300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

[mstennes]

A friend of mine is getting ready to build his next long range rifle his plans are 800-1200+ yards. His back yard range has a 2000 yard opening he shoots in (I know he sucks) but he's looking at going with a 300 Win Mag, but it seems to me a better choice for his shooting would be the 300RUM since he wants to reach out a little further. Right now he has taken ground hogs at about 1000 with his old and tired Sendero 300 Win Mag, which has seen better days and has opend up quite a bit.

 

[coldboremiracle]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

Depending on what your friend plans on doing with said rifle, I would disagree with you. I know if I had a range in my backyard, I would shoot daily. A guy who shoots daily will go through a lot of ammo, lots of ammo+300RUM=burned up barrel. With barrel life as short as it is with the RUM's, I would suggest something a bit less consumable, say a 300wm. A 300wm loaded properly can take full advantage of the range you describe.

 

[Fieldman_.308]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I'd say if he is set on 800-1200 yards then in my opinion the 300wm would work well, depending on(like coldboremiracle stated)it is set up properly. If he wants to shoot more in the range of 800-1000 you can get a lot more burn time through a .308win. My buddies current build rifle in .308win with berger 185 gr vld's don't hit transonic speed till 1085 yards, and you can get a lot more burn time through a .308 as compared to a 300Win or 300 rum. Just a thought. Have fun!

 

[mstennes]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fieldman_.308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'd say if he is set on 800-1200 yards then in my opinion the 300wm would work well, depending on(like coldboremiracle stated)it is set up properly. If he wants to shoot more in the range of 800-1000 you can get a lot more burn time through a .308win. My current build rifle in .308win with berger 185 gr vld's don't hit transonic speed till 1085 yards, and you can get a lot more burn time through a .308 as compared to a 300Win or 300 rum. Just a thought. Have fun! </div></div>
Well hes got two very nice 308's and wants to step up to either the 300RUM or 300WM, his plan is to get up to a 338LPM, but its down the road a ways, he said to do it right. He shoots at least 2-3 times a week, some times more, sometimes less, depending on family life. He has built a small shooting shack to at least beat the cold, and direct sun, and has his reloading equipment setup in there. So the 300RUM has a shorter barrel life? He shoots his 308 out to a 100, but figured he would use the new build for 800-1200 maybe more as he gets comfortable with it. His ultimate goal is to use all his range.

 

[asian8ter]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I would agree with fieldman the 300 mag is a very fine cartridge.
but if all he wants to do is punch holes, even at a longer range the 308 win is a good choice.

 

[Fieldman_.308]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

You might have him look at the .338 edge. Thats suppose to be the poor mans lapua. Not very far off from the 300 ultra, many say it'll outperform the lapua with the 300 gr bullets. Look it up theres a lot of great info on it.

 

[jrob300]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

A 26-30" 300WM shooting 208 or 210's loaded long, will get to 2000 yds. without breathing hard.

Question though... if he's shooting 800-1200, why not build a .260? Very similar ballistics to the 300WM, more intrinsically accurate, cheaper to reload and WAY easier on the shoulder.

I have a 300WM and I'm in the process of building a .260 for just the reasons I stated. The .260 should be good to a mile +. That will let me save the 300 for 2000+.

Just a thought.

John

 

[Bunnyack]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

considering the price a .300 would be the better choice, up to 1200 (and beyond, with good loads). I disagree a little with john, yes the .260 will go out to 1200 yards, but it reaches that distance at less velocity and less energy, making it less effective on game and more affected by wind and drop than the .300 wm. I also would be careful calling the RUM a "barrel burner". It depends. If you remove fouling from the bore and don´t let the barrel heat up too much, (avoiding fast follow-up shots) you can get an acceptable barrel life out of your RUM. And even replacing the barrel every 1500-2000 rounds can be an acceptable price if you consider the extra power you get.

 

[winxp_man]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

once you go to 1200 and see how nice it is to shoot that far you will want to go further

+1 for 300 Win Mag

 

[Fieldman_.308]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

Yep, that goes pretty much with anything. The 300 ultra will erode the throat faster than a win mag though. Anytime you push more velocity out of a bullet. But like you said taking care of your gun will lengthen their life span. Have you talked to your friend anymore about this topic?

 

[DP425]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I haven't heard a compelling reason, in all of this for .300RUM. There are no requirements listed that call for .300 RUM over .300WM. Considering cost of loading, shortened barrel life and additional recoil, it simply isn't the best choice.

 

[JWV]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I am thinking you would have to shoot very very slow to get 1500-2000 accurate shots out of a 300 RUM. I have one, and after 3 shots in say under 2 minutes seconds, that barrel is smoking hot. Oh yea, your going to throw around 100 grains of powder into every RUM cartridge.

 

[Fieldman_.308]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

Good point on cost of reloading. I don't believe he mentioned anything about that but if he's shooting daily then i'm sure it will be a factor. My opinion stands on a 338 cal rifle for longer distances. They have an easier time making 1500 to 2000 yards. Stay with an edge or lapua for 300 gr bullets. But for 800 to 1200 yards I'd say the .308win or .300wm.

 

[head2h2o]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

For what you are asking, I would go with the 300WM. It is more than capable of handling 1200 yds. A buddy and I also run RUMs, but they are a lot of gun and not something I feel the need to shoot often. Plan on feeding a hungry round also. Depending on the load, we are running between 87 and 102 gr of powder per round. I run the 240gr SMK in mine also and those are fairly expensive compared to some of the lighter 30 caliber bullets.

 

[Graham]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jrob300</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 26-30" 300WM shooting 208 or 210's loaded long, will get to 2000 yds. without breathing hard...
The .260 should be good to a mile +.
That will let me save the 300 for 2000+.</div></div>Having tried it more than a few times, I can't agree with any of that.

Unless you are at serious altitude the 300WM won't make it to 2000 yards. A 210gr VLD at 2950fps out of a 29" barrel at 4500 feet won't reliably get there in the summer. And a .260 is not a one-mile gun.

If your max range is 1200 yards, and you plan to actually shoot at that distance, a 300WM is fine.

 

[jrob300]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jrob300</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A 26-30" 300WM shooting 208 or 210's loaded long, will get to 2000 yds. without breathing hard...
The .260 should be good to a mile +.
That will let me save the 300 for 2000+.</div></div>Having tried it more than a few times, I can't agree with any of that.

Unless you are at serious altitude the 300WM won't make it to 2000 yards. A 210gr VLD at 2950fps out of a 29" barrel at 4500 feet won't reliably get there in the summer. And a .260 is not a one-mile gun.

If your max range is 1200 yards, and you plan to actually shoot at that distance, a 300WM is fine. </div></div>

Graham,

I've read many of your posts and you seem like a reasonable person and as I think I've stated in the past, I respect your opinion. I can only tell you what I've witnessed myself or heard from people I deem reputable (and witnessed).

I'm shooting 208 Amax's at about 2900 fps from a 22" barrel and had no problem at all reaching 2300 yds. in Sept. at 80 + deg. F... around 1 moa or less... witnessed.

I hit the 1900 yd plate in August at Augustis Ranch without coming close to maxed out elevation... witnessed in a 15-20 mph wind.

I recently shot over 2000 yds. (I went back and checked my notes... this would have been 1915 and 1985 yds)in freezing weather, blowing snow and although the shots were really hard to spot (hard ground) several were within inches of the intended target... witnessed.

Altitude: approx. 4000' ASL.

Tom Sarver told me he hit 10 of 10 shots on a 12" plate at 1760 yds at TVP (Ohio... NOT 4000')with his .260. I'm not going to call him a liar.

I do not know how to resolve when two people see different results. Perhaps it's not as cut and dried as I think. But these are my experiences and I do not share them lightly or make a habit of lying.

You are more than welcome to come shoot with me out here. I'm currently putting together a 30" 300WM for my boy who's serving in Iraq... the goal? 2500 yds. You can come watch if you like.

You probably also wont believe that a friend from this site has made reliable hits at a mile with his .308 either?

"Your opinions, thoughts and predictions are mostly irrelevant, the bullet has the last word." Sound familiar? If I had read your words and decided to take them as gospel, I would not have seen what I have seen...

John

 

[Graham]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I appreciate your reply, and the invite. My intention was to diagree with you, not to call you or anyone else a liar. What you decsribed in your original post was regular use: .300WM to 2000 "without breating hard" and a .260 as good for regular use to one-mile-plus. Both calibers need serious work and very favorable conditions to be anywhere near reliable at many hundreds of yards short of those distances. Reliable subsonic hits at extreme ranges are not unheard-of. And the Australians are achieving some amazing things with 175SMK's in .308 now. But I still disagree with your premise.

 

[jrob300]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

Graham,

I did feel called out. Thanks for the clarification.

Your post has made me rethink my position, too. It is very possible that I have witnessed a string of uniquely favorable conditions that are too small a sample to be considered significant. I will continue to play and report back.

I do know this... I think it was Bryan Litz, or perhaps Bohem that pointed out that the VLD with more of its weight in the tail as compared to the Amax, shows less stable transonic performance at sea level. The conjecture was that altitude might mitigate it to some extent, but the Amax has shown itself to hardly notice the transition to sub-sonic flight, thus *greatly* extending the maximum range. The Amax is the only bullet I've played with over 1500 yds.

It would be fun to do some side-by-side testing to see just how effective different configurations affect ELR performance and to what degree.

I hope you're wrong about the .260. Mike Bush is building one for me right now, and I based that decision on some long conversations with Tom Sarver about what he and others at TVP have done with that cartridge. As soon as I get a load worked up, you can bet I'll be out testing. It won't be the end of the world if it falls apart shortly after 1500, but I'd hoped to get a little more from it.

John

 

[freeflight]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

So what was your friend's final choice?

 

[Subxero]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I am not near as experienced as most of the other people here but i do know this.

If your friend has his heart set on one or the other, to just do it. They are both great cartridges and will perform great.

Second....not sure how much shooting of one particular rifle your friend does, but 2000rds of barrel life for me is significant especially out of something like the 300RUM...sure i am barely a weekend warrior and this may not be true to most people here so he may want to factor in use

This all being said, Think of the high velocity cartridges as super sports cars. You are not going to buy a Lambo for 250 K then be worried about putting new expensive tires on it every few months and using super high octane gas. You want performance expect to pay for it.

People spend upwards to around 5-6k on a build and justify the reason to pick one cartridge over another is 20grs of powder per round??

not exactly breaking the bank here

and the cost of a re-barrel at ~ 2000 rds fired

the only thing i can suggest is to look into the reloading aspect of it, seems your friend already has a 300wm and is probably familiar with it, powders, bullets, ect... and has all the equipment for it to reload so might be easier to stick with it.

but sometimes you just want a change over the norm

300wm is a belted case and 300 rum is beltless rebated if he has any preference there?

Just my 2 cents, i do not mean to offend anyone.

 

[cummins cowboy]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I would do something with a 6.5 or go big and go 338

 

[RustyShackleferd]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I am debating between .300 winmag and .300 norma

 

[The_FNG]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RustyShackelferd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I am debating between .300 winmag and .300 norma </div></div>

Now you're talking, those Norma rounds have always interested me.

 

[beretta989]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I allways had more fun shooting 300 Win over 308.

 

[338RUM runner]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

Grow a set and shoot the 300 Ultra. I do, my son and even my wife shoot one. Bigger is better, my .02

 

[PRDRIVER]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

I would go .300 WM out of the two. It will have longer barrel life and quality brass is easier to find.

If your friend is not wanting to go up to a .338 LM for long range, I would take a 7 WSM over a .300 WM.

 

[turbo54]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RMW</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I would go .300 WM out of the two. It will have longer barrel life and quality brass is easier to find.

If your friend is not wanting to go up to a .338 LM for long range, I would take a 7 WSM over a .300 WM. </div></div>

Finally some sense talking!

A 7 would definitely be my choice. Most any of them would do fine for this application.

 

[Unsichtbar]

Re: 300 Win Mag vs 300 RUM Which is?

7mm RSUM which out prefrorms the 30s IMO, is an outstanding preformer but be advised is hard on barrels