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21 feet? Think again ...
- Thread starter Veer_G
- Start date
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
The 21ft rule - Fail or why a 45 caliber handgun round is better than a 9mm. A 12 bore would also have helped here. When trying to stop a madman with a knife or sword, caliber counts....
How many times are we going to repeat the 1899-1902 lessons?
Thanks for posting
The 21ft rule - Fail or why a 45 caliber handgun round is better than a 9mm. A 12 bore would also have helped here. When trying to stop a madman with a knife or sword, caliber counts....
How many times are we going to repeat the 1899-1902 lessons?
Thanks for posting
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
yeah you can tell these guys had little to no training though. once the guy started slashing there should have been shots popping like it was a firework grand finale. im not saying your not going to be affected mentally or physically by a guy running at you with a knife but these guys pretty much suck at there job.
yeah you can tell these guys had little to no training though. once the guy started slashing there should have been shots popping like it was a firework grand finale. im not saying your not going to be affected mentally or physically by a guy running at you with a knife but these guys pretty much suck at there job.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
OK..... here's the plan:
Lets all get in circle. When he goes ape shit we can't shoot him without hitting eachother, that way he can kill a couple of us and we'll go viral on youtube.
They under estimated his resolve......and got jacked!
How do you say 21ft in Swahili? Ouch!
OK..... here's the plan:
Lets all get in circle. When he goes ape shit we can't shoot him without hitting eachother, that way he can kill a couple of us and we'll go viral on youtube.
They under estimated his resolve......and got jacked!
How do you say 21ft in Swahili? Ouch!
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
i took an Andy Stafford course YEARS ago......blades can be very scarey
i took an Andy Stafford course YEARS ago......blades can be very scarey
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
It looked like the way they had him surrounded if they had shot and missed they could have hit there own people on the other side of him.
It looked like the way they had him surrounded if they had shot and missed they could have hit there own people on the other side of him.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel.
Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
....or you could spend some time and effort learning the basic techniques of Gracie Humaita. That way if your gun isn't on you or isn't accessible fast enough, you at least have some idea of what to do with an attacker who has a blade.
For anyone who hasn't done this, I really do highly recommend it. Whether you agree with MMA and such or not, the Gracie classes that train your body to react certain ways to things like knife attacks (by letting someone go ballistic on you with a red sharpie etc.), really do help, as you start to see yourself more and more able to disarm someone without even thinking about it. Yeah, adrenaline and "real" danger changes everything, but I really 110% believe knowing those systems of self defense against armed attackers could have made all the difference here.
....or you could spend some time and effort learning the basic techniques of Gracie Humaita. That way if your gun isn't on you or isn't accessible fast enough, you at least have some idea of what to do with an attacker who has a blade.
For anyone who hasn't done this, I really do highly recommend it. Whether you agree with MMA and such or not, the Gracie classes that train your body to react certain ways to things like knife attacks (by letting someone go ballistic on you with a red sharpie etc.), really do help, as you start to see yourself more and more able to disarm someone without even thinking about it. Yeah, adrenaline and "real" danger changes everything, but I really 110% believe knowing those systems of self defense against armed attackers could have made all the difference here.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel. </div></div>
+1 on that. 21 feet is the absolute MINIMUM distance that most people can expect to get rounds on target, and even then the attacker is likely to be within arms reach before you get a shot off. You are going to get cut.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel. </div></div>
+1 on that. 21 feet is the absolute MINIMUM distance that most people can expect to get rounds on target, and even then the attacker is likely to be within arms reach before you get a shot off. You are going to get cut.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel. </div></div>
you dont have to punch out to be able to shoot thats why you immediatly point the pistol forward as it clears the holster. you should be able to put rounds on target at any given time in your draw. you can begin shooting once the gun clears the holster if need be. this way instead of getting rounds on target when hes 5 feet away maybe youll get rounds on him when hes 7-10 feet away. sure he might still make it to you alive but hell have a couple more holes in his chest to kill him sooner.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Badshot308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Thing to remember too, is that if someone charges you with an edged weapon, even one or more solid hits probably won't stop the attack soon enough. Bullets don't blow people backwards like they show in the movies. That persons momentum will have them right on top of you with that weapon. Unless you get a good CNS shot,(which isn't likely), the attacker will live long enough to slice and dice the hell out of you. We practiced the 21 foot rule years ago at my local PD. Almost everyone that got charged, couldn't draw fast enough. I managed to draw with the "attacker" about 5 feet away. If it was a real situation, I would have been cut up bad or killed. Practice rapid lateral movement while firing. If your only option is to backpedal, your movement won't be as fast as your attackers forward travel. </div></div>
you dont have to punch out to be able to shoot thats why you immediatly point the pistol forward as it clears the holster. you should be able to put rounds on target at any given time in your draw. you can begin shooting once the gun clears the holster if need be. this way instead of getting rounds on target when hes 5 feet away maybe youll get rounds on him when hes 7-10 feet away. sure he might still make it to you alive but hell have a couple more holes in his chest to kill him sooner.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over.
Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kentactic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you dont have to punch out to be able to shoot thats why you immediatly point the pistol forward as it clears the holster. you should be able to put rounds on target at any given time in your draw. you can begin shooting once the gun clears the holster if need be. this way instead of getting rounds on target when hes 5 feet away maybe youll get rounds on him when hes 7-10 feet away. sure he might still make it to you alive but hell have a couple more holes in his chest to kill him sooner. </div></div>
It is my opinion (inexperienced though it may be...) that this process would need to be practiced considerably beforehand. I'm talking about actual and concentrated practicing. Simply because, someone wise here has stated previously that "one cannot miss fast enough to win a gunfight".
Just thought I'd throw that into the mix.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kentactic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">you dont have to punch out to be able to shoot thats why you immediatly point the pistol forward as it clears the holster. you should be able to put rounds on target at any given time in your draw. you can begin shooting once the gun clears the holster if need be. this way instead of getting rounds on target when hes 5 feet away maybe youll get rounds on him when hes 7-10 feet away. sure he might still make it to you alive but hell have a couple more holes in his chest to kill him sooner. </div></div>
It is my opinion (inexperienced though it may be...) that this process would need to be practiced considerably beforehand. I'm talking about actual and concentrated practicing. Simply because, someone wise here has stated previously that "one cannot miss fast enough to win a gunfight".
Just thought I'd throw that into the mix.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
correct. but even if you miss every shot until your punched out assuming its safe to miss then theres no loss. you get the gun punched out at the same speed your just shooting as you draw. i myself do practice this. a warning though like anything else if some ones going to try this they need to start slow and get the correct form before they go full speed. otherwise your likely to shoot your support hand as your shooting and it meets the pistol. the gun should go to the hand not the hand to the gun. keep the support hand on your chest wating for the gun to meet it.
correct. but even if you miss every shot until your punched out assuming its safe to miss then theres no loss. you get the gun punched out at the same speed your just shooting as you draw. i myself do practice this. a warning though like anything else if some ones going to try this they need to start slow and get the correct form before they go full speed. otherwise your likely to shoot your support hand as your shooting and it meets the pistol. the gun should go to the hand not the hand to the gun. keep the support hand on your chest wating for the gun to meet it.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
I agree MMA techniques would be in order, the first guy stabbed had an AK in his hand, even if not POINTING and firing he could use the buttstock as a deflector and butt t his guy in the head several times.
Secondly, he had a knife OUT already, so ifn't it were me, and it was at one point many years ago, my finger would be on trigger with the safety off ready to fire if he even FLINCHED.
And lastly look at the terrain he was on....they all fell.
Very sad case, I hope the cops lived and bad guy did not.
I agree MMA techniques would be in order, the first guy stabbed had an AK in his hand, even if not POINTING and firing he could use the buttstock as a deflector and butt t his guy in the head several times.
Secondly, he had a knife OUT already, so ifn't it were me, and it was at one point many years ago, my finger would be on trigger with the safety off ready to fire if he even FLINCHED.
And lastly look at the terrain he was on....they all fell.
Very sad case, I hope the cops lived and bad guy did not.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Shot placement on a moving target like that has got to be pretty hard. Makes sense why pro's would want a larger caliber.
Shot placement on a moving target like that has got to be pretty hard. Makes sense why pro's would want a larger caliber.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dareposte</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shot placement on a moving target like that has got to be pretty hard. Makes sense why pro's would want a larger caliber. </div></div>
See my post above, larger caliber would not save your life, unless you hit him in the head. Crazy is like PHP, if someone wants to kill you a head shot is probably the only way ot go, at that oint caliber is almost not applicable.
Point being, they should have had handguns drawn, aimed, ready to fire if he flinched and they did not.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dareposte</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shot placement on a moving target like that has got to be pretty hard. Makes sense why pro's would want a larger caliber. </div></div>
See my post above, larger caliber would not save your life, unless you hit him in the head. Crazy is like PHP, if someone wants to kill you a head shot is probably the only way ot go, at that oint caliber is almost not applicable.
Point being, they should have had handguns drawn, aimed, ready to fire if he flinched and they did not.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
I was in a knife fight once. I was very lucky and was not injured. However, the other guy I was with was. It is not fun when the blood starts pouring onto the sidewalk. I can tell you first hand that the 21 foot rule is a bare minimum.
If someone has a knife out like that guy does inside 7 yards, you should not hesitate at that point. You are completely kidding yourself if you think otherwise.
I was in a knife fight once. I was very lucky and was not injured. However, the other guy I was with was. It is not fun when the blood starts pouring onto the sidewalk. I can tell you first hand that the 21 foot rule is a bare minimum.
If someone has a knife out like that guy does inside 7 yards, you should not hesitate at that point. You are completely kidding yourself if you think otherwise.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Well if he was in SoCal he would have been shot dead on the spot when he first refused. LAPD and surrounding areas are not afraid to shoot! See it everyday on the news.
HB police shot a girl 17 times that had a knife and refused to drop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDLcMSmB6Fc
Well if he was in SoCal he would have been shot dead on the spot when he first refused. LAPD and surrounding areas are not afraid to shoot! See it everyday on the news.
HB police shot a girl 17 times that had a knife and refused to drop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDLcMSmB6Fc
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
WOW, just WOW. Around here they would have used a taser on him.
I have always thought a good knife fighting class would be good to have taken if it came down to that.
WOW, just WOW. Around here they would have used a taser on him.
I have always thought a good knife fighting class would be good to have taken if it came down to that.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
+1 They should not be. Somebody is gonna play that game they better be ready to get shot. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well if he was in SoCal he would have been shot dead on the spot when he first refused. LAPD and surrounding areas are not afraid to shoot! See it everyday on the news.
HB police shot a girl 17 times that had a knife and refused to drop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDLcMSmB6Fc
</div></div>
+1 They should not be. Somebody is gonna play that game they better be ready to get shot. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well if he was in SoCal he would have been shot dead on the spot when he first refused. LAPD and surrounding areas are not afraid to shoot! See it everyday on the news.
HB police shot a girl 17 times that had a knife and refused to drop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDLcMSmB6Fc
</div></div>
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Intresting comments. I was a State Trooper and have been involved in LE for nearly 30yrs and am a black belt in both Karate and Judo and have had many DT classes and tought them at the LE training center.
The one thing I learned over the years is if your going to take on someone with a knife you better plan on getting cut and plan on bleeding. We tought the 21ft rule and when we did training exercises there were very few officers who could get their gun out and fire befor being set up on by an attacker.
You get someone who can use a knife and its like facing a damn blender!! I have talked to a couple of officers who were cut and the one thing they all said was when that knife slashs your arm or hand and you look down and see a gash 6"s long and an inch wide your panic when its "Your" blood draing out on the sidewalk and all you can think about is flight.
They have a great training film out called "Surviving a edged weapon attack" its a real eye opener and they have interviews with officers who were attacked and cut.
Yes, these guys made mistakes but even so, facing a knife is not a prospect any of us want to do. And yes in that situtation I "Would have" had my weapon drawn because I know what can happen.
As far as being trained in any kind of MMA or whatever your kidding yourself if you think you can disarm a determind attack who has a knife. I had many guys go through my classes who were black belts in about every style out there and they had their eyes opened.
I had a DT instructor who had more black belts than you could imagine and tought knife fighting and his saying was "Face someone with a knife plan ono getting cut" and "A determined untrained man with a knife will always beat a trained unarmed man" So just my thoughts on this........
Intresting comments. I was a State Trooper and have been involved in LE for nearly 30yrs and am a black belt in both Karate and Judo and have had many DT classes and tought them at the LE training center.
The one thing I learned over the years is if your going to take on someone with a knife you better plan on getting cut and plan on bleeding. We tought the 21ft rule and when we did training exercises there were very few officers who could get their gun out and fire befor being set up on by an attacker.
You get someone who can use a knife and its like facing a damn blender!! I have talked to a couple of officers who were cut and the one thing they all said was when that knife slashs your arm or hand and you look down and see a gash 6"s long and an inch wide your panic when its "Your" blood draing out on the sidewalk and all you can think about is flight.
They have a great training film out called "Surviving a edged weapon attack" its a real eye opener and they have interviews with officers who were attacked and cut.
Yes, these guys made mistakes but even so, facing a knife is not a prospect any of us want to do. And yes in that situtation I "Would have" had my weapon drawn because I know what can happen.
As far as being trained in any kind of MMA or whatever your kidding yourself if you think you can disarm a determind attack who has a knife. I had many guys go through my classes who were black belts in about every style out there and they had their eyes opened.
I had a DT instructor who had more black belts than you could imagine and tought knife fighting and his saying was "Face someone with a knife plan ono getting cut" and "A determined untrained man with a knife will always beat a trained unarmed man" So just my thoughts on this........
L
longguntoter
Guest
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Well, I think very few of us are truly trained in the proper use of a blade. I carry a nice big clip knife, but really don't know how to use the blade properly. Even being in the Marines does not really qualify as being properly trained. At least as far a blade work goes. 21 feet is really not that much distance to clear when one is determined and especially when one is determined AND trained in hand to hand combat. I agree with what you say here and don't try to kid myself that just because I CC, I am somehow immuned to having someone get the better of me if they are truly determined to get me. Anyways, I feel that most attackers are going to start their attack at a range that is closer than 21 feet, so you better be on your toes. JMHO.
Well, I think very few of us are truly trained in the proper use of a blade. I carry a nice big clip knife, but really don't know how to use the blade properly. Even being in the Marines does not really qualify as being properly trained. At least as far a blade work goes. 21 feet is really not that much distance to clear when one is determined and especially when one is determined AND trained in hand to hand combat. I agree with what you say here and don't try to kid myself that just because I CC, I am somehow immuned to having someone get the better of me if they are truly determined to get me. Anyways, I feel that most attackers are going to start their attack at a range that is closer than 21 feet, so you better be on your toes. JMHO.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Long Beach PD shot a drunk guy a while back with a hose nozzle in his hands...multiple times with a shotgun and pistol.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ief-admits.html
LAPD shoots most.
Long Beach PD shot a drunk guy a while back with a hose nozzle in his hands...multiple times with a shotgun and pistol.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ief-admits.html
LAPD shoots most.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
obviously poor tactics, training, mindset...amuteuers, and not b/c of the country this took place...i've seen it in the US where LEOs have poor discipline and training + healthy doses of complacency that when a situation goes south, many resort to the ole' bum rush or the "shoot from the hip" mentality...usually the ones that don't take training seriously or believe they don't need to...also regarding the vid major cross fire issue...poor positioning (i.e "BASIC" contact/cover positioning)...WTF are they thinking trying to close the gap like that...sad but you can even see shit like that here....
obviously poor tactics, training, mindset...amuteuers, and not b/c of the country this took place...i've seen it in the US where LEOs have poor discipline and training + healthy doses of complacency that when a situation goes south, many resort to the ole' bum rush or the "shoot from the hip" mentality...usually the ones that don't take training seriously or believe they don't need to...also regarding the vid major cross fire issue...poor positioning (i.e "BASIC" contact/cover positioning)...WTF are they thinking trying to close the gap like that...sad but you can even see shit like that here....
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Long Beach PD shot a drunk guy a while back with a hose nozzle in his hands...multiple times with a shotgun and pistol.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ief-admits.html
LAPD shoots most. </div></div>
i think in this incident the police were trigger happy but like what was it a year ago?...that drunk mexican guy had a knife and they shot him in the head a couple times.... everyone said they should have just tazed him...screw that i woulda shot him more then twice. screw around with a knife or gun and you deserve anything that you recieve.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: shooter65</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Long Beach PD shot a drunk guy a while back with a hose nozzle in his hands...multiple times with a shotgun and pistol.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ief-admits.html
LAPD shoots most. </div></div>
i think in this incident the police were trigger happy but like what was it a year ago?...that drunk mexican guy had a knife and they shot him in the head a couple times.... everyone said they should have just tazed him...screw that i woulda shot him more then twice. screw around with a knife or gun and you deserve anything that you recieve.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobinNC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The 21ft rule - Fail or why a 45 caliber handgun round is better than a 9mm. </div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BobinNC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The 21ft rule - Fail or why a 45 caliber handgun round is better than a 9mm. </div></div>
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 999yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over. </div></div>
+1
.45 vs. 9mm What? These guys had rifles but were not ready. Never underestimate the opponent and when you shoot break 'em down. Take out the pelvis and the knife goes no futher.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 999yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over. </div></div>
+1
.45 vs. 9mm What? These guys had rifles but were not ready. Never underestimate the opponent and when you shoot break 'em down. Take out the pelvis and the knife goes no futher.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
Run Forrest run is pretty right on.
If facing a knife, get way out of the way or at least pick something up to get between you and the knife. A knife is a very deadly weapon. It will freakin' kill you dead. Do not mess with it if you can get away from it, ever. Get others out of the way if you can too but first and foremost, make sure you are alive for the next day.
Sure there are things worse than dying, but ordinarily speaking the risk/reward scenario of messing with a knife isn't worth it.
Now if your wife or child is in danger and can't get out of the way, you just might not make it. At least you will go out on your shield. Hopefully you have a good life insurance policy.
If you are LE, I say use excessive force. The attacker sure is.
I think the only thing more deadly than a knife or a gun is political correctness, as the video showed.
Run Forrest run is pretty right on.
If facing a knife, get way out of the way or at least pick something up to get between you and the knife. A knife is a very deadly weapon. It will freakin' kill you dead. Do not mess with it if you can get away from it, ever. Get others out of the way if you can too but first and foremost, make sure you are alive for the next day.
Sure there are things worse than dying, but ordinarily speaking the risk/reward scenario of messing with a knife isn't worth it.
Now if your wife or child is in danger and can't get out of the way, you just might not make it. At least you will go out on your shield. Hopefully you have a good life insurance policy.
If you are LE, I say use excessive force. The attacker sure is.
I think the only thing more deadly than a knife or a gun is political correctness, as the video showed.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Longshotbml</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 999yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over. </div></div>
+1
.45 vs. 9mm What? These guys had rifles but were not ready. Never underestimate the opponent and when you shoot break 'em down. Take out the pelvis and the knife goes no futher. </div></div>
+2 , failure low. Poor tactics and complacency were the culprit here, not the caliber. They would have missed with a .45 the same way the only difference is they would have had to do a reload sooner. Its the indian not the arrow. And people who think they can make a head shot thats running at them with a pistol are either amazing shooters or deceiving themselves with catch phrases like "double tap". Also with a handgun your headshot shouldn't be the forehead so your looking at a very small t zone to hit. I have seen a lot of handgun bullets deflect off the forehead because of the shape and hardness of the forehead. That or enter the skin and travel around the head in between the skin and skull. My goal in this scenario is for him to stop moving. Disable the mobility section but more importantly put shots on target as fast as possible and as accurately as possible until the desired results are achieved. With a 9mm if I fire 3-5 rounds and he doest go down I still have 12-15 rounds to alternate target areas and my front sight tracks much faster.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Longshotbml</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 999yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Forget chest and head shots to start with, hit the pelvic area first, on adrenaline or drugs he will double over. </div></div>
+1
.45 vs. 9mm What? These guys had rifles but were not ready. Never underestimate the opponent and when you shoot break 'em down. Take out the pelvis and the knife goes no futher. </div></div>
+2 , failure low. Poor tactics and complacency were the culprit here, not the caliber. They would have missed with a .45 the same way the only difference is they would have had to do a reload sooner. Its the indian not the arrow. And people who think they can make a head shot thats running at them with a pistol are either amazing shooters or deceiving themselves with catch phrases like "double tap". Also with a handgun your headshot shouldn't be the forehead so your looking at a very small t zone to hit. I have seen a lot of handgun bullets deflect off the forehead because of the shape and hardness of the forehead. That or enter the skin and travel around the head in between the skin and skull. My goal in this scenario is for him to stop moving. Disable the mobility section but more importantly put shots on target as fast as possible and as accurately as possible until the desired results are achieved. With a 9mm if I fire 3-5 rounds and he doest go down I still have 12-15 rounds to alternate target areas and my front sight tracks much faster.
Re: 21 feet? Think again ...
i dont remember the part at the academy that taught you if holding an ak and a suspect holding a knife jump the fence and close the distance to said suspect as hes just bluffing! idiots with little to no training
as far as the taser crowd your a idiot of the tenth degree if you think taser was the right tool. if fact my so would probably give you a reprimand (if your alive) for making such a stupid mistake!
i dont remember the part at the academy that taught you if holding an ak and a suspect holding a knife jump the fence and close the distance to said suspect as hes just bluffing! idiots with little to no training
as far as the taser crowd your a idiot of the tenth degree if you think taser was the right tool. if fact my so would probably give you a reprimand (if your alive) for making such a stupid mistake!
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