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.22 br
- Thread starter Dai Bando
- Start date
tried h4350. 30.6 gr gave me 2852 fps, 15.23 sd, 62.17 fps es over 19 shots. i had two bad flyers resulting in the worst group I've shot with this rifle and bullet combo. worse velocity spreads than with staball match. I'm not going to try it again. I'll give staball 6.5 a shot and also 80 gr eldm (seems like a better fit for varget). after that i will consider load development done.
FWIW, the last batch I loaded for my .22BR w/88’s was 31.9 RL-16. There was a nice node there but I never bothered looking for SD’s.
At the last match, we set my friend’s new Garmin next to it for four rounds. They all went 3048-3051 (24” Bart). Good enough for me.
IMO, RL-16 is titties for 85 and up. I couldn’t find a node for 80.5’s, so I think they want something a tick faster. It does, however, play very nice with Sierra 95’s.
I couldn’t find a node for 88’s and 6.5 StaBall, but it’s a bit slower than ‘16, so I’m going to try it with 95’s. I THINK 6.5 will want to be run a bit faster than ‘16 as well. I was at 2,850 (95’s) with ‘16, I’m not going to quit playing with 6.5 StaBall until I hit 2,900 (or just a smooch over, but quit before the primers fall out
).
At the last match, we set my friend’s new Garmin next to it for four rounds. They all went 3048-3051 (24” Bart). Good enough for me.
IMO, RL-16 is titties for 85 and up. I couldn’t find a node for 80.5’s, so I think they want something a tick faster. It does, however, play very nice with Sierra 95’s.
I couldn’t find a node for 88’s and 6.5 StaBall, but it’s a bit slower than ‘16, so I’m going to try it with 95’s. I THINK 6.5 will want to be run a bit faster than ‘16 as well. I was at 2,850 (95’s) with ‘16, I’m not going to quit playing with 6.5 StaBall until I hit 2,900 (or just a smooch over, but quit before the primers fall out
).
Same results here when I tried H4350. Not the right powder for 22BR in my testing....
FWIW, the last batch I loaded for my .22BR w/88’s was 31.9 RL-16. There was a nice node there but I never bothered looking for SD’s.
At the last match, we set my friend’s new Garmin next to it for four rounds. They all went 3048-3051 (24” Bart). Good enough for me.
IMO, RL-16 is titties for 85 and up. I couldn’t find a node for 80.5’s, so I think they want something a tick faster. It does, however, play very nice with Sierra 95’s.
I couldn’t find a node for 88’s and 6.5 StaBall, but it’s a bit slower than ‘16, so I’m going to try it with 95’s. I THINK 6.5 will want to be run a bit faster than ‘16 as well. I was at 2,850 (95’s) with ‘16, I’m not going to quit playing with 6.5 StaBall until I hit 2,900 (or just a smooch over, but quit before the primers fall out
24" 22BR with 88's @ 3050..?? That's cooking
I was roughly half a grain lighter and 100 fps slower, also a 24” Bartlein, always did right by me. Still is actually, I just switched to the Berger 85.5’s24" 22BR with 88's @ 3050..?? That's cooking
You know Padom, your comment made me look back at me notes (I gotta start keeping better ones), but I worked that batch up last spring, and it was showing 2950 for 31.9, workup was done at about the same temperature, but worked up on a pro-chrono vs. his Garmin.
Another odd thing is that in my notes (assuming I’m looking at the right dates, didn’t write down lot#), the actual node was at 32.2 (around 2980 on the pro chrono) but 31.9 IS what was loaded because that’s what’s on the boxes (I am pretty religious about that).
I thought maybe I mis remembered what his Garmin said, but I checked my dope in DOF from the match, and there was 3050. And my dope was pretty good the day of the match (I just can’t shoot
).
Bolt lift, primers, etc have all been fine.
Weird mystery. If I figure out wtf I have going on (going to try the two different chronographs next Saturday), I’ll post it.
Another odd thing is that in my notes (assuming I’m looking at the right dates, didn’t write down lot#), the actual node was at 32.2 (around 2980 on the pro chrono) but 31.9 IS what was loaded because that’s what’s on the boxes (I am pretty religious about that).
I thought maybe I mis remembered what his Garmin said, but I checked my dope in DOF from the match, and there was 3050. And my dope was pretty good the day of the match (I just can’t shoot
).Bolt lift, primers, etc have all been fine.
Weird mystery. If I figure out wtf I have going on (going to try the two different chronographs next Saturday), I’ll post it.
You know Padom, your comment made me look back at me notes (I gotta start keeping better ones), but I worked that batch up last spring, and it was showing 2950 for 31.9, workup was done at about the same temperature, but worked up on a pro-chrono vs. his Garmin.
Another odd thing is that in my notes (assuming I’m looking at the right dates, didn’t write down lot#), the actual node was at 32.2 (around 2980 on the pro chrono) but 31.9 IS what was loaded because that’s what’s on the boxes (I am pretty religious about that).
I thought maybe I mis remembered what his Garmin said, but I checked my dope in DOF from the match, and there was 3050. And my dope was pretty good the day of the match (I just can’t shoot
Bolt lift, primers, etc have all been fine.
Weird mystery. If I figure out wtf I have going on (going to try the two different chronographs next Saturday), I’ll post it.
Yea, Im shooting 4" longer than you (28" Bartlein) and my hot loads just starting to show pressure, especially on warmer days are right at that 3050 area.... Thats across various different powders..
My go to is 3000fps and I have 1 load that is just under where I found pressure at 3028fps...
I get way lower velocity than you with a longer barrel. it's a 26" .219 boreFWIW, the last batch I loaded for my .22BR w/88’s was 31.9 RL-16. There was a nice node there but I never bothered looking for SD’s.
At the last match, we set my friend’s new Garmin next to it for four rounds. They all went 3048-3051 (24” Bart). Good enough for me.
IMO, RL-16 is titties for 85 and up. I couldn’t find a node for 80.5’s, so I think they want something a tick faster. It does, however, play very nice with Sierra 95’s.
I couldn’t find a node for 88’s and 6.5 StaBall, but it’s a bit slower than ‘16, so I’m going to try it with 95’s. I THINK 6.5 will want to be run a bit faster than ‘16 as well. I was at 2,850 (95’s) with ‘16, I’m not going to quit playing with 6.5 StaBall until I hit 2,900 (or just a smooch over, but quit before the primers fall out
FWIW, the last batch I loaded for my .22BR w/88’s was 31.9 RL-16. There was a nice node there but I never bothered looking for SD’s.
At the last match, we set my friend’s new Garmin next to it for four rounds. They all went 3048-3051 (24” Bart). Good enough for me.
IMO, RL-16 is titties for 85 and up. I couldn’t find a node for 80.5’s, so I think they want something a tick faster. It does, however, play very nice with Sierra 95’s.
I couldn’t find a node for 88’s and 6.5 StaBall, but it’s a bit slower than ‘16, so I’m going to try it with 95’s. I THINK 6.5 will want to be run a bit faster than ‘16 as well. I was at 2,850 (95’s) with ‘16, I’m not going to quit playing with 6.5 StaBall until I hit 2,900 (or just a smooch over, but quit before the primers fall out
My load for 88’s is 31.4 out of a mcgowen 1:7 30 inch at 3026. I too think rl16 is the best powder. This is my pounding steel load. My 1000 fclass load is with 90 Atips. I would love to try 90 or 95 smks but they seem to be unobtainium lately
David
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I will have to look up my data from my 22 BR barrels, I had good luck with RL16, Varget, and H4895. 3050 fps seemed to be the magic spot for consistant accuracy, but I hit close to 3100 with RL16 out of a 26" barrel suppressed.
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This is a new caliber for my Fclass rifle as of this winter. I have taken my 223 1:7 out to 1000 yards on steel with the 85.5 bergers. This range goes to 1200M and I have done that with my 6x47L and plan to do it with my 22BR. The 223 is a little anemic for that distance. My friend who has access to this range is going to take me in mid March so I will know more after I have a chance to shoot but my ballistic program says the 88 are only about 1 MOA more wind at 1000 than my 115 DTACs at 2975 were. We shall see
David
Thanks, I ordered 200 to give them a try. We will see if I can get a good node around 2900 or so. If so these are cheaper than Atips and would be better. It is definitely worth a trySierra Bullets 22 Cal 95 Gr HPBT Matchking 100/Box
Introduced in early 2018, Sierra Bullets .22 Caliber 95Gr. HPBT Matchking will be appreciated by shooters around the world. The accuracy and extreme long range performance of the 22 caliber 95 grain HPBT. A sleek 27 Caliber elonga
David
1:7. I have heard that the package says 1:6.5 but i am going to give them a try nevertheless.
Any thoughts?
I didn't have any problems with the 95smk in a 1:7 Mullerworks 219 using H4831sc
I tried staball 6.5
the velocity numbers didn't impress me. I feel like it might be spiky as I experienced some heavy bolt lifts, sometimes even without noticeably higher velocity.
it does shoot well, definitely shoots better than h4350.
I shot two groups. one group of 19 that I annealed and loaded on the autotrickler v4 (Group A) and a group of 30 that I did not anneal and loaded with a normal lyman brass smith powder measure. both were set at 32.1 gr of powder. both were hornady 88 elds at 2.317 coal
Group A results: 2858 fps avg velocity, 66.2 fps extreme spread, 18.8 fps sd, 19 shots
Group B results: 2861 fps avg velocity, 70.5 fps extreme spread, 19.7 fps sd, 19 shots
precision was really good. shot a nice tight group. I put all 30 of Group B into the target and it stayed small, like 3/4 moa. if the velocity numbers are ok for you, this would be a good powder for bulk loading on a progressive as it clearly meters very well in a PM.
the velocity numbers didn't impress me. I feel like it might be spiky as I experienced some heavy bolt lifts, sometimes even without noticeably higher velocity.
it does shoot well, definitely shoots better than h4350.
I shot two groups. one group of 19 that I annealed and loaded on the autotrickler v4 (Group A) and a group of 30 that I did not anneal and loaded with a normal lyman brass smith powder measure. both were set at 32.1 gr of powder. both were hornady 88 elds at 2.317 coal
Group A results: 2858 fps avg velocity, 66.2 fps extreme spread, 18.8 fps sd, 19 shots
Group B results: 2861 fps avg velocity, 70.5 fps extreme spread, 19.7 fps sd, 19 shots
precision was really good. shot a nice tight group. I put all 30 of Group B into the target and it stayed small, like 3/4 moa. if the velocity numbers are ok for you, this would be a good powder for bulk loading on a progressive as it clearly meters very well in a PM.
got a chance to shoot 80 eldm. I'm really impressed with these and think they might be a better option than the 88 eldm. Varget and Staball Match are both appropriate burn rate for them. I loaded 30 with staball match and 19 with varget. I started at an arbitrary 2.320 coal and 29 grs of each. both groups were really good. I think Varget might have more precision potential. I was able to shoot the staball group at a leisurely pace, with only 1 or 2 shots I would call as flyers. the varget group I had to shoot quickly and would take back maybe 3 or 4 of them. staball match had some slightly sticky bolt lifts. I felt like varget got the barrel hotter than staball but it might just be due to my pace in that string. I'll try and go back and check the time between shots. varget is a lot cleaner on the brass. Staball match gets the brass pretty dirty.
Varget prediction: 3023 fps velocity, 50.7k psi
Staball match prediction: 2886 fps velocity, 51.4k psi
Varget results: 3020 fps avg velocity, 34.9 fps extreme spread, 8.2 fps SD, 17 shots
Staball match results: 2893 fps avg velocity, 56.2 fps extreme spread, 12.3 fps SD, 19 shots
Varget prediction: 3023 fps velocity, 50.7k psi
Staball match prediction: 2886 fps velocity, 51.4k psi
Varget results: 3020 fps avg velocity, 34.9 fps extreme spread, 8.2 fps SD, 17 shots
Staball match results: 2893 fps avg velocity, 56.2 fps extreme spread, 12.3 fps SD, 19 shots
22 arc bolt gun load data from Hornady is out. Case capacity is only about a grain down from 22 br so it should be a useful guide for loading 22 br as well. It lists 88 eld as 2800 fps max @ 62k psi from 27 grains of Varget in a 24" barrel.
Fellas, I see most of the .22 BR forum is about loads and bullet weights so may I digress and ask is forming .22 BR brass as simple as taking a 6mm BR case and running it through a .22 BR FL sizer? I had a .22 BR almost 40 years ago and I have some leftover 6mm Remington BR brass that I converted but my mental acuity has diminished since then as to what I did ages ago. It seems too easy.
I’m just starting down the 22br road but so far it’s been Luce 6br brass and running it through my Forster 22br die without an expander and then over my mandrel.
I’m sure it would work just fine with the expander, I just prefer mandrel.
I’m sure it would work just fine with the expander, I just prefer mandrel.
I ruined a few pieces of brass doing this until I applied an outside chamfer on the necks; after that it was smooth sailing. FL sizer in one full step from 6mm to 22 cal, then expander mandrel after that.
ordered 8lb shooters world long rifle and berger 85.5 let's get the party going
I'm hoping you can give me some information on .22 BR dies. My 1980s Bonanza/Forster are for 1.52" cases (I believe 6mm BR Remington were also 1/52" back then). However, current Lapua 6mm BR (Norma) brass is 1.56" Do the new .22 BR dies account for 1.56" or does the Lapua brass need to be trimmed .04"? Thanks,
shot the bergers with rl16. shot great but no better than 88 eld. pressure felt and sounded lower with the same charge so i think higher velocity is possible
My load for 85.5 bergers is 31.2 RL16 seated to 2.270 in a 30 inch 1:7 barrel. I am getting 3014 fps. These are my 600 yard load. My 1000 right now is 90 Atips because they shoot inside the 85.5’s at 1000 because of greater retained velocity. I also now have some 95 SMK’s to start load development on and see if they are even better than the Atips.
David
David
I loaded 31.3 and had them seated out to 2.31 something. i have a 26" 1:7 219 bore and got 2903 fps. my confirmation load for 88 elds with the same charge was 2908 fps with multiple firings brass and 2915 fps with freshly converted brass.
Hey guys so when designing a reamer how much longer do you recommend the chamber length be then the brass case itself? I want to limit carbon ring if I can is .005 to short it seems like most are designed around .015 or .020. Also what would you say is optimal freebore for the Berger 85.5? Thanks
I have a 0.130" freebore and I'd have been happy with a 0.150" or even a 0.180". The 85.5's have plenty of room, but when I ran the 88 ELDM I was closer to the neck/shoulder junction than I wanted to be. Wasn't a problem, per se, but if I had another reamer made it'd probably be like a 0.160".
As far as the carbon ring, I just trimmed my Lapua brass after the fifth firing. I didn't need to before that. Your question is reasonable, but I just clean the carbon ring every time I clean the barrel, every ~250-300 rounds; never had an issue with it, and it was definitely longer than it needed to be. You could bring it in by 0.010" off of the typical length and be fine, or just leave it and be fine too.
As far as the carbon ring, I just trimmed my Lapua brass after the fifth firing. I didn't need to before that. Your question is reasonable, but I just clean the carbon ring every time I clean the barrel, every ~250-300 rounds; never had an issue with it, and it was definitely longer than it needed to be. You could bring it in by 0.010" off of the typical length and be fine, or just leave it and be fine too.
Thanks ya I actually ordered a .100 fb because I like shooting 80s and 80.5s also I have a .160 now and for an 80 vld to get to jam its barely in the case. I also shortened my chamber up a little bit so I can trim brass a little shorter just because I have the henderson so I'd rather use it then chamfer and deburr
Long Range Report on my 22BR.
I have been shooting F-Open with a 6x47L for the last 3 years. I am now 75 and shooting 70+ rounds in a day just wore me out. So I needed to go down in recoil. I considered the 22BR as my answer. My gun is a Remington 700 in an Eliseo stock. The barrel is 1:7 30" McGowen. I have loads for Berger 85.5, Hornandy 88 and Hornady ATIP. After running the numbers the 85.5 will be the 600 load, the 90 Atip will be the 1000 load and the 88 will be my steel load.
Last Wednesday I got to go with a friend to a steel range that goes out to 1310 yards. So here was my chance to test this thing out. The 88 ELDM load is 31.4 RL16 at a COAL of 2.270 for a muzzle velocity of 3034 fps. I use Shooter as my app for ballistics data. I started at 100, went to 300, then 400 then 500, then 700 and then 1000. I used shooter's come-ups and hit the torso plates first shot. the 10 inch plates till 700 first shot. the wind came up so after seeing the splash I corrected and connected. I then went to a 1000 and was still holding well and connected on the second shot. I then went to the 1310 yard plate. It is 4x4' Shooter said I needed 39.6 MOA come up. I dialed 29.6 and then held in my reticle 10 more MOA. Connected the 4x4 plate first shot. Purposely shot in the dirt to see what my elevation looked like and it was good so I went after a 12 inch plate. Took 4 shots to connect. My velocity was down to 1207 so I was deep in the transsonic range. yet the bullet wasn't go wild. I was missing due to wind and once I got that figured out it was good.
To end the day, I wanted to concentrate on 1000 yards. I really worked to get my come up corrected and then went for the 10 inch plate. Again after a windage miss I corrected and my last 2 shots were hits on a 10 inch plate. In F-class 1000 yards that would have been 10's.
In summary, I don't think that the 22BR is going to be any deficit at 1000 over the 6x47L. In fact I have shot the 6x47 at this exact range twice and they bot shot the same. In the 6x47 my steel bullet was the Barnes 112 MB. This little bullet holds its own. Gives good velocity and a medium barrel life. I am happy and next month when I shot and f-class match I know it will perform if I do.
So when the dust settled at 1000 and I had corrected the elevation, I saw that I had 23.75 MOA on the scope. Shooter said I needed 24.0. To me that is REALLY good correlation.
David
I have been shooting F-Open with a 6x47L for the last 3 years. I am now 75 and shooting 70+ rounds in a day just wore me out. So I needed to go down in recoil. I considered the 22BR as my answer. My gun is a Remington 700 in an Eliseo stock. The barrel is 1:7 30" McGowen. I have loads for Berger 85.5, Hornandy 88 and Hornady ATIP. After running the numbers the 85.5 will be the 600 load, the 90 Atip will be the 1000 load and the 88 will be my steel load.
Last Wednesday I got to go with a friend to a steel range that goes out to 1310 yards. So here was my chance to test this thing out. The 88 ELDM load is 31.4 RL16 at a COAL of 2.270 for a muzzle velocity of 3034 fps. I use Shooter as my app for ballistics data. I started at 100, went to 300, then 400 then 500, then 700 and then 1000. I used shooter's come-ups and hit the torso plates first shot. the 10 inch plates till 700 first shot. the wind came up so after seeing the splash I corrected and connected. I then went to a 1000 and was still holding well and connected on the second shot. I then went to the 1310 yard plate. It is 4x4' Shooter said I needed 39.6 MOA come up. I dialed 29.6 and then held in my reticle 10 more MOA. Connected the 4x4 plate first shot. Purposely shot in the dirt to see what my elevation looked like and it was good so I went after a 12 inch plate. Took 4 shots to connect. My velocity was down to 1207 so I was deep in the transsonic range. yet the bullet wasn't go wild. I was missing due to wind and once I got that figured out it was good.
To end the day, I wanted to concentrate on 1000 yards. I really worked to get my come up corrected and then went for the 10 inch plate. Again after a windage miss I corrected and my last 2 shots were hits on a 10 inch plate. In F-class 1000 yards that would have been 10's.
In summary, I don't think that the 22BR is going to be any deficit at 1000 over the 6x47L. In fact I have shot the 6x47 at this exact range twice and they bot shot the same. In the 6x47 my steel bullet was the Barnes 112 MB. This little bullet holds its own. Gives good velocity and a medium barrel life. I am happy and next month when I shot and f-class match I know it will perform if I do.
So when the dust settled at 1000 and I had corrected the elevation, I saw that I had 23.75 MOA on the scope. Shooter said I needed 24.0. To me that is REALLY good correlation.
David
Picked up my first 22br this weekend and got to the range to test it out today. Kelbly nanook, 16” proof 1-7 chambered by Fischer T&C in a XLR element magnesium. Came in around 7# 12oz without the can.
Used N140, 62eldvt and 75 eldm. I hit pressure with the 62’s at 32.8gn (3267fps) slight resistance on bolt lift. 75s I hit bolt resistance at 31.8gn (3082fps)
I only shot 2 shot groups to check velocity and pressure so doesn’t tell an accurate story on accuracy but seems to have potential. I struggled to shoot the gun with as light as it is. Going to load it up with weights to help with testing next time.
Used N140, 62eldvt and 75 eldm. I hit pressure with the 62’s at 32.8gn (3267fps) slight resistance on bolt lift. 75s I hit bolt resistance at 31.8gn (3082fps)
I only shot 2 shot groups to check velocity and pressure so doesn’t tell an accurate story on accuracy but seems to have potential. I struggled to shoot the gun with as light as it is. Going to load it up with weights to help with testing next time.
Attachments
Looking for something besides RL 16 for the 88 ELD -M's. Might have to switch to 80 SMK's or 75 A Max's. Just for "banging steel'' out to 600 yds out of my 26" 8T bbl. Wondering about N 550, a bit faster that 16 ? Or maybe IMR 4451 ?
Thank you
Thank you
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I'm using 29gr varget shooting up to 900.
Also using 29gr varget with 80gr eld m shooting to 900.
Also using 29gr varget with 80gr eld m shooting to 900.
I have some 80s and 88s loaded with rmshot big game just for shits and giggles but haven't gotten a chance yet.
Coal 2.325
Bto 1.776
Speed 3015 with 88s. That's right on the edge of pressure in my gun, but shoots in upper. 2s and lower. 3s.
Bto 1.776
Speed 3015 with 88s. That's right on the edge of pressure in my gun, but shoots in upper. 2s and lower. 3s.
Ok I need help on this.
I started blowing bullets, and I want to know if the same thing happened to someone else before.
95gr SMK, H4350, @2880fps, jump of 0.010, barrel is à gain twist 7 to 6.25, and the same thing happen to my other barrel, same specs but one is à 6g the other à 5r.
I went thrue all my reloading process everything looks good. Doesnt happen with 88gr eldM or 85.5gr berger.
Groups are phenomenal (when bullets make it to the target). The first 15 shots never blew up, after that its 10 to 20% of the shots that doesnt make it to the target.
Same either barrel is clean or not. Could a barrel heat up cause this? Shots are consecutives with about 10sec between them. If I let the barrel cool down for 30min plus Im good for an other 15 to 20 shots without issue.
I started blowing bullets, and I want to know if the same thing happened to someone else before.
95gr SMK, H4350, @2880fps, jump of 0.010, barrel is à gain twist 7 to 6.25, and the same thing happen to my other barrel, same specs but one is à 6g the other à 5r.
I went thrue all my reloading process everything looks good. Doesnt happen with 88gr eldM or 85.5gr berger.
Groups are phenomenal (when bullets make it to the target). The first 15 shots never blew up, after that its 10 to 20% of the shots that doesnt make it to the target.
Same either barrel is clean or not. Could a barrel heat up cause this? Shots are consecutives with about 10sec between them. If I let the barrel cool down for 30min plus Im good for an other 15 to 20 shots without issue.
How long is the barrel?
The reason I ask is to try to get a feel for how hard you’re pushing pressure. I ran my old 24” barrel at 2950 with 85.5’s and it wasn’t high pressure but it was on the top half for sure.
After listening to most top PRS guys say they want less pressure because it’s more consistent, I’m running my new 26” barrel at ~2900. Seems to shoot pretty good, but still seeing how it goes.
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