6.5 Grendel Bolt action.

[CarbonMTN]

I've been doing a ton of research on the 6.5 Grendel and its what I'm going to dive deep into. Would love to do a Custom rifle but I need to get to basics before I go spend the big bucks. So help me please choose a factory bolt gun.

CZ Varmit or CZ MTR, I LOVE a mauser action but I have never owned a CZ and from what I've read, scope rings are a CZ propitiatory so I may be limited to what scope I use.

Lack luster Ruger predator.

Howa 1500 in a Bravo chassis. I dont know that much about Howa, I know a lot of folks recommend them on this forum. But a friend of mine says they are cheap for a reason and he would NEVER buy one.

please help me out!!!!

Thank you!!!!!

 

[XLR308]

Here's a review of a Howa HCR that Frank did, you be the judge.
If that's the way a cheap rifle shoots were all doing something wrong then.

https://www.snipershide.com/howa-hcr-6-5cm-review/

 

[lou400a]

I don't think you can get Bravo in mini chassis for the Grendel

 

[CarbonMTN]

Here's a review of a Howa HCR that Frank did, you be the judge.
If that's the way a cheap rifle shoots were all doing something wrong then.

https://www.snipershide.com/howa-hcr-6-5cm-review/

Thats like comparing Ruger RPR to a predator.... 1500 is not the HCR

Again, if its so good and its almost $300+ dollars cheaper than the RPR why are people not using it in PRC, NRL, or any other competition?

 

[CarbonMTN]

I don't think you can get Bravo in mini chassis for the Grendel

KRG says howa 1500. ill have to give them a call after shot show.

 

[BR7.62]

will the mini action restrict oaverall cartridge length or any thing?
i was looking at one to do a 223 ackley but ended up using a 700 instead.
your buddy is entitled to his opinion of course but i
love my 308 howa, shoots really nice.
i have a cz 527 grendel w/ a skinny barrel not super impressed w/ it w/ hornady hunting ammo.

 

[JC0352]

The new Howa Oryx rifle is offered in a mini action. Not sure when they’re available though.

https://www.legacysports.com/catalog/howa/howa-oryx/

 

[stilesg57]

I have both a Howa mini and a CZ 527 in Grendel. Get the Howa unless you’re mounting it on a wall for looks.

My 527 has a nice trigger (adjustable and adjusted over the course of an evening, has a set trigger from the factory), a decent barrel, great looks, and a garbage action and factory stock. You can (and I have) replace the latter; you’re stuck with the former.

The Howa mini action is limited to AR15 COLs. It’s substantially shorter than a short action. Action screw spacing is different and will not fit the Bravo unfortunately.

For what you’re talking about, Howa HCR is the ticket until going custom.

 

[CarbonMTN]

The new Howa Oryx rifle is offered in a mini action. Not sure when they’re available though.

https://www.legacysports.com/catalog/howa/howa-oryx/

hhmmm.. I think we have a winner!

 

[stilesg57]

 

[CarbonMTN]

I have both a Howa mini and a CZ 527 in Grendel. Get the Howa unless you’re mounting it on a wall for looks.

My 527 has a nice trigger (adjustable and adjusted over the course of an evening, has a set trigger from the factory), a decent barrel, great looks, and a garbage action and factory stock. You can (and I have) replace the latter; you’re stuck with the former.

The Howa mini action is limited to AR15 COLs. It’s substantially shorter than a short action. Action screw spacing is different and will not fit the Bravo unfortunately.

For what you’re talking about, Howa HCR is the ticket until going custom.

As far at accuracy, because you have both, are they the same or does one out shoot the other.

garbage action, how, i love the mauser action, I think its one of the best.

I dont know all gun lingo yet so what is AR15 " COLs "

 

[CarbonMTN]

How is Howa's warranty since they are imported through a 3rd party? would i have to deal with howa or legacy?

 

[CarbonMTN]

will the mini action restrict oaverall cartridge length or any thing?
i was looking at one to do a 223 ackley but ended up using a 700 instead.
your buddy is entitled to his opinion of course but i
love my 308 howa, shoots really nice.
i have a cz 527 grendel w/ a skinny barrel not super impressed w/ it w/ hornady hunting ammo.

have you tried other ammo, or is it not a MOA shooter? I really cant wait to try 107gr T- SMK, from what I read it does really well.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Thats like comparing Ruger RPR to a predator.... 1500 is not the HCR

Last I checked the HCR is literally just the standard 1500 barreled action thrown in a chassis.

 

[JC0352]

How is Howa's warranty since they are imported through a 3rd party? would i have to deal with howa or legacy?

I would say @Matt @ LSI could get you squared away but I’ll bet he’s busy at SHOT this week.

 

[stilesg57]

As far at accuracy, because you have both, are they the same or does one out shoot the other.

garbage action, how, i love the mauser action, I think its one of the best.

I dont know all gun lingo yet so what is AR15 " COLs "

I've got about 500 rounds through the CZ. It's not bad by any means, but the skinny barrel heats up quickly and it starts throwing shots when it does. Shoots 1 MOA 3-round groups and 2 MOA 5-round groups if you know what I mean. I've only got 200 rounds through the Howa but so far it's a hair more accurate, even with the trigger in its out-of-box state and not as nice as the CZ's that I've adjusted. Nothing earth shattering, but a quarter MOA or so tighter and doesn't seem to open up quite as much with a few rounds worth of heat even though its barrel is also skinny. Both are wearing similar, 12x glass btw.

Dude I hear you on the action design, I got the CZ first because I LOVE Mausers and I'm a controlled-round-feed snob. This action is really rough though and not fun to cycle at all, let alone trying to work it quickly (holy binding batman). The Howa is like butter by comparison, and one of the smoothest bolts I own. If you want to see more documentation about my experiences and others, search my handle over on the Grendel forums in the bolt action section.

COL is Cartridge Overall Length. AR15 limits the COL basically to .223 length because that's the dimensions of the STANAG magazine. This is one of the primary limiting factors for cartridges designed to fit in AR length actions (the Grendel basically has the same COL as the 223/556, as does the 6.8 SPC, 24 Sharps, 22 Nosler, 224 Valk, etc). The Howa Mini action may allow a little longer (higher BC, seated further out) COL handloads than an AR will run, but it definitely isn't long enough to fit short-action class cartridges like the .308 and its relatives.

Note that this may not be the case in short actions that just chamber the Grendel but are still short-action sized, like the Ruger American. Those guns don't have the awesomely short bolt throw, shorter overall length with the same barrel and lighter weight of a true mini/micro action though.

How is Howa's warranty since they are imported through a 3rd party? would i have to deal with howa or legacy?

Not sure but I believe Legacy. To be frank though, I'd be amazed if you ever need it; the Howa 1500 is solid.

 

[stilesg57]

Save your money and just build the custom rifle now, with a 6.5 Grendel barrel.
...
Once you've got 6.5Grendel out of your system, you just need to add your "forever" barrel.

There's some truth to that. The Grendel is so awesome...that you'll almost immediately want a Creedmoor, ha. My Howa was $435 though and the CZ just $560 (plus another $135 for a new stock), so I can't complain about the money I have in the rifles compared to the custom route. And one (the Howa) is meant purely as an ultralight mountain rifle, so no need to go custom for that purpose anyway.

 

[CarbonMTN]

There's some truth to that. The Grendel is so awesome...that you'll almost immediately want a Creedmoor, ha. My Howa was $435 though and the CZ just $560 (plus another $135 for a new stock), so I can't complain about the money I have in the rifles compared to the custom route. And one (the Howa) is meant purely as an ultralight mountain rifle, so no need to go custom for that purpose anyway.

Don't want a creedmoor. just like I dont own a AR. its just not for me. I like what the Grendel offers,maybe a 22 Grendel. but for the matches that are here in northern Nevada they only push to 800 yards so I figure I would get a kick if i would play with the big boys with a little Grendel.

 

[CarbonMTN]

Save your money and just build the custom rifle now, with a 6.5 Grendel barrel.

Bighorn TL3
MPA Chassis
TT trigger
McGowan Savage style prefit with the barrel nut loctited and a set screw drilled into it. 20" 1:8" $450

123 Scenars going 2630fps with 30.3gr of TAC loaded on a Dillon 550 and throwing charges. Pretty much neck and neck with a .308 for ballistics.

Once you've got 6.5Grendel out of your system, you just need to add your "forever" barrel.

Oh man, drooling already. I just dont have the funds to go that route and the extra money I do have is going to get me into reloading.

But my dream build from my best guess would cost upward of $3k or more(?) not to mention trying to find a trust-able gunsmith around me.

Mausingfield or TL3
Proof Research Bull 24" + my omega 300
Timney 2 stage
wiskey 3

 

[Supersubes]

I bought two Howa mini barreled actions from Brownells. One is a Grendel, and will become a 6mm grendel soon. Waiting on my reamer and the Krieger blank. So far the Mini’s seem just as nice as their big brothers. Very well priced, and a lot of nice features. Perfectly sized for the Grendel sized cases as well.

 

[CarbonMTN]

TL3 - $1250
MPA - $900
Barrel - $450
Trigger - $200

$2800

PS - I have a Timney 2 stage with a small defect that Timney will probably fix for next to nothing that I might let go for pretty cheap. I also have a PVA 6mm Creed that I'd let go for $500.

Yes I see the pricing but how much is a gunsmith going to charge me? Don't barrels just come blank and still need to be cut, threaded, and chambered?

 

[XLR308]

Thats like comparing Ruger RPR to a predator.... 1500 is not the HCR

Again, if its so good and its almost $300+ dollars cheaper than the RPR why are people not using it in PRC, NRL, or any other competition?

Last I checked the HCR is literally just the standard 1500 barreled action thrown in a chassis.

It's my understanding that they are the same hammer forged barrels as the 1500 so yes it is essentially the same just without the chassis, a chassis for most people is a highly individualized decision and I doubt most would opt for the HCR chassis based on looks alone but it seems to be pretty damn effective.
As far as the mini action I wouldn't personally want to be hamstrung with the AR-15 mags or limited coal especially in a bolt action.
Brownells has a sale going on for the Howa mini barreled action in 65G with 20" heavy barrel and muzzle threads for $359.99.

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...ed-heavy-barreled-mini-action-prod113624.aspx

 

[CarbonMTN]

It's my understanding that they are the same hammer forged barrels as the 1500 so yes it is essentially the same just without the chassis, a chassis for most people is a highly individualized decision and I doubt most would opt for the HCR chassis based on looks alone but it seems to be pretty damn effective.
As far as the mini action I wouldn't personally want to be hamstrung with the AR-15 mags or limited coal especially in a bolt action.
Brownells has a sale going on for the Howa mini barreled action in 65G with 20" heavy barrel and muzzle threads for $359.99.

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...ed-heavy-barreled-mini-action-prod113624.aspx

I saw the sale but then shot show happened and they are releasing this THING.

 

[CarbonMTN]

I've got about 500 rounds through the CZ. It's not bad by any means, but the skinny barrel heats up quickly and it starts throwing shots when it does. Shoots 1 MOA 3-round groups and 2 MOA 5-round groups if you know what I mean. I've only got 200 rounds through the Howa but so far it's a hair more accurate, even with the trigger in its out-of-box state and not as nice as the CZ's that I've adjusted. Nothing earth shattering, but a quarter MOA or so tighter and doesn't seem to open up quite as much with a few rounds worth of heat even though its barrel is also skinny. Both are wearing similar, 12x glass btw.

Dude I hear you on the action design, I got the CZ first because I LOVE Mausers and I'm a controlled-round-feed snob. This action is really rough though and not fun to cycle at all, let alone trying to work it quickly (holy binding batman). The Howa is like butter by comparison, and one of the smoothest bolts I own. If you want to see more documentation about my experiences and others, search my handle over on the Grendel forums in the bolt action section.

COL is Cartridge Overall Length. AR15 limits the COL basically to .223 length because that's the dimensions of the STANAG magazine. This is one of the primary limiting factors for cartridges designed to fit in AR length actions (the Grendel basically has the same COL as the 223/556, as does the 6.8 SPC, 24 Sharps, 22 Nosler, 224 Valk, etc). The Howa Mini action may allow a little longer (higher BC, seated further out) COL handloads than an AR will run, but it definitely isn't long enough to fit short-action class cartridges like the .308 and its relatives.

Note that this may not be the case in short actions that just chamber the Grendel but are still short-action sized, like the Ruger American. Those guns don't have the awesomely short bolt throw, shorter overall length with the same barrel and lighter weight of a true mini/micro action though.



Not sure but I believe Legacy. To be frank though, I'd be amazed if you ever need it; the Howa 1500 is solid.

Is your CZ the American or the varmint?

 

[XLR308]

I saw the sale but then shot show happened and they are releasing this THING.

That's nice looking rifle and seems to be everything you were looking for ?

 

[CarbonMTN]

OR, OR! do I just just get the cheapest one (Ruger) just to get me into the caliber and save for a custom one? But will the Ruger be a shooter or more of a MOA+

 

[CarbonMTN]

That's nice looking rifle and seems to be everything you were looking for ?

I am leaning towards this option but how long before it hits market.... I don't want to wait like I did for the Tikka T1x.. thing was shown at 2018 SHOT and you still cant get your hands on them today.

 

[XLR308]

I am leaning towards this option but how long before it hits market.... I don't want to wait like I did for the Tikka T1x.. thing was shown at 2018 SHOT and you still cant get your hands on them today.

Not sure what the package price would be or availability but if you look on their website the chassis is in stock and the barreled action offered is the same one on sale at Brownells.

 

[CarbonMTN]

Not sure what the package price would be or availability but if you look on their website the chassis is in stock and the barreled action offered is the same one on sale at Brownells.

Price for the Mini action is $1059.. so maybe my dealer could get it for less.

 

[XLR308]

If you just bought the chassis from MDT and the barreled action from Brownells your a $759.99 for the same package. Just a thought

 

[Supersubes]

I saw the sale but then shot show happened and they are releasing this THING.

I have one of those Brownells mini Grendel’s, and the Oryx should be on the doorstep any time now.

 

[Kadams1563]

I would rather get into a regular short action For a Grendel.

Everything is available for short actions and nothing for mini actions.

Regardless of what you see for yourself now it will change after you get into this for awhile. You start shooting 800 yards with the Grendel and your going to want a larger caliber soon. Just wind alone is going to be a challenge.

I thought I was gonna be happy with a full custom build off of a Savage action. Then I thought I would have been happy with a full custom build on a defiance action in a manners. Now I think I’m gonna be happy with an Impact action in a Foundation.

You get my drift?

 

[CarbonMTN]

I have one of those Brownells mini Grendel’s, and the Oryx should be on the doorstep any time now.

post pics when you can please!

 

[Bender]

The RPR shoots lights out. Great starter gun

 

[CarbonMTN]

The RPR shoots lights out. Great starter gun

Its not in Grendel, unless I get it re-barreled and that's not my money....

 

[wes1]

I had two 6.5 Grendel bolt guns built before the factory options existed.
Love them...WTO is building me a 6 Grendel on a T3

 

[stilesg57]

My CZ527 is the American.

Gotta admit, that Oryx in a mini action looks siiiiiiiiiiick.

Also Kadams1563 is right all around. The mini action has a deliciously short throw, a shorter overall length, and a little less weight (the felt effect of those attributes is in that order, btw). If those aren’t very important to you/this build, go short action because it gives you so many more options.

 

[CarbonMTN]

So I asked my wife her opinion, she doesn't know much other than I don't need another one. She likes the Ruger for the color and they way it looks..... so it got me thinking why not the Predator?

I mean, its got a thin-ish barrel , crummy factory trigger (would replace with Timney 1.5# ), and a lack luster chassis.

On the plus side its got a pic rail (CZ does not), 22" barrel (Howa 20"), best customer cervices out there, all of my Rugers (I got 5) are all 1-MOA or better and its a cheap rifle just to get me into the caliber to see if its worth taking Grendel to the next level (custom).

Magpul american hunter chassis??? PMAGS that come with it wont work but will a modified AICS (like this) mag work or will it not cycle correctly because of the way the predator bolt it cut?

 

[Kadams1563]

You asked your wife about what gun to get???

You have already lost your mind and the ruger will fit you.

 

[CarbonMTN]

You asked your wife about what gun to get???

You have already lost your mind and the ruger will fit you.

Just looking at all my options.

 

[CarbonMTN]

I had two 6.5 Grendel bolt guns built before the factory options existed.
Love them...WTO is building me a 6 Grendel on a T3

Who built yours?

 

[wes1]

The Stiller/MPA/Benchmark was built by Steve Lentz, formally of Beaver CO.( Fun fact, it's an exact clone of my 6.5 GAP)
The Tikka/Christensen/McM was built by S&S Precision out of Denton TX.

 

[ilmonster]

Wes1, that McMillan stocked Grendel is making me drool.... Are you using the full size AICS type magazine with the spacer in the rear to make it feed reliably?

 

[wes1]

Yes. I use the Primal Rights BR kits.....all feed perfectly

 

[hlee]

What is your use case for the 6.5 grendel?

I have 2 grendels and one 6.5 creedmoor. I love the grendels for what they are (light weight, semi-auto, ACCURATE rifles). But, they are not a 6.5 creedmoor. My "match" grendel has a 22 inch JP barrel and shoots hornady factory ammunition (123 gr ELD-M) at 2562 (avg) and is a 0.5 MOA gun when I screw up. Where I typically shoot (near sea level) that keeps me comfortably super-sonic out to about 950 yards. My other grendel is an 18 inch Odin Works barrel that is boringly accurate, but not quite as much so as the JP. It is decidedly lighter weight and is my deer hunting rifle.

My 6.5 creedmoor is a Ruger Precision rifle and shoots hornday match ammunition (147 gr ELD-M) at 2700 fps. That keeps the bullets comfortably super-sonic well past 1200 yards. This rifle is quite possibly a bet less accurate on the 100 yard line than my match grendel, bit makes up for that at distance. At 900 yards, the creedmoor requires 1 mil less wind correction for a 10 mph wind and 2.9 mils less elevation correction.

The JP grendel is a fantastically fun gun to shoot and I have shot it in competitions. But, there are targets that are just out of reach (our local match can extend out to 1200 yards) and I have to keep my expectations reasonable when really reaching out there. Additionally, when the wind kicks up, those little bullets really get pushed around- and with my wind calling skills I can really get my butt handed to me by mother nature. The low recoil and semi-auto action makes up for some of the shortcomings, as I find it easier to keep on target than a bolt action. (I realize that this is not strictly germain as you are looking for a bolt action grendel, but I throw it out there none the less.) The semi-auto is also lighter and handier than the RPR which makes it less not fun to lug around.

If I were looking for commonality of ammunition in my motley assortment of firearms, I think I would look at a bolt action grendel. But, for performance (especially competitive performance) I would- and did- stick to the short action in a bolt rifle.

If you really want a grendel, buy/build it for what it is. The wind will eventually kick its ass and gravity ALWAYS wins, but it is still a fun and capable caliber.

 

[mcfred]

This action is really rough though and not fun to cycle at all, let alone trying to work it quickly (holy binding batman).

Oil the bolt and work it a while watching a movie or two. It gets a lot better. My 527 American was horrible when new but it's almost my favorite action now. I have maybe 1500 rounds through the action and far more cycles dry-firing.

The metallic Howa Mini hardware is also impressive, especially if you replace the trigger spring to a lighter one. The Mini though, I hate the magazine catch and rubber stock/floor plate. Luckily, there are solutions to those issues now. By the time you "fix" the Mini you're in it for more than the CZ but at least you get a 1911 rail option and a higher capacity magazine.

 

[CarbonMTN]

My CZ527 is the American.

Would you know if the 527 varmint has a true "Heavy barrel" I mean Ruger says its a heavy "tapered" barrel, to me Rugers is a mild thin barrel.