,Was told I would have my ass handed to me by 6.5x284's and such ..I am not a FTR shooter and dont even know what all that stuff is and dont care..

 

[9H_Cracka]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

Hey folks, Monte pointed out an inconsistency in my info above re: 155s, 2975 FPS, and 1k supersonic. At 1k under the worst atmospheric conditions you're still right at 1500 FPS. So, my guidance on the 2975 fps must be based on something else. I am thinking it is the Bisley matches in England and shooting out to 1200 meters. I'll confirm that and get back with the info.

Even my old 2155 Palma bullets at 2850 FPS at sea level is still well into the supersonic range. Sorry for the mis-info.

 

[Asm1]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: criver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sounds like you got it all figgered out........ </div></div>


If you have doubt cowboy up I have cordnance...

 

[Guest]

Re: 1000yards on a 24 inch barreled 308

WTF,.... I come with folding money in my left hand and Johnny Cash in the other,...can I play in your woods again?

Chasing real targets in the woods,...ain't like "A" square range,...Is It,....!