.223ai with 80gr A-max's, rebarreling question

[GSRswapandslow]

i'm rebarreling my SSC built 223ai. Right now I have a rechambered 1:9 rem tactical barrel....and it's just not a great shooter. it shoots better now than it did when it was factory...but it's still just not as consistent as I'd like. I'm rebarreling to a 1:8...setting it up to run 80 a-max's...and will be shooting steel out to 600yds and paper at 100 and 200yds.

current gun setup:
SSC true'd and coated rem700 with rechambered factory barrel
Badger thruster brake
Timney 517 trigger @ ~1.5-2lbs (getting changed to jewell)
EGW HD 0moa rail
Burris signature zee rings
Sightron SIII, 8-32, MOA-2
Bobby Hart LRT stock (getting changed to ST1000)
Cowan front rest with protektor front and rear bag
shooting with a Liberty Torch suppressor


My two options area:

1. Bartlein HV 29" blank...finish at 28" with a nice recessed crown
2. Bartlein Rem Var contour 27" blank....finish at 24" and thread and time my already in stalled brake...and shoot with my can


also...anyone got any insight into what freebore I should go with? Russel has the reamer from when he did my rem barrel, it's 0" freebore but he has a throating reamer to run whatever I need


(this is cross posted in the gunsmithing area)

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Theres no reason to do that long of a barrel with a 223AI. A 20-21" barrel is about perfect for one and very efficient. I've shot a 20" 223AI well beyond 1000 yards with great consistency with 75gr Amax's. Also putting a brake on a 223 that heavy is absolutely pointless, theres almost no recoil already. All a brake is going to do on that rifle is add unnecessary noise and annoy shooters around you.

Other than that it sounds like a good build.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

i'm def not going LESS than 24"....i don't want to sacrifice anymore velocity than needed.....

and the brake was done just to do it...i have a private range, so no one to annoy but my friends lol

 

[redneckbmxer24]

You're not sacrificing anything going less than 24". If you look at most 223AI builds on here they are at 18-21" for good reason. I shot mine twice as far as you plan to and I had no problem ringing steel with near perfect consistency, there is no way it would have shot any better with a longer barrel.

A 223AI with a compact barrel is a very handy little rifle to have around and is good for more than just targets. Varmints, predators, and deer are all no problem. A 24" barrel + can sucks in the field, a loud ass gun with a muzzle brake sucks even worse.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

well...i shoot from the bench....and occasionally I'll shoot prone at my familys fraiser fir farm....but that's drive up shooting proposition...i don't have to worry about lugging the rifle more than from my safe to the car. and...it'll be shot suppressed.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

It's your rifle, I was just trying to make a practical suggestion and let you know you're not gaining anything with the longer barrel.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

i appreciate it... i'm more in tune with the guys on accurateshooters....they'd all say it's dumb to NOT go 28"

so....i just talked to Russel....and I've thought about it..and, even though i despise the whole 5r bandwagon...i'm ordering the 27" bartlein 5r friday and getting it sent to him.

 

[bward]

I definitely wouldn't go over 24'' in 223AI if you are going to run a can. It would be extremely long, and you aren't burning enough powder to gain much velocity with a long barrel. If it were mine I would probably finish it at 22''.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

they'd all say it's dumb to NOT go 28"

Sometimes I would agree, but there is absolutely no reason to go that long in a .22 cal thats burning 25gr of powder. A 22-250 would see an advantage, an overbore .17 would see an advantage, the 223AI will not.

 

[MLC]

I have a 20" 223AI.
I will say that it works out to 1200 yards with 75 Amax's and don't know that 80's will offer you any tangible advantage.
If the barrel length doesn't bother you then go 24-26.
There is a significant gain between 20 and 25 but I wouldn't bother with a really long barrel unless you needed the sight radius with irons.
My 20" tube is awesome to tote.
When I have a can on it the rifle gets nose heavy. A 16" would be better with the can.
A 28" tube will give that can a whole lot of lever to work with as far as balance goes.

I have a 30" tube on a rifle and am seriously thinking of cutting it to 26 because it's retarded to deal with, extra long cleaning rods, very limited gun case options and weight are a few reasons.

I would have your smith throat it to match an Amax of your choosing at the magazine length that you have in that rifle.
My rifle was chambered by APA and it's shot everything great, maybe get a copy or at least the specs of their reamer.

 

[pinsandpitons]

No one has addressed the aspect of the OP that attracted me to reading this thread. Namely the twist rate for 80gr. Is 1:8 truly fast enough? I would have thought that 1:7 would be a more solid choice. Not saying the 8 won't shoot, just curious what others experiences have been.

 

[ChemE1975]

What are you giving up in terms of muzzle velocity between 20 and 24 inches? Assuming a 75-80 grain Amax at a max load? Is it 100 f/s?

 

[redneckbmxer24]

What are you giving up in terms of muzzle velocity between 20 and 24 inches? Assuming a 75-80 grain Amax at a max load? Is it 100 f/s?

No way will it be 100FPS. 223AI is very efficient in a 20-21" barrel so I would say a 24" will net 50-60FPS more at most. The can will likely make up the slight velocity loss. I cut one of my 308's down from 26" to 20" once and the 20" with the can was faster than 26" was without. The difference will be so negligible that it will come down to the individual barrel and my experience is that bartleins are a touch slower than some other barrels. If speed is what you're after a Lothar 4 groove is where its at IMO.

 

[cav has been]

I also favor the 20" on my 223AI. Seven twist, shoots the 80 Amax and 80 Bergers around 3050 with very good accuracy. Seriously doubt that a longer tube would show much improvement. It sounds like you have already made up your mind so enjoy!

 

[TRTAC]

I would go with a faster twist. there is no such thing as a perfect barrel length. understand this tho, I can get to 1000 yards with my 24" barreled 243 just as easily as I can with my 7mag with a 28" tube.... Shorter barrels are stiffer and I think more accurate. so what if you give up a little velocity as long as it shoots well. The key here is that the gun shoots well. Do not judge your guns capability at 100 yards either. Long range rifles should be grouped at 300 or 400 yards to see what they are worth.

 

[Jered Joplin]

I was shooting the 75 Amax at 3080 out of my 22" Broughton. That was a 1-9. I would second the long barrel satements but 22" was nice. If you go 24" and the 80g's you are going to need to stick with slow powders but it will still be a nice little stick.

 

[ChemE1975]

No way will it be 100FPS. 223AI is very efficient in a 20-21" barrel so I would say a 24" will net 50-60FPS more at most. The can will likely make up the slight velocity loss. I cut one of my 308's down from 26" to 20" once and the 20" with the can was faster than 26" was without. The difference will be so negligible that it will come down to the individual barrel and my experience is that bartleins are a touch slower than some other barrels. If speed is what you're after a Lothar 4 groove is where its at IMO.

Thanks for the response on this. With just 50 fps on the line, I am in the go shorter camp.

 

[ChemE1975]

I was shooting the 75 Amax at 3080 out of my 22" Broughton. That was a 1-9. I would second the long barrel satements but 22" was nice. If you go 24" and the 80g's you are going to need to stick with slow powders but it will still be a nice little stick.

Jared, will 1:8 be sufficient for the 80 Amax in a 20-24" barrel 223ai? Any reason to go faster if the rifle will be dedicated to the 80 Amax?

 

[GSRswapandslow]

Powder will most likely be varget, rl15, or 8208xbr....all are easy to find so ill have some of each to test


As for twist rate.....I've read quite a bit of folks running 80's on a 1:8...ill look more into it though

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[eldiablo]

Not to derail your idea of an Ackley chambering, but I had Russel build me a 223 with the wylde chamber. 80 Amax's in the low 3000 range with 2000mr. 22 inch barrel. The longer freebore of the wylde chamber allows me to seat the bullets to 2.5 coal. Perfect for aics 223 mags.

 

[Jered Joplin]

I haven't shot the 80's but I was shooting the 75's in a 1-9 with a 22" barrel. If it were shorter I don't know that you would have enough RPM at distance. I shot my set up out to 700 with amazing results. My friends rifle was 20" modified factory rifle and it was not very hot at 700 but did very well at shorter ranges for what it was.

 

[GSRswapandslow]

Not to derail your idea of an Ackley chambering, but I had Russel build me a 223 with the wylde chamber. 80 Amax's in the low 3000 range with 2000mr. 22 inch barrel. The longer freebore of the wylde chamber allows me to seat the bullets to 2.5 coal. Perfect for aics 223 mags.

I'm already setup for Ackley...so I'm sticking with it for this rifle.

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[SSC]

Sorry I am arriving to this party late... For the type of shooting you do I don't see the extra length being and issue at all. You are also the type of shooter that wants the most out of his round and play on the bench an awful lot. So any extra velocity that could be gained, I am guessing that you are willing do the development to make it happen. This isn't a match gun that will be packed around and in and out of different positions.

As to the FB, did you decide to install that follower and make it a single shot or are we going to run from a mag? Load a round and I will match it, but I would guess we aren't going to be too far off of .080"s

 

[awp762]

I run a 27" Bartlein 4 groove 1 in 8 twist shooting 80gr SMK's.
With 24.1gr Varget it chronos at 2833fps.
Nice tack driver that I had built for my daughter but I take it out occasionally.
.088" FB .252" neck turn neck fits AICS mags with some spare room.
Mine is a standard .223 no AI here