?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????

[Smcarroll]

I would argue that that purposeful dismantling of religion, the purposeful redefinition of morality, the obliteration of the family unit and the erasure of the concept of personal responsibility are the root causes of problems in this country. I will leave it to others to reveal whom architected this decline, but make no mistake this trend is part of a well thought out strategy.

This kid is merely a product of those plans. Welcome to the new normal.

Your morality and my morality may drastically differ. Who are you to force your beliefs and morality on other people. This boy didn't plan to do what he did because of a lack of religion, family unit or morality. He is mentally ill. There is something wrong with the mechanisms in his brain.

 

[pawprint2]

For a number of years, I have read about the number of children in the U.S. taking the drug Ritalin (and like drugs), the current number has sky rocketed to 8million! Many of the articles have pointed out the unusually high number of kids involved in school shooting/ murder/ etc. have been taking these type(s) of drugs. Albeit these kids were "under the care of a physician" and their drugs were prescribed, and being taken IAW the law, the possible link to this type of behavior need further study. A study NOT funded by the drug companies that make billions on the sale of this stuff. On a personal note, I find it hard to believe that 8 million of our kids need to be on a psychotropic drug, for years at a time. Where did this come from? As more and more kids are placed on these drugs, the test scores as compared to other civilized countries slips, as well as our "own" testing, ACT for example. There may, in fact be a link.
I'm editing this post to add, the as the number of un-wed mothers rises, the number of young males growing up without a man's influence increases. In areas where this is most prevalent, so does all manner of violent crime-and the criminals are starting their life of crime younger and younger. Gangs actively recruit kids, serious violence, murder being the top of the list is far toooooo common in most of our large cities. This too, happens to be where we find the largest concentration of single parent families , drug dealing and where the gangs are concentrated. The gangs are primarily funded by illegal drug sales, it's hard to tell kids drugs are bad, when a large number of their classmates are taking psychotropic all day every day! The way they may see it is, as long as certain people are making money on the drugs, they are good, if we (the gangs) try to make money on it, it's bad! In short, there are a number of factors destroying our society, the break-down of family, as we have known it for so long, it at the core, it is in a large part both the cause and the effect.

 

[orkan]

The ?stuff? we are made of « America needs an Iron Patriot

 

[5RWill]

Truth be told there is a lot of good still left in the world, but that doesn't attract views. I mean honestly when do you turn on the news and see the goodness of people being reported every day? I couldn't tell you but i stopped watching the news long ago. I'm of the thinking like Eli Polite said things are reported so fast now a days it's ridiculous.

 

[jashmore1234]

Your morality and my morality may drastically differ. Who are you to force your beliefs and morality on other people. This boy didn't plan to do what he did because of a lack of religion, family unit or morality. He is mentally ill. There is something wrong with the mechanisms in his brain.

Who are you to incorrectly assume I force anything on anyone?

I have espoused no particular belief system, other than right and wrong. We are at a point in our society where we have been programmed to instantly assume that beliefs are being forced on other people at the mere mention of religion, morality, family and personal responsibility. If it wasn't so sad, it would be laughable.

This young man clearly lacked a basic understanding of morality and ethics (right and wrong).

While it is possible that he is mentally ill, based on what we know about him, it is equally likely that his moral and ethical foundation was lacking to make rational decisions or at a minimum not to make immoral decisions; programming, not mechanisms.

 

[Smcarroll]

Who are you to incorrectly assume I force anything on anyone?

I have espoused no particular belief system, other than right and wrong. We are at a point in our society where we have been programmed to instantly assume that beliefs are being forced on other people at the mere mention of religion, morality, family and personal responsibility. If it wasn't so sad, it would be laughable.

This young man clearly lacked a basic understanding of morality and ethics (right and wrong).

While it is possible that he is mentally ill, based on what we know about him, it is equally likely that his moral and ethical foundation was lacking to make rational decisions or at a minimum not to make immoral decisions; programming, not mechanisms.

That's a load of shit. While the details may vary, every person knows its wrong to kill people and blow up their school, even if they have 2 daddies and worship the wrong gods. This kid knew what he was doing was wrong, that's why he hid his actions.

 

[predator hunter]

First you have no idea who I am. If you want to place me in a little box of hate that makes you feel better go right ahead.

I am in Business also and after the holier than thou party crashed the economy, I came real close to losing mine. But I sucked it, up toughed it out and made it. So excuse me If I am reluctant to put those same folks back in power. The are like men in prison who find Jesus. Only these guys suddenly found fiscal responsibility. Sure they did.

The fact that you would let politics prevent you from helping someone in need speaks volumes about you and those like you. Volumes.

FS1,
Just go ahead and say it, you know you want to. It's all George W's fault. There now, don't you feel better? And, don't tell us about a little box of hate, the left, for all there preaching of tolerance are the first ones to start slinging shit.

 

[Maggot]

For a number of years, I have read about the number of children in the U.S. taking the drug Ritalin (and like drugs), the current number has sky rocketed to 8million! Many of the articles have pointed out the unusually high number of kids involved in school shooting/ murder/ etc. have been taking these type(s) of drugs. Albeit these kids were "under the care of a physician" and their drugs were prescribed, and being taken IAW the law, the possible link to this type of behavior need further study. A study NOT funded by the drug companies that make billions on the sale of this stuff. On a personal note, I find it hard to believe that 8 million of our kids need to be on a psychotropic drug, for years at a time. Where did this come from? As more and more kids are placed on these drugs, the test scores as compared to other civilized countries slips, as well as our "own" testing, ACT for example. There may, in fact be a link.
I'm editing this post to add, the as the number of un-wed mothers rises, the number of young males growing up without a man's influence increases. In areas where this is most prevalent, so does all manner of violent crime-and the criminals are starting their life of crime younger and younger. Gangs actively recruit kids, serious violence, murder being the top of the list is far toooooo common in most of our large cities. This too, happens to be where we find the largest concentration of single parent families , drug dealing and where the gangs are concentrated. The gangs are primarily funded by illegal drug sales, it's hard to tell kids drugs are bad, when a large number of their classmates are taking psychotropic all day every day! The way they may see it is, as long as certain people are making money on the drugs, they are good, if we (the gangs) try to make money on it, it's bad! In short, there are a number of factors destroying our society, the break-down of family, as we have known it for so long, it at the core, it is in a large part both the cause and the effect.

Paw, we have disagreed on much but I think your analysis here is largely correct.

The one thing I would add is that the pharmaceutical companies, who make billions off the sale of Ritalin and other drugs of this type, also block the legalization of cannabis, which is shown in many studies to have very beneficial advantages to the more destructive drugs they offer. Its about the money. And the headlines the media can sell everytime one of these mass murders occurs.

 

[Smcarroll]

For a number of years, I have read about the number of children in the U.S. taking the drug Ritalin (and like drugs), the current number has sky rocketed to 8million! Many of the articles have pointed out the unusually high number of kids involved in school shooting/ murder/ etc. have been taking these type(s) of drugs. Albeit these kids were "under the care of a physician" and their drugs were prescribed, and being taken IAW the law, the possible link to this type of behavior need further study. A study NOT funded by the drug companies that make billions on the sale of this stuff. On a personal note, I find it hard to believe that 8 million of our kids need to be on a psychotropic drug, for years at a time. Where did this come from? As more and more kids are placed on these drugs, the test scores as compared to other civilized countries slips, as well as our "own" testing, ACT for example. There may, in fact be a link.
I'm editing this post to add, the as the number of un-wed mothers rises, the number of young males growing up without a man's influence increases. In areas where this is most prevalent, so does all manner of violent crime-and the criminals are starting their life of crime younger and younger. Gangs actively recruit kids, serious violence, murder being the top of the list is far toooooo common in most of our large cities. This too, happens to be where we find the largest concentration of single parent families , drug dealing and where the gangs are concentrated. The gangs are primarily funded by illegal drug sales, it's hard to tell kids drugs are bad, when a large number of their classmates are taking psychotropic all day every day! The way they may see it is, as long as certain people are making money on the drugs, they are good, if we (the gangs) try to make money on it, it's bad! In short, there are a number of factors destroying our society, the break-down of family, as we have known it for so long, it at the core, it is in a large part both the cause and the effect.

Well said. I was put on ritalin and several other drugs at age 11 or so. I gained weight, lost my interest in going outdoors and just basically zombied out. My mom took me off them and found a school where they actually worked with me and gave me challenging school materials. Its a lot easier to stuff shit into a child's mind if they are zoned out on drugs.

19 people will die from prescription drugs today. The only people killed from pot are the ones the police shoot.

 

[pmclaine]

Well said. I was put on ritalin and several other drugs at age 11 or so. I gained weight, lost my interest in going outdoors and just basically zombied out. My mom took me off them and found a school where they actually worked with me and gave me challenging school materials. Its a lot easier to stuff shit into a child's mind if they are zoned out on drugs.

19 people will die from prescription drugs today. The only people killed from pot are the ones the police shoot.

I think right now the second coming of Einstein is out there but because he was different he was perscribed ADD drugs and the world is that much poorer.

A coworker, with kids that have been diagnosed, told me the drugs have their value and it helps his kids but they way they use it is to only take it when necessary. If they are studying for a test and realize they cant get through it they take some adderal or whatever and it gives them focus. All the new names are sweet for patenting purposes and making a buck but arent most of these drugs forms of "speed" by another name? I guess in some awful instances it can create the "ultimate soldier".

Im not ready to abandon modern medicine but it cant be used as a means to replace paying attention to the kids, a means to "quiet them down".

 

[Smcarroll]

I think right now the second coming of Einstein is out there but because he was different he was perscribed ADD drugs and the world is that much poorer.

A coworker, with kids that have been diagnosed, told me the drugs have their value and it helps his kids but they way they use it is to only take it when necessary. If they are studying for a test and realize they cant get through it they take some adderal or whatever and it gives them focus. All the new names are sweet for patenting purposes and making a buck but arent most of these drugs forms of "speed" by another name? I guess in some awful instances it can create the "ultimate soldier".

Im not ready to abandon modern medicine but it cant be used as a means to replace paying attention to the kids, a means to "quiet them down".

Adderall is an amphetamine. It will get you high as hell. How many years did our soldiers use amphetamines? They used to be over the counter, same as cocaine and opiates. In ww2 German soldiers used drugs as currency, since the Reichsmark was almost worthless.

 

[KYpatriot]

Your morality and my morality may drastically differ. Who are you to force your beliefs and morality on other people. This boy didn't plan to do what he did because of a lack of religion, family unit or morality. He is mentally ill. There is something wrong with the mechanisms in his brain.

Can't let this go, because this attitude is literally going to be the downfall of our entire society. The assumption that people will be basically good without adherence to a moral code of some kind is demonstrably false. The breakdown in the American family directly correlates to worse outcomes for children. This is statistically proven, by almost any measure you want to start with- look at economic outcomes for single parent children for example.

Your and my morality may differ, but that doesn't mean that they are both equally good for society. Do you think it is coincidence that communism, with all the disastrous threats it entails for people's lives and well being, most easily takes root in cultures like those in Asia where the belief systems devalue individual life relative to the whole? Likewise, is it coincidence that the USA, the very first Constitutional Republic respecting individual liberty, was born out of a Judeo-Christian ethic that places natural law ( god's law) above that of a king who is a mere man?

Of course it isn't coincidence. Beliefs matter to societies ( and governments) because they influence what individuals citizens do and say. Try to import bibles into any totalitarian country on the planet if you don't believe me.

Without limitations in some form, human behavior will tend to anarchy where might makes right, and so anarchy always leads to tyranny of the strong over the weak. This happens every time unless human behavior is constrained by one of two things- individuals who self limit by adhering to a system of belief or the individual behavior is limited by government control. There is almost always a little (or a lot) of both happening. The founders understood that with the never-before-seen amount of individual liberty recognized in our Constitution, our society would rely on morality to function correctly. There was so little government control we actually depend on a common code of morality to provide limits on behavior where government did not.

John Adams said it this way:
“We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge or gallantry would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution is designed only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other.”

Whether you realize it or not, or whether you adhere to it or not, you are still the beneficiary of a society that restrains itself through the worldview of the Judeo-Christian ethic. Just like if you choose not to vaccinate yourself from common disease you benefit from others that do. If everyone opts out, embraces your moral relativism, and does their own thing you will see the breakdown of society. Government will attempt to implement more and more control to maintain order- just as you are seeing now. Likewise, if everyone opted out of vaccination for polio it would again rear it's ugly head as a common disease.

Your moral relativism works for you because I don't practice it with you. You criticize efforts to keep morality in public life not realizing you depend on it daily. You are sawing off the branch you are sitting on.

 

[orkan]

KYpatriot, you just described the ever evolving and relentlessly pushed tolerance agenda. If you don't support the latest immoral cause, then you are labeled a racist bigot.

 

[EventHorizon]

Can't let this go, because this attitude is literally going to be the downfall of our entire society. The assumption that people will be basically good without adherence to a moral code of some kind is demonstrably false. The breakdown in the American family directly correlates to worse outcomes for children. This is statistically proven, by almost any measure you want to start with- look at economic outcomes for single parent children for example.

Your and my morality may differ, but that doesn't mean that they are both equally good for society. Do you think it is coincidence that communism, with all the disastrous threats it entails for peoples lives and well being, most easily takes root in cultures like that of Asia where the beliefs systems devalue individual life relative to the whole? Likewise, is it coincidence that the USA, the very first Constitutional Republic respecting individual liberty, was born out of a Judeo-Christian ethic that places natural law ( god's law) above that of a king who is a mere man?

Of course it isn't coincidence. Beliefs matter to societies because they influence what individuals citizens do and say. Try to import bibles into any totalitarian country on the planet if you don't believe me.

Without limitation human behavior will tend to anarchy where might makes right, and so anarchy always leads to tyranny of the strong over the weak. This happens every time unless human behavior is constrained by one of two things- individuals who self limit by adhering to a system of belief or the individual behavior is limited by government control. There is almost always a little of both happening. The founders understood that with the never-before-seen amount of individual liberty recognized in our Constitution, our society would rely on morality to function correctly. There was so little government control we actually depend on a common code of morality to provide limits on behavior where government did not.

John Adams said it this way:
“We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge or gallantry would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution is designed only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate for any other.”

Whether you realize it or not, or whether you adhere to it or not, you are still the beneficiary of a society that restrains itself through the worldview if the Judeo-Christian ethic. Just like if you choose not to vaccinate yourself from common disease you benefit from others that do. If everyone opts out, embraces your moral relativism, and does their own thing you will see the breakdown of society and government will attempt to implement more and more control to maintain order- just as you are seeing now. Likewise, if everyone opted out of vaccination for polio it would again rear it's ugly head as a common disease.

Your moral relativism works for you because I don't practice it with you. You criticize efforts to keep morality in public life not realizing you depend on it daily. You are sawing off the branch you are sitting on.

The premise of individual liberty has little root in the moral framework you reference. In fact, starkly the opposite. Almost all the principles are those of supplication, fatalism and pre-ordained positions in life. The entire apparatus was designed, implemented and refined to maintain an asymmetric and sustained imbalance of knowledge, power and economic wealth.

If the fate of mankind was rampant and self-destructive anarchy without the moral framework you referenced then it's wonder, if not a miracle (if such things existed) that we made it to that point in the first place. Mankind as a civilization existed for a good few thousand years before hand.

Right from Wrong is not divinely defined. Commonsense and 'man's law' forms a goodly basis of it with cultural norms filling in the rest. The crime of murder has always been such - a crime, before 'Thou Shalt not Kill' were ever supposedly uttered by Moses. Why? Because no society could exist without such restraints and enforcement of them.

A mark of anarchy is the absence of coherent effort, innovation that benefits the masses and the planning, progression and advancement of the 'tribe' - indeed, there cannot be a tribe - yet many societies have achieved all those things without ever hearing of Abraham, Moses or Jesus.

My morality is not based on what I fear may happen to me in some afterlife and if that's the guiding principle of those who refrain from doing wrong then they have no morality whatsoever - they're just afraid of the unknown.

 

[Smcarroll]

I agree there must be a baseline moral code that everyone should follow. Do not rape, do not kill, do not steal. Treat others and their possesions with respect. Those are simple guidelines that everyone of every race and religion should follow. If I want to jerk off to donkey porn, smoke peyote in a sweat lodge, get naked and worship the stars that's my own business and by my moral code its ok. I don't tell others how to live their life but if I see someone breaking those basic fundamentals I lined out I will go out of my way to stop them.

John Wayne had a great quote in The Shootist.
"I wont be wronged. I wont be insulted. I wont be laid hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them."
If everyone lived by that simple code our society would be a lot better off.

 

[Smcarroll]

Obama's 'Operation Choke Point' Seeks to Destroy Sectors of Private Lending Industry

Now they are trying to impose their morality on us with this legislation.

 

[KYpatriot]

EH, Your morality may not be based on fear of the afterlife, but you are less likely to be a victim of theft or murder because others do believe those things.

The premise of individual liberty recognized as pre-existing by government rather than granted by government was absolutely an extension of the philosophy of John Locke and without question rooted in the Judeo-Christian ethic.

The fate of mankind is always anarchy without moral framework or government control. When you asked why order existed before Christian ethic you ignored the government control portion of the sentence. You know from history that people despise the insecurity of anarchy above all things, and will embrace unrestrained religion (theocracy) or unrestrained government (totalitarianism) before anarchy. Anarchy is not freedom, because my liberty will be curtailed in short order by people with better swords, more guns, more wealth, or more numbers.

Look at societies that function in an orderly manner, either in the past or present, that don't have the Judeo-Christian ethos in their day to day life. You will find that without the self limiting/self governance attributes of that ethos the restraint is provided by much more government control than we suffer here. Though, as I pointed out, as our society because more diverse in morality government control will increase in direct proportion. It is already happening. Public shame and disgrace is being replaced by police power.

Murder is restricted in non-religious societies by government. It is restricted in religious societies by belief and likely also by government. I leave for you to figure out if you will need more or less government controls in the society where the people have a moral basis for not murdering rather than merely a legal code.

You don't have to believe that religion is true in order to benefit from it as a society or to understand the positive impact they have on our relationship with government in the case of the Judeo-Christian ethic that permeates our culture in this country. Human being will not live in anarchy- you have to choose, will government restrain people or will a religion, or a mix of both as we have here. There are examples of the entire spectrum of that choice around the world as we speak.

 

[KYpatriot]

I agree there must be a baseline moral code that everyone should follow. Do not rape, do not kill, do not steal. Treat others and their possesions with respect. Those are simple guidelines that everyone of every race and religion should follow. If I want to jerk off to donkey porn, smoke peyote in a sweat lodge, get naked and worship the stars that's my own business and by my moral code its ok. I don't tell others how to live their life but if I see someone breaking those basic fundamentals I lined out I will go out of my way to stop them.

John Wayne had a great quote in The Shootist.
"I wont be wronged. I wont be insulted. I wont be laid hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them."
If everyone lived by that simple code our society would be a lot better off.

And if a bunch of people followed that code it would be a religion rather than just a quote, or alternatively everyone could be forced to follow it as the basis of a legal code enforced by a government. QED

By the way, I like that quote and agree with it.

 

[pmclaine]

Can't let this go, because this attitude is literally going to be the downfall of our entire society.....

Well said.

Im open to the inclusion of a wider array of beliefs as long as they include the importance of individual liberty in their present code or they must be willing to put the concepts in the Declaration and COTUS ahead of their spritual beliefs in order to be a US Citizen.

They way I read the Constitution it does not contain a mechanism for its own destruction but it does put forward measures for its defense. Weimar, on the other hand, was a system that provided no means to prevent its destruction. This is the beauty of three equal branches and an unbiased media.

 

[EventHorizon]

EH, Your morality may not be based on fear of the afterlife, but you are less likely to be a victim of theft or murder because others do believe those things.

The premise of individual liberty recognized as pre-existing by government rather than granted by government was absolutely an extension of the philosophy of John Locke and without question rooted in the Judeo-Christian ethic.

The fate of mankind is always anarchy without moral framework or government control. When you asked why order existed before Christian ethic you ignored the government control portion of the sentence. You know from history that people despise the insecurity of anarchy above all things, and will embrace unrestrained religion (theocracy) or unrestrained government (totalitarianism) before anarchy. Anarchy is not freedom, because my liberty will be curtailed in short order by people with better swords, more guns, more wealth, or more numbers.

Look at societies that function in an orderly manner, either in the past or present, that don't have the Judeo-Christian ethos in their day to day life. You will find that without the self limiting/self governance attributes of that ethos the restraint is provided by much more government control than we suffer here. Though, as I pointed out, as our society because more diverse in morality government control will increase in direct proportion. It is already happening. Public shame and disgrace is being replaced by police power.

Murder is restricted in non-religious societies by government. It is restricted in religious societies by belief and likely also by government. I leave for you to figure out if you will need more or less government controls in the society where the people have a moral basis for not murdering rather than merely a legal code.

You don't have to believe that religion is true in order to benefit from it as a society or to understand the positive impact they have on our relationship with government in the case of the Judeo-Christian ethic that permeates our culture in this country. Human being will not live in anarchy- you have to choose, will government restrain people or will a religion, or a mix of both as we have here. There are examples of the entire spectrum of that choice around the world as we speak.

It's interesting that you reference Locke. I suggest you read "Letters Concerning Toleration" as it is very illuminating on his theories on the matter. There is considerable and viable notion that Locke was at best a Deist and not a subscriber to any one viewpoint. This would suggest a more 'law of man' framework of which J-C subscribes from but in no way exclusively or novel such that it pushes personal liberty.

I have more to say (shocking, I know) on the J-C side but I would then be joining FS1 and that is something that compels me to be good from fear...

 

[orkan]

This is the beauty of three equal branches and an unbiased media.

Something we lost long ago.

 

[pmclaine]

I disagree, we never had it to lose.

Yep after the first eight years it seems to have been a continuous struggle against the erosion of all that had been gained at high cost.

 

[Mark williams]

I was born in the early '40s, a time when if you were brought home by a police officer for something he saw you do he would probably suggest that your dad bust your ass for it. today, you could be arrested for that. We have evolved into a society where there is rarely any consequences for bad behavior. children generally rule the house from about age 4. It makes me sick to see parents in a resturant "begging" their little darling to please behave. I can just see my Dad begging me to do anything, I was usually told only once. It's all about what the kid wants, and is rarely told "no". When he or she is told no they just keep whinning until they get what they want, so, if someone in authority outside the home tells them "no", they can't handle it so they go "postal". It's taken about fifty years to get to this point. Don't expect it to change anytime soon.

well said sir, you hit the nail on the head!

 

[Smcarroll]

Yep after the first eight years it seems to have been a continuous struggle against the erosion of all that had been gained at high cost.

The first thing president Washington did was stamp on a bunch of dirty rebels for protesting a tax hike. Ironic huh?

 

[pmclaine]

The first thing president Washington did was stamp on a bunch of dirty rebels for protesting a tax hike. Ironic huh?

Shays Rebellion? Wasn't that repeated in 1933 or there abouts in Washington DC?

 

[Smcarroll]

Shays Rebellion? Wasn't that repeated in 1933 or there abouts in Washington DC?

I was speaking of the whiskey makers rebellion of 1791. Can you imagine how betrayed you would feel as a veteran that spent years fighting the British only to find the new boss was the same as the old boss?

 

[pmclaine]

I was speaking of the whiskey makers rebellion of 1791. Can you imagine how betrayed you would feel as a veteran that spent years fighting the British only to find the new boss was the same as the old boss?

Yep. Whiskey Rebellion was after the COTUS. Shays was before. Its debated the role Shays played in creating a stronger Federal Govt and whether or not it was an influence in the debate to include the Bill of Rights in COTUS.

Shays Rebellion brought in the conflict of taxes, urban vs rural living and I think there was an issue with failure to compensate veterans as promised for service in the Revolution. Interesting that none of this seems to have a sparked an anti firearms movement.

Shays' Rebellion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Prebanpaul]

Back to the original problem,

Every Major Serial murder in the last twenty years has been linked to some kind of Narcotic. Prescribed by a physician. Now I am a little different than the people who believe its the doctors or even the Medical companies fault. You see that is their only recourse, medicate and pray.

The real problem is when the government has just about absolved all medical hospitals for the insane. Someone who is smart posted early that you sometimes cant fix a predisposed violent person. I agree. Its just like any other animal. No matter what they do, their violent. Unfortunately someone along the way, has come out a said you cant execute these people because they don't mean to do it. They don't really mean to commit rape murder and mayhem. That is the problem right there. You cant kill them and you cant lock them up, therefore they will roam the streets. This is why I carry a CCW me and mine will go home every time or I will die fighting.


FS1 Here is my deduction, you are very well educated. You can tell from the words that you write and the way you speak. How ever, your major problem is your narcissism.
As educated as your are, your thought of being superior has led you astray. You have evoked a fight with 10-15 people, that is usually a mistake on all levels. Secondly you believe in the Government, which is ignorant (60,000 individuals making decisions to benefit them selves and don't even know your name.) If you pay attention to history, you will see that every government has fallen.

I love my country with out question. I love the fact that we have a constitution. You site the use of one of the constitution's ability to change, and they put that plan in so that we would not have to take up arms. Lets not forget they also put in a plan so that if ever needed we would have the ability to take up arms. They where smarter that you. Period. They saw the ability for the people and government to make changes when needed. They also saw that the government may become corrupt. Which it has.

Smart people do not start fights with large groups of people, your educated on book smarts. Be careful and read some more books on strategy because trust me in this part of education you lack it completely.

 

[MosesTheTank]

I think that in all reality things are not necessarily worse it's just that information travel faster an even smaller events become stories in a flash. Every few years some one does something crazy and every one thinks the world is worse than it was the decade before. I think that in the last 20 years the crime rate has actually dropped. But every one just waits for the next episode of crazy.

This is a topic worth taking note of. There are 2 books that shed more than a smidgen of light on it. I read them in the 1-2 order below and I think this makes the most sense:

On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society: Dave Grossman: 9780316040938: Amazon.com: Books

Amazon.com: They Marched Into Sunlight: War and Peace Vietnam and America October 1967 eBook: David Maraniss: Books

Something happened in, and to, America in the 1960's and a particular type of violence emerged at the University of Texas, Austin on August 1st 1966 and spiraled through the next 30 years in schools and the workplace.

 

[rlwilson]

The Neuroscientist Who Discovered He Was a Psychopath | Science | Smithsonian
For those who want to read about nurture and nature, this Doctor has an interesting story. it sheds some light on how the kid was thinking.

 

[Maggot]

This is a topic worth taking note of. There are 2 books that shed more than a smidgen of light on it. I read them in the 1-2 order below and I think this makes the most sense:

On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society: Dave Grossman: 9780316040938: Amazon.com: Books

Amazon.com: They Marched Into Sunlight: War and Peace Vietnam and America October 1967 eBook: David Maraniss: Books

Something happened in, and to, America in the 1960's and a particular type of violence emerged at the University of Texas, Austin on August 1st 1966 and spiraled through the next 30 years in schools and the workplace.

I think it begn a few years earlier...when JFK was assassinated by the banksters, CIA, FBI, MI complex and Mafia, and no one was ever brought to trial for it. Fuck, if the gubmint can get away with murdering the president, the gloves are off.

 

[pmclaine]

This is a topic worth taking note of. There are 2 books that shed more than a smidgen of light on it. I read them in the 1-2 order below and I think this makes the most sense....

Grossman is awesome, if a little bit strange. Met him and he is intense. Dinner conversation must be odd at his table - Hooo Ahhh!

 

[FS1]

You say I don't know who you are? Maybe. ... but I know what you stand for. You've made it abundantly clear. Likewise, no one has ever questioned where I stand on a topic. Make damn sure you never do business with any business I own, and tell your libtard friends the same! I'd rather be broke, deaf, blind, and cripple than to reach the end of my life knowing that I didn't do everything possible to salvage the country I love and served.

Fear not sir, I shall never become your customer. But I must say that is a very interesting business model you have.

FS1 Here is my deduction, you are very well educated. You can tell from the words that you write and the way you speak. How ever, your major problem is your narcissism.
As educated as your are, your thought of being superior has led you astray. You have evoked a fight with 10-15 people, that is usually a mistake on all levels. Secondly you believe in the Government, which is ignorant (60,000 individuals making decisions to benefit them selves and don't even know your name.) If you pay attention to history, you will see that every government has fallen.

Smart people do not start fights with large groups of people, your educated on book smarts. Be careful and read some more books on strategy because trust me in this part of education you lack it completely.

Thank you for your diagnosis doctor. I will ad narcissist to the things you all have labeled me. Lets see I am a Narcissistic, Communist, Socialist Troll, Idiot ,Liar. Did I get them all?

You must be a pretty good doctor to diagnose me so easily from just a few internet forum posts. So let me ask your professional opinion on something doc.

What condition would a man have who posts something negative about another man he knows can't respond for thirty days?

An educated man is normally what people would call a man who went to college. I did not, but I do know how to read. So I would be what most would call a well read man. Because I educated myself.

 

[pmclaine]

Fear not sir, I shall never become your customer. But I must say that is a very interesting business model you have.



Thank you for your diagnosis doctor. I will ad narcissist to the things you all have labeled me. Lets see I am a Narcissistic, Communist, Socialist Troll, Idiot ,Liar. Did I get them all?

You must be a pretty good doctor to diagnose me so easily from just a few internet forum posts. So let me ask your professional opinion on something doc.

What condition would a man have who posts something negative about another man he knows can't respond for thirty days?

An educated man is normally what people would call a man who went to college. I did not, but I do know how to read. So I would be what most would call a well read man. Because I educated myself.

Give it up. You are fighting "your" fight and I give you some props for your digging in your heels but there will be no common ground found nor will you convert any to your thinking.

It is apparent you value "you" more than anything else. Everything to you is a topic of discussion capable of evolving into something else. I freely admit my view is more rigid and less flexible but that is because I have taken on a set of values and beliefs that I am commited to. My black and white world defines right and wrong, good and evil. I dont have to say "It depends on what the definition of "is" is".

You are willing to accept a subservient existence to the agenda of the lowest common denominator and a life of bondage appeals to you as long as you get your daily subsistence through whatever means.

You are a valuable contributor to the conversation. Im not wishing you to go away. Just dont get all butt hurt because you cant achieve any conversions here.

 

[Guest]

Our country has lost its moral compass. Parents don't raise their kids, schools and TV do. Schools teach children that anything goes. I realize it's not popular to express Christian values but without them, or at least old fasion values, then this is what you get.

That's a large part of it, but I also believe that kids who grew up on the farm, or even visited relatives' farms developed a greater sense of life and death, through exposure to animals and pets.
The other factor is the media, which ALWAYS shines a bright light on the killer.
Used to be that a suicide was performed quietly at home. Now they all see the attention given to others in the media, and it's almost like trying to beat the high score in a video game.

 

[Maggot]

, and it's almost like trying to beat the high score in a video game.

You may have stroked the nail directly on its ugly little head.

 

[-=boone=-]

Failure has been removed from our children's lives. Everybody's the same, everybody's a winner.

That's not reality and it's having devistating impacts on them. When I grew up my father let us fail, he wanted us to fail things. Failure teaches you how to pick yourself up and push forward with life. To have the dream and ambition to strive forward. To be ready and proud to step up the the responsibility of adulthood. When you remove failure, you remove accountability, you remove success. If you never fail how can you succeed? How can you know that feeling? What do you have to look forward to?

We failed by removing failure...

 

[Guest]

Suicide is the ultimate selfish attempt at being noticed, acknowledged, and or missed.
When these sick minds see the massive amount of attention their "heroes" get from the press, family, and the world, it strokes them in a way like nothing else can.
Fill the tub and slit your wrists, and nobody notices, except a handful of family and friends.
Make a public spectacle of it, and not only do you become a globally recognized enigma and monster, but you embarrass and insult parents, employers, etc.

It won't ever happen, because our unquenchable thirst demands it, but I'd like to see news agencies adopt policies that only mention the killer as, "an assailant whose identity we will not disclose".

 

[Phil1]

Our country has lost its moral compass. Parents don't raise their kids, schools and TV do. Schools teach children that anything goes. I realize it's not popular to express Christian values but without them, or at least old fasion values, then this is what you get.

Test Results ,,, 100 wallets deliberately lost to test honesty

 

[Maggot]

Test Results ,,, 100 wallets deliberately lost to test honesty

Interesting study. If I found a wallet I would definitely return it. If it were a bag of money I would stash it somewhere safe where the cops couldnt find it and then notify authorities and if someone turned up and properly identified it I'd take 10% and return it. If it were a BANK bag full of money, Id send ya'll and nice photo and note from the Virgin Islands.....

 

[Flyingbullseye]

You think this kid was paying attention to the Bundy ranch and decided to blow up his school? Bullshit. My grandfather watched every sort of cowboy and Indian killing movie and WWI and II glorifying shooting movies made and his buddies didn't plan mass murder-suicides. They actually carried guns to school and the teacher kept them in a broom closet. You wanna play the blame game, I'd start with his almost certain prescription medication.

Yep, then mix in copious amounts of no respect to anyone (least of all authority), no responsibility and consequences to ones actions, no belief of right and wrong and entitled to everything in life then shake well and you got yourself a psycho shitball.

What did we expect as a society?

 

[orkan]

Yep, then mix in copious amounts of no respect to anyone (least of all authority), no responsibility and consequences to ones actions, no belief of right and wrong and entitled to everything in life then shake well and you got yourself a psycho shitball.

What did we expect as a society?

Absolutely correct.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Yep, then mix in copious amounts of no respect to anyone (least of all authority), no responsibility and consequences to ones actions, no belief of right and wrong and entitled to everything in life then shake well and you got yourself a psycho shitball.

What did we expect as a society?

When I grew up we had family time. Supper was served at the same time every day. No matter what was going on the whole family was there. We sat and ate together. Topics were discussed. From current events to family issues. Nothing was off limits. Your age was not a determining factor of whether your topic was of value to be talked about. After the meal everyone had a part in clean up except mom and dad. After that we would sit on the porch or in the family room and books were read or board games were played. We had chores that were done on a daily basis. They were done before you went off to play. There were things that were expected of you. Good grades in school, chores done, be kind to brothers and sisters, help mom with whatever w/o complaining or you paid the consequences. We spent a lot of time together as a family. I have a brother that would have assuredly been prescribed meds for behavior problems in any other family. We learned how to deal with him. It was to keep him occupied and busy doing physical activities. He had a very violet tendancy to him. We found that when he was physically tired not so much. So we dealt with it as a family by everyone insuring he was tired. It was out of the question to consider medications. As he aged and became aware of his triggers and such it was easier to control on his own. I believe that in todays society the family is so preoccupied with garbage that they don't see or care to see what is happening to anyone else. Children are not taught how to interact with and respect others, to have responsibility or to own up for the things they do wrong. In the OP where were the parents of this kid? He has rented a storage facility and is making bombs and collecting guns to start his own massacre. Luckily someone stumbles across his lair and disrupts his plan. Is it a lack of morals, religion, ethics or a mental disorder (Physical or chemical)? Could be a possible combination, who knows. What I believe is that there was a serious lack in family in this young persons life. If he had not been caught would his neighbors and family be saying the same things all the others said? He was a good boy, quiet and kept to himself never got into trouble. They only say these things because they are clueless to what is going on in his life. They are too busy keeping up with the Kardashians or J Wow or what ever crap is on the tube. Johnny is just someone that they cross paths with a couple times a day.

 

[Smcarroll]

Interesting study. If I found a wallet I would definitely return it. If it were a bag of money I would stash it somewhere safe where the cops couldnt find it and then notify authorities and if someone turned up and properly identified it I'd take 10% and return it. If it were a BANK bag full of money, Id send ya'll and nice photo and note from the Virgin Islands.....

Same here. Loose cash is mine. If I can find the person who lost it I will return it. If its the banks fuck em.