6.5 Creedmoor - Rem 700 PCR vs Tikka T3x + MPA BA Chassis

[rubenhak]

Hi Everybody,

I'm trying to build my first long range rifle. Decided to go with 6.5 Creedmoor. Ended up with following options. The base rifle:
a) Remington 700 PCR - https://www.remington.com/rifles/bolt-action/model-700/model-700-pcr
b) Tikka T3x LITE - JRTXE382 - http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-lite
c) Tikka T3x LITE STAINLESS - JRTXB382 - http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-lite-stainless

Remington PCR seems to be pretty new and could not find many reviews and comparison with Tikka. Though some had opinion that Tikka barrel is more precise. Although Remington guarantees sub MOA for 700 PCR with a factory test included with each rifle, while Tikka guarantees 1 MOA accuracy. I would appreciate comments on the rifle choice.

I will upgrade the chassis to MasterPiece Arms BA or BA Competition models. (https://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa-ba-chassis or https://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa-ba-competition-chassis) so the specifics of grip, stock and whatever would be replaces by the new chassis is insignificant.

What would be the benefits of stainless steel model for Tikka? Is it work the difference of $200? How about the MPA Chassis models, is the Competition model worth $75?

One more question regarding chassis compatibility. MPA web site was pretty clear that it was compatible with Remington Short-Actions and Tikka T3 short-actions. Would the chassis be compatible with Tikka T3X?

Regarding the muzzle break. Remington has threaded barrel which makes it easy to add muzzle break. Though it was not clear about thread size. Anyone knows the thread size and can recommend some muzzle breaks? How about Tikka T3x, does it have threaded barrel or it uses screw-on attachment?

Thanks in advance,
Ruben

 

[jpspeeddemon]

Tikka's have a more well designed action w/ a 70 degree bolt throw (Remington has a 90 degree), the Tikka action smoother than a Remington, they are better made w/ better QA/QC, and are more accurate than Remingtons in most cases. You should look at the Tikka T3x CTR in 6.5cm because that model has the heavier barrel and is designed for long range shooting.

 

[rubenhak]

Got it, for Tikka, it would be T3x CTR model (not Lite). Remington has something called 5R rifting which they claim would make it more accurate. How would compare that with Tikka barrels?

Which muzzle break would you recommend for Tikka T3x CTR?

Would I be able to replace the chassis on Tikka just like I would do with Remington? My understanding is that I wouldn't need professional to do that.

 

[rubenhak]

Tikka's have a more well designed action w/ a 70 degree bolt throw (Remington has a 90 degree), the Tikka action smoother than a Remington, they are better made w/ better QA/QC, and are more accurate than Remingtons in most cases. You should look at the Tikka T3x CTR in 6.5cm because that model has the heavier barrel and is designed for long range shooting.

Also, for Tikka T3x CTR, would you recommend stainless model? If not, why?

 

[rubenhak]

I started to think about getting barreled action instead. Couldnt find Tikka. but instead found Howa 1500. What do you think about it?
https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...531.aspx?avs|Cartridge_1=BCC_6xzzx5+Creedmoor

 

[gac700]

Remington 700 SPS Barreled Action 6.5 Creedmoor 22" 86503
SKU: 86503-Remington
Buy one of those from EuroOptic and drop it into your MPA.
You could drop it into a KRG Bravo for a very cost effecient package.

 

[mgrs]

I do not think the stainless tikka would be worth the premium over the blued model unless you plan to spend a lot of time in bad weather with it or the finish appeals to you. The Tikka will have a very smooth action in either that is easy to operate quickly.

The howa action will be well manufactured and finished with a hammer forged barrel. It will have stronger extractor mechanism than the M700 and the HACT trigger it comes with is great for the price. Chassis availability for the howa will be lower than the Tikka or M700, but not hard to find.

 

[jpspeeddemon]

mgrs is right on.

I had a Howa 6.5 barreled action and ran it for a couple matches. It was very accurate and well made and ran fine, but i just switched to a Tikka CTR and love it. The Tikka bolt is smoother and faster w/o a question; i really like the 70 degree bolt lift vs the 90 degree. Accuracy between the Howa and Tikka is the same, both a very accurate. I shot both for groups at 100 yards with Hornady Match 140 and 147 eLDMsand they're 0.5 moa guns with that ammo.

 

[rubenhak]

Remington 700 SPS Barreled Action 6.5 Creedmoor 22" 86503
SKU: 86503-Remington
Buy one of those from EuroOptic and drop it into your MPA.
You could drop it into a KRG Bravo for a very cost effecient package.

I was more leaning towards Tikka or Howa, but Tikka is impossible to find.

A dumb question. Regarding the chassis. Are they really different for each action manufacturer? So if I get MPA for Howa, I would only be able to use Howa actions on it?

 

[rubenhak]

I do not think the stainless tikka would be worth the premium over the blued model unless you plan to spend a lot of time in bad weather with it or the finish appeals to you. The Tikka will have a very smooth action in either that is easy to operate quickly.

The howa action will be well manufactured and finished with a hammer forged barrel. It will have stronger extractor mechanism than the M700 and the HACT trigger it comes with is great for the price. Chassis availability for the howa will be lower than the Tikka or M700, but not hard to find.

For Tikka barreled action a small shop quoted me $500 more than what Howa would cost. Do you think smoothness is worth the price? What would be other best chassis for Howa except for MPA?

 

[rubenhak]

mgrs is right on.

I had a Howa 6.5 barreled action and ran it for a couple matches. It was very accurate and well made and ran fine, but i just switched to a Tikka CTR and love it. The Tikka bolt is smoother and faster w/o a question; i really like the 70 degree bolt lift vs the 90 degree. Accuracy between the Howa and Tikka is the same, both a very accurate. I shot both for groups at 100 yards with Hornady Match 140 and 147 eLDMsand they're 0.5 moa guns with that ammo.

What would be the effect on smoothness? Reloading half a second faster? I'm not sure that I'd be going for competitions, so I guess it would be less important.

Another question is how easy it would be to sell Howa vs Tikka.

 

[rubenhak]

The howa action will be well manufactured and finished with a hammer forged barrel. It will have stronger extractor mechanism than the M700 and the HACT trigger it comes with is great for the price. Chassis availability for the howa will be lower than the Tikka or M700, but not hard to find.

Didn't you have issues with the trigger being too hard? I've seen some cutting a bit from the spring to make it softer.

 

[jpspeeddemon]

I thought the Howa HACT trigger is very good. Its a 2-stage and breaks crisp. The Tikka trigger is a single stage and breaks a bit crisper which i prefer, but both are very good.

 

[patriot07]

For Tikka barreled action a small shop quoted me $500 more than what Howa would cost. Do you think smoothness is worth the price? What would be other best chassis for Howa except for MPA?

What barrel was on that action? Not long ago, you could get closeout T3 models for under $500, which included the entire rifle (stock, mag, and all).

I think your small shop may be off base...unless it comes with a CTR or Varmint barrel maybe?

 

[rubenhak]

What barrel was on that action? Not long ago, you could get closeout T3 models for under $500, which included the entire rifle (stock, mag, and all).

I think your small shop may be off base...unless it comes with a CTR or Varmint barrel maybe?

It was Tikka T3x CTR 6.5 Creedmoor 24" they asked $935. For only $60 i could get entire rifle here: https://www.eurooptic.com/Tikka-T3x-CTR-65-Creedmoor.aspx
So yes, I guess they are off base.

 

[BCP]

You could get one of the ruger chassis rifles in 6.5 creedmoor they are affordable by all accounts shoot well.

If you get the Tikka and stick it in a chassis take a good look at KRG.

 

[stello1001]

If you're dead set Remmy vs Tikka, take the Tikka. If the Howa comes in to play and it's a candidate, disregard the Remmy again. I own a Howa and it is extremely accurate and well made. Id buy another one. Both the Tikka or the Howa will serve you well. You could build a nice precision rifle off a Howa BA for less and it would still compete with rifles costing more. Good luck on your decision!

 

[rubenhak]

If you're dead set Remmy vs Tikka, take the Tikka. If the Howa comes in to play and it's a candidate, disregard the Remmy again. I own a Howa and it is extremely accurate and well made. Id buy another one. Both the Tikka or the Howa will serve you well. You could build a nice precision rifle off a Howa BA for less and it would still compete with rifles costing more. Good luck on your decision!View attachment 6975357

I just ordered Howa simply because couldn't find Tikka barreled action for a reasonable price. For $500 difference I can get a decent scope.

What else would i need? For the scope I was thinking to go with "Vortex Optics Viper HS-T SFP 6x24-50". Anything else you can recommend?
For muzzle brake liked Area 419 Hellfire. Though its more on a expensive side.
Not sure about the scope mount though. Would any mount sit on Howa?

 

[stello1001]

What's your scope budget? I honestly had a weaver tactical 3-15 on it and truly regret selling it. It had a very outdated reticle but it worked fine and got the job done for me. I never ever had a viper like the one you mentioned but when I bought my weaver I picked it over those first gen vipers because many people said the weaver had much better glass. Honestly, the glass for me was really good. There's still many many more options.

Are there any particular features you personally prefer? And again, optics budget???

 

[rubenhak]

What's your scope budget? I honestly had a weaver tactical 3-15 on it and truly regret selling it. It had a very outdated reticle but it worked fine and got the job done for me. I never ever had a viper like the one you mentioned but when I bought my weaver I picked it over those first gen vipers because many people said the weaver had much better glass. Honestly, the glass for me was really good. There's still many many more options.

Are there any particular features you personally prefer? And again, optics budget???

Scope budget is around $650, so Vortex viper is on top of the list. I'd want 24x zoom, ideally 30x but that would definitely be outside my budget. Otherwise I might consider getting used as well.

From features most probably it would be SFP. I'm planning to do hunting. Not sure what other features can a scope have. Could you give some examples?

Another option i consider is Nikon Black X1000.

 

[rubenhak]

If you're dead set Remmy vs Tikka, take the Tikka. If the Howa comes in to play and it's a candidate, disregard the Remmy again. I own a Howa and it is extremely accurate and well made. Id buy another one. Both the Tikka or the Howa will serve you well. You could build a nice precision rifle off a Howa BA for less and it would still compete with rifles costing more. Good luck on your decision!View attachment 6975357

btw, that a really nice looking rifle! Why did you decide to not to use a muzzle break?

 

[stello1001]

At the time I bought mine, Howas were not selling with threaded muzzle nor threaded bolt knobs. It seems now they are. If my barrel was threaded, I'd probably get a break for it but I don't feel the need for it. I hunt with it mostly and shoot steel every now and then.

Features can include:

Illumination
SFP or FFP
10 mil turrets or 5 mil turrets
Glass quality
Zero stop
Rev indicator for your turrets
Threaded for sunshade
Parallax adjustment range (where it starts from, 35 yards, 50 yards, 75 yards, etc.)

I honestly would recommend the weaver tactical over the viper. For your intended ranges, you won't need more than 12X. You can get the weaver tactical in 4-20 or 3-15.

 

[rubenhak]

At the time I bought mine, Howas were not selling with threaded muzzle nor threaded bolt knobs. It seems now they are. If my barrel was threaded, I'd probably get a break for it but I don't feel the need for it. I hunt with it mostly and shoot steel every now and then

Illumination - YES
SFP or FFP - SFP
10 mil turrets or 5 mil turrets - 1/4MOA should be sufficient which is just a little finer than 10mil
Glass quality - as good as it can be within the budget
Zero stop - YES
Rev indicator for your turrets - not sure what that is
Threaded for sunshade - YES
Parallax adjustment range (where it starts from, 35 yards, 50 yards, 75 yards, etc.) - The scope I was thinking has 50 - infinity range. I'm anyways going to shoot 100+ yards with this rifle. What difference does the lowest range provide?

 

[stello1001]

Illumination - YES
SFP or FFP - SFP
10 mil turrets or 5 mil turrets - 1/4MOA should be sufficient which is just a little finer than 10mil
Glass quality - as good as it can be within the budget
Zero stop - YES
Rev indicator for your turrets - not sure what that is
Threaded for sunshade - YES
Parallax adjustment range (where it starts from, 35 yards, 50 yards, 75 yards, etc.) - The scope I was thinking has 50 - infinity range. I'm anyways going to shoot 100+ yards with this rifle. What difference does the lowest range provide?

People sometimes like the parallax adjustment to start very low like at 25 or maybe 35 yards. These people are usually using their scopes on rimfire rifles like a .22 where they engage on targets at very short distances. Some might like a parallax adjustment that goes down low because they hunt with it, that would be me. I get deer pop up on me sometimes at 30 yards. At that range, on a deer sized target, it doesn't matter much. I can be off a bit and still hit the vitals tho.

May I ask why you prefer second focal plane reticle vs first focal plane? A SFP reticle will only have true subtensions on max mag whereas a FFP will have true subtensions throughout the whole magnification range.

 

[rubenhak]

May I ask why you prefer second focal plane reticle vs first focal plane? A SFP reticle will only have true subtensions on max mag whereas a FFP will have true subtensions throughout the whole magnification range.

My primary use would be at the range. So I don't see a need to zoom reticle with the object. By giving this up I will have thin reticle which would not "obstruct" the view at the maximum zoom level. Does this make sense?

 

[mgrs]

I just ordered Howa simply because couldn't find Tikka barreled action for a reasonable price. For $500 difference I can get a decent scope.

What else would i need? For the scope I was thinking to go with "Vortex Optics Viper HS-T SFP 6x24-50". Anything else you can recommend?
For muzzle brake liked Area 419 Hellfire. Though its more on a expensive side.
Not sure about the scope mount though. Would any mount sit on Howa?

Wow, this developed quickly. I just did this build off one of the 6.5 creedmoor 1500 barreled actions from brownells but have not shot it yet and might never after falling into a deal on a multi-caliber rifle. Pretty slick setup though for right around $1k. It is a good time to be into this hobby:

It has a NF 20 moa mount.

 

[rubenhak]

Wow, this developed quickly. I just did this build off one of the 6.5 creedmoor 1500 barreled actions from brownells but have not shot it yet and might never after falling into a deal on a multi-caliber rifle. Pretty slick setup though for right around $1k. It is a good time to be into this hobby:

View attachment 6975519
It has a NF 20 moa mount.

This rifle is looking good. What was the deal with multi-caliber rifle?

 

[mgrs]

Just used on the PX here.... you can find some excellent deals on great lightly used equipment on this site.

 

[stello1001]

My primary use would be at the range. So I don't see a need to zoom reticle with the object. By giving this up I will have thin reticle which would not "obstruct" the view at the maximum zoom level. Does this make sense?

I get what you're saying about the reticle getting thick at higher power in a FFP scope. However, SFP scopes usually have the reticle as thick as it gets on a FFP. So for example, if X scope is manufactured in both SFP and FFP, the SFP model will have the reticle as thick as it gets on the FFP when magnification is zoomed up all the way. I'm not saying this is always the case. Usually tho, it is.

Anyhow, in SFP, I really don't know what to recommend. For $500.00 bucks, you can get a weaver tactical 3-15x50 which has amazing glass for that price point. It will be more than enough to get you out to 1000 yards. For a little bit more, you can get the illuminated reticle version. Of course these are FFP models tho!

 

[rubenhak]

I get what you're saying about the reticle getting thick at higher power in a FFP scope. However, SFP scopes usually have the reticle as thick as it gets on a FFP. So for example, if X scope is manufactured in both SFP and FFP, the SFP model will have the reticle as thick as it gets on the FFP when magnification is zoomed up all the way. I'm not saying this is always the case. Usually tho, it is.

Anyhow, in SFP, I really don't know what to recommend. For $500.00 bucks, you can get a weaver tactical 3-15x50 which has amazing glass for that price point. It will be more than enough to get you out to 1000 yards. For a little bit more, you can get the illuminated reticle version. Of course these are FFP models tho!

I guess I would go with FFP. Vortex PST Gen 2 really catches my attention.

Bit off topic. how to post in trading subforum? It requires "For Sale Forum *Note* You must have Full Member Status and a complete profile in order to post items for sale. "

 

[CaptNemo]

Look at the Athlon scopes as well. @gr8fuldoug is THE hook up for the ‘Hide.

 

[stello1001]

PST gen 2 should be a very solid contender. Never looked through it but I don't doubt it's good. Try to look for one in the PX used so you don't have to pay as much. Show us pics of your build as it's coming along!

 

[jpspeeddemon]

https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/vortex-gen-1-pst-6-24-ffp-mrad.6911168/

 

[rubenhak]

https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/vortex-gen-1-pst-6-24-ffp-mrad.6911168/

This is Gen1 scope, and I'm looking for Gen2. Vortex made some significant improvements on Gen2.

Also, opticsplanet sells same scope for the same price as the seller. I'm generally fine with buying used stuff, if the price difference is significant.

 

[Jaman]

Hi Everybody,

I'm trying to build my first long range rifle. Decided to go with 6.5 Creedmoor. Ended up with following options. The base rifle:
a) Remington 700 PCR - https://www.remington.com/rifles/bolt-action/model-700/model-700-pcr
b) Tikka T3x LITE - JRTXE382 - http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-lite
c) Tikka T3x LITE STAINLESS - JRTXB382 - http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-lite-stainless

Remington PCR seems to be pretty new and could not find many reviews and comparison with Tikka. Though some had opinion that Tikka barrel is more precise. Although Remington guarantees sub MOA for 700 PCR with a factory test included with each rifle, while Tikka guarantees 1 MOA accuracy. I would appreciate comments on the rifle choice.

I will upgrade the chassis to MasterPiece Arms BA or BA Competition models. (https://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa-ba-chassis or https://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa-ba-competition-chassis) so the specifics of grip, stock and whatever would be replaces by the new chassis is insignificant.

What would be the benefits of stainless steel model for Tikka? Is it work the difference of $200? How about the MPA Chassis models, is the Competition model worth $75?

One more question regarding chassis compatibility. MPA web site was pretty clear that it was compatible with Remington Short-Actions and Tikka T3 short-actions. Would the chassis be compatible with Tikka T3X?

Regarding the muzzle break. Remington has threaded barrel which makes it easy to add muzzle break. Though it was not clear about thread size. Anyone knows the thread size and can recommend some muzzle breaks? How about Tikka T3x, does it have threaded barrel or it uses screw-on attachment?

Thanks in advance,
Ruben

Thanks for starting this tread. I am going through the same decision process.

 

[rubenhak]

Thanks for starting this tread. I am going through the same decision process.

I eventually ended up getting Howa 1500 barreled action for unbelievable price ($400) at a time, now brownells are selling it for $550: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...hreaded-heavy-barreled-action-prod103531.aspx and married it to MPA Competition Chassis.

If you wait a week or so, I will get the scope bolted and share the pictures.