.243 or 6.5

[FamilyMan]

This is not intended to be a "This vs. That" thread but more of a question for those who have chosen to stick with the .243win cartridge. Why have you chosen to go with it over say the 6.5x47 or other 6.5's out there that most claim are superior? I have a .243 now and am budgeting out the eventual barrel swap for it (7-9 mos out) and have been leaning towards a 6.5 but part of me would like to stay with it, So I was wondering why have others chosen it? Like I know Rob01 just built a switch barrel one for comps and I believe LonewolfUSMC shoots one and just want to know why.
Thanks

 

[RobertB]

Re: .243 or 6.5

They are both great. A souped up 243 can beat a 260 in drift and drop out to 1k yds or so. Not by much though, in the hands of a practiced marksman either caliber is pure awesome. 6.5 has a bit better bbl life. I have both, at longer ranges the 6.5 bullets you can see a little better. I have thought I've missed with my 243 at 800 yds out when I hit it. It has happened at 1k with my 260 but only once. Both calibers are awesome with the right bullets, bll, and powder. It's a hard choice between them, like I said, I have both but couldn't make an easy choice. You can't make a bad decision. Good luck

 

[tylerw02]

Re: .243 or 6.5

The 6mm offerings recoil less, they are faster, and they shoot flatter. They are also a little cheaper to acquire components for. Their disadvantage is that they are sometimes hard to spot and they are harder on barrels. Sometimes you have to slow them down, hurting their advantage, for range rules as they can be hard on steel. Pick your poison. To me, I seem to believe that the 6.5mm is the better compromise. If in doubt and you have the desire, try one.

 

[Swift]

Re: .243 or 6.5

Speed, recoil and drop.

Lower time of flight = less affect from exterior environmentals
Low recoil allows the shooter to better spot their own shots
Drop is self explanatory

Downsides, they can burn barrels if you push em, the 6mm pills make less splash at distance but that's slightly mitigated by the recoil, and many matches have a 3000fps cap which forces some of the 6mm guys to back it off a bit.

It's really six one half dozen, I only chose the 260 for marginally improved barrel life.

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260

perfection would be a no $hit 7mm designed to run via S/A

284 shehane is close but has OAL issues in S/A

7saum is lil to much n mag bolt face

7CM no gains over 7-08

there is no current 7mm solution for S/A, with 60gr wet cap
everything considered hard to beat a 7mm
except as stated there currently is not a viable commercial case available

 

[Alan_H]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: THEBEARRRRRRJEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Speed, recoil and drop.

Lower time of flight = less affect from exterior environmentals
Low recoil allows the shooter to better spot their own shots
Drop is self explanatory

Downsides, they can burn barrels if you push em, the 6mm pills make less splash at distance but that's slightly mitigated by the recoil, and many matches have a 3000fps cap which forces some of the 6mm guys to back it off a bit.

It's really six one half dozen, I only chose the 260 for marginally improved barrel life. </div></div>

^^^ these are my exact reasons i chose .260

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260 </div></div>

Not "better" choices. More options would be the wording I would choose. Which is my point to make..... more bullet options in the 6.5 flavor. The 243 really has two good choices IMO and they are the 105gr Berger Hybrid and 115gr DTAC.

A 6.5 Creedmoor and 260 are so close in performance that it would be hard to have a long conversation about the differences between the two.

 

[RobertB]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260 </div></div> I have to disagree, I have 2 of those calibers and I thing they are great but I deff wouldn't go so far as to call them better. I feel the 6.5CM and the 260 are a wash because you can buy ammo for either. I picked the 260 over it for a few reasons and I would put the 2 on the top for the 6.5 choices. Actually, I would put the 260 on top because of the brass, You can get good or cheap, Factory hunting and match ammo. I don't see the xc doing that to put it "better" than the 260. of the x47. YOu can buy that ammo but will pay for it. Not down talking the 6.5 cm cuz it's right there with it but the others aren't in the same class

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

6.5x47 has factory ammo by one company and its atrocious what they charge per box for it. Brass to load your own would be a nightmare, its just not popular enough in the tactical shooting world. Bench rest guys love it though.

6XC is not better, again.... ammo can be a pain in the ass if Tubb has a shortage on brass or ammo runs. I waited 6 weeks for 100 rounds once upon a time. Now I have it loaded but brass is sometimes impossible to get.

 

[Outback]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260 </div></div>

Not "better" choices. More options would be the wording I would choose. Which is my point to make..... more bullet options in the 6.5 flavor. The 243 really has two good choices IMO and they are the 105gr Berger Hybrid and 115gr DTAC.

A 6.5 Creedmoor and 260 are so close in performance that it would be hard to have a long conversation about the differences between the two.
</div></div>

I agree with the above. Many matches have been with all of the above .Now days a lot of matches are caliber specific ,belly matches and tactical matches with a lot of positions. The size of target at a tactical match has gotten to be a little larger to be more realistic . I don't think that there is any difference between shooting a 6.5 or a 6mm round , they both out way each other in there advantages and disadvantages.

 

[Rob01]

Re: .243 or 6.5

Family Man I have a GAP built 6.5 Creedmoor as well that I have been shooting for 4 years in matches. I am waiting on a Bartlein 6.5 barrel and will be getting that added to the switch barrel with the .243 and .308. Both have their places. Just another club in the bag. I grab the rifle I think will do the job better for the task/match at hand.

I like the .243 because it shoots flat with no recoil especially with the brake. It basicallly has a 300WM trajectory with no recoil. It can be a problem spotting impacts on steel and misses in dirt as the little 6mm bullet doesn't make much of a splash but for the most part it can be seen.

I like my 6.5 Creedmoor because it does well in the wind, as does the .243, but I can just grab loaded ammo already and hit a match. I shoot all factory ammo at matches and it does great and makes life easier as I don't have to load. The 6.5mm bullets hit a little harder and are easier to see at longer ranges.

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260 </div></div>

Not "better" choices. More options would be the wording I would choose. </div></div>

How you care to word something has zero interest to me.

The cases i mentioned utilize a 30' shoulder which is better than the weak shoulder offered on any 308 or its siblings.
They all work perfectly in S/A regardless of long high BC bullet used, 308 etc not so much
Better case design period
performance wise same same
Trimming brass is tedious n time consuming,the new case designs all but eliminate that dull task.
Better .... YES

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260

perfection would be a no $hit 7mm designed to run via S/A

284 shehane is close but has OAL issues in S/A

7saum is lil to much n mag bolt face

7CM no gains over 7-08

there is no current 7mm solution for S/A, with 60gr wet cap
everything considered hard to beat a 7mm
except as stated there currently is not a viable commercial case available </div></div>

After your edit I have to disagree further.... the 7 Creedmoor is better then a 7-08, IMO. Im running a mild load and pushing a 162 AMAX at nearly 2940. The 7-08 was overpressurizing at 2780ish. There has been on guy reporting back to Mark @ SAC that his melonited barreled action is getting nearly 3k with no pressure and minimal wear.

Until this caliber gets tested to its full extent we cant say the 7mm Creedmoor is better for sure but so far I am not impressed with the 7-08.

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYS338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6.5XC
6.5CM
x47

all better choices than 260 </div></div>

Not "better" choices. More options would be the wording I would choose. </div></div>

How you care to word something has zero interest to me.

The cases i mentioned utilize a 30' shoulder which is better than the weak shoulder offered on any 308 or its siblings.
They all work perfectly in S/A regardless of long high BC bullet used, 308 etc not so much
Better case design period
performance wise same same
Trimming brass is tedious n time consuming,the new case designs all but eliminate that dull task.
Better .... YES </div></div>

So now your argument is that those are better then 308 when you clearly said 260 to begin with? I am fairly sure almost any bump up is better, ballistically speaking, then the 308 of the ones you named.

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

The fact ROB01 may well collapse with a seizure

You would be hard pressed to better 6.5CM

Cheap match grade ammo, good bullets
AMAX is one of fav
alas however
Its not the 7mm i long for.

KY
case design
260,243, 708 all use basic 308 case with different neck dia
same weak shoulder angle, same constant trimming
pert simple
The new smaller 30' cases do everything their 308 based counterparts with less powder
case in point
my X47
20" barrel will launch a 123scenar @ 3023fps with ease not even close to max load
I can chase the lands until the bullet falls outta the case
308 etc not so much unless your running mags with long OAL.
The new cases are just better by design period

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

Hornady 140gr is some good stuff to practice with, a bit slow but it still lets you put rounds down range without dumping your good pills. I often shoot it instead of my hand loads from C4.

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

IF i thought for one moment a 7cm would run a 162amax @ 2900fps +
from a 22" barrel,
Nirvana
but as of yet i,m not convinced
But your now arguing the benefits of the new case designs, sharper shoulder angle handles PSI better
Why not just shoot a 7-08 if there is no benefit from case design?
I will say it again
The new cases are better period
Wonder what a 7SLR would do??
Perhaps a 7SLR is the answer

off topic a lil
7mm to me to perfect, high BC bullets @ reasonable weight
ie 180 or less
but in order to meet my performance goals 2900fps or better from 22" barrel
284 shehane, bullet is way back in case
or
7saum which requires mag bolt face and is over kill
7CM still not seeing it, unless the case design really does boost performance. Slightly less case cap than 7-08 yet folks say it will run a 162amaX WAY faster THAN ANY 7-08 Ever could.
Wait didnt you just state the very same KY
hmmm
better case design
perhaps there is something to it after all

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">IF i thought for one moment a 7cm would run a 162amax @ 2900fps +
from a 22" barrel,
Nirvana
but as of yet i,m not convinced
But your now arguing the benefits of the new case designs, sharper shoulder angle handles PSI better
Why not just shoot a 7-08 if there is no benefit from case design?
I will say it again
The new cases are better period
Wonder what a 7SLR would do??
Perhaps a 7SLR is the answer

off topic a lil
7mm to me to perfect, high BC bullets @ reasonable weight
ie 180 or less
but in order to meet my performance goals 2900fps or better from 22" barrel
284 shehane, bullet is way back in case
or
7saum which requires mag bolt face and is over kill
7CM still not seeing it, unless the case design really does boost performance. Slightly less case cap than 7-08 yet folks say it will run a 162amaX WAY faster THAN ANY 7-08 Ever could.
Wait didnt you just state the very same KY
hmmm
better case design
perhaps there is something to it after all
</div></div>

I said the same thing. My 7mm Creedmoor is outperforming the 7-08 that I had. I ran everything from 150 SMK's to 162 AMAX. It would not perform even close to the 7 CM that I am running now. That is my personal take on the calibers..... nothing more or less.

 

[majohnson2]

Re: .243 or 6.5

I haven't shot rifles very long but I must say that the 6.5CM is easy to shoot, easy to reload. Loading 140SMK 41.5gr H4150, at just under 2800FPS from a 28" barrel. No excessive pressure signs. I get a lot of people inquiring about what I am shooting.

A lot of people have never heard of the round. Not being a hunter, I have no idea of its game taking ability, I would think it should work reasonably well. Given the BC value, a 140gr bullet at roughly 2800FPS should work well on North American game.

 

[Swift]

Re: .243 or 6.5

Jedi are you claiming that 260 brass is difficult to work with?. I have Remington and Winchester 260 brass on it's 6th firing, trimmed and FL sized after the 3rd and it's ready for 6 more. My Lapua is on it's 5th, trimmed and FL sized after 3 and it, too, is ready for more. I also necked up Hornady 243 and FWIW, after 5 firings, it hasn't performed any differently than the brass stamped with a 260; they show the same wear as the rest and haven't been treated any differently.

I just don't see how you can claim that those 3 cartridges are all "better" than a 260. I'm willing to bet good money that if you lined up rifles chambered in the top 6.5 offerings and shot em blind you wouldn't be able to discern what is what. Sorry but a shoulder angle isn't enough to claim that an entire cartridge is superior.

And why did you derail this into a 7mm argument in the first place? The first line of the thread says "This isnt meant to be a this vs that" and not only do you do just that, but you do it with calibers that weren't even mentioned.

 

[VKC]

Re: .243 or 6.5

6.5 Creedmoor for me. Relatively reasonably priced factory ammo. A little more powder efficient than a 260rem. More splash and longer barrel life than a 6mm or 243.

For up to 1000 yards shooting, it is hard to find a better round in my opinion.

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

The op seeks info
a short 7 ie 7cm would fit his needs n most anyone's based on KY and other info on 7cm
So would i be remiss for not providing that info, barrels and the required smithing to send rounds down range is not cheap.
Any of the new cases will match 260 performance, all eliminate the OAL issue associated with the 08 based cartridges.
Better mouse trap why not use one

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: THEBEARRRRRRJEW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jedi are you claiming that 260 brass is difficult to work with?. I have Remington and Winchester 260 brass on it's 6th firing, trimmed and FL sized after the 3rd and it's ready for 6 more. My Lapua is on it's 5th, trimmed and FL sized after 3 and it, too, is ready for more. I also necked up Hornady 243 and FWIW, after 5 firings, it hasn't performed any differently than the brass stamped with a 260; they show the same wear as the rest and haven't been treated any differently.

I just don't see how you can claim that those 3 cartridges are all "better" than a 260. I'm willing to bet good money that if you lined up rifles chambered in the top 6.5 offerings and shot em blind you wouldn't be able to discern what is what. Sorry but a shoulder angle isn't enough to claim that an entire cartridge is superior.

And why did you derail this into a 7mm argument in the first place? The first line of the thread says "This isnt meant to be a this vs that" and not only do you do just that, but you do it with calibers that weren't even mentioned.
</div></div>

I have to agree, shoulder angle has nothing to do with this conversation. Stop changing the subject to calibers that were not asked for.... lets stay on topic. You are pushing a 7mm hybrid, that was not asked for, Jedi.... the OP specifically asked for 243 vs 6.5. And why you chose 243 OVER 6.5. I even got sidetracked for a minute but that was only to argue the effectiveness of the calibers you blurted out that were "more advanced than 260".

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: FamilyMan</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This is not intended to be a "This vs. That" thread but more of a question for those who have chosen to stick with the .243win cartridge. </div></div>

 

[Jedi]

Re: .243 or 6.5

6XC or 6.5XC
I would run a 6mm, melonite barrel, RE17 105 @ 3100fps 20" barrel
but thats just me

 

[D_TROS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jedi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...
The new smaller 30' cases do everything their 308 based counterparts with less powder
case in point
my X47
20" barrel will launch a 123scenar @ 3023fps with ease not even close to max load
I can chase the lands until the bullet falls outta the case
308 etc <span style="color: #FF0000">not so much unless your running mags with long OAL</span>.
The new cases are just better by design period

</div></div>

Exactly. The x47 or CM is no where near superior a case than the 260, it is just better suited to the S/A than the 260 due to the OAL constraints.

The 260 is limited in the OAL to fit in a mag. This causes the long VLD's to be/sit in the powder column (reducing the amt of powder you can out in a case), making some people think that the x47 can actuall keep up with the 260.
Get an AW cut with a long throat cut on a 243/260/etc and load em long and leave the others in the dust. Better yet use a long action.
Easy peezy.

To stay on topic, I have considered switching to the 243 over the 260 for cheaper bullets, less recoil, but thin k I will stay on the 6.5 trip for the foreseable future. I am having hard time deciding what bullet to use next or stick with the 130jlk.

Regards,
DT

 

[KYS]

Re: .243 or 6.5

I just think for the fact of ease of loading and manipulation of ammo components that the 260 is the better overall round to keep. The 243 is an awesome flat round, but can leave you lacking when it comes to hitting steel as it does not always splash or resinate well. The 260 has the horsepower and weight behind it to make it count.

 

[Jaxdialation]

Re: .243 or 6.5

I own both calibers. For pound for pound performance the 260 is superior IMHO. No need for a long barrel -- my 23" is a laser.
And the 260 is SO easy to handload. All of them have at least 2 accuracy nodes. I am not that good at all, and I get very good results handloading.

 

[105amatt]

Re: .243 or 6.5

243 Win pushing Dtacs. Having said that i'm thinking about a 6.5cm for my next build. I really like the 243, low recoil, good bullets. My rifle weighs in around 18 pounds, you could shoot it all day. I only thing is the mentioned barrel life. I got around 3500 rounds out of my factory barrel before I noticed the groups starting to open up. That was running 105 A-Max's at 3100. Now I'm running bare Dtacs at 2875, well see how long this one goes.

 

[JByrd]

Re: .243 or 6.5

243 is great ,some people i highly respect shoot them, i just have a hard time spotting impacts. The zero recoil and brass avail. Of 243 is a great feature as well. The 243 is on the far end of the scale to me and the 260 is a happy medium and fits me better at my current performance level. I look at the light impacts of a 243 almost as a feature reserved for advanced shooters.

In short , i run 260 and am 100% totally happy/satisfied with it and thats what i recommend.

Great thread btw, ive ran this debate over in my head quite a bit.

 

[dmpowder]

Re: .243 or 6.5

I own and love both the .243 and the 6.5 Creedmoor. If I had to pick just one it would be the 6.5 Creedmoor for the plain and simple fact of having the heavy pills. I won't give up my .243 and when I burn the barrel out I will get another one but in AI version.

I can go down to my local Wal-mart and buy the things needed for the .243 and I can't do that with the Creedmoor. Joys of a small town.

On a side note I have 12 loadings on my Hornady brass and the pockets are still nice. As Rob01 says you can go to just about any major retailer and pick up match worthy Creedmoor ammo and shoot in comps and have a good chance of winning with factory loaded ammo, you can't say the same with the .243,260,x47.

OP just keep your .243 and get a 6.5 of your poison and enjoy both.

PS Creedmoor still has the coolest sounding name of them all!

 

[tylerw02]

Re: .243 or 6.5

In my experience I've only get maybe one or two more firings out of x47L before trimming than .308 family for what its worth.