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.308 Battle Rifle
- Thread starter demonsmokr
- Start date
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm saying a modernized, ergonomically enhanced M14 rifle is as accurate, more reliable and more cost effective than a $5,000 ++ KAC SR25 EMC.
</div></div>
Interesting...
What types of components and features would need to be present on the M14-type rifle to reach this level of accuracy and reliability? Again, any info is much appreciated.
Would this rifle be a good example? Enhanced M1A for sale
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm saying a modernized, ergonomically enhanced M14 rifle is as accurate, more reliable and more cost effective than a $5,000 ++ KAC SR25 EMC.
</div></div>
Interesting...
What types of components and features would need to be present on the M14-type rifle to reach this level of accuracy and reliability? Again, any info is much appreciated.
Would this rifle be a good example? Enhanced M1A for sale
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Haha, wow I'm honored my little ol' M1A EBR was mentioned here. While the EBR chassis does go a long way to enhancing the accuracy, it will not reach the level's of accuracy most on this site require. A good barrel with a properly tuned load and a few parts that H20MAN can recommend will make it an even better shooter. However, I am in no way the best shooter out there and do not bring the best out of my EBR, yet still manage 1.5 MOA groups pretty consistently. It will shoot better than I can drive. Now, as I feel that we have thread jacked enough from the OP's topic, I am going to get back to the original topic. I feel like a tricked out M1A or a SR25 EMC are out of the OP's (and most others) budget. So I still think the PTR91 or the SOCOM16/SOCOMII represent the best battle rifle for the money. Both have 16" barrels and are capable of minute of man to 300 yards. Both have enough aftermarket options to make anyone happy, and both will run all day. I personally would choose a 16" PTR with A3 stock, G3 forearm, integral bipod, B&T top rail, a 1-4x optic, and about 20 mags.
Haha, wow I'm honored my little ol' M1A EBR was mentioned here. While the EBR chassis does go a long way to enhancing the accuracy, it will not reach the level's of accuracy most on this site require. A good barrel with a properly tuned load and a few parts that H20MAN can recommend will make it an even better shooter. However, I am in no way the best shooter out there and do not bring the best out of my EBR, yet still manage 1.5 MOA groups pretty consistently. It will shoot better than I can drive. Now, as I feel that we have thread jacked enough from the OP's topic, I am going to get back to the original topic. I feel like a tricked out M1A or a SR25 EMC are out of the OP's (and most others) budget. So I still think the PTR91 or the SOCOM16/SOCOMII represent the best battle rifle for the money. Both have 16" barrels and are capable of minute of man to 300 yards. Both have enough aftermarket options to make anyone happy, and both will run all day. I personally would choose a 16" PTR with A3 stock, G3 forearm, integral bipod, B&T top rail, a 1-4x optic, and about 20 mags.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vmpgsc</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm saying a modernized, ergonomically enhanced M14 rifle is as accurate, more reliable and more cost effective than a $5,000 ++ KAC SR25 EMC.
</div></div>
Interesting...
What types of components and features would need to be present on the M14-type rifle to reach this level of accuracy and reliability? Again, any info is much appreciated.
</div></div>
Good examples:
Look at what TACOM-RI is doing with the M14 EBR.
Look at the Crazy Horse and MK14 Mod 0 from SEI.
Look at what NSWC Crane has done with the M14.
The Mod 1 clone up for sale is very nice.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: vmpgsc</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I'm saying a modernized, ergonomically enhanced M14 rifle is as accurate, more reliable and more cost effective than a $5,000 ++ KAC SR25 EMC.
</div></div>
Interesting...
What types of components and features would need to be present on the M14-type rifle to reach this level of accuracy and reliability? Again, any info is much appreciated.
</div></div>
Good examples:
Look at what TACOM-RI is doing with the M14 EBR.
Look at the Crazy Horse and MK14 Mod 0 from SEI.
Look at what NSWC Crane has done with the M14.
The Mod 1 clone up for sale is very nice.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigBoss0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I feel like a tricked out M1A or a SR25 EMC are out of the OP's (and most others) budget.</div></div>
Yep. The SOCOM and the 16" PTR are more in line with what the OP is looking for.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigBoss0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I feel like a tricked out M1A or a SR25 EMC are out of the OP's (and most others) budget.</div></div>
Yep. The SOCOM and the 16" PTR are more in line with what the OP is looking for.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
My 5.56 FN Scar-16 has been shooting sub MOA out of the box, I would expect nothing less from the Scar-17 in 308.
20 rounds of 308, piston system reliable, durable, folding stock, accurate (based on the 5.56 version). This should be in the mix of options for sure.
My 5.56 FN Scar-16 has been shooting sub MOA out of the box, I would expect nothing less from the Scar-17 in 308.
20 rounds of 308, piston system reliable, durable, folding stock, accurate (based on the 5.56 version). This should be in the mix of options for sure.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Again, I highly doubt the OP is looking to spend 2k+ on a battle rifle that is just going to spend time in the back of his truck.
Again, I highly doubt the OP is looking to spend 2k+ on a battle rifle that is just going to spend time in the back of his truck.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
You are exactly correct big boss. I have my 2000$ rifle now, atleast its getting up there in parts. My Armalite fits all the needs of the AR type I want. Im looking for something cheap, reliable, low maintenance. Im thinking the M14 will be a better choice because I can modify the mags to fit in my Armalite, and still have them work in the M14. Armalite mags are not that special, they work better than DPMS style, its just an M14 mag with a different follower and spring. What mag is more battle proven than the M14 and G3? I figured them being the oldest and still using the same technology just modernized, has more going for them than the rest. But Im no expert, thats why Im asking all of your advice.
About that M1A in the pawn shop, I think its a Norinco or something. Its not really marked, atleast I was not able to tell today. I only stopped in for a few minutes to get a better glimpse. Comes with one mag, I believe to be USGI, it feels tougher than the rifle itself, so I only assume, no marking on the mag at all. The spot rust is on the barrel surface, and some small spots in the chamber area and around the charging handle. Nothing WD40 cant fix. Im looking for a gun that will take abuse of sitting behind my seat. If any has been to Houston or lives here, you will know what kind of driving happens around this city. Im looking for a gun that is tough as a truck, I treat my Armalite like a Corvette. Pet it, stroke the barrel, shine it up once a week, set it down softly, its spoiled. Its my baby, I just want another 308 semi that I can treat like crap, shoot shitty ammo, run a bore snake through it every now and then, maybe spray it down with some redneck lube once it starts feeling a little rough. That kind of thing. The M14 stole the legacy away from the Armalite, so I kinda like the idea of having American rivals as my go to guns. Colt can suck it.
Also about the expensive rifles. I dont know if any of you have heard about them, but FD Defense is making a new rifle. They are based out of the Austin area here in Texas. Its supposed to be a piston driven AR type rifle, that take 308 PMags. They are also making a .338 Lapua version. http://www.fd-defense.com/ I believe they are still in the prototype stage, but Im on the waiting list for that rifle. Thats my next big project. I want the M14 or G3 as my truck gun.
You are exactly correct big boss. I have my 2000$ rifle now, atleast its getting up there in parts. My Armalite fits all the needs of the AR type I want. Im looking for something cheap, reliable, low maintenance. Im thinking the M14 will be a better choice because I can modify the mags to fit in my Armalite, and still have them work in the M14. Armalite mags are not that special, they work better than DPMS style, its just an M14 mag with a different follower and spring. What mag is more battle proven than the M14 and G3? I figured them being the oldest and still using the same technology just modernized, has more going for them than the rest. But Im no expert, thats why Im asking all of your advice.
About that M1A in the pawn shop, I think its a Norinco or something. Its not really marked, atleast I was not able to tell today. I only stopped in for a few minutes to get a better glimpse. Comes with one mag, I believe to be USGI, it feels tougher than the rifle itself, so I only assume, no marking on the mag at all. The spot rust is on the barrel surface, and some small spots in the chamber area and around the charging handle. Nothing WD40 cant fix. Im looking for a gun that will take abuse of sitting behind my seat. If any has been to Houston or lives here, you will know what kind of driving happens around this city. Im looking for a gun that is tough as a truck, I treat my Armalite like a Corvette. Pet it, stroke the barrel, shine it up once a week, set it down softly, its spoiled. Its my baby, I just want another 308 semi that I can treat like crap, shoot shitty ammo, run a bore snake through it every now and then, maybe spray it down with some redneck lube once it starts feeling a little rough. That kind of thing. The M14 stole the legacy away from the Armalite, so I kinda like the idea of having American rivals as my go to guns. Colt can suck it.
Also about the expensive rifles. I dont know if any of you have heard about them, but FD Defense is making a new rifle. They are based out of the Austin area here in Texas. Its supposed to be a piston driven AR type rifle, that take 308 PMags. They are also making a .338 Lapua version. http://www.fd-defense.com/ I believe they are still in the prototype stage, but Im on the waiting list for that rifle. Thats my next big project. I want the M14 or G3 as my truck gun.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
The SOCOM is an awesome rifle and pretty much exactly what Im after. But its too expensive new and I have not seen many deals within my budget for one. I want to stay under 1000$ for a semi 308. If I have to piece it together, thats fine with me. Its more fun that way to me.
The SOCOM is an awesome rifle and pretty much exactly what Im after. But its too expensive new and I have not seen many deals within my budget for one. I want to stay under 1000$ for a semi 308. If I have to piece it together, thats fine with me. Its more fun that way to me.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Ok maybe you guys can clear something up for me. I have heard from a few gun shops and guys at the gunshow, that SOCOM canceled the FN SCAR as a replacement for the M16 and M4. They said it was due to being too expensive to replace the Arsenal with spare parts, training new specialist, blah blah blah. Is there any truth behind these statements or is it simply rumors gone bad? From I have seen on the SCAR, the only thing that bugs me is the front sight folding forward, and the stock and certain parts feel weak. But I also compare this only by feel and no range time or field use.
Ok maybe you guys can clear something up for me. I have heard from a few gun shops and guys at the gunshow, that SOCOM canceled the FN SCAR as a replacement for the M16 and M4. They said it was due to being too expensive to replace the Arsenal with spare parts, training new specialist, blah blah blah. Is there any truth behind these statements or is it simply rumors gone bad? From I have seen on the SCAR, the only thing that bugs me is the front sight folding forward, and the stock and certain parts feel weak. But I also compare this only by feel and no range time or field use.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
If you really really don't care go the CETME route. Not as reliable or accurate as a PTR, but you can find them for 400-500 used with a ton of accessories and they get the damn job done. One warning about the M1A, be careful because once you have one, you either want another or want to mod the one you have.
If you really really don't care go the CETME route. Not as reliable or accurate as a PTR, but you can find them for 400-500 used with a ton of accessories and they get the damn job done. One warning about the M1A, be careful because once you have one, you either want another or want to mod the one you have.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I have been noticing that while looking for parts and extras for the M1A. What are the differences between the G3, PTR91 and HK91, and the CETME style rifles. I actually have an old ass bayonet for the CETME. I look up the info, and basically come up with the G3 being a semi or full auto rifle, the CETME being the same thing just called something different by the Spanish army, then the American version being the HK91 and the portugese built PTR91, or some country with a P. Is there no real difference besides quality of workmanship? Or are they completely different rifles with different parts?
I have been noticing that while looking for parts and extras for the M1A. What are the differences between the G3, PTR91 and HK91, and the CETME style rifles. I actually have an old ass bayonet for the CETME. I look up the info, and basically come up with the G3 being a semi or full auto rifle, the CETME being the same thing just called something different by the Spanish army, then the American version being the HK91 and the portugese built PTR91, or some country with a P. Is there no real difference besides quality of workmanship? Or are they completely different rifles with different parts?
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
About that M1A in the pawn shop, I think its a Norinco or something. Its not really marked, atleast I was not able to tell today. I only stopped in for a few minutes to get a better glimpse. Comes with one mag, I believe to be USGI, it feels tougher than the rifle itself, so I only assume, no marking on the mag at all. The spot rust is on the barrel surface, and some small spots in the chamber area and around the charging handle. Nothing WD40 cant fix. Im looking for a gun that will take abuse of sitting behind my seat. If any has been to Houston or lives here, you will know what kind of driving happens around this city. Im looking for a gun that is tough as a truck, I treat my Armalite like a Corvette. I want the M14 or G3 as my truck gun. </div></div>
The Norinco comes with a forged receiver and a forged 1-piece op rod. The 22" barrel is chrome lined and all parts mentioned as well as the trigger group are as good as GI. The Chicom M14 can be domesticated rather inexpensively and they are an excellent host for eventually building it the way you want with a USGI bolt and a 16.25" or 18.0" barrel. Compare today's price for a plain jane stripped forged receiver from LRB with the price your pawn shop is asking for a complete and functional M14. Make them a cash offer of $700.00 and see what happens
I have built up two Norinco and three Poly Tech M14s... no regrets.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
About that M1A in the pawn shop, I think its a Norinco or something. Its not really marked, atleast I was not able to tell today. I only stopped in for a few minutes to get a better glimpse. Comes with one mag, I believe to be USGI, it feels tougher than the rifle itself, so I only assume, no marking on the mag at all. The spot rust is on the barrel surface, and some small spots in the chamber area and around the charging handle. Nothing WD40 cant fix. Im looking for a gun that will take abuse of sitting behind my seat. If any has been to Houston or lives here, you will know what kind of driving happens around this city. Im looking for a gun that is tough as a truck, I treat my Armalite like a Corvette. I want the M14 or G3 as my truck gun. </div></div>
The Norinco comes with a forged receiver and a forged 1-piece op rod. The 22" barrel is chrome lined and all parts mentioned as well as the trigger group are as good as GI. The Chicom M14 can be domesticated rather inexpensively and they are an excellent host for eventually building it the way you want with a USGI bolt and a 16.25" or 18.0" barrel. Compare today's price for a plain jane stripped forged receiver from LRB with the price your pawn shop is asking for a complete and functional M14. Make them a cash offer of $700.00 and see what happens
I have built up two Norinco and three Poly Tech M14s... no regrets.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Im just not fond of a Chinese M14. Im sure it can be made to work, but its effin Chinese. That would go against many things I stand for. Thats an abomination in my eyes, a Chinese M1A. Does not sound appealing at all. I know American craftsmanship is dwindling to nil nowadays, but your supposed to be able to count on guns, hand tools, and liquor to be best from America. Im sure it works as well as I want it to, but its Chinese. I just would not feel right holding a Springfield knock off. Thats just disrespectful.
Im just not fond of a Chinese M14. Im sure it can be made to work, but its effin Chinese. That would go against many things I stand for. Thats an abomination in my eyes, a Chinese M1A. Does not sound appealing at all. I know American craftsmanship is dwindling to nil nowadays, but your supposed to be able to count on guns, hand tools, and liquor to be best from America. Im sure it works as well as I want it to, but its Chinese. I just would not feel right holding a Springfield knock off. Thats just disrespectful.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
hi for an reliable 308 semi auto the Australian Made SLR is hard to beat FAL made here. it is not the most accurate but a lot were with hemmer forged or cut rifles barrels and an adjustable gas system they are just plain reliable. I shot thousands of rounds in and out of the servica and am realy upset i had to sell mine to have it crushed by the government. But is the SHTF it would be my go to. they are more reliable than the older AR10's we ever had access to i dont know about the reliability of the newer AR10's but they are gas piston and run in dirt, mud and sand as Australia made soecial sand groves on the locking block to allow function in any condition. the FAL's are also a great rifle i had one for a lot of years. I found the M1 Garand to also be a very reliable rifle but the M14's and M1a's had issues with the cocking handle cracking off we used to fired thousands of rounds through them in IPSC shoots and if something was going to fail it would be the cocking handle on a M14/M1A so i would probably not get one even though they are probably the most accurate of the rifles mentioned.
Check out a SLR/FAL they will work when the shit hits the fan, other than that as said above a M1 Garand
hi for an reliable 308 semi auto the Australian Made SLR is hard to beat FAL made here. it is not the most accurate but a lot were with hemmer forged or cut rifles barrels and an adjustable gas system they are just plain reliable. I shot thousands of rounds in and out of the servica and am realy upset i had to sell mine to have it crushed by the government. But is the SHTF it would be my go to. they are more reliable than the older AR10's we ever had access to i dont know about the reliability of the newer AR10's but they are gas piston and run in dirt, mud and sand as Australia made soecial sand groves on the locking block to allow function in any condition. the FAL's are also a great rifle i had one for a lot of years. I found the M1 Garand to also be a very reliable rifle but the M14's and M1a's had issues with the cocking handle cracking off we used to fired thousands of rounds through them in IPSC shoots and if something was going to fail it would be the cocking handle on a M14/M1A so i would probably not get one even though they are probably the most accurate of the rifles mentioned.
Check out a SLR/FAL they will work when the shit hits the fan, other than that as said above a M1 Garand
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Im gonna check out the pawn shop rifle some more. Fulton Armory says most of the parts are crap, but some of the receivers will work with GI parts. So it might be an ok investment. I may be over reacting a bit, but that just caught me off guard. I did not know Norinco made M14s, their AKs work. Thats all I can say about those.
Im gonna check out the pawn shop rifle some more. Fulton Armory says most of the parts are crap, but some of the receivers will work with GI parts. So it might be an ok investment. I may be over reacting a bit, but that just caught me off guard. I did not know Norinco made M14s, their AKs work. Thats all I can say about those.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fulton Armory says most of the parts are crap, but some of the receivers will work with GI parts. </div></div>
Who?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Fulton Armory says most of the parts are crap, but some of the receivers will work with GI parts. </div></div>
Who?
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
http://www.fulton-armory.com/M14S_Eval.htm comes up when you search Norinco M14
http://www.fulton-armory.com/M14S_Eval.htm comes up when you search Norinco M14
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I love my Garand, but I don't think it's the right answer.
FAL all the way.
If the fecal matter ever hits the air handling device, I will likely be found ready-to-go, dead with a pensive look on my face trying to figure out just which FAL(s) to bring along.
I love my Garand, but I don't think it's the right answer.
FAL all the way.
If the fecal matter ever hits the air handling device, I will likely be found ready-to-go, dead with a pensive look on my face trying to figure out just which FAL(s) to bring along.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Well said AlterEgo. Thats the type of collection I plan on having, or hope to have by the time the the world has defecated into a tornado.
Well said AlterEgo. Thats the type of collection I plan on having, or hope to have by the time the the world has defecated into a tornado.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Im thinking with the parts that Im able to search for and are available, the M14 or FAL is the best bet. I see FAL parts everywhere, M1A stuff too. Just a little pricier, but hopefully worth the money. So Its between a FAL reciever form DSA, or a used or new M1A receiver. My mind is made up that far. Thanks again for the info guys.
Im thinking with the parts that Im able to search for and are available, the M14 or FAL is the best bet. I see FAL parts everywhere, M1A stuff too. Just a little pricier, but hopefully worth the money. So Its between a FAL reciever form DSA, or a used or new M1A receiver. My mind is made up that far. Thanks again for the info guys.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1stIDvet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I recommend a SCAR 17 myself but that KAC rifle is sweet! If only they could produce a rifle for the public that the average person can pay for... </div></div>
Get ready for some KAC 7.62mm pricing to stand the world on its head...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1stIDvet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I recommend a SCAR 17 myself but that KAC rifle is sweet! If only they could produce a rifle for the public that the average person can pay for... </div></div>
Get ready for some KAC 7.62mm pricing to stand the world on its head...
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Hey BigJoe, that's a sweet rifle - can I borrow it?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KevinB-KAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1stIDvet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I recommend a SCAR 17 myself but that KAC rifle is sweet! If only they could produce a rifle for the public that the average person can pay for... </div></div>
Get ready for some KAC 7.62mm pricing to stand the world on its head...
</div></div>
KAC legacy systems for LESS
Hey BigJoe, that's a sweet rifle - can I borrow it?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KevinB-KAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1stIDvet</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I recommend a SCAR 17 myself but that KAC rifle is sweet! If only they could produce a rifle for the public that the average person can pay for... </div></div>
Get ready for some KAC 7.62mm pricing to stand the world on its head...
</div></div>
KAC legacy systems for LESS
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">sure though the US government might not like it very much
</div></div>
The color was the give away it was GI.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">sure though the US government might not like it very much
The color was the give away it was GI.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
love carrying it though, light, accurate, i have been rocking a vortex 1-4 lately but took it off so a buddy could run it for a few days. barrel changes are easy as hell. thats why i bought my own which is waitin for me when i get home, and i have 2 ar10's.
love carrying it though, light, accurate, i have been rocking a vortex 1-4 lately but took it off so a buddy could run it for a few days. barrel changes are easy as hell. thats why i bought my own which is waitin for me when i get home, and i have 2 ar10's.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
$1000 for an M14 variant... possible but not likely. You may be able to get the initial rifle from the pawn shop for $800 but it'll need some love. A bolt conversion and stock and possibly front and rear sights to get it started (some Chinese rear sights the hole is drilled off center). Probably in the $600 range for all that. Plus the barrel and gas system are metric so if you want to change anything there you need to buy everything; barrel, gas system and muzzle device. This can be another $500+. So now your affordable rifle is equal to or more than what a Standard, Loaded, Socom or Scout would cost...
$1000 for an M14 variant... possible but not likely. You may be able to get the initial rifle from the pawn shop for $800 but it'll need some love. A bolt conversion and stock and possibly front and rear sights to get it started (some Chinese rear sights the hole is drilled off center). Probably in the $600 range for all that. Plus the barrel and gas system are metric so if you want to change anything there you need to buy everything; barrel, gas system and muzzle device. This can be another $500+. So now your affordable rifle is equal to or more than what a Standard, Loaded, Socom or Scout would cost...
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The SOCOM is an awesome rifle and pretty much exactly what Im after. But its too expensive new and I have not seen many deals within my budget for one. I want to stay under 1000$ for a semi 308. If I have to piece it together, thats fine with me. Its more fun that way to me. </div></div>
$1K don't buy anything decent in the M14 line - SAinc "BOB" cost more than that & the EBR stock is $750 by the time it hits your doorstep
Piecing it together won't save you $$ it will be more $$ in the end.
I ran a SEinc barreled LRB m25 at the last multigun match - I did well but its not as quick to load as the AR setups, even the 7.62 AR setups are much faster.
Thinking of running a SEinc SAGE EBR at the match comming up the end of the month against the 9mm & 5.56 crowd, my times will be slower but it will be fun & I like to use my toys & not just sitting at a bench
A $650 FAL I just picked up would be in your "price range", the one I just acquired shoots well & the FAL is a proven battle rifle - The DSA Para ?Tactical? which I have also is a much quicker handling & lighter rifle over the M14 EBR's although they are above your $$ limit as well.
Next season I think I will try an Armalite A2 Carbine for a 7.62 multigun blaster, maybe you can look along those lines for a cheapo 7.62 a bunch of manu's make them.
The M14 & FAL are among my favorite SHTF rifles, I would really hate to have to choose just one, The Armalite will reload alot quicker & mounting a optic will be alot cheaper, not to mention building one yourself anyone can assemble.
The AR & FAL setups will get you blasting & having fun at matches cheapest.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The SOCOM is an awesome rifle and pretty much exactly what Im after. But its too expensive new and I have not seen many deals within my budget for one. I want to stay under 1000$ for a semi 308. If I have to piece it together, thats fine with me. Its more fun that way to me. </div></div>
$1K don't buy anything decent in the M14 line - SAinc "BOB" cost more than that & the EBR stock is $750 by the time it hits your doorstep
Piecing it together won't save you $$ it will be more $$ in the end.
I ran a SEinc barreled LRB m25 at the last multigun match - I did well but its not as quick to load as the AR setups, even the 7.62 AR setups are much faster.
Thinking of running a SEinc SAGE EBR at the match comming up the end of the month against the 9mm & 5.56 crowd, my times will be slower but it will be fun & I like to use my toys & not just sitting at a bench
A $650 FAL I just picked up would be in your "price range", the one I just acquired shoots well & the FAL is a proven battle rifle - The DSA Para ?Tactical? which I have also is a much quicker handling & lighter rifle over the M14 EBR's although they are above your $$ limit as well.
Next season I think I will try an Armalite A2 Carbine for a 7.62 multigun blaster, maybe you can look along those lines for a cheapo 7.62 a bunch of manu's make them.
The M14 & FAL are among my favorite SHTF rifles, I would really hate to have to choose just one, The Armalite will reload alot quicker & mounting a optic will be alot cheaper, not to mention building one yourself anyone can assemble.
The AR & FAL setups will get you blasting & having fun at matches cheapest.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoExpert</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...the barrel and gas system are metric so if you want to change anything there you need to buy everything; barrel, gas system and muzzle device. This can be another $500+. So now your affordable rifle is equal to or more than what a Standard, Loaded, Socom or Scout would cost... </div></div>
Keeping it affordable: Save your money and run the original chrome lined barrel.
The threads for the gas lock and castle nut are metric... the Chinese gas cylinder, piston and plug work just fine, but you can install GI or SEI parts as long as you use the metric gas lock. Also, as long as you use the metric castle nut you can install a GI or SEI muzzle device however, the DC Vortex can not be installed on metric threads.
BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoExpert</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...the barrel and gas system are metric so if you want to change anything there you need to buy everything; barrel, gas system and muzzle device. This can be another $500+. So now your affordable rifle is equal to or more than what a Standard, Loaded, Socom or Scout would cost... </div></div>
Keeping it affordable: Save your money and run the original chrome lined barrel.
The threads for the gas lock and castle nut are metric... the Chinese gas cylinder, piston and plug work just fine, but you can install GI or SEI parts as long as you use the metric gas lock. Also, as long as you use the metric castle nut you can install a GI or SEI muzzle device however, the DC Vortex can not be installed on metric threads.
BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I just picked up a very nice pre-ban (1993) SA M1a Bush rifle for $900 at the local pawn shop. It was hardly used and and came with all USGI parts, Mostly TRW with Winchester sights. Keep your eyes open, the deals are out there.
I just picked up a very nice pre-ban (1993) SA M1a Bush rifle for $900 at the local pawn shop. It was hardly used and and came with all USGI parts, Mostly TRW with Winchester sights. Keep your eyes open, the deals are out there.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: konabully</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just picked up a very nice pre-ban (1993) SA M1a Bush rifle for $900 at the local pawn shop. It was hardly used and and came with all USGI parts, Mostly TRW with Winchester sights. Keep your eyes open, the deals are out there. </div></div>
Awesome score!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: konabully</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just picked up a very nice pre-ban (1993) SA M1a Bush rifle for $900 at the local pawn shop. It was hardly used and and came with all USGI parts, Mostly TRW with Winchester sights. Keep your eyes open, the deals are out there. </div></div>
Awesome score!
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Hi, About Your 308 Battle Rifle,
Like you, I'm in absolute love with an M-1A Springfield. Recently, I decided to make them both an FAL & M1A opporational. While the FAL has the built-in bipod, I had to buy a Harris bipod for the M-1A.
I was struggling with standard walnut stock and elevating the comb high enough to see down a Nikon 3X9 scope. The Weaver scope mount allows the simultaneous use of the iron sights and the scope by elevating the scope high enough to make CQB iron sight use possible. I bought a cheek piece elevator which is fastened to the stock by adhesive material. I have not had her out to the range to assess how practical the new adhesive cheek piece will be. I suspect it will fail under prolonged usage. Do you know of another alternative? I heard somewhere that FAL's made a screw on cheek piece, but have not been able to track one down. Any ideas?
Have you attached optics to your FAL? It shoots very good with iron sights. I would admit a love affair with ACOG scopes which might be just what the Dr. ordered. It's ironic that the sights cost twice as much as the rifle.
I put one on an AR-15 sporter and Poof, I was sold! I've got to locate a sling for the FAL, do you have any ideas? I love the carry handle on the FAL, but for rapid usage, it's not practical. How's your rifle rigged?
Thanks, papertiger
Hi, About Your 308 Battle Rifle,
Like you, I'm in absolute love with an M-1A Springfield. Recently, I decided to make them both an FAL & M1A opporational. While the FAL has the built-in bipod, I had to buy a Harris bipod for the M-1A.
I was struggling with standard walnut stock and elevating the comb high enough to see down a Nikon 3X9 scope. The Weaver scope mount allows the simultaneous use of the iron sights and the scope by elevating the scope high enough to make CQB iron sight use possible. I bought a cheek piece elevator which is fastened to the stock by adhesive material. I have not had her out to the range to assess how practical the new adhesive cheek piece will be. I suspect it will fail under prolonged usage. Do you know of another alternative? I heard somewhere that FAL's made a screw on cheek piece, but have not been able to track one down. Any ideas?
Have you attached optics to your FAL? It shoots very good with iron sights. I would admit a love affair with ACOG scopes which might be just what the Dr. ordered. It's ironic that the sights cost twice as much as the rifle.
I put one on an AR-15 sporter and Poof, I was sold! I've got to locate a sling for the FAL, do you have any ideas? I love the carry handle on the FAL, but for rapid usage, it's not practical. How's your rifle rigged?
Thanks, papertiger
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
If you were asking for a cheekpiece for the FAL (or was it the M1A?) keep in mind that you can buy a Magpul PRS for them now.
To the OP:
About 7 years ago I bought a Polytec just for the receiver. If I would've gone the route of just using the chrome lined barrel, which was fine BTW, it would've been a cheaper build. With transfer to an FFL, shipping both ways to Geoffrey Corn at Match Armorers Shop Oakland City, IN I have about 1,500 invested. For that, this is what I have. Barnett Douglas barrel medium wt. w/ M852 chamber. HR bolt, GI trigger parts replaced, such as hammer, etc., set at 4.5 lb., NM mod to flash suppressor, repaired rear sight, and whatever else. I think that's a good price for a build on a forged receiver.
If you were asking for a cheekpiece for the FAL (or was it the M1A?) keep in mind that you can buy a Magpul PRS for them now.
To the OP:
About 7 years ago I bought a Polytec just for the receiver. If I would've gone the route of just using the chrome lined barrel, which was fine BTW, it would've been a cheaper build. With transfer to an FFL, shipping both ways to Geoffrey Corn at Match Armorers Shop Oakland City, IN I have about 1,500 invested. For that, this is what I have. Barnett Douglas barrel medium wt. w/ M852 chamber. HR bolt, GI trigger parts replaced, such as hammer, etc., set at 4.5 lb., NM mod to flash suppressor, repaired rear sight, and whatever else. I think that's a good price for a build on a forged receiver.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I still say get an AR in 223 or an AK pattern rifle. If you're still dead-set on 308 battle rifle a buddy of mine builds PTR-pattern rifles and loves them, I think he is up to 22 of them now.
I still say get an AR in 223 or an AK pattern rifle. If you're still dead-set on 308 battle rifle a buddy of mine builds PTR-pattern rifles and loves them, I think he is up to 22 of them now.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.</div></div>
For less than $200 including the bolt? Remember the $1000 limit...
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.</div></div>
For less than $200 including the bolt? Remember the $1000 limit...
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I was doing some math last night. And to setup that M14 in the pawn shop, I would be at about 2000$ getting it to where I would trust it. Thats way out of my range. Im thinking the FAL will do just fine. The M1A will have to be a special build like my Armalite next year. Well maybe even 2 years because I have to cough up 4500$ on the FD Defense rifle when it gets ready.
I would love to have a the Mini Para OSW from DSA. That gun just looks angry and tough. I dont have a Trust setup yet so thats out of the question for now. But thats the setup I want. I have made my mind up, its going to be the FAL. I think I will just start with a receiver for now, while I look for deals. I have built my AR-10, so the FAL is going to be a new experience for me. I dont have a good idea on how they are pieced together because I have not had any experience with one. So I have no idea what I need to be looking for, what kind of parts or receivers, and all that jazz. So I will be coming to you guys for advice when I cant figure out what the hell im doing.
Can we get some pictures of different setups for the FAL? Anyone build their own like an AR15? Would I be better off buying a whole, used rifle? Or taking a crack at building it? Is it any harder than building an AR15 from scratch? Thanks again guys.
I was doing some math last night. And to setup that M14 in the pawn shop, I would be at about 2000$ getting it to where I would trust it. Thats way out of my range. Im thinking the FAL will do just fine. The M1A will have to be a special build like my Armalite next year. Well maybe even 2 years because I have to cough up 4500$ on the FD Defense rifle when it gets ready.
I would love to have a the Mini Para OSW from DSA. That gun just looks angry and tough. I dont have a Trust setup yet so thats out of the question for now. But thats the setup I want. I have made my mind up, its going to be the FAL. I think I will just start with a receiver for now, while I look for deals. I have built my AR-10, so the FAL is going to be a new experience for me. I dont have a good idea on how they are pieced together because I have not had any experience with one. So I have no idea what I need to be looking for, what kind of parts or receivers, and all that jazz. So I will be coming to you guys for advice when I cant figure out what the hell im doing.
Can we get some pictures of different setups for the FAL? Anyone build their own like an AR15? Would I be better off buying a whole, used rifle? Or taking a crack at building it? Is it any harder than building an AR15 from scratch? Thanks again guys.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
Im dead set on the 308 solely for ammo continuity. I think it would be easier to stockpile ammo that way. I know 308 is expensive, but thats why I want a few 308 semis that will eat garbage ammo just fine. My Armalite will eat most ammo, but it gets dirty quick doing it. I can shoot Winchester power points all day long, but the American Eagle FMJ gums up the chamber just after 2-3 20rd mags. Not enough to cause problems or anything, but would in a SHTF scenario if I cant clean it. Thats why I want something that can sit in my truck behind my seat next to my tools and 4foot piece of 1" rebar for the same situation. Something that can collect dirt and me not have to worry about it not firing because of that dirt. I know any gun can jam, but I would like my goto "battle" rifle to have the least possibility of a misfire or jam. Anyone have any experience with a Saiga 308?
Im dead set on the 308 solely for ammo continuity. I think it would be easier to stockpile ammo that way. I know 308 is expensive, but thats why I want a few 308 semis that will eat garbage ammo just fine. My Armalite will eat most ammo, but it gets dirty quick doing it. I can shoot Winchester power points all day long, but the American Eagle FMJ gums up the chamber just after 2-3 20rd mags. Not enough to cause problems or anything, but would in a SHTF scenario if I cant clean it. Thats why I want something that can sit in my truck behind my seat next to my tools and 4foot piece of 1" rebar for the same situation. Something that can collect dirt and me not have to worry about it not firing because of that dirt. I know any gun can jam, but I would like my goto "battle" rifle to have the least possibility of a misfire or jam. Anyone have any experience with a Saiga 308?
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was doing some math last night. And to setup that M14 in the pawn shop, I would be at about 2000$ getting it to where I would trust it. Thats way out of my range. Im thinking the FAL will do just fine. The M1A will have to be a special build like my Armalite next year. Well maybe even 2 years because I have to cough up 4500$ on the FD Defense rifle when it gets ready.
I would love to have a the Mini Para OSW from DSA. That gun just looks angry and tough. I dont have a Trust setup yet so thats out of the question for now. But thats the setup I want. I have made my mind up, its going to be the FAL. I think I will just start with a receiver for now, while I look for deals. I have built my AR-10, so the FAL is going to be a new experience for me. I dont have a good idea on how they are pieced together because I have not had any experience with one. So I have no idea what I need to be looking for, what kind of parts or receivers, and all that jazz. So I will be coming to you guys for advice when I cant figure out what the hell im doing.
Can we get some pictures of different setups for the FAL? Anyone build their own like an AR15? Would I be better off buying a whole, used rifle? Or taking a crack at building it? Is it any harder than building an AR15 from scratch? Thanks again guys. </div></div>
Just FYI building a FAL is nothing like building an AR in 5.56 or .308. It is not plug and play with just a few tools, an action block, and a vise. You need specialized tools and some skill to build an FAL correctly.
In addition, if you want to build a FAL you need to be aware of the 922(r) requirements for foreign vs domestic (US-made) parts or you may accidentally commit a felony.
My advice would be either to purchase a complete DSA FAL, or have a reputable FAL gunsmith guide you on what types of components to purchase, then have the gunsmith assemble everything for you.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: GoatHead</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was doing some math last night. And to setup that M14 in the pawn shop, I would be at about 2000$ getting it to where I would trust it. Thats way out of my range. Im thinking the FAL will do just fine. The M1A will have to be a special build like my Armalite next year. Well maybe even 2 years because I have to cough up 4500$ on the FD Defense rifle when it gets ready.
I would love to have a the Mini Para OSW from DSA. That gun just looks angry and tough. I dont have a Trust setup yet so thats out of the question for now. But thats the setup I want. I have made my mind up, its going to be the FAL. I think I will just start with a receiver for now, while I look for deals. I have built my AR-10, so the FAL is going to be a new experience for me. I dont have a good idea on how they are pieced together because I have not had any experience with one. So I have no idea what I need to be looking for, what kind of parts or receivers, and all that jazz. So I will be coming to you guys for advice when I cant figure out what the hell im doing.
Can we get some pictures of different setups for the FAL? Anyone build their own like an AR15? Would I be better off buying a whole, used rifle? Or taking a crack at building it? Is it any harder than building an AR15 from scratch? Thanks again guys. </div></div>
Just FYI building a FAL is nothing like building an AR in 5.56 or .308. It is not plug and play with just a few tools, an action block, and a vise. You need specialized tools and some skill to build an FAL correctly.
In addition, if you want to build a FAL you need to be aware of the 922(r) requirements for foreign vs domestic (US-made) parts or you may accidentally commit a felony.
My advice would be either to purchase a complete DSA FAL, or have a reputable FAL gunsmith guide you on what types of components to purchase, then have the gunsmith assemble everything for you.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
If this is going to just sit in your truck with a couple loaded mags and only get taken out to be shot once in a blue moon, I would go CETME. It will take a steady diet of wolf and milsurp battlepacks all day. Its cheap enough that you don't have to worry about it when it gets scratched up and parts and accessories are available at any gunshow, cheaperthadirt, and a whole host of other places. Hell you could buy 2 of them for the price of that M1A in the pawn shop. Mags are plentiful and you can leave them loaded in your truck for as long as you please. Just lube it and work the bolt every now and then and you're good to go.
If this is going to just sit in your truck with a couple loaded mags and only get taken out to be shot once in a blue moon, I would go CETME. It will take a steady diet of wolf and milsurp battlepacks all day. Its cheap enough that you don't have to worry about it when it gets scratched up and parts and accessories are available at any gunshow, cheaperthadirt, and a whole host of other places. Hell you could buy 2 of them for the price of that M1A in the pawn shop. Mags are plentiful and you can leave them loaded in your truck for as long as you please. Just lube it and work the bolt every now and then and you're good to go.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoExpert</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.</div></div>
For less than $200 including the bolt? Remember the $1000 limit... </div></div>
All of mine have new SEI barrels and TRW bolts... the bolts are more than $200.00 so, no.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoExpert</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW, SEI and WarBird can perform a USGI bolt conversion on the original chrome lined ChiCom barrel.</div></div>
For less than $200 including the bolt? Remember the $1000 limit... </div></div>
All of mine have new SEI barrels and TRW bolts... the bolts are more than $200.00 so, no.
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
MY .02 like my L1A1 ( so does most of the warring world)
You mentioned the Cetme- the ridges in the chamber make for reliable extraction - I beleive this is true of the H&K - but forget about trying to reload them - just a thought -
while not a consideration in a shtf situation , it helps on being able to pratice .....
I am on the other side of the coin have several battle rifle in 7.62 now looking for accurate med to long range semi in 7.62- for SHTF rifle make sure u got some spare parts-
MY .02 like my L1A1 ( so does most of the warring world)
You mentioned the Cetme- the ridges in the chamber make for reliable extraction - I beleive this is true of the H&K - but forget about trying to reload them - just a thought -
while not a consideration in a shtf situation , it helps on being able to pratice .....
I am on the other side of the coin have several battle rifle in 7.62 now looking for accurate med to long range semi in 7.62- for SHTF rifle make sure u got some spare parts-
Re: .308 Battle Rifle
I see that VMPGSC. I just read some of the 922r crap. That is just more bullshit the ATF does to make things a hassle for owning these guns. I dont understand what the difference would be, its the same parts. I hate the ATF. But thanks for the info, Ill make sure to watch what Im buying. But if I get alot of DSA stuff, it will all be USA made I believe. I may just wait for a used DSA to come up with a nice price. Again thanks for the heads up, I actually was not aware of 922r being such a pain.
I see that VMPGSC. I just read some of the 922r crap. That is just more bullshit the ATF does to make things a hassle for owning these guns. I dont understand what the difference would be, its the same parts. I hate the ATF. But thanks for the info, Ill make sure to watch what Im buying. But if I get alot of DSA stuff, it will all be USA made I believe. I may just wait for a used DSA to come up with a nice price. Again thanks for the heads up, I actually was not aware of 922r being such a pain.
