Please explain to me why anyone would choose a .300 Blackout Out over a .308. I can definately see the draw in an AR platform where you can shoot sub and super sonic ammo without making any adjustments but doesn't a .308 offer better everything (ballistics, component availability, etc.) when considering a bolt action rifle?
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.300 Blackout in a bolt action - why?
- Thread starter bhart89
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More appealing subsonic performance? Especially for somebody who only shoots subsonic and suppressed? Lower cost of brass?
On a multi-caliber rifle addition of 300 Blackout would be easy, and not "instead of" 308.
Mouse
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On a multi-caliber rifle addition of 300 Blackout would be easy, and not "instead of" 308.
Mouse
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Because shooting suppressed you don't have the sound of a bolt slamming home and you don't have port noise, so it's quieter. .308 can be finnicky to load subs for.
It's also America, so we get what we want because we want it...NOW. That's usually my justification. I have a tikka t3 in .300 blackout, and am building a moss erg MVP in the same. It's super quiet with 247g cast bullets, and packs a punch.
It's also America, so we get what we want because we want it...NOW. That's usually my justification. I have a tikka t3 in .300 blackout, and am building a moss erg MVP in the same. It's super quiet with 247g cast bullets, and packs a punch.
I am a big fan of 300BLK, own a company that converts brass, shot something north of 15k rounds, etc...
I have a bolt 300BLK
I have a bolt .308
Subs in either are just about equal sound wise IMO. Maybe on a meter you could tell the difference.
300BLK shines in the AR platform. In a bolt, meh, I dont know. I have it as a demo, I dont shoot it nearly as often as I have my .308 out. I also have a TC 300BLK that I am building up right now.
NOW, in states where you cant hunt with a semi auto, 300BLK in a bolt starts to make sense. I forget which states, but some states its illegal to hunt with a semi auto, but silencers are legal. DUR....
Delta4-3: I have never had an issue with subs in a .308. Probably loaded 3k with trailboss and a variety of bullets. I dont do any special brass prep although I tend to use worn out .308 cases with loose primer pockets and what not.
I have a bolt 300BLK
I have a bolt .308
Subs in either are just about equal sound wise IMO. Maybe on a meter you could tell the difference.
300BLK shines in the AR platform. In a bolt, meh, I dont know. I have it as a demo, I dont shoot it nearly as often as I have my .308 out. I also have a TC 300BLK that I am building up right now.
NOW, in states where you cant hunt with a semi auto, 300BLK in a bolt starts to make sense. I forget which states, but some states its illegal to hunt with a semi auto, but silencers are legal. DUR....
Delta4-3: I have never had an issue with subs in a .308. Probably loaded 3k with trailboss and a variety of bullets. I dont do any special brass prep although I tend to use worn out .308 cases with loose primer pockets and what not.
Not sure about all the Blackout barrels but for the rest of the clones like the 300 fireball, 30-221, 300 whisper and such the twist rates are optimized for subsonics where most 308 barrels are intended for supersonics. This allows you to shoot accurately and consistently with the smaller case and not worry about trashing your suppressor. In a 308 with a 1-10 twist you are risking serious damage shooting 220-240gr bullets subsonic and the whole point of subs is maintaining as much energy as possible while keeping things as quiet as you can. What good is it to shoot 150gr subsonics? As for the AR I have no idea....never cared for them and don't know a lot about them. I do know however that not all of them will work with both subs and supersonics as far as cycling goes. Some won't so that isn't the point at all. I think some guys just feel a need for big mags and semi auto.
I prefer the bolt action for the quiet subsonic use at shorter ranges. In that area the smaller case is much much more efficient, has a wide range of powders available to get there and uses much less powder to do it. The 308 is pretty much stuck with crappy trailboss due to the huge case capacity. I'd much rather use 2400, 4227 or lil gun for my subs.
Basic answer to the question is : the shorter blackout, whisper, 30-221, fireball case is more efficient, uses less powder for the same velocity, uses a wider range of powders which can make the report quieter so that it does suppress better and normally comes with a twist rate that allows the use of the heaviest bullets safely. Its possible to build a rifle to shoot very accurately at shorter (or somewhat longer) ranges with subsonics where the 308 is primarily a longer range accurate supersonic shooter. Its not always possible to have both subs and supersonics shoot accurately in one rifle. In the bolt action its much quieter than the semi's and since the original point was subsonics this makes it better for suppressing than gas guns.
Hope that all makes sense
Frank
I prefer the bolt action for the quiet subsonic use at shorter ranges. In that area the smaller case is much much more efficient, has a wide range of powders available to get there and uses much less powder to do it. The 308 is pretty much stuck with crappy trailboss due to the huge case capacity. I'd much rather use 2400, 4227 or lil gun for my subs.
Basic answer to the question is : the shorter blackout, whisper, 30-221, fireball case is more efficient, uses less powder for the same velocity, uses a wider range of powders which can make the report quieter so that it does suppress better and normally comes with a twist rate that allows the use of the heaviest bullets safely. Its possible to build a rifle to shoot very accurately at shorter (or somewhat longer) ranges with subsonics where the 308 is primarily a longer range accurate supersonic shooter. Its not always possible to have both subs and supersonics shoot accurately in one rifle. In the bolt action its much quieter than the semi's and since the original point was subsonics this makes it better for suppressing than gas guns.
Hope that all makes sense
Frank
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You've got it figured out. Subs in both = same shit. Supersonic 308 dry humps a 300 BLK into submission. In an AR 300 BLK is great. I have both, 308 bolt 300 BLK AR.
I just got the 700 AAC-SD in 300 Blackout and am taking it down to 14" with a pinned brake. It has a 1:7 twist so I know it's gonna stabilize the heavy stuff. I'm not as confident in a 1:10 14 incher stabilizing a 240gr round. And I won't have the sound of the bolt flying around as I would with an AR. Although, I'm beginning to feel a little bit like my dad back when I was a little kid asking him why he took all the trouble to fabricate wildcat ammo when I could just go to the local sporting goods store and pick up a box of .303 for my Enfield.
This is America...better question is why not?
Perhaps your state allows hunting with semi, but here in PA we cannot hunt with semi. I have a 300 BO bolt action to hunt in my state because my rifle is light and compact and I can use my suppressor.
Perhaps your state allows hunting with semi, but here in PA we cannot hunt with semi. I have a 300 BO bolt action to hunt in my state because my rifle is light and compact and I can use my suppressor.
I have a 308 bolt gun. I want a 300 blk bolt gun. So I'm gonna buy one!
Mostly I want a rifle to get my girls into shooting and hunting. Something lightweight, low recoil, and quiet to teach her fundamentals without inducing flinch.
The first time I shot a rifle, other than 22, I was about 8 and it was a 30-06. Needless to say I had a flinching problem for years!!! But my papaw sure got a good laugh!!!
Mostly I want a rifle to get my girls into shooting and hunting. Something lightweight, low recoil, and quiet to teach her fundamentals without inducing flinch.
The first time I shot a rifle, other than 22, I was about 8 and it was a 30-06. Needless to say I had a flinching problem for years!!! But my papaw sure got a good laugh!!!
I got mine because I don't like ARs and it's much quieter. There's no wrong way to go, just personal preference.
SEMO deer stand there in disbelief when you drop one of their friends with a blackout bolt gun. Mine is also built on a Savage.
99.9% of factory 300 Blackout barrels are twisted for heavy for caliber bullets. The same can not be said for the 308 Win.
The Blackout doesn't need long barrels and often come in 16 inch threaded versions. This helps when running a suppressor Until very recently the same can not be said of the 308 Win. Personally I don't want to run a standard twist 24 inch barreled 308 and then add the length of a suppressor to shoot sub sonics.
The diminutive 300 BO was designed around being run in the AR but not everyone is a lover of that platform. It's a purposely built sub sonic suppressed round first I believe and a short distance med game hunting round using light for caliber bullets second. It wasn't brought out to compete with the 308 Win and in a bolt gun will still do everything it was designed to do.
The Blackout doesn't need long barrels and often come in 16 inch threaded versions. This helps when running a suppressor Until very recently the same can not be said of the 308 Win. Personally I don't want to run a standard twist 24 inch barreled 308 and then add the length of a suppressor to shoot sub sonics.
The diminutive 300 BO was designed around being run in the AR but not everyone is a lover of that platform. It's a purposely built sub sonic suppressed round first I believe and a short distance med game hunting round using light for caliber bullets second. It wasn't brought out to compete with the 308 Win and in a bolt gun will still do everything it was designed to do.
I had a 300 Whisper bolt action. It was neat and all, but my 300 BLK AR is nearly as quiet with a 9" barrel and far more useful. The big advantage of the bolt action is for cast bullets, light charge weights, etc. that will not feed in an AR.
Dont worry, over here in Aus we cant have cans or semis, and guys are still buying them in bolt guns ... :S
And one less set of dies, one less pile of brass, one less powder to keep on hand. Plus, and not that I'm saying this is a bad thing, you have to have a rifle to shoot said 300BO from.
The only drawback I can see to shooting .308 subs is the twist rate on most rifles is too slow. I have a 1-8" Bartlein on order that I will chamber in .308 and cut to 16". I don't know how many subs I'll shoot but I know I will be able to shoot any weight .30 cal. bullet from 110gr AMAX's fast to 240gr Sierras slow and have it stabilize.
I do own an 8" Noveske upper in 300BO. It's great for that platform.
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