-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
.17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
- Thread starter ruth
- Start date
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
You neglected to mention what your budget is, what distance you'll be shooting, what you will be shooting/hunting, etc, etc... Fill in all the blanks for the best answers to your question.
That being said, here you go.
17 HMR vs. 22 WMR:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1535776
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=876807
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1629222
Rifle choices:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2757381
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2764575
http://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2464203
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2026799
Read all of those threads, and search using the search-bar on the Right side of your screen in the box titled "Custom Search Engine" and you'll be miles ahead. Once you've done those things come back and ask SPECIFIC questions.
Topics like "what caliber" or "what rifle" have been beaten to death many times over. Despite this, I'll be more than happy to help once I know what you want to do with the rifle in its entirity as well as how much you are willing to spend on it.
-Dylan
You neglected to mention what your budget is, what distance you'll be shooting, what you will be shooting/hunting, etc, etc... Fill in all the blanks for the best answers to your question.
That being said, here you go.
17 HMR vs. 22 WMR:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1535776
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=876807
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1629222
Rifle choices:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2757381
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2764575
http://snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2464203
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2026799
Read all of those threads, and search using the search-bar on the Right side of your screen in the box titled "Custom Search Engine" and you'll be miles ahead. Once you've done those things come back and ask SPECIFIC questions.
Topics like "what caliber" or "what rifle" have been beaten to death many times over. Despite this, I'll be more than happy to help once I know what you want to do with the rifle in its entirity as well as how much you are willing to spend on it.
-Dylan
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rifle will be for Target and hunting, max range 200 meters. Budget for rifle approximately $500. </div></div>
I have $10 saying he didn't even read one of those links...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rifle will be for Target and hunting, max range 200 meters. Budget for rifle approximately $500. </div></div>
I have $10 saying he didn't even read one of those links...
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
speed kills and trumps all independent factors
.17 and move on to the next question, like what glass should I get.....which ammo is the best.....should I replace the stock.....do I need a canted scope base.......
speed kills and trumps all independent factors
.17 and move on to the next question, like what glass should I get.....which ammo is the best.....should I replace the stock.....do I need a canted scope base.......
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes I read the links, seems people are split 50/50 between these rimfires. </div></div>
that is why I have both!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yes I read the links, seems people are split 50/50 between these rimfires. </div></div>
that is why I have both!
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
The 3 most popular rimfire cartridges of today are the .17HMR, .22LR, and .22WMR. Each of these rimfire calibers can be researched in further detail with a simple Google search. Each are a fine addition to any shooter and a choice can be narrowed down further depending on what your application is. For hunting, all three perform well while the generally more expensive .17HMR and .22WMR offers more "punch" than the .22LR, the .22LR offers a relatively more economical target / hunting caliber that offers a variety of ammos for versatility. However some Match .22LR ammos can rival and surpass the cost of .17HMR and .22WMR. The design of the .17HMR cartridge not only contributes to it's flat trajectory, but is also devastating on varmint type game. The .22WMR (although not quite as flat shooting as the .17HMR) is also quite effective on small to varmint sized game, and is also able to utilize a heavier bullet to help retain more downrange energy. Due to the availability, versatility, and rifles chambered in .22LR, it appears to be the most popular rimfire of all. The more pronounced arch of it's trajectory also aids in its duty of a training round, having to adjust more for different distances than the others adds to it's training value for understanding bullet flight.
IMO between the .22mag or .17hmr for hunting in real conditions, .22 mag as it has less wind deflection and knietic energy (depending on ammo used) at realistic distances and offers more types of ammo choices depending on what you are hunting for. if you are a fair weather hunter / target shooter, the .17hmr as it is flatter and is far superior in trajectory in less windy conditions.
in my part of the world we seem to have less favorable conditions during hunting seasons, and since time is precious and i find myself in those conditions, my choice is the .22 mag. taking a day off from work and dragging my butt out before dawn to go hunting - i want a rimfire that has the knockdown power and not have the shot or day spoiled by a wind that the .17hmr can't stay as true as the .22 mag can.
a good article comparing the 2:
http://www.chuckhawks.com/compared_17HMR_22WMR.htm
The 3 most popular rimfire cartridges of today are the .17HMR, .22LR, and .22WMR. Each of these rimfire calibers can be researched in further detail with a simple Google search. Each are a fine addition to any shooter and a choice can be narrowed down further depending on what your application is. For hunting, all three perform well while the generally more expensive .17HMR and .22WMR offers more "punch" than the .22LR, the .22LR offers a relatively more economical target / hunting caliber that offers a variety of ammos for versatility. However some Match .22LR ammos can rival and surpass the cost of .17HMR and .22WMR. The design of the .17HMR cartridge not only contributes to it's flat trajectory, but is also devastating on varmint type game. The .22WMR (although not quite as flat shooting as the .17HMR) is also quite effective on small to varmint sized game, and is also able to utilize a heavier bullet to help retain more downrange energy. Due to the availability, versatility, and rifles chambered in .22LR, it appears to be the most popular rimfire of all. The more pronounced arch of it's trajectory also aids in its duty of a training round, having to adjust more for different distances than the others adds to it's training value for understanding bullet flight.
IMO between the .22mag or .17hmr for hunting in real conditions, .22 mag as it has less wind deflection and knietic energy (depending on ammo used) at realistic distances and offers more types of ammo choices depending on what you are hunting for. if you are a fair weather hunter / target shooter, the .17hmr as it is flatter and is far superior in trajectory in less windy conditions.
in my part of the world we seem to have less favorable conditions during hunting seasons, and since time is precious and i find myself in those conditions, my choice is the .22 mag. taking a day off from work and dragging my butt out before dawn to go hunting - i want a rimfire that has the knockdown power and not have the shot or day spoiled by a wind that the .17hmr can't stay as true as the .22 mag can.
a good article comparing the 2:
http://www.chuckhawks.com/compared_17HMR_22WMR.htm
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
My vote is for the. 17hmr. Check out hornady's website and compare ballistics.
Rifle? Marlin 917 vsl or vsfl. Buy a rifle basix trigger for it and you will be good to go.
I have a Marlin xt-17v and their pro-fire trigger isn't that impressive. Mine is very accurate and likes hornady vmax 17 gr ammo.
I was waiting on the xt-17vsl but none were to be found. Wish I had bought a 917vsl and put the rifle basix in it.
I don't think you can go wrong with either but the 17 has the advantage ballistically and in accuracy. In the real world on critters probably a toss up. If you need more than a 17 in a hunting situation grab a centerfire.
Just my opinion, but I was blessed to grow up on a farm where I shot tens of thousands of rounds of 22 and 22 mag over the years at multiple targets both inanimate and alive.
My vote is for the. 17hmr. Check out hornady's website and compare ballistics.
Rifle? Marlin 917 vsl or vsfl. Buy a rifle basix trigger for it and you will be good to go.
I have a Marlin xt-17v and their pro-fire trigger isn't that impressive. Mine is very accurate and likes hornady vmax 17 gr ammo.
I was waiting on the xt-17vsl but none were to be found. Wish I had bought a 917vsl and put the rifle basix in it.
I don't think you can go wrong with either but the 17 has the advantage ballistically and in accuracy. In the real world on critters probably a toss up. If you need more than a 17 in a hunting situation grab a centerfire.
Just my opinion, but I was blessed to grow up on a farm where I shot tens of thousands of rounds of 22 and 22 mag over the years at multiple targets both inanimate and alive.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Shooting within 200 yards:
Target, standard 22 cal although really more for trigger time on the cheap.
Hunting, 17 HMR, I love shooting ground squirrels with mine. Ammo is a little expensive for just target shooting, and a slight breeze will open up a group at 100 yards.
Enjoy,
SScott
Shooting within 200 yards:
Target, standard 22 cal although really more for trigger time on the cheap.
Hunting, 17 HMR, I love shooting ground squirrels with mine. Ammo is a little expensive for just target shooting, and a slight breeze will open up a group at 100 yards.
Enjoy,
SScott
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I'll have to agree with most of the above. The only hunting I do with rimfire is Prairie Dogs. I usually take a few .22lrs, a .17hmr and a .22 mag. My .17 is a Savage 93 heavy barrel and my .22 mag is a (/sigh perfect condition) Anschutz 1515-1516 that I probably shouldn't be dragging through the field.
Both rifles shoot wonderfully and on a calm day I will choose the .17 over the .22 mag any time. On a windy day (this is usually in West Texas) I will choose the .22 mag.
It is mostly personal preference, but .17hmr is hard to beat, so if I had to hunt with just 1 rimfire - it would be a .17 hmr.
I'll have to agree with most of the above. The only hunting I do with rimfire is Prairie Dogs. I usually take a few .22lrs, a .17hmr and a .22 mag. My .17 is a Savage 93 heavy barrel and my .22 mag is a (/sigh perfect condition) Anschutz 1515-1516 that I probably shouldn't be dragging through the field.
Both rifles shoot wonderfully and on a calm day I will choose the .17 over the .22 mag any time. On a windy day (this is usually in West Texas) I will choose the .22 mag.
It is mostly personal preference, but .17hmr is hard to beat, so if I had to hunt with just 1 rimfire - it would be a .17 hmr.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I've got a Ruger 77/22 bolt action, takes 10/22 magazines and fairly accurate. I've also got a 77/17 which takes the 10/22 Mag magazines, along with a .22 mag barrel for when .17HMR is hard to find.
On sage rats to 100 yards, the .22 comes out. Past that, it's the 'big gun' with either barrel. FWIW I think the .17 is the most accurate of the three, but more subject to wind than the .22 Mag. But it's quite explosive, and the highly frangible bullets reduce richochets. The .22 Mag knocks 'em down hard, but drops faster.
If I only had one, it would be the .17HMR.
1911fan
I've got a Ruger 77/22 bolt action, takes 10/22 magazines and fairly accurate. I've also got a 77/17 which takes the 10/22 Mag magazines, along with a .22 mag barrel for when .17HMR is hard to find.
On sage rats to 100 yards, the .22 comes out. Past that, it's the 'big gun' with either barrel. FWIW I think the .17 is the most accurate of the three, but more subject to wind than the .22 Mag. But it's quite explosive, and the highly frangible bullets reduce richochets. The .22 Mag knocks 'em down hard, but drops faster.
If I only had one, it would be the .17HMR.
1911fan
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBXpBlavBFo
Ruger..took 4 coyotes with this setup...17hmr
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBXpBlavBFo
Ruger..took 4 coyotes with this setup...17hmr
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I have to say that I am partial to the .22WMR.
I own 4 CZ 452 Americans, one in each of the four calibers used by CZ (Now it is three, HM2 is no longer produced.) I have taken a few groundhogs and coons with all four of the rifles but of course I like to reach out and take them at farther distances and for this application, I use the HMR and WMR. I have come to discover that I am more confident in the abilities of the WMR. I am not too worried about the speed getting to the animal as much as I am about the energy of the bullet when it gets there. This is what makes me take the heavier WMR bullet. I know that the HMR is a flatter shooter, but I can practice bullet drop and what have you when I am trying to reach out with my WMR.
I have also had few animals keep moving after taking a MaxiMag to the vital region than I have with any bullet I have tried in my HMR.
I know that many people may not agree with what I have said here or my thoughts, but that is why it is an opinion. When it comes to hunting where I need to reach out a little farther than a .22LR can handle and isn't far enough to reach for .22-250/.223/.308, I go with my WMR. It is devastating to game and usually has a DRT outcome.
My vote: 22WMR.
As for rifles... It is pretty darn hard to beat a CZ out of the box! I'm not a huge fan of the way Savages feel, although they are great shooters and do exactly what they need to do. I have had great success with my CZ in all of the calibers.
I have to say that I am partial to the .22WMR.
I own 4 CZ 452 Americans, one in each of the four calibers used by CZ (Now it is three, HM2 is no longer produced.) I have taken a few groundhogs and coons with all four of the rifles but of course I like to reach out and take them at farther distances and for this application, I use the HMR and WMR. I have come to discover that I am more confident in the abilities of the WMR. I am not too worried about the speed getting to the animal as much as I am about the energy of the bullet when it gets there. This is what makes me take the heavier WMR bullet. I know that the HMR is a flatter shooter, but I can practice bullet drop and what have you when I am trying to reach out with my WMR.
I have also had few animals keep moving after taking a MaxiMag to the vital region than I have with any bullet I have tried in my HMR.
I know that many people may not agree with what I have said here or my thoughts, but that is why it is an opinion. When it comes to hunting where I need to reach out a little farther than a .22LR can handle and isn't far enough to reach for .22-250/.223/.308, I go with my WMR. It is devastating to game and usually has a DRT outcome.
My vote: 22WMR.
As for rifles... It is pretty darn hard to beat a CZ out of the box! I'm not a huge fan of the way Savages feel, although they are great shooters and do exactly what they need to do. I have had great success with my CZ in all of the calibers.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
CZ 455 and get all three barrels; solves all your problems.....
CZ 455 and get all three barrels; solves all your problems.....
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I have both and will continue to own both, but if I only could have one then I would probably stick with a 22WMR. I have a Ruger 10/22Magnum that shoots amazing. I also have a few 17hmr's, they are more fun to shoot, but the 22 is more versatile.
I have both and will continue to own both, but if I only could have one then I would probably stick with a 22WMR. I have a Ruger 10/22Magnum that shoots amazing. I also have a few 17hmr's, they are more fun to shoot, but the 22 is more versatile.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
i love my WMR. My primary hunting/shooting buddy has a .17 and we constantly go back and forth. He can hit groundhogs a little further out with consistency than i can, but the ones i hit are DRT, his will crawl back into holes.
If i were going to get a NEW rifle, i'd be leaning to the 5mm but that wasn't in your list. so go WMR, and marlins are hard to argue with in the accuracy department.
Keep in mind that all 22WMR's are FINICKY when it comes to ammo. Try them all and stick with what your rifle likes. down range performance of bullets is very different between brands too (no surprise) and I have become a bit smitten by the info at www.brassfetcher.com for the rifle fired 22WMR bullets.
My Marlin 882SSV absolutely loves the hornady 30 grain and remington 33 grain fodder. I'm still trying to source a box of the new Hornady Critical Defense 45 grain stuff...would be a little more whallop down range for larger critters...would turn the 22WMR into a dedicated Yote gun for allegheny county (pittsburgh) where only rimfire and shotgun are allowed for them.
i love my WMR. My primary hunting/shooting buddy has a .17 and we constantly go back and forth. He can hit groundhogs a little further out with consistency than i can, but the ones i hit are DRT, his will crawl back into holes.
If i were going to get a NEW rifle, i'd be leaning to the 5mm but that wasn't in your list. so go WMR, and marlins are hard to argue with in the accuracy department.
Keep in mind that all 22WMR's are FINICKY when it comes to ammo. Try them all and stick with what your rifle likes. down range performance of bullets is very different between brands too (no surprise) and I have become a bit smitten by the info at www.brassfetcher.com for the rifle fired 22WMR bullets.
My Marlin 882SSV absolutely loves the hornady 30 grain and remington 33 grain fodder. I'm still trying to source a box of the new Hornady Critical Defense 45 grain stuff...would be a little more whallop down range for larger critters...would turn the 22WMR into a dedicated Yote gun for allegheny county (pittsburgh) where only rimfire and shotgun are allowed for them.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SingleShot85</div><div class="ubbcode-body">CZ 455 and get all three barrels; solves all your problems..... </div></div>
By far the best answer yet !!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SingleShot85</div><div class="ubbcode-body">CZ 455 and get all three barrels; solves all your problems..... </div></div>
By far the best answer yet !!!
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
So it seems most people here agree that the 22wmr is better in the wind than the 17hmr?
Well, you are all wrong the 17hmr is far better in the wind than the 22wmr. This isnt something that is an opinion, it is a fact.
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? Have no idea and talking out of your asses? Why is it that you give people false information that could effect the outcome of what they purchase. If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such.
The 22wmr is a fine cartridge, but the only advantage it has over a 17hmr is a little more energy and only at distances of 100-125 yds and under depending on the cartridge, farther than that the 17hmr retains energy better. The 17 also has a much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
So it seems most people here agree that the 22wmr is better in the wind than the 17hmr?
Well, you are all wrong the 17hmr is far better in the wind than the 22wmr. This isnt something that is an opinion, it is a fact.
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? Have no idea and talking out of your asses? Why is it that you give people false information that could effect the outcome of what they purchase. If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such.
The 22wmr is a fine cartridge, but the only advantage it has over a 17hmr is a little more energy and only at distances of 100-125 yds and under depending on the cartridge, farther than that the 17hmr retains energy better. The 17 also has a much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it seems most people here agree that the 22wmr is better in the wind than the 17hmr?
Well, you are all wrong the 17hmr is far better in the wind than the 22wmr. This isnt something that is an opinion, it is a fact.
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? Have no idea and talking out of your asses? Why is it that you give people false information that could effect the outcome of what they purchase. If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such.
The 22wmr is a fine cartridge, but the only advantage it has over a 17hmr is a little more energy and only at distances of 100-125 yds and under depending on the cartridge, farther than that the 17hmr retains energy better. The 17 also has a much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
</div></div>
[sarcasm]Thank you for your very scientific and data-driven answer![/sarcasm]
My statement that .22WMR is better on a windy day than my .17HMR is from actual range trips and actual hunting trips (mostly groups at 50 / 100 yards, but the PD misses with the rifles don't lie either). I understand that the .17HMR has a higher muzzle velocity (300-500 fps), but that doesn't necessarily mean that it "bucks the wind better". Although I am not a physicist, I believe that the 17gr bullet is much more easily pushed around in the wind, causing the groups to open up much larger than a 40gr bullet.
Thank you for your input, but you should keep your hostility to yourself. Feel free to post targets from your range trips (we'll also need environmental conditions as well).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So it seems most people here agree that the 22wmr is better in the wind than the 17hmr?
Well, you are all wrong the 17hmr is far better in the wind than the 22wmr. This isnt something that is an opinion, it is a fact.
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? Have no idea and talking out of your asses? Why is it that you give people false information that could effect the outcome of what they purchase. If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such.
The 22wmr is a fine cartridge, but the only advantage it has over a 17hmr is a little more energy and only at distances of 100-125 yds and under depending on the cartridge, farther than that the 17hmr retains energy better. The 17 also has a much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
</div></div>
[sarcasm]Thank you for your very scientific and data-driven answer![/sarcasm]
My statement that .22WMR is better on a windy day than my .17HMR is from actual range trips and actual hunting trips (mostly groups at 50 / 100 yards, but the PD misses with the rifles don't lie either). I understand that the .17HMR has a higher muzzle velocity (300-500 fps), but that doesn't necessarily mean that it "bucks the wind better". Although I am not a physicist, I believe that the 17gr bullet is much more easily pushed around in the wind, causing the groups to open up much larger than a 40gr bullet.
Thank you for your input, but you should keep your hostility to yourself. Feel free to post targets from your range trips (we'll also need environmental conditions as well).
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
now to completely take it off topic:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? <span style="color: #FF0000">Have no idea and talking out of your asses? </span> </div></div>
FEELIN' A LITTLE GASSY...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such. </div></div>
in the end, (no pun intended) it is NOT and apples to apples comparison, and shouldn't even be a valid topic of discussion anywhere, although it has been beat to death everywhere.
the facts are (and rarely pointed out during these ford vs. chevy type discussions):
one is .22 cal, the other .17
one is straight walled, the other bottlenecked.
one is 30 to 50 grains, one is 17 or 20 grains.
most "comparisons" out there are using round nose 40gr .22 loads, VS. spire poly ballistic tipped .17 loads
one ranges in FPS from 1500 to 2200, the other 2350 to 2550.
<span style="font-size: 14pt">it's like comparing a .30 carbine to a .2506, the only similiarity is the cases are made of brass and that they are both centerfires.</span> each has it's place and application as does the .17 hmr and .22 wmr.
more facts:
the .17 TOF dictates (on a ballistic calculator) that it is less susceptible to wind drift as it spends less time in flight, along with thinner signature to catch wind resistance. therefore SHOULD be less wind drift than slower moving, heavier, fatter .22 caliber slower moving bullet.
yet those that shoot both calibers attest that the .17 drifts more in a crosswind. there's at least three posts in this thread by actual users of both calibers that attest to the performance in wind is better with the .22 mag. actually let's not even call it "amount of drift" or "performance" - let's call it "more consistant" or "predictable" in the wind.
in most articles or reviews on both or either of the calibers this is called out often...."this ballistic table or that ballistic table says the .17 has less wind drift"...this is true. even though the numbers vary depending on what BC they "cook up" to use - that too seems to change with every new article.
as in most articles written about rimfires by "the big magazines", they just can't seem to take rimfires seriously enough to go through the trouble to go out and prove the numbers the ballistic tables or manufacturer's are telling them, and in many cases, still seem to fail to field test them past 50 yards; so they quote what the program tells them to quote, or outright plagerizes or quotes the work performed by someone else.
i'm sure beyond any doubt that in a closed laboratory environment, with a constant wind coming from 90 degrees for the entire distance the .17 would "hold the wind" better, as per the sterile ballistic calculators say so.
when was the last time this happened at your local range?
so i could only ASSume that the .17 is more apt to be affected by <span style="font-weight: bold">changes</span> in the windspeed as it makes it's way from point A to B - not accounted for in any ballistic program that i know of, yet those that get paid to write articles keep referencing those tables as gospel for field use.
armchair quarterbacks say it's possible the raiders could win the superbowl, the government says my SUV gets 27 mpg hwy, and ammo manufacturer's advertised FPS are always correct too.
unfortunately, i don't have access to a .17, as i would like to do a simultanious firing from both .22 mag and .17 hmr in both calm and windy conditions using actual measurements both in deviation from POA and relative group size and put this whole thing to rest.
from a less than scientific try a few years ago in a less than constant but ever present wind at my local range, i did have the oppurtunity to shoot my .22mag simultaniously with a very locally known shooter and his .17hmr @ 100 yards. after 5 rounds, it was apparent that the .17 hmr group was more erratic in that changing wind. i do not recall the group size or amount of deflection, but i do recall that 2 .17 rounds were closer to the bull than the .22 mag group, and 2 .17 rounds were outside the .22 mag group. 1 .17 round didn't even print on the 8.5 X 11 target. the .22 mag group did open up more and showed more horizontal stringing than the calm day group, but not as much in relation to the .17 group. that was only 5 rounds, and IMO 5 rounds isn't enough data for me to make a 100% decision, but enough to produce a HMMMM....
now in calm conditions the week before, the .17 could literally shoot circles around the .22 mag group, and he did so on purpose - just to prove that he and that caliber can be that precise.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
</div></div>
oddly enough (while not grouping as well) i've found that 50 gr gamepoint .22mag ammo "holds the wind" better than the flatter trajectory and faster 30gr hornady ammo...so i can only say in that instance that faster and flatter may not be better.
that's my reasoning, and <span style="text-decoration: underline">only my deduction - not opinion </span> that based on the information at hand, that i choose to have the .22 mag by my side at the range or in the field when conditions are not optimal, and especially on game that you want to keep edible and require penetration.
for fair weather shooting and fair weather hunting, the .17hmr by leaps and bounds.
back to the op: for rifle choice, for under 500.00 you have savage, marlin, CZ, maybe a ruger if you look hard enough. if you have a not so abundant optic budget, get a lower priced savage or marlin and invest the rest into an optic. if you don't mind the carrying the extra weight while hunting, get a heavy barrel. as mentioned before a rifle basix trigger is pretty good for the money, so you may even want to consider a non adjustable trigger model and replace it with a rifle basix later. it'll cost alittle more in the end, but you'll end up with a more savory trigger. the money you save up front will cut the RB trigger cost in half.
now to completely take it off topic:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
My question is, why are all of you saying this? Bad memory? Just agreeing with everyone else? Just for the hell of it? <span style="color: #FF0000">Have no idea and talking out of your asses? </span> </div></div>
FEELIN' A LITTLE GASSY...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If you dont know know the FACTS, then dont pass along your information as such. </div></div>
in the end, (no pun intended) it is NOT and apples to apples comparison, and shouldn't even be a valid topic of discussion anywhere, although it has been beat to death everywhere.
the facts are (and rarely pointed out during these ford vs. chevy type discussions):
one is .22 cal, the other .17
one is straight walled, the other bottlenecked.
one is 30 to 50 grains, one is 17 or 20 grains.
most "comparisons" out there are using round nose 40gr .22 loads, VS. spire poly ballistic tipped .17 loads
one ranges in FPS from 1500 to 2200, the other 2350 to 2550.
<span style="font-size: 14pt">it's like comparing a .30 carbine to a .2506, the only similiarity is the cases are made of brass and that they are both centerfires.</span> each has it's place and application as does the .17 hmr and .22 wmr.
more facts:
the .17 TOF dictates (on a ballistic calculator) that it is less susceptible to wind drift as it spends less time in flight, along with thinner signature to catch wind resistance. therefore SHOULD be less wind drift than slower moving, heavier, fatter .22 caliber slower moving bullet.
yet those that shoot both calibers attest that the .17 drifts more in a crosswind. there's at least three posts in this thread by actual users of both calibers that attest to the performance in wind is better with the .22 mag. actually let's not even call it "amount of drift" or "performance" - let's call it "more consistant" or "predictable" in the wind.
in most articles or reviews on both or either of the calibers this is called out often...."this ballistic table or that ballistic table says the .17 has less wind drift"...this is true. even though the numbers vary depending on what BC they "cook up" to use - that too seems to change with every new article.
as in most articles written about rimfires by "the big magazines", they just can't seem to take rimfires seriously enough to go through the trouble to go out and prove the numbers the ballistic tables or manufacturer's are telling them, and in many cases, still seem to fail to field test them past 50 yards; so they quote what the program tells them to quote, or outright plagerizes or quotes the work performed by someone else.
i'm sure beyond any doubt that in a closed laboratory environment, with a constant wind coming from 90 degrees for the entire distance the .17 would "hold the wind" better, as per the sterile ballistic calculators say so.
when was the last time this happened at your local range?
so i could only ASSume that the .17 is more apt to be affected by <span style="font-weight: bold">changes</span> in the windspeed as it makes it's way from point A to B - not accounted for in any ballistic program that i know of, yet those that get paid to write articles keep referencing those tables as gospel for field use.
armchair quarterbacks say it's possible the raiders could win the superbowl, the government says my SUV gets 27 mpg hwy, and ammo manufacturer's advertised FPS are always correct too.
unfortunately, i don't have access to a .17, as i would like to do a simultanious firing from both .22 mag and .17 hmr in both calm and windy conditions using actual measurements both in deviation from POA and relative group size and put this whole thing to rest.
from a less than scientific try a few years ago in a less than constant but ever present wind at my local range, i did have the oppurtunity to shoot my .22mag simultaniously with a very locally known shooter and his .17hmr @ 100 yards. after 5 rounds, it was apparent that the .17 hmr group was more erratic in that changing wind. i do not recall the group size or amount of deflection, but i do recall that 2 .17 rounds were closer to the bull than the .22 mag group, and 2 .17 rounds were outside the .22 mag group. 1 .17 round didn't even print on the 8.5 X 11 target. the .22 mag group did open up more and showed more horizontal stringing than the calm day group, but not as much in relation to the .17 group. that was only 5 rounds, and IMO 5 rounds isn't enough data for me to make a 100% decision, but enough to produce a HMMMM....
now in calm conditions the week before, the .17 could literally shoot circles around the .22 mag group, and he did so on purpose - just to prove that he and that caliber can be that precise.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> much flatter trajectory and bucks the wind better which translates to more clean hits in the feild.
</div></div>
oddly enough (while not grouping as well) i've found that 50 gr gamepoint .22mag ammo "holds the wind" better than the flatter trajectory and faster 30gr hornady ammo...so i can only say in that instance that faster and flatter may not be better.
that's my reasoning, and <span style="text-decoration: underline">only my deduction - not opinion </span> that based on the information at hand, that i choose to have the .22 mag by my side at the range or in the field when conditions are not optimal, and especially on game that you want to keep edible and require penetration.
for fair weather shooting and fair weather hunting, the .17hmr by leaps and bounds.
back to the op: for rifle choice, for under 500.00 you have savage, marlin, CZ, maybe a ruger if you look hard enough. if you have a not so abundant optic budget, get a lower priced savage or marlin and invest the rest into an optic. if you don't mind the carrying the extra weight while hunting, get a heavy barrel. as mentioned before a rifle basix trigger is pretty good for the money, so you may even want to consider a non adjustable trigger model and replace it with a rifle basix later. it'll cost alittle more in the end, but you'll end up with a more savory trigger. the money you save up front will cut the RB trigger cost in half.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fellas,
I will be getting a rimfire rifle in the next month and wanted opinions as whether to get .17HMR or .22 Mag?
Next question is what rifle to get in the above calibers?
Thanks, </div></div>
For the money its hard to beat a CZ for a rim fire rifle. I love the 452 in 22lr.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ruth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fellas,
I will be getting a rimfire rifle in the next month and wanted opinions as whether to get .17HMR or .22 Mag?
Next question is what rifle to get in the above calibers?
Thanks, </div></div>
For the money its hard to beat a CZ for a rim fire rifle. I love the 452 in 22lr.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Top predator- So your actual feild testing of both calibers side by side consisted of some random dudes 5 shot side by side test? You then agree that a ballistic calculator clearly indicates a 17hmr is better in the wind, which would be the only FACT you mentioned.
I have both calibers, i've shot both side by side many, many, many times the 17 is better in the wind. Im not just talking about going hunting and estimating the wind drift from memory. I've put both side by side on a bench and shot out to 200yds and measured the results, the 17hmr wins hands down.
I have no reason to lie about this.
Top predator- So your actual feild testing of both calibers side by side consisted of some random dudes 5 shot side by side test? You then agree that a ballistic calculator clearly indicates a 17hmr is better in the wind, which would be the only FACT you mentioned.
I have both calibers, i've shot both side by side many, many, many times the 17 is better in the wind. Im not just talking about going hunting and estimating the wind drift from memory. I've put both side by side on a bench and shot out to 200yds and measured the results, the 17hmr wins hands down.
I have no reason to lie about this.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
After owning both for years, and basically not shooting the .22 Mag after getting a .17 HMR, I sold my .22 Mag. Its not much cheaper to shoot and the trajectory sucks compared to the HMR.
After owning both for years, and basically not shooting the .22 Mag after getting a .17 HMR, I sold my .22 Mag. Its not much cheaper to shoot and the trajectory sucks compared to the HMR.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I have both but the 22 sits in the gun cabinet or the kids shot it. The 17 HMR is my favorite rifle to shoot and all my friends that have shot it now own one.
I have both but the 22 sits in the gun cabinet or the kids shot it. The 17 HMR is my favorite rifle to shoot and all my friends that have shot it now own one.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Top predator- So your actual feild testing of both calibers side by side consisted of some random dudes 5 shot side by side test? You then agree that a ballistic calculator clearly indicates a 17hmr is better in the wind, which would be the only FACT you mentioned.
I have both calibers, i've shot both side by side many, many, many times the 17 is better in the wind. Im not just talking about going hunting and estimating the wind drift from memory. I've put both side by side on a bench and shot out to 200yds and measured the results, the 17hmr wins hands down.
I have no reason to lie about this.
</div></div>
neither do i, and 5 shots are not enough to judge anything.
again, not it's not an apple to apple comparison other than the cases are made of brass and both are rimfires.
ford vs. chevy, toyota vs. dodge.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthony1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Top predator- So your actual feild testing of both calibers side by side consisted of some random dudes 5 shot side by side test? You then agree that a ballistic calculator clearly indicates a 17hmr is better in the wind, which would be the only FACT you mentioned.
I have both calibers, i've shot both side by side many, many, many times the 17 is better in the wind. Im not just talking about going hunting and estimating the wind drift from memory. I've put both side by side on a bench and shot out to 200yds and measured the results, the 17hmr wins hands down.
I have no reason to lie about this.
</div></div>
neither do i, and 5 shots are not enough to judge anything.
again, not it's not an apple to apple comparison other than the cases are made of brass and both are rimfires.
ford vs. chevy, toyota vs. dodge.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I say, go to the store and flip a coin. Which ever you get, the other is likely to follow at some point. Each has it's advantages.
I'm not trying to jump into a battle here, but I think that anthony1 has it backwards. the .17 is flatter shooting and more accurate than the .22 when there isn't any wind, but when there is wind, the .17 is going to get tossed around like a kite. I haven't run any numbers though a ballistics calculator or anything, but me and my shooting buddies are avid rimfire shooters. Mostly long rifle, but we all have either a .22mag or .17 hmr. Those that have the .17s LOVE them, but when the wind starts kicking, the .22 holds it together better. This is just an opinion based on the observations that I've made over the course of many, many shooting trips.
I say, go to the store and flip a coin. Which ever you get, the other is likely to follow at some point. Each has it's advantages.
I'm not trying to jump into a battle here, but I think that anthony1 has it backwards. the .17 is flatter shooting and more accurate than the .22 when there isn't any wind, but when there is wind, the .17 is going to get tossed around like a kite. I haven't run any numbers though a ballistics calculator or anything, but me and my shooting buddies are avid rimfire shooters. Mostly long rifle, but we all have either a .22mag or .17 hmr. Those that have the .17s LOVE them, but when the wind starts kicking, the .22 holds it together better. This is just an opinion based on the observations that I've made over the course of many, many shooting trips.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Most opinions are the same the only thing that dreaded me away from a .17 was 1. Wind drifts really badly 2. For hunting if the grass is long then the 17 prijectile can deflect on a blade of grass where as the .22 will push through I went .22 mag cos we shoot in long grass a fair bit so I erred on the safe side as for optics it's a rimfire so no need to go silly I have a hawk scope on mine and it does just fine
Most opinions are the same the only thing that dreaded me away from a .17 was 1. Wind drifts really badly 2. For hunting if the grass is long then the 17 prijectile can deflect on a blade of grass where as the .22 will push through I went .22 mag cos we shoot in long grass a fair bit so I erred on the safe side as for optics it's a rimfire so no need to go silly I have a hawk scope on mine and it does just fine
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Most opinions are the same the only thing that dreaded me away from a .17 was 1. Wind drifts really badly 2. For hunting if the grass is long then the 17 prijectile can deflect on a blade of grass where as the .22 will push through I went .22 mag cos we shoot in long grass a fair bit so I erred on the safe side as for optics it's a rimfire so no need to go silly I have a hawk scope on mine and it does just fine
Most opinions are the same the only thing that dreaded me away from a .17 was 1. Wind drifts really badly 2. For hunting if the grass is long then the 17 prijectile can deflect on a blade of grass where as the .22 will push through I went .22 mag cos we shoot in long grass a fair bit so I erred on the safe side as for optics it's a rimfire so no need to go silly I have a hawk scope on mine and it does just fine
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Get a 22 mag! 30-50g bullet -a huge range is available. , Try CCI 30 Speer HP for more zip & yes , a 50g .22 mag can fill your deer tag. I shoot my 22 mag w/ can.
Lots of fun & the report does not even sound like a rifle 100 yds. away. Never shot the 17 HMR tho.
Get a 22 mag! 30-50g bullet -a huge range is available. , Try CCI 30 Speer HP for more zip & yes , a 50g .22 mag can fill your deer tag. I shoot my 22 mag w/ can.
Lots of fun & the report does not even sound like a rifle 100 yds. away. Never shot the 17 HMR tho.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Winds about the same for both. A 17 is going to be better from 135 yards or so
on. At 200 it has the same energy as a 22 long rifle does at 200. So it's not a 200
yard round as such. 175 Yards it's still purring along pretty good though. It should
be more accurate than a 22 mag. A 22 mag with the 50 grain federals is a lethal
combo out to 110 yards or so. Hard to find the 50 grainers and your gun may not
like them. A Savage would be my choice of guns. They almost always are good
shooters out of the box. Stay away from plastic stocks. If they don't shoot you
can't bed them. m2c
Winds about the same for both. A 17 is going to be better from 135 yards or so
on. At 200 it has the same energy as a 22 long rifle does at 200. So it's not a 200
yard round as such. 175 Yards it's still purring along pretty good though. It should
be more accurate than a 22 mag. A 22 mag with the 50 grain federals is a lethal
combo out to 110 yards or so. Hard to find the 50 grainers and your gun may not
like them. A Savage would be my choice of guns. They almost always are good
shooters out of the box. Stay away from plastic stocks. If they don't shoot you
can't bed them. m2c
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Rifle choice...
I've got a CZ 452 in 22 LR that is scary accurate. Lots of other people will say the same.
Rifle choice...
I've got a CZ 452 in 22 LR that is scary accurate. Lots of other people will say the same.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I'll agree about those CZs, man those Czechs can make some nice guns. I'd go for the 22 mag,but why not get the CZ switch barrel and not worry about it.
I'll agree about those CZs, man those Czechs can make some nice guns. I'd go for the 22 mag,but why not get the CZ switch barrel and not worry about it.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I am a ground hog hunter. And first off neither cartridge is a 200 yard ground hog cartridge unless you like crawl offs-which I detest.
The 22 Magnum holds an advantage over the 17 HMR in killing effectiveness on critters the size of ground hogs or slightly larger. I don't have a chart to prove that. Just hundreds of dead ground hogs.
If I were only hunting PD's then I would opt for the 17HMR because of the slighlty flatter trajectory. But anything over the size of a PD needs the larger more powerful 22 WMR if your shooting might approach 125 to 150 yards. Past that then neither are effective killers.
As far as accuracy is concerned that is mostly a function of the quality of your firearm. It does seem like the 17 HMR tends to be a bit more accurate. But for 125 yard ground hog shooting I know of no human that can discern the difference in accuracy between the two.
I also think the windage argument is bunk unless you are shooting longer distances for PD's in the windier Western States. In most states no hunter will be able to discern the difference at the effective killing ranges of the rounds.
I would buy neither one for target shooting. Both are just too expensive too shoot for target. Get a good 22 LR for target, and a small CF if you want to shoot bench rest.
Both have their finer points. And to say that one is superior to the other in every circumstance is wrong. You really need to decide exactly what ou want to do with the rifle. Then pick your poison.
As far as rifles are concerned there are tons of choices. Save as much as you can and buy the best quality rifle you can afford. Tom.
I am a ground hog hunter. And first off neither cartridge is a 200 yard ground hog cartridge unless you like crawl offs-which I detest.
The 22 Magnum holds an advantage over the 17 HMR in killing effectiveness on critters the size of ground hogs or slightly larger. I don't have a chart to prove that. Just hundreds of dead ground hogs.
If I were only hunting PD's then I would opt for the 17HMR because of the slighlty flatter trajectory. But anything over the size of a PD needs the larger more powerful 22 WMR if your shooting might approach 125 to 150 yards. Past that then neither are effective killers.
As far as accuracy is concerned that is mostly a function of the quality of your firearm. It does seem like the 17 HMR tends to be a bit more accurate. But for 125 yard ground hog shooting I know of no human that can discern the difference in accuracy between the two.
I also think the windage argument is bunk unless you are shooting longer distances for PD's in the windier Western States. In most states no hunter will be able to discern the difference at the effective killing ranges of the rounds.
I would buy neither one for target shooting. Both are just too expensive too shoot for target. Get a good 22 LR for target, and a small CF if you want to shoot bench rest.
Both have their finer points. And to say that one is superior to the other in every circumstance is wrong. You really need to decide exactly what ou want to do with the rifle. Then pick your poison.
As far as rifles are concerned there are tons of choices. Save as much as you can and buy the best quality rifle you can afford. Tom.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I have them both and love them both. A 10/22 wmr that's been seriously customized, and a savage hmr that shoot's fantastic. Personally I shoot the wmr more but either way they are both solid short range calibers.
I have them both and love them both. A 10/22 wmr that's been seriously customized, and a savage hmr that shoot's fantastic. Personally I shoot the wmr more but either way they are both solid short range calibers.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I've just bought a Savage 93 BRJ in 22mag. I already have a 22mag pistol so it just made sence. I'm impressed with it. I really haven't had a lot of time behind it. I just got it Veterans day for myself. 50 yards it put 5 shots under 1/4" and at 100 yards I was 1 1/4". I probably will get better results at 100 when it isn't so windy. Wednesday the crosswind gusts were over 30mph and I was trying to shoot my groups when the wind either slowed or changed to a no value wind. The plus 2000fps second ammo all did better than the slower ammo bucking the wind. For the record the Remington Premier accu-tip 33gr ammo has performed the best thru my rimfire so far, but even the worst ammo at 100 would be accurate enough for yotes.
In the future I might upgrade my Redfield 4-12 with a Weaver V16 AO. I'd like a finer crosshair and an adjustable objective. If I got really serious with it, I might try a Basix custom trigger for it also. Just to squeak a little better trigger than the accu-trigger. Right now I'm going to the gun shop and get a couple of extra mags for it.
I love my Savage...
I've just bought a Savage 93 BRJ in 22mag. I already have a 22mag pistol so it just made sence. I'm impressed with it. I really haven't had a lot of time behind it. I just got it Veterans day for myself. 50 yards it put 5 shots under 1/4" and at 100 yards I was 1 1/4". I probably will get better results at 100 when it isn't so windy. Wednesday the crosswind gusts were over 30mph and I was trying to shoot my groups when the wind either slowed or changed to a no value wind. The plus 2000fps second ammo all did better than the slower ammo bucking the wind. For the record the Remington Premier accu-tip 33gr ammo has performed the best thru my rimfire so far, but even the worst ammo at 100 would be accurate enough for yotes.
In the future I might upgrade my Redfield 4-12 with a Weaver V16 AO. I'd like a finer crosshair and an adjustable objective. If I got really serious with it, I might try a Basix custom trigger for it also. Just to squeak a little better trigger than the accu-trigger. Right now I'm going to the gun shop and get a couple of extra mags for it.
I love my Savage...
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SingleShot85</div><div class="ubbcode-body">speed kills and trumps all independent factors
.....do I need a canted scope base....... </div></div>
Sir, can you please explain this, i've never heard the argument of canted scope bases.. thank you
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SingleShot85</div><div class="ubbcode-body">speed kills and trumps all independent factors
.....do I need a canted scope base....... </div></div>
Sir, can you please explain this, i've never heard the argument of canted scope bases.. thank you
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I own a Marlin 917vt (thumbhole goodness) and the thing is an absolute laser beam. After shooting that one for the first time, I stopped off at Sportsman's and ordered a second one!
I own a Marlin 917vt (thumbhole goodness) and the thing is an absolute laser beam. After shooting that one for the first time, I stopped off at Sportsman's and ordered a second one!
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
Savage 93r17 in heavy barrel is an awesome choice. They are good out to 200yrds. Ive killed many a jackrabbit at 200+ with 1 shot. Very nice rifles.
Savage 93r17 in heavy barrel is an awesome choice. They are good out to 200yrds. Ive killed many a jackrabbit at 200+ with 1 shot. Very nice rifles.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
17 hmr without a doubt. I have a CZ 452 varmint in 17 hmr and its awesome. Accuracy is unbelieveable. Really ought to check them out. Its also very easy to adjust the trigger.
17 hmr without a doubt. I have a CZ 452 varmint in 17 hmr and its awesome. Accuracy is unbelieveable. Really ought to check them out. Its also very easy to adjust the trigger.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
[sarcasm]Thank you for your very scientific and data-driven answer![/sarcasm]
My statement that .22WMR is better on a windy day than my .17HMR is from actual range trips and actual hunting trips (mostly groups at 50 / 100 yards, but the PD misses with the rifles don't lie either). I understand that the .17HMR has a higher muzzle velocity (300-500 fps), but that doesn't necessarily mean that it "bucks the wind better". Although I am not a physicist, I believe that the 17gr bullet is much more easily pushed around in the wind, causing the groups to open up much larger than a 40gr bullet.
Thank you for your input, but you should keep your hostility to yourself. Feel free to post targets from your range trips (we'll also need environmental conditions as well).
+ 1000 ON THAT ANSWER. I have both and will take the .22 mag
[sarcasm]Thank you for your very scientific and data-driven answer![/sarcasm]
My statement that .22WMR is better on a windy day than my .17HMR is from actual range trips and actual hunting trips (mostly groups at 50 / 100 yards, but the PD misses with the rifles don't lie either). I understand that the .17HMR has a higher muzzle velocity (300-500 fps), but that doesn't necessarily mean that it "bucks the wind better". Although I am not a physicist, I believe that the 17gr bullet is much more easily pushed around in the wind, causing the groups to open up much larger than a 40gr bullet.
Thank you for your input, but you should keep your hostility to yourself. Feel free to post targets from your range trips (we'll also need environmental conditions as well).
+ 1000 ON THAT ANSWER. I have both and will take the .22 mag
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
I shoot both and I agree the 17 is pushed around much more by wind. I also agree the 22WMR kills more effectively. Anything over squirrel or rabbit size game isn't going to die where you shoot it and if you plan to eat the squirrels or rabbit then its a poor choice because it makes a mess of them. 22WMR with some bullets will also wreck a squirrel too but with some bullets it won't. 22WMR will put groundshogs, foxs and coyotes down right there. With 17HMR I've had a couple of the foxs I've shot go down immediately, one of the coyote's (head shot) but every groundhog I've shot with it has crawled away and/or required follow up shots. With 17MR groundhogs must be head shot to keep them from going anywhere.
I would probably like the 17 a little more if I had a rifle in it that would shoot. My current is a savage FV and I can't get it to shoot better than 2MOA. This is my third savage 17 (also had a BTV and a GV) that has shot like this so I gave up on trying to get a shooter. I'll probably sell it and pick up a CZ 455 at some point. My Marlin 883 tube fed 22WMR on the other hand is the most accurate rimfire I've ever owned. It's well under MOA with two different loads at 100 yards and at or just below MOA at 200 yards which is the farthest I've shot it.
For me the choice is 22WMR.
I shoot both and I agree the 17 is pushed around much more by wind. I also agree the 22WMR kills more effectively. Anything over squirrel or rabbit size game isn't going to die where you shoot it and if you plan to eat the squirrels or rabbit then its a poor choice because it makes a mess of them. 22WMR with some bullets will also wreck a squirrel too but with some bullets it won't. 22WMR will put groundshogs, foxs and coyotes down right there. With 17HMR I've had a couple of the foxs I've shot go down immediately, one of the coyote's (head shot) but every groundhog I've shot with it has crawled away and/or required follow up shots. With 17MR groundhogs must be head shot to keep them from going anywhere.
I would probably like the 17 a little more if I had a rifle in it that would shoot. My current is a savage FV and I can't get it to shoot better than 2MOA. This is my third savage 17 (also had a BTV and a GV) that has shot like this so I gave up on trying to get a shooter. I'll probably sell it and pick up a CZ 455 at some point. My Marlin 883 tube fed 22WMR on the other hand is the most accurate rimfire I've ever owned. It's well under MOA with two different loads at 100 yards and at or just below MOA at 200 yards which is the farthest I've shot it.
For me the choice is 22WMR.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redneckbmxer24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I would probably like the 17 a little more if I had a rifle in it that would shoot. My current is a savage FV and I can't get it to shoot better than 2MOA. This is my third savage 17 (also had a BTV and a GV) that has shot like this so I gave up on trying to get a shooter. I'll probably sell it and pick up a CZ 455 at some point. My Marlin 883 tube fed 22WMR on the other hand is the most accurate rimfire I've ever owned. It's well under MOA with two different loads at 100 yards and at or just below MOA at 200 yards which is the farthest I've shot it.
For me the choice is 22WMR.</div></div>
Thats crazy because ive had 2 heavy barrel 93r17 that Ive shot 5 shot groups in a dime at 100 yrds. I even have one of those mossbergs that cost about $150 shoot close to that. Ive shot coyote at 200 and dropped them no problem.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: redneckbmxer24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I would probably like the 17 a little more if I had a rifle in it that would shoot. My current is a savage FV and I can't get it to shoot better than 2MOA. This is my third savage 17 (also had a BTV and a GV) that has shot like this so I gave up on trying to get a shooter. I'll probably sell it and pick up a CZ 455 at some point. My Marlin 883 tube fed 22WMR on the other hand is the most accurate rimfire I've ever owned. It's well under MOA with two different loads at 100 yards and at or just below MOA at 200 yards which is the farthest I've shot it.
For me the choice is 22WMR.</div></div>
Thats crazy because ive had 2 heavy barrel 93r17 that Ive shot 5 shot groups in a dime at 100 yrds. I even have one of those mossbergs that cost about $150 shoot close to that. Ive shot coyote at 200 and dropped them no problem.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
CZ 453 17hmr. Get it since it has that single set trigger and get it before they chop the model and switch all rimfires to their 455 platform.
CZ 453 17hmr. Get it since it has that single set trigger and get it before they chop the model and switch all rimfires to their 455 platform.
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
TOO PREDATOR doesn't need my approval, but just as he said. They all have something to offer. Personally, it should be your goal to get all three and shoot the heck out of them and tell us what you think.
Peace
TOO PREDATOR doesn't need my approval, but just as he said. They all have something to offer. Personally, it should be your goal to get all three and shoot the heck out of them and tell us what you think.
Peace
Re: .17 HMR or .22 Magnum and which rifle?
If you're doing any kind of matches or competitions I would recommend .22 Long Rifle personaly I haven't shot all that much with .17hmr but if your starting to shoot rimfire I think .22 would be the way to go maybe a Ruger 10/22 with a heavy barrel,nice little scope, and some good ammunition will get you going.
If you're doing any kind of matches or competitions I would recommend .22 Long Rifle personaly I haven't shot all that much with .17hmr but if your starting to shoot rimfire I think .22 would be the way to go maybe a Ruger 10/22 with a heavy barrel,nice little scope, and some good ammunition will get you going.
