358 grant 1.8

[TRAAV]

I know this is a long shot but I'm desperate!!!

I am looking for anyone that is currently set up to convert brass for this chambering. Myself and a few others are having one build and the guy that ordered or was supposed to have ordered the dies failed to do so. Now they are 20 weeks out which puts us to close to deer season.

My smith said If I can come up with some converted brass he can make me a neck sizer and seating die. I have 7WSM brass I can send you to convert.
Please if anyone is or knows of someone that is using this let me know. I am willing to pay someone to convert me some brass so I can get this up and running before deer season.

I would also be interested in purchasing or renting a set of dies for a couple weeks to do it myself.

Thanks

 

[former naval person]

I guess I can only ask, "Why bother" when you have the Whelen? Or the .358 Winchester? (As the old lady said when she heard the draft board wanted her son, "There is no accounting for taste". Good luck. And don't lose your ammo if you take a long trip to go hunting.

 

[BoilerUP]

I guess I can only ask, "Why bother"

Because Indiana has some stoooopid laws about hunting deer with centerfire rifles.

.357 or bigger bullet diameter, case length no more than 1.800", etc.

 

[biffj]

I know a number of guys who are doing .358 WSM-IN which is based on the WSM case necked up to .358 after trimming to 1.8". A friend builds Rem 700's in this cal and has probably done 150 of these and the 358 WSSM though a lot of the WSSM's have been converted to the WSM. How exactly is this cartridge any different??? Is is just a WSM shortened and necked to .358? Hornady makes dies for the WSM-IN and guys did very well last year with many deer ending up in the freezers.

Frank

 

[Runamuk]

Traav,

Can you tell me what you need exactly? One of my best friends was the guy who developed the cartridge. He has about everything necessary for a build and I'm sure will help you out. He's in TN getting married this weekend (poor bastard) but will be back in town next week.

 

[former naval person]

I agree...stoopid. Might as well do a 20mm case bored and necked to .358. What asses these lawmakers be. In Mississippi, we started with muzzleloaders...too many deer. Went to centerfire but only rifles of a type before 1900 in .45 or greater. Then original type but .35 or greater. Still too many deer. Now...on private lands (haven't gotten to Federal Public Lands yet) ANY rifle. Still too many deer. Went to one a day, any rifle, in Alabama. Going there in Mississippi next. Still too many deer. If they allowed claymores, most hunters couldn't kill one a year! A great depression would help. People ate anything they could kill back then. Hope you have success. FNP

 

[TRAAV]

I didn't make the laws Im only following them. Don't get me wrong I think they should just open up any modern rifle chambering but they haven't so this is what we have to do.

 

[7mmRM]

Runamuk,

We NEED formed brass. Like he mentioned another shooter was supposed to take care of getting dies, hydro former, etc. But he FAILed to do that and let us know this past Monday. I promptly called Hornady, the custom die fellow told me that they were not taking custom orders at the moment, that they may in July, and lead time would be 20 weeks. That puts scheduled delivery after deer season. I do plan on ordering the needed stuff to make brass and what not, but need to get something rolling soon. I've got several of these rifles to build, and of course all of the customers would like to gun them this fall.

That said, I can whip out a seater and neck sizer easily. The form dies and all that shit not so much. If I can get someone to make us up some brass for this season we would be in good shape. I have a bucket load of 7WSM brass ready for the change. I'm certainly willing to pay accordingly.

 

[Sgt K]

hello I'm new to the site. so the official name for this new round is the grant which is 1.8" .358 wsm. I emailed the the guys at BFG and they are making the guns and reloading dies, and brass. he did say they are very scarce right now, but said he would let me know when they were available. seem like pretty good guys too. responded to email within a day. good prices too. BFG Design, Wildcat Cartridge Design, Custom Barrels, Brass, Bullets and Dies. any other new info on who's building these rifles would be appreciated!

Sgt K

 

[TRAAV]

Thanks for the help we have this figured out

 

[TRAAV]

 

[TRAAV]

Well I finally got it up and running just in time for Indiana whitetail firearm season. I am running a 225 Nosler Accu Bond at 2850. Built by SOUTHERN INDIANA PRECISION.

Built on a Savage action, 24" pacnor barrel, and Bell and Carlson stock

225 Accu Bond, SAUM brass

3 shot group at 100

 

[Runamuk]

Looks good! I've seen what this round does to deer and it ain't purdy. Glad you guys got everything worked out and with a week or so to spare.

 

[TRAAV]

Looks good! I've seen what this round does to deer and it ain't purdy. Glad you guys got everything worded out with a week or so to spare.

Thanks for your help

 

[BoilerUP]

That looks badass...you know, for a bastard wildcat forced upon us by DNR.

So how exactly is SAUM brass (I presume 300SAUM?) manipulated to achieve that?

 

[7mmRM]

Runamuk indeed thanks for your help!

Boiler,
The short of it is-
shortening the case
Series of form dies
Hydro form.
After all that its fire form time.

We had to scab together a set of of dies and they are far from optimal. That said the rifles are shooting great! Once we got the velocity and BC straightened out, Traav and I both made 1st rnd hits at 650 and 800. That big 225 @2850 packs some ass down range!

 

[7mmRM]

Here's my rifle.

Trued Rem 700.
M24 contour PacNor @26"
B&C Light Tactical
Badger M5 w/ Alpha WSM mag
Cerakote in graphite black
Scope is a Bushnell G2DMR

Couple groups during final load development.

Quite a difference in unfireformed vs fireformed.

 

[ksthomas]

Stupid laws from stupid legislators, and a creative solution that stays well within the letter of the law while basically solving the problem. Major pain in the ass, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do! Good answer, and good luck with the project.

 

[TRAAV]

+1 on being a major pain in the ass but all said and done I'm glad I did it.

 

[neeltburn]

Looking good guys. Ill be waiting for pics on Saturday!

 

[George63]

Stupid laws from stupid legislators, and a creative solution that stays well within the letter of the law while basically solving the problem. Major pain in the ass, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do! Good answer, and good luck with the project.

from the numbers it looks like this exceeds the performance of most 30-06 loads, so they are only prohibiting a hunter with less means from using a high power rifle

 

[XTREM HTR16]

I've got a 358 IDC (Indiana Deer Cartridge) built on a model 70 WSSM action. Getting 2,550 to 2,600 with a 200 grain Hornady Interlock. This WSM based cartridge looks very interesting. Bet you could get a 180 or 200 grain TTSX going!

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Is Redding making custom dies for this yet?

 

[TRAAV]

The only ones I know of is Hornady and they are not taking custom orders right now (last I checked)

 

[TRAAV]

I've got a 358 IDC (Indiana Deer Cartridge) built on a model 70 WSSM action. Getting 2,550 to 2,600 with a 200 grain Hornady Interlock. This WSM based cartridge looks very interesting. Bet you could get a 180 or 200 grain TTSX going!

I haven't messed with any 200's but the guys that developed the cartridge pushed a 200 Accu Bond to 3000. The 225's shoot so good Im not sure that I will mess with the 200's (other than availability)

 

[bohem]

The wildcatter in me is salivating at this even though I really have no need for it with PA's rifle laws, it's just cool.

 

[Runamuk]

WELL?

Where's the death and destruction?

Gun season doesn't last forever

 

[TRAAV]

WELL?

Where's the death and destruction?

Gun season doesn't last forever

Well I have only taken a BIG ass doe. Im still holding out waiting for a big buck

My brother in law did take this Saturday with my rifle at 250 yards. 165"

 

[7mmRM]

If Traav would have let me shoot an 8pt!

 

[TRAAV]

If Traav would have let me shoot an 8pt!

leave those little ones alone

 

[Runamuk]

Nice Buck, and that is a "Big ass doe"!

7mmRM---that 8pt will start looking better and better the closer it gets to the end of gun season.

How did the cartridge perform for you?

 

[TRAAV]

Both DRT

 

[7mmRM]

Its really a white tailed cow elk!

 

[AKONA]

Nice you got that figured out.
I was going to tell you contact Mike Mirili from Dtech. He might have some dies as he builds IN legal hunting ARs.
I am surprised these are hard to find as they are becoming very popular in Indiana.

I am actually looking into the 358 based on the 308w bolt face but to shoot from the AR15 and w/o going with the larger shank.
Any experience with the hoosier or similar?

Thanks.

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Traav, that is a huge doe and one heck of a buck! Got me considering buying a 700 or 70 in a WSM and building next years IN deer rifle!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TRAAV]

Get with 7mmRM.(southern indiana precision ) He built three this year and all three hammer. We are getting some really good velocity with the 225's.

 

[7mmRM]

Nice you got that figured out.
I was going to tell you contact Mike Mirili from Dtech. He might have some dies as he builds IN legal hunting ARs.
I am surprised these are hard to find as they are becoming very popular in Indiana.

I am actually looking into the 358 based on the 308w bolt face but to shoot from the AR15 and w/o going with the larger shank.
Any experience with the hoosier or similar?

Thanks.

I have no direct experience with the Hoosier, but have a reamer ordered. I feel its a "good value" for the Indiana hunter who wants more range than slugger, ML, 44 Mag, etc, wants to keep it pretty simple with brass and use standard bolt face actions or an AR upper.

 

[AKONA]

I have no direct experience with the Hoosier, but have a reamer ordered. I feel its a "good value" for the Indiana hunter who wants more range than slugger, ML, 44 Mag, etc, wants to keep it pretty simple with brass and use standard bolt face actions or an AR upper.

Many thanks for your feedback.
I have a truck load of spent 308w brass so the whole idea is to use the 308w and other 308w bolt face brass and also value pack 357 pistol bullets for 200yard practice.
I thin the issue is the hoosier would have to be a tad short chambered to be optimal in the AR15 platform. But it will give superior performance to the 35 rem. and 357/44 automag and/or mag obviously.
But if someone is considering this with new brass a very nice and simple option would be to shortchamber a 358 norma magnum. With the 284 brass this will make a perfect round close to the WSSM
but in the 308 bolt face. The dies are simple, 358 norma mag cut to 1.7 OAL. This will be perfect 180, 200 bullets and even the sierra 225gr.
But first I want to get a 308w based in the 358/357 going. Indiana or not it makes sense at the average range we hunt here in the northern woods. The wounding those stubby 357/358 bullets make
are brutal in any grain and I think it would be a fun choice vs 6.8 and others.

 

[precision308]

Nice travis

 

[7mmRM]

Killed a few deer with the 358 over the weekend.

When I put this rifle together and after load & range testing. I came up with a goal of a 600 yard deer kill.

Friday evening, ' Hide me member 308Skinner and I did just that. Skinner was on the spotter. Ranged a nice doe @ 617 yards. Put 3.9 mils on the scope. Wind was dead. Held for high shoulder impact. Sent it. That big ass 225 Accubomb found the mark as intended. The doe went exactly 2ft... straight down! Good stuff!

Killed another yesterday with Traav @160.... standing offhand! Boiler room insertion, ran 20 yards.

 

[neeltburn]

Killed a few deer with the 358 over the weekend.

When I put this rifle together and after load & range testing. I came up with a goal of a 600 yard deer kill.

Friday evening, ' Hide me member 308Skinner and I did just that. Skinner was on the spotter. Ranged a nice doe @ 617 yards. Put 3.9 mils on the scope. Wind was dead. Held for high shoulder impact. Sent it. That big ass 225 Accubomb found the mark as intended. The doe went exactly 2ft... straight down! Good stuff!

Killed another yesterday with Traav @160.... standing offhand! Boiler room insertion, ran 20 yards.

Awesome! Congrats.


Sent from my IPhone 5S.

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Definitely sounds like a worthwhile spring project!

 

[TRAAV]

I took a doe at 523 with mine new years eve.

 

[TRAAV]

A couple more fell victim to the 358 Grant. 7mmRM and I took the last night at 418 and 363 both DRT

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Can a model 70 WSSM action be used for this, or does it have to be a WSM or SAUM?

 

[cowboywhorses]

Nice job guys , love the reading material. That is one bad asssss thumper for deer.

 

[BoilerUP]

What's the recoil like with this cartridge...seems like it'd be pretty stout?

What kind and how much powder are you guys running, if you don't mind sharing?

 

[TRAAV]

Recoil isn't terrible but if your position is a little jacked up it will bounce you off target pretty good.

We are using 56.5 grains of benchmark.

 

[TRAAV]

Can a model 70 WSSM action be used for this, or does it have to be a WSM or SAUM?

Send 7mmRM a pm about that. I can't answer it.

 

[TRAAV]

Now that the indiana deer season has came to a end I thought I would post how the Southern Indiana Precision built 358 Grant 1.8 preformed. There were a total of 6 deer taken ( 3 by me, 2 by my brother in law, and 1 by a youth taking his first deer). I was using a 225 grain accu bond at 2850 fps. Ranges were 60, 241, 298, 303, 363 and 523 yards. All first round hits with clean kills.