147gr ELD and Reloader 26 Test

Juggerxxx

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Feb 13, 2017
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I have seen some people having good results with Reloader 26 so I decided to give it a try with the 147gr ELDs in my 28” long barrel.
Only loaded up 9 rounds with increments of 0.5gr for each starting at 43gr and stopping at 47gr. I was amazed at how little of point of impact change there was and how much speed was achieved. I did not use a drop tube and really did not have any powder crunch when seating the bullets at 47gr. No pressure signs and no heavy bolt. I am going to test again with as much as 50gr.
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My load is 46 gr and goes 2835 out of a 23.5” Broughton. Lapua brass, and have to use a 24” drop tube to get it in there, and it does crunch slightly. My load is certainly making more pressure than yours at 46 gr, but totally safe. I’ve actually cooked this load in the sun for several hours inside a sealed up car and noted no I’ll effects. Average bumped up a 14 fps.

Having just moved, my home range is at 8k feet asl now(2k before). In conjunction with the rl26 load, the creedmoor is hitting way above it’s weight. Shocking supersonic range.
 
My load is 46 gr and goes 2835 out of a 23.5” Broughton. Lapua brass, and have to use a 24” drop tube to get it in there, and it does crunch slightly. My load is certainly making more pressure than yours at 46 gr, but totally safe. I’ve actually cooked this load in the sun for several hours inside a sealed up car and noted no I’ll effects. Average bumped up a 14 fps.

Having just moved, my home range is at 8k feet asl now(2k before). In conjunction with the rl26 load, the creedmoor is hitting way above it’s weight. Shocking supersonic range.

That’s is great to hear about not being temp sensitive!
The Lapua Brass vs the Hornady has to be the reason for you needing the drop tube and still getting a small about of powder crunch.
 
I just noticed something possibly positive when resizing the brass. I had to resize 41 pieces that were fired with my normal load of 42.2gr of H4350 with 140gr ELDs as well as the 9 that were tested with the Reloader 26 and 147gr ELD. The 41 pieces had more resistance and took more effort to resize compared to the 9. I thought it would be the opposite.
 
That’s is great to hear about not being temp sensitive!
The Lapua Brass vs the Hornady has to be the reason for you needing the drop tube and still getting a small about of powder crunch.


That’s what I attribute it to.

I looked back at my data for the cooked rounds. Two of the three shots were one fps apart, and on the cool temp average, and one round was 14 fps faster. When my buddy was bringing me the three rounds from the dashboard, he dropped one in the dirt. I swear that made it go faster. lol.


26 seems to be some special stuff. Nothing I’ve tried has shown a single pressure sign either.
 
All I wanted to risk was going as high as 48.4gr of Reloader 26. Started this OCW at 46.6gr with 0.2gr increments with 5 rounds each up to 48.4gr. Had to vibrate powder on the higher charges. Hope to get out tomorrow and test. On a side note the primer pockets were all stil nice and tight. Did I mention this is the 10th reload on this brass.
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Here are the results of today’s test starting at 46.6gr and pushing up to 48.4gr of Reloader 26. All 5 shot groups at 100 meters. I needed to vibrate settle the powder on the higher charges so to make it consistent I vibrated all the charges. Started to see ever so faint ejector rings half way through the charge range that are indicated between the red marks. Primers all look decent and no different than my normal load with 42.2gr of H4350 and 140gr ELDs. Never had a stick bolt. I think I’m going to pick 47.4gr and try a few vibrate settled and a few with a normal pour.
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That 47.0-47.2 area is nice and flat, and also coincides with a velocity flat spot. I don’t think I’d wanna operate so close to ejector marks at 47.4, especially with Hornady brass. Wouldn’t surprise me if some of those upper charges hurt the pockets.


2900 out of a creed with a 147 is smokin. Those are traditional powder 6.5-284 speeds I’d say.
 
I am getting very similar results with the 147 ELD and R26 out of my .260 (26" bartlein barrel).

6.5x284 speeds are still a bit more: 3,050 - 3,100 for a 140 AMAX or 142 SMK however this bullet powder combination for the 6.5 creed or .260 is hard to beat.

Anyone try 150g sierra matchkings?
 
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I am getting very similar results with the 147 ELD and R26 out of my .260 (26" bartlein barrel).

6.5x284 speeds are still a bit more: 3,050 - 3,100 for a 140 AMAX or 142 SMK however this bullet powder combination for the 6.5 creed or .260 is hard to beat.

Anyone try 150g sierra matchkings?

Never tried the 150gr bullet. Any idea how much of a BC advantage it would be over the 147eld?

How much RL26 are you loading for the 140 and 142? Any idea how many rounds you have shot with that combo so far? I ask because I’m on the fence about torching this barrel to quick.

Thanks
 
That 47.0-47.2 area is nice and flat, and also coincides with a velocity flat spot. I don’t think I’d wanna operate so close to ejector marks at 47.4, especially with Hornady brass. Wouldn’t surprise me if some of those upper charges hurt the pockets.


2900 out of a creed with a 147 is smokin. Those are traditional powder 6.5-284 speeds I’d say.

I decided to try these loads with Hornady brass that has been loaded 10 times when I get done loading them this week. This should help give me an idea fair soon if the primer pockets shit the bed or not. If they do, I’m not out on wasted brass.
 
Very interesting. May have to try this out. Rl16 is treating. Me awesome, but much slower at 2650. Adding 300 FPS would be amazing

Should make a big difference in speed. Keep in mind my muzzle brake is caked and nasty after shooting only 59 of these. I could careless about the brake but I’m not certain of how quick the barrel will foul. I have heard people state that using a can with this combo is a bad idea as it will fill up with carbon real quick.
 
Should make a big difference in speed. Keep in mind my muzzle brake is caked and nasty after shooting only 59 of these. I could careless about the brake but I’m not certain of how quick the barrel will foul. I have heard people state that using a can with this combo is a bad idea as it will fill up with carbon real quick.
Good to know. I don’t have a can yet, but some of the guys I shoot with do, and make me run one while I’m with them, so I will keep that in mind for sure. I wonder why there’s so much build up?
 
I did not try R26 w/140 and 142's. The slowest powder that I used was H4831SC for the 140 grainers and got velocities around 2,800 - 2,840. The R26 seems to work decent in my rifle between 47-48.3gr and giving great velocities with the 147's (2,850 - 2,920-ish).

Caveat Emptor: The ES's and SD's were so -so with R26 - ES in the 20-50fps range and SD's tended to wander. I did have a couple of tests were I recorded the Sd's down to 10 fps but that number seemed to jump around more than other powders. The R26 accuracy is decent 3/4 - 1/2 MOA, velocity is GREAT but I have some concerns about the variability of ES and SD's. No matter it still bangs steel at 1,200 yards. Kicks a little harder also.

I had read in the "prevailing wisdom" that a slower burning powder accelerating a heavier bullet will not burn up a 6.5 barrel as fast as H4350. I guess time will tell.
 
Went out to shoot some of these loads at 47.4gr and they performed very at ranges from 400yards out to 1000 yards. They were nailing the 18” plate at 1000 yards over and over without a single miss in 14 rounds and only required 23MOA for 1000yards. Bucked the wind way better than my buddy that was shooting the 140gr BTHP as expected.
The bad news is the case head separtations on 2 and the the obvious start on another 12. It doesn’t surprise me but I’m not 100% certain it’s the load or the fact it’s Hornady brass that has been shot 11 times or a combination of the two.
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I have another 50 that is on its 9th reloading so I’m going to continue to shoot that until failure of some sort.
 
If it was the load, the primer pockets would have told you many firings ago. Pressure doesn’t cause separations anyway. You’re doing pretty good with hornady brass I’d say. Just go easier on the shoulder bump when you switch to new stuff.

Edit: 11 firings with hornady, at that performance level is good! Keep on trucking with new hornady, or switch to Lapua.



Mine continues to shoot awesome. Cold bore shots going into the group, temp stable, and crazy performance down range.
 
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If it was the load, the primer pockets would have told you many firings ago. Pressure doesn’t cause separations anyway. You’re doing pretty good with hornady brass I’d say. Just go easier on the shoulder bump when you switch to new stuff.

Edit: 11 firings with hornady, at that performance level is good! Keep on trucking with new hornady, or switch to Lapua.



Mine continues to shoot awesome. Cold bore shots going into the group, temp stable, and crazy performance down range.

The 6.5CM is the only Hornady brass I am currently using. Reason being is Midway fucked up and sent me several hundreds more than I order 4 years ago and I’m still using it up. Otherwise I would love to have Lapua for it as Lapua has been great for my other calibers.
8 of the 11 loadings was on 42.2gr of H4350 and the 140elds. The last 3 of the 11 were on the 47.4gr RL26 and the 147elds. I thought it was odd not having any loose primer pockets so it very well could have been the number of firings and possibly the load made it happen a few loadings sooner? Iv just never personally experienced case head separations before.
 
That's usually from bumping the shoulder too much when sizing. Do you measure the bump and set your dies to only bump .001-002"?
 
Most people seem to struggle for double digit firings on them. Certainly it can be done, but not at the performance levels most are seeking around here. The real question is would they have failed if you’d stayed with your h4350 load? I think yes.
 
Most people seem to struggle for double digit firings on them. Certainly it can be done, but not at the performance levels most are seeking around here. The real question is would they have failed if you’d stayed with your h4350 load? I think yes.
I will find out in the coming months as I have another 50 that are the same 42.2gr load and should hit 11 reloads.
 
I converted some Lake City .308 brass to 6.5 CM about 2 years ago, and am using it now on a backup rifle for fun. It’s some heavy brass for sure, and has less capacity than Hornady. I’ve not tested it against my Lapua brass for volume yet, but believe it’s very close.

Anyway, I loaded 50 rounds of 6.5CM with 147s over 45.5g of RL26. Fits easily, and I knew it would be safe pressure wise. Ran at 2810fps consistently, but didn’t note the SD because I was in a hurry. Won’t do that again.

Anyway, I’m happy and while I’m sure I can stuff another grain or so of powder on top, I may leave it and just enjoy having a solid round with above average ballistics.
 
I converted some Lake City .308 brass to 6.5 CM about 2 years ago, and am using it now on a backup rifle for fun. It’s some heavy brass for sure, and has less capacity than Hornady. I’ve not tested it against my Lapua brass for volume yet, but believe it’s very close.

Anyway, I loaded 50 rounds of 6.5CM with 147s over 45.5g of RL26. Fits easily, and I knew it would be safe pressure wise. Ran at 2810fps consistently, but didn’t note the SD because I was in a hurry. Won’t do that again.

Anyway, I’m happy and while I’m sure I can stuff another grain or so of powder on top, I may leave it and just enjoy having a solid round with above average ballistics.

What length barrel was that speed from? I see more and more people using RL26, I wonder when we will see published numbers from a bullet or powder manufacturer?
 
Does anyone know which powder is the faster burning powder, RL26 or Retumbo? I am assuming RL26 is faster since Retumbo is closer to RL33.
I haven’t been able to find a chart with both listed to see where they place in relation to each other.
 
What length barrel was that speed from? I see more and more people using RL26, I wonder when we will see published numbers from a bullet or powder manufacturer?
Does anyone know which powder is the faster burning powder, RL26 or Retumbo? I am assuming RL26 is faster since Retumbo is closer to RL33.
I haven’t been able to find a chart with both listed to see where they place in relation to each other.

26” barrel on a Howa 1500 action.

I believe you are correct- Retumbo is used by many for calibers like 28 Nosler. Those same folks use RL33.

I’m not sure about publication information. Many of us are really compressing our powder charges to get these speeds. Not sure if Alliant will ever recommend it under that condition, even if the burn speed means it is likely to be safe.
 
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I wanted to add some info to this thread. I've been working on a load for my 6.5 Creedmoor over the last few days using RL26, 147 eldm, and Lapua brass. Here is what I found.

Rifle:

Bighorn TL3
23" Bartlein Heavy Palma 1-8" barrel
Manners T4A
Built by Phoenix Custom Rifles

I ran the first OCW from 44.0 to 47.2 grains of RL26 using once fired Lapua brass and CCI 450 primers. As a side note, I tried working up a load last year for another rifle using Lapua brass and CCI 450 primers and was not happy with the lack of consistency in velocity. That load was with RL16 and Berger 140 hybrids. I finally switched to Norma brass with F210M primers and the same load was a tack driver with very solid velocity and low ES/SD.

OCW - 1 (3 shots at each load)

147 ELDM, RL26, CCI450, 1x fired Lapua brass, .020" jump

Load / Avg Vel / ES / SD
44.0 2653 37 18.9
44.4 2693 16 8.0
44.8 2727 21 11.6
45.2 2739 31 16.3
45.6 2770 36 18.1
46.0 2799 35 18.5
46.4 2816 54 27.2
46.8 2845 3 1.7
47.2 2874 31 16.5

The above were all 3 shots per charge weight. As you can see, velocity was good but ES and SD were all over the place. As far as the ocw, it appeared that there was a node from 46.0 - 46.8 based on center point of the groups of those charge weights.

I decided to run another OCW running from 46.0 to 46.8 in .2 increments. I also wanted to try a different primer, just to see if the CCI 450's could be causing the erratic velocity numbers, so I bought some CCI BR4 primers to use on the second round.


OCW - 2 (5 shots at each load)

147 ELDM, 1x fired Lapua brass, CCI BR4, RL26, .020" jump

Load / Avg Vel / ES / SD
46.0 2827 25 9.9
46.2 2832 21 9.5
46.4 2848 21 8.2
46.6 2857 33 11.8
46.8 2882 30 11.7

These were all 5 shots per charger weight. A couple of things I noticed. First, the velocity is more consistent with the BR4's. Second, the velocity is about 30ish fps higher with the BR4's at the same charge weight.

Group location in relation to the poi was the same for loads 46.0 to 46.6. Load 46.8 was located down and a bit right on the target. I think the node falls off on my gun at that point. None of the groups were particularly tight. I ran both ocw's at .020" jump, so I'm sure the groups would shrink with some tweaking of seating depth. Group size ranged from 1/2" to about 1".

Last year I worked up a load for a Christensen Ridgeline 6.5 CM. It was 41.8 grains of RL16, 140 Berger Elite Hunters, Norma Brass, and F210M primers. This load shot really well out of the Ridgeline. After finishing the ocw, I decided to shoot 5 rounds of this load out of my Bighorn just to see how it would shoot. 5 shots were in one ragged hole (about 3/8"). Velocity was 2814 average, ES of 15, and SD of 6.9 for 5 shots. I don't know how far the bullets were jumping. Although the 147s with RL26 seems promising with the velocity. I think my next step will be to stretch it out on steel and do a comparison between the 147 eldm with RL26 vs the 140 Bergers with RL16.
 
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Dirthead good info and thanks for adding. Very interesting to see the difference in velocity with just the primer change. How many rounds down the barrel total and since the last cleaning? You know where I’m going with that as I’m sure you have already thought about it.
RL26 seems to be very promising. I plan to switch over after I use up all my H4350 and 140gr bullets. I have yet to see anything negative posted about it or anything that would indicate we should not be pushing these speeds.

How much crunch did you feel at 47.2gr in the Lapua brass? Did you use a drop tube?
 
Jugger,

About 350 rounds down the barrel. It had already gone through the “speed up” at around 120 rounds. I cleaned the barrel and fired 10 fouling rounds before starting the first ocw. No cleaning before the second.

No drop tube, but I did trickle it into the cases slowly and tap them several times before seating bullets, just to try and get the powder to settle down as far as possible. At 46.8 there was still some crunching when seating bullets.

I was definitely impressed with the velocity out of a 23” barrel, but I’m not sure it would trump the better consistency at long range of the 140 with RL16. That will be the next test.
 
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48 grains of RL26 in a CM case? and the load wasnt even compressed? Im using 54.5 grains of RL26 in my 6.5-284 Norma! The long bearing surface of the 143/147 also builds alot more pressure than 140 bthp.


Curious, was your chrono at the muzzle, or out 10ft?
 
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48 grains of RL26 in a CM case? and the load wasnt even compressed? Im using 54.5 grains of RL26 in my 6.5-284 Norma! The long bearing surface of the 143/147 also builds alot more pressure than 140 bthp.


Curious, was your chrono at the muzzle, or out 10ft?

The velocities in my post above were taken with a labradar.
 
I have some loads ready to test with H4831SC and 147g ELD 10thou jump, 24” barrel. I believe I went up to 48g with nothing but a drop tube. Hopefully I can test soon, might wish I went with RL26!
I have heard good things about H4831 as well. Similar velocities to RL26 and good accuracy.
 
Has anyone tried RL26 or H4831SC in an AR10? Wonder whether how they interact with semi’s gas system. It seems that the peak pressure is not elevated with these slower powders, so AR’s gas system should handle it well.
 
I did quite a bit of testing today using RL26 and 147 eld in my 6.5cm. I had very similar results as you. I am at abt 600ft of elevation so I am not getting quit the same velocities. I found the sweet spot to be 47.8 of RL26. I was getting an average velocity of 2881 and not getting any pressure signs til 48.2 and it got hot pretty quick there. I verified bullet drop at 500 yards and this load basically shot 3/4 to 1 MOA higher than my current 143 eld at 2750. I also seen same results using BR4 primers over FGMM primers. I used all Hornady brass, some new and some fire formed with shoulders bumped back .002. The only problem with any of this I see is there isn’t any RL26 anywhere that I can find.
 
I.... The only problem with any of this I see is there isn’t any RL26 anywhere that I can find.
Take a number.

Alliant Powder was talking about initial back in stock of mid December, but neglected to say what year.

Another month and I pick another powder. H1000 I think is the next flavor for the 47-54gr range pushing a 147. My shooting has ceased at 400 rounds in the bank and 1# of powder on the shelf.
 
Take a number.

Alliant Powder was talking about initial back in stock of mid December, but neglected to say what year.

Another month and I pick another powder. H1000 I think is the next flavor for the 47-54gr range pushing a 147. My shooting has ceased at 400 rounds in the bank and 1# of powder on the shelf.



Anyone tried H1000? I have some of that I can try.