22 trainer

B

brianb1998

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Full Member
Minuteman
Feb 14, 2011
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United States
#1
Ok so after talking to a couple members here I was told it is a good idea to get a 22 trainer. Im looking at 3 different modles right now
remington 504t (if I ever find one)
Savage Mark-ii
and cz472 (not sure on the number)

What do you guys think of the 3 and which one is going to be most accurate.

Also what types of exercises should I be doing with the 22?
control breathing
learn when to let it fly for the most precise shot.

Thats all for now I have a lot more questions that I will save up instead of dropping them all at once.
 
#2
Re: 22 trainer

Might want to check this out.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...124#Post3145124

FrenchMAS45-LD020.JPG
 
#3
Re: 22 trainer

I have a savage mark II and really enjoy it. It is more accurate than my skill level currently. I have no experience with the other rifles though. I would suggest doing the usual dot drills that you would do with center fire rifles. Instead of 1 inch dots at 100 yards, you can make 1/2" dots for 50 yards and 1/4" dots at 25 yards. Also check out the rim fire competition thread. there are several printable targets that you can utilize to improve your shooting. Printable Rimfire Targets
 
#4
Re: 22 trainer

I have a regular little Savage 22lr heavy barrel that I use. Any of those should shoot great. I like the the CZ and the Savage TR's. But thats just preference.

Training.

I use my 22lr to practice the Following.

*Some breathing and position building exercises for prone.
*Mainly positional type shooting. Like Barricades, weird postitions that may be encountered in matches.
*Run it out to 200+ yrds to simulate long distance shot under all the mentioned conditions.
*If you get good dope on the weapon and have a scope that is capable you can also do unknown distance targets. Mil them, then dope the rifle so you can practice those skills as well.
*Set up little mini stages and run them.

My Savage does fine out to 200yds with the Walmart Federal Bulk 550rd ammo. Yeah it has some fliers at longer distances but is only $20 a box. My opinion. Just picked up a box of Federal Auto Match to see if it has less fliers than the Bulk.
 
#6
Re: 22 trainer

Personally I prefer the CZ452 Varmint over the Savage. The Remington will likely prove a little too difficult to locate. The biggest downside to the CZ452 Varmint is that it was discontinued and replaced by the 453 Varmint and 455 Varmint. NIB 452 models are still out there, but rapidly disappearing. At present Boyds' does not make a drop in Tacti-cool stock for either the 453 or 455 model. Manners' however does and new this year CZ will offer a CZ 455 in a Manners' called the Varmint Precision Trainer. If the nearly $900 price tag for a rimfire doesn't make you blink then add another $300 and step up to an Anshutz 64 MPR for one of the most accurate rimfire available, without getting into the benchrest realm.

You only specified an accurate rimfire not whether you wanted to clone/mimic your centerfire. If that is your primary goal; most go the Savage route as they offer several tacti-cool models.

Ask lots of questions, there are some very helpful folks here in the Rimfire section that are very knowledgeable and passionate about it.
 
#7
Re: 22 trainer

All would be good IMHO. I've always leaned the Savage way because of their accuracy, and of course CZ's as well as that Remington are accurate. So it really comes down to a personal choice of what you prefer. Can you get to a sporting goods outlet where they may have both the Savage & CZ where you could handle each one and see what feels would fit your needs. Just my two cents worth. Good luck.
 
#8
Re: 22 trainer

I think a 22 trainer should be basic and simple. Greater specialization simply adds complexities to the basic trainer's task. My own basic trainer is an older Savage MKII that is represented in the current product line by the Stevens 300. Mine still differs from that by having a receiver that's grooved for .22 cal slide-on scope rings.

I would and do use mine for any training task I would use the centerfire rifle for, but distances are adjusted to match the rifle's capabilities.

I have a basic belief that most of the accuracy in a properly functioning 22 derives inherently from the chambering/cartridge itself.

I don't believe that a trainer's primary capability should be its raw accuracy, but rather the <span style="font-style: italic">consistency</span> of the rifle's inherent accuracy, whatever it turns out to be. A valid trainer challenges the <span style="font-style: italic">shooter's</span> performance, not that of the rifle or the ammunition.

Greg
 
#10
Re: 22 trainer

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't believe that a trainer's primary capability should be its raw accuracy, but rather the <span style="font-style: italic">consistency</span> of the rifle's inherent accuracy, whatever it turns out to be. A valid trainer challenges the <span style="font-style: italic">shooter's</span> performance, not that of the rifle or the ammunition.

Greg </div></div>
Greg, I do agree. However, IMO an accurate rifle is key. If you don't have that, how will you know if it was a "flier" or shooter error? In other words, yes - you could train with a Cricket. But how will you know when you did it right when the round goes wherever it wants?
 
#11
Re: 22 trainer

Well, that's why I refer to a <span style="font-style: italic">properly</span> functioning rimfire rifle. This implies a moderate degree of inherent accuracy.

What I'm trying to do here is to separate the anal pursuit of absolutely extreme accuracy from the more reasonable requirement of consistent and moderately decent accuracy. The former obscures the latter.

Greg
 
#13
Re: 22 trainer

I usually always agree with Greg and I am not disagreeing with him now. It is all about what you plan top do and what you expect.
You say you want the most accurate. The 504T was a bit of a flop. Some are great many are dogs for what you paid. A bit pricey for a so-so rifle. All 504's are hammers as soon as you gte a Lilja barrel to drop in one.
As to the Savge CZ debate everyone knows where I stand and I have loads of data to back up my claims in a very serious tactical 22 match we hold every month from March through October. It will seperate the wheat from the chaff. CZ's and Savages have been fielded equally but the pendulum has swung towards CZ ownership in this match. Guys trading and selling Mark IIs to obtain a CZ was heavy last season. There were a few stand out scores with Savages but CZ's ruled the middle of the pack even taking some wins against the mighty Anschutz on occasion. The big factor is the man driving the rig...no doubt about that. The pinacle of accuracy so far that I have seen is the Anschutz MPR, any other position on this rifle's accuracy is untenable. This year there has been a large exodus toward the Anschutz and yours truly even hocked his beloved CZ for the MPR. I am not in love with the wood stock but it is comfortable and acts close enough to my A2 that I won't throw it under the bus. I did much prefer the feel of the Tacticool but I am working on a solution to the MPR aftermarket stock option. I should have a working prototype by summers end.
If I had to list your choices in least to best:
504(due to price and lack of consistency from rifle to rifle)
Savage
CZ
 
#14
Re: 22 trainer

I would order a CZ 453, and drop it into the new M40A22 stock McMillan is making. The 453 because it has two screws in the action, and a threaded barrel into the action. Not press fit, or pinned!

Im doing this in fact, and a M40a1 (HTG) stock for my Howa 308. Then the trainer and main rifle will have the same stock!


The Cz is pure quality.. its proven that for the last 50 years.
 
#15
Re: 22 trainer

I'm not knocking the pursuit of accuracy, or the employment of highly accurate rifles as trainers. Use 'em if you got 'em. I just think there should be a different rifle for training. The competitively accurate rifle should be used for comp. The trainer spares the comp rifle from the wear and tear encountered by the trainer.

What I'm promoting is the use of a rifle whose level of accuracy is adequate (there's that word again...) to disclose degrees of variation in the individual shooter's performance.

This does not mandate outstanding accuracy; it only needs accuracy of a degree that reveals that variation.

My view of the trainer promotes economy, as something like a 'force multiplier'. This view intends a means of developing and managing marksmanship skill in a way that allows more 'bang per buck'. While pursuing accuracy is desirable, expenditures solely in that intent could defeat the goal of economy.

Greg
 
#17
Re: 22 trainer

Greg I get what you are saying, but if I have get close to high accuracy for around 400 I dont have a problem beating the hell out of it provided it will hold up for a while at least. Plus I'm only going to be using it for bench/prone shooting as I'm just starting out.
 
#18
Re: 22 trainer

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brian Burton</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Greg I get what you are saying, but if I have get close to high accuracy for around 400 I dont have a problem beating the hell out of it provided it will hold up for a while at least. Plus I'm only going to be using it for bench/prone shooting as I'm just starting out. </div></div>

If you want do it on the cheap go with a Savage FV. If you want a more tactical stock go with the Savage TR. These rifles have a reputation for great accuracy at a great price.

For a little more money, I would be tempted to go with a CZ 452 or 455 in a varmint/heavy type barrel platform. I prefer the action of the CZ over the Savage.
 
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