458 Socom

[Rustybroadhead]

I don't have kids, but I have two nephews who I take shooting as often as I can. They are great kids and both of them are pretty mechanically inclined. I mentioned building an AR15 with them and they were very excited about it. Problem is... I already have several of them in 223 and 300blk.... I have wanted to build a 458 Socom but I have never done a big bore. Just wanted to hear from guys that had built them and see if there are any pitfalls or anything special I needed to do or not do. Also wanted to find out if there was a good source for loading data out there....

Thanks!

 

[Spblademaker]

https://www.snipershide.com/shootin...58-socom-and-50-beowulf.6890621/#post-7140533

Some of my load info. I highly recommend going with Tromix barrel and bolt combo. Also purchase their case gauge. Lyman has 458 load data, as does Nosler.

 

[Strykervet]

I've heard a lot of people say they have problems with that particular cartridge, I don't see why that one. It's bottlenecked, it would seem to me to work fine. But that's what other people say. Ejection problems and recoil issues mostly, so I guess the bottleneck isn't really the issue. The .458 also isn't as powerful as some other options but does have a cool name.

I have a .50 Beowulf that I got from Bill Alexander 15 years ago to test for my unit (all that's another story in and of itself). Our idea was to keep an upper in the Stryker under the seat in a case for the SDM to use for breaching or barrier penetration at road barricades. They decided the turret mounted M2 was enough and training made up for the lack of spending on SDM gear at the time.

Anyway, I got an upper and KAC sent us 3 different FF rails and I got the long one and sent it to them to put on the upper they were gonna send us. He sent it along with a couple hundred rounds of FMJ. Holy shit was that thing powerful. Punched through 3A armor, jug of water, pair of cinder blocks, shattered those, a giant railroad tie and was recovered several inches in the ground. This was from maybe 10m. It did that three times and I still have the giant disc shaped slugs.

It never failed to work. We put it on an M4 lower and played with it on burst. But you'd only do that one time. Recoil is like a 12ga. A fixed A2 or A1 stock is best, an A5 next to that and finally something heavy like a SOPMOD or B5 stock and the appropriate buffer (I forget which one is in there). I got to keep it, they didn't want it back, and since it wasn't in inventory army didn't want it either. I demo'd it for the War College when they visited and low and behold, the Coast Guard DID buy the Beowulf to take out small boats and outboard motors and for boarding. I like to think I helped with that but I'll never know.

The max range is really 100m but you can stretch it to 200. It drops a lot between there and after that it's more like a mortar round. A .500 S&W actually has ever so slightly more power, believe it or not, but I don't think there is anything more powerful in an AR. Any upper/lower will do but I bet a VLTOR MUR would be ideal, and maybe a 7075 billet lower with a lot of meat in the rear where the buffer tube threads in. Mine is just on forged parts though and it's fine. I guess it depends on how much you use it. It's easy to load for and fairly inexpensive but it does wear out brass sorta fast and you'll always lose a few cases out of every hundred for this or that. I imagine any big bore will do that though.

SBR'ing one would be fun, a 12" ideally, but the 16" I have is just awesome when it comes to power. It's one to consider. Rainier Ballistics is the company that makes one of the OEM bullets for the mfg. A 334gr. plated flat tip. Mushrooms to a flat disc bigger than a silver dollar, razor sharp and retains decent weight. They're plated, but Rainier plates these and their 124gr. 9mm bullets just as thick as regular jackets. They're cheap and certainly do the job. Someone makes a tungsten core bullet for it IIRC, I have the load data for it from the factory. Tungsten in a .50 AR... They also fire pretty much all the .500 S&W bullets too and then some. I have some Gold Dots to load for it. It's pretty versatile.

Well, that's it. Bill Alexander is responsible for introducing me to two rounds early on, this and the 6.5Grendel and I have to say that both are the best in their class. He really knows how to push an AR to it's performance limits. Sorry for going so long.

 

[Sniperwannabee]

If you get a complete upper from radical firearms you will have 0 problems and then you can build the rest of it for fun
https://www.joeboboutfitters.com/Radical-Firearms-Complete-458-SOCOM-Uppers-s/149197.htm

 

[Spblademaker]

Stay the hell away from Radical. Their feed ramps are cut like shit. Poorly profiled and nothing but sharp edges. Also their chambers are not cut properly. I owned one. Nothing but issues. Don’t believe me, do some research. I’m sure there are some people who have had luck with them. Why risk it?

https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Radical-Firearms-458-SOCOM-uppper-any-experience-/118-718333/

 

[Sniperwannabee]

hmmm 0 problems with mine and out of 91 reviews it has 4.8 out of 5 stars.

 

[Spblademaker]

hmmm 0 problems with mine and out of 91 reviews it has 4.8 out of 5 stars.

Because no website censors what they post. Not my money to spend. Feel free to purchase what you like. Some get lucky. Some are shit. There is zero reason for any manufacturer to release such a hit-or-miss product.

Primary arms hasn’t had them in stock for a while. The reviews on there are more true to life.
Big Bore knows his shit with this caliber
https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/-458-Socom-issues/121-715779/

 

[Velocity Chad]

I love my 458. I have a kak barrel and bcg. Shoots excellent, and couldn't beat the price. Keep in mind you will need to mill out the ejection port unless you buy an upper specific for big bores. Aero makes one.

 

[Rustybroadhead]

Thanks everybody for the input. Strykervet, sounds like you were really on the very front edge of the big bore ARs. That is a really cool story and I appreciate you sharing it. My biggest reason for considering the 458 Socom over the other similar cartridges is that I already own a Sico Hybrid so I can shoot it suppressed. There are lots of bullet choices in the 400-600 grain range and that is an enormous hunk of subsonic lead! My nephews and I both really enjoy the subsonic stuff....

 

[sht4brnz]

http://www.teppojutsu.com

https://tromix.com

in case you weren't already aware of the above sites.
Because the 458 hasn't been an approved saami cartridge there are some manufacturers that vary in chamber dimensions. Not a big problem if you load your own, just something to consider.

 

[Stevo86]

My brother has a black rain 458 socom. It’s a no feeding piece of shit, the feed ramp looks like it was cut with a grinder.

 

[Strykervet]

Thanks everybody for the input. Strykervet, sounds like you were really on the very front edge of the big bore ARs. That is a really cool story and I appreciate you sharing it. My biggest reason for considering the 458 Socom over the other similar cartridges is that I already own a Sico Hybrid so I can shoot it suppressed. There are lots of bullet choices in the 400-600 grain range and that is an enormous hunk of subsonic lead! My nephews and I both really enjoy the subsonic stuff....

Oh, well that's different. If you got a can for it I totally get it and I think that caliber is easier to suppress than mine is. I'd like to just port the barrel I have, it's not threaded. Something to tame the recoil. I wish I still had the short video we shot of us firing that damn thing on burst. It was actually kinda funny. Nobody could really control it. So I'd get a brake for when you're not using the can for sure. Half the fun with these is firing the full power stuff. You'll get a kick out of it for sure.

I'd also talk to someone about firing full power ammo and subs in the same rifle like that and see what they say about cycling. That's the only real concern about those I remember, cycling, so if you can avoid any problems that'd be in your favor. Hopefully someone with a .458 who does the same thing will chime in. You could also put it in the suppressor section and see what turns up.

I guess I was on the front end, but what happened was it was the tail end of the Cliton ban and after almost ten years of bullshit, engineering turned towards smaller compacts and big bore everything else. There were .50 Glocks and 1911's coming out, Beowulf, SOCOM and a few others. If you couldn't have 30 rounds then damn it, the 10 you can have better be as big as possible. That was the sentiment. 9/11 happened too and every mfg. on planet Earth was sending us free gear. Free gear! I mean good stuff too. KAC, Surefire, AA, etc., etc. First Magpul mag I saw was a case of freebies this squad leader asked for. Call or send a letter and a sample was on the way. Wear BDU's to a gunshow and you'd walk away with some free stuff too. It was nice companies helped soldiers out like that at that time, there wasn't any real new gear around then. The ban ended, the wars continued, tons of new stuff came out, and everything went back to a new normal.

I forget where I saw it or exactly what it was, but it's like a .458 but in an AR10 frame and it'll blow the doors off the SOCOM and Beowulf, and it'll handle some heavy subs too. I wish I could remember what it was. Kinda like a .450 Marlin or a .458 Win. Magnum and it was touted as the most powerful AR10. Used regular unaltered mags but I think the capacity was diminished some.

 

[Velocity Chad]

Oh, well that's different. If you got a can for it I totally get it and I think that caliber is easier to suppress than mine is. I'd like to just port the barrel I have, it's not threaded. Something to tame the recoil. I wish I still had the short video we shot of us firing that damn thing on burst. It was actually kinda funny. Nobody could really control it. So I'd get a brake for when you're not using the can for sure. Half the fun with these is firing the full power stuff. You'll get a kick out of it for sure.

I'd also talk to someone about firing full power ammo and subs in the same rifle like that and see what they say about cycling. That's the only real concern about those I remember, cycling, so if you can avoid any problems that'd be in your favor. Hopefully someone with a .458 who does the same thing will chime in. You could also put it in the suppressor section and see what turns up.

I guess I was on the front end, but what happened was it was the tail end of the Cliton ban and after almost ten years of bullshit, engineering turned towards smaller compacts and big bore everything else. There were .50 Glocks and 1911's coming out, Beowulf, SOCOM and a few others. If you couldn't have 30 rounds then damn it, the 10 you can have better be as big as possible. That was the sentiment. 9/11 happened too and every mfg. on planet Earth was sending us free gear. Free gear! I mean good stuff too. KAC, Surefire, AA, etc., etc. First Magpul mag I saw was a case of freebies this squad leader asked for. Call or send a letter and a sample was on the way. Wear BDU's to a gunshow and you'd walk away with some free stuff too. It was nice companies helped soldiers out like that at that time, there wasn't any real new gear around then. The ban ended, the wars continued, tons of new stuff came out, and everything went back to a new normal.

I forget where I saw it or exactly what it was, but it's like a .458 but in an AR10 frame and it'll blow the doors off the SOCOM and Beowulf, and it'll handle some heavy subs too. I wish I could remember what it was. Kinda like a .450 Marlin or a .458 Win. Magnum and it was touted as the most powerful AR10. Used regular unaltered mags but I think the capacity was diminished some.

45 raptor would be AR10 variant. If I didnt have all the socom stuff I would look into going that way. 375 raptor might be next auto though.