6.5 SLR Chambering
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I'm doing my M2013 in 6.5SLR (also going to cut a 6mm SLR barrel for it), and [MENTION=22700]RyeDaddy[/MENTION] is thinking of a 6.5SLR barrel on his m2013.
Anybody else want in???
I'm going to have Chad @ LRI chamber mine under the group buy he's currently running.
Dies come from either Whidden or Robert Whitley (ARX Enterprises) at 6mmar.com. The ones from Robert are Redding, and are available in both 6mm SLR and 6.5mm SLR. Whidden only offers the 6mm SLR version, but he can hone out the neck to make it a 6.5mm.
I have the Redding dies from Whitley and have formed a number of cases, but can give no feedback on how well they work in relation to the chambering reamer - and how they chamber/extract. I'm (fingers crossed) sure hoping the sizing die and chamber reamer are a good match. My intent is for this to be a match rifle and I sure don't want to deal with tight chambering or sticky extraction.
Here is a picture of 3 6.5SLR cartridges loaded with 142 sierras @ 2.920" COAL in an AW magazine. The SLR fits the AW magazine famously.
I'm doing my M2013 in 6.5SLR (also going to cut a 6mm SLR barrel for it), and [MENTION=22700]RyeDaddy[/MENTION] is thinking of a 6.5SLR barrel on his m2013.
Anybody else want in???
I'm going to have Chad @ LRI chamber mine under the group buy he's currently running.
Dies come from either Whidden or Robert Whitley (ARX Enterprises) at 6mmar.com. The ones from Robert are Redding, and are available in both 6mm SLR and 6.5mm SLR. Whidden only offers the 6mm SLR version, but he can hone out the neck to make it a 6.5mm.
I have the Redding dies from Whitley and have formed a number of cases, but can give no feedback on how well they work in relation to the chambering reamer - and how they chamber/extract. I'm (fingers crossed) sure hoping the sizing die and chamber reamer are a good match. My intent is for this to be a match rifle and I sure don't want to deal with tight chambering or sticky extraction.
Here is a picture of 3 6.5SLR cartridges loaded with 142 sierras @ 2.920" COAL in an AW magazine. The SLR fits the AW magazine famously.
Which reamer you going with turbo? After my M2013 in 308 is finished Im building a 6.5SLR on a Deviant.
My reamer is close to the 6.5mm SLR/S, but not quite.
I changed the freebore to .050", which'll put a 139 scenar on the lands @ 2.800", so the reamer can cut chambers for an AR10, or throated out deeper for other applications. (I additionally have 6, 6.5 and 7mm throaters).
I changed the neck diameter to .298" from .295" because after loading 15-20 dummy rounds using winchester 243win brass, I found a few @ .295", and I wanted to be sure I'd never ever have to sort/cull/neckturn brass if I didn't want to. Most winnie 243win brass necked up to 6.5mm will measure .291".
Lastly, my reamer's neck is straight, no taper. The LR/S reamer has .001" taper in the neck.
I changed the freebore to .050", which'll put a 139 scenar on the lands @ 2.800", so the reamer can cut chambers for an AR10, or throated out deeper for other applications. (I additionally have 6, 6.5 and 7mm throaters).
I changed the neck diameter to .298" from .295" because after loading 15-20 dummy rounds using winchester 243win brass, I found a few @ .295", and I wanted to be sure I'd never ever have to sort/cull/neckturn brass if I didn't want to. Most winnie 243win brass necked up to 6.5mm will measure .291".
Lastly, my reamer's neck is straight, no taper. The LR/S reamer has .001" taper in the neck.
I've made up my mind on it, definitely going with the 6.5 SLR with the M2013. Gonna order a reamer tomorrow with a .298 no taper neck like Turbo54's but with .120" freebore. If my math is right that should have me at ~2.87" COAL with the 140 AMAX, and ~2.920" with 140 VLD's. Perfect for AW mags, and enough room to chase the lands as the throat wears. I'm planning on using Lapua 260 Rem brass because I have a bunch already, and loaded rounds measure .295" at the case mouth, so a .298" neck makes sense, I'm not into fiddling with brass.
This Super LR thing is really picking up steam lately, and I can see why. Biggest turn off in wildcats is availability of parent brass and (ghasp) fireforming, neither of which is a problem with the SLR's. Really can't wait to get this going.
For the original question, I'm going to call Mark Gordon at SAC tomorrow to make sure my reamer specs make sense and have him do the chambering. I'll be ordering some of the Redding dies from 6mmAR.
Turbo- do you have the base-ogive length for those 142's at 2.920" OAL?
This Super LR thing is really picking up steam lately, and I can see why. Biggest turn off in wildcats is availability of parent brass and (ghasp) fireforming, neither of which is a problem with the SLR's. Really can't wait to get this going.
For the original question, I'm going to call Mark Gordon at SAC tomorrow to make sure my reamer specs make sense and have him do the chambering. I'll be ordering some of the Redding dies from 6mmAR.
Turbo- do you have the base-ogive length for those 142's at 2.920" OAL?
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[MENTION=22700]RyeDaddy[/MENTION]
Tomorrow afternoon I'll double-check your measurements/arithmetic on throating. Offhand, I think that sounds about right. I think I was planning on ~.130" FB for my chamber, also fed via AW mags.
ETA: I'm not sure you want to mess with Lapua brass for this one. You really push the shoulder back quite a ways, and a lot of shoulder becomes neck. You may be looking at a neckturning being required. I know you will if you start with Lapua 243 brass, not really sure what you'll be dealing with using Lapua 260 brass. Definitely play with it a bit before vesting yourself in the high-dollar brass!
[MENTION=27418]lencomatt[/MENTION]
Chad doesn't have an SLR reamer or GO gage, so he'll be using mine. I'll have to check with him if I should send along my 6.5mm throating reamer, or if he prefers to use his own.
Tomorrow afternoon I'll double-check your measurements/arithmetic on throating. Offhand, I think that sounds about right. I think I was planning on ~.130" FB for my chamber, also fed via AW mags.
ETA: I'm not sure you want to mess with Lapua brass for this one. You really push the shoulder back quite a ways, and a lot of shoulder becomes neck. You may be looking at a neckturning being required. I know you will if you start with Lapua 243 brass, not really sure what you'll be dealing with using Lapua 260 brass. Definitely play with it a bit before vesting yourself in the high-dollar brass!
[MENTION=27418]lencomatt[/MENTION]
Chad doesn't have an SLR reamer or GO gage, so he'll be using mine. I'll have to check with him if I should send along my 6.5mm throating reamer, or if he prefers to use his own.
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Here's a couple more pictures to whet ya'lls whistle:
260 case, 6.5SLR with hornady 140hpbt @ 2.950, 6.5SLR-->7mm with 162amax @ 2.950... The SLR cases are winnie 243win, passed through the sizing die set to .001" under the GO gage.
Closeup of the 6.5mm dummy cartridge, fluffed/buffed with some scotchbrite. Again, never fired as an SLR...243 brass sized in an SLR die.
260 case, 6.5SLR with hornady 140hpbt @ 2.950, 6.5SLR-->7mm with 162amax @ 2.950... The SLR cases are winnie 243win, passed through the sizing die set to .001" under the GO gage.
Closeup of the 6.5mm dummy cartridge, fluffed/buffed with some scotchbrite. Again, never fired as an SLR...243 brass sized in an SLR die.
One more thought:
If someone was willing to fireform, and deal with (slightly) custom dies, I think a nice improvement to the SLR case would be to decrease it's body taper to .005"/inch like the Creedmoor. The SLR retains standard x08 body taper of ~.011"/inch. I haven't run the numbers to see what case capacity advantage this would provide, but it should provide another 25-50fps.
Redding sells the sleeve blanks for their competition seating dies for ~$15. You'd have to have your gunsmith or a machinist to use your chambering reamer to cut the sleeve blank for you.
Dave @ Pacific will make you a sizing die reamer and supply you with a die blank for $150. The gunsmith/machinist would then have to use that reamer to cut your sizing die.
Perhaps more effort/bother than most people want to deal with.... Just saying.
If someone was willing to fireform, and deal with (slightly) custom dies, I think a nice improvement to the SLR case would be to decrease it's body taper to .005"/inch like the Creedmoor. The SLR retains standard x08 body taper of ~.011"/inch. I haven't run the numbers to see what case capacity advantage this would provide, but it should provide another 25-50fps.
Redding sells the sleeve blanks for their competition seating dies for ~$15. You'd have to have your gunsmith or a machinist to use your chambering reamer to cut the sleeve blank for you.
Dave @ Pacific will make you a sizing die reamer and supply you with a die blank for $150. The gunsmith/machinist would then have to use that reamer to cut your sizing die.
Perhaps more effort/bother than most people want to deal with.... Just saying.
Sounds like Ryes reamer is exactly what Im chasing. Turbo - Chad is happy to chamber it up for the M2013 without the receiver? Or are you hoping the 2 week action finally arrives?
Doing that right now. Sent the barrel off for clambering Sat. I should be receiving the Whidden dies about the same time I get the barrel back.
To do this I opted for 2 sets of sizing dies one pre-fire forming and the second for post fire forming. The bullet seating die is the Whidden custom die for the improved case.
I am toying with the idea of a 7mm based off of my 6.5 slr improved variation to fill the gap between my 284 Shehane and 6.5 slr improved. I expect that as a 7mm variant it will have measurably longer barrel life and greater terminal performance all in a short action. It might very well become my new favorite lr target and hunting short action chambering.
I'll have to see how the improved case shoots and extracts (my real concern) before I double down.
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I just ordered the reamer from JGS, they quoted 20 weeks. Ouch, I should have planned this better.
EDIT: Scratch the above, ordered a carbide reamer from PTG. Cheaper and they quoted 4-6 weeks. Being that I don't have the action yet that will be fine. I'm sure JGS makes a fine product, but 20 weeks is just too damn long for me right now.
EDIT: Scratch the above, ordered a carbide reamer from PTG. Cheaper and they quoted 4-6 weeks. Being that I don't have the action yet that will be fine. I'm sure JGS makes a fine product, but 20 weeks is just too damn long for me right now.
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Consider using PTG. They worked with Whitley to begin with. JGS got involved only after Dave @ PTG refused to make reamers for Whitley, on account of Whitley copying Dave's print into JGS format.
PTG is taking 6-8 weeks on standard orders, and for $240 (the price of a JGS reamer), you can have it in your hands this week.
I don't know if Chad would cut the chamber without the action. My guess is no, particularly because the action is brand new, hot off the press. It would also mean the engraving couldn't be clocked into the correct position.
Yes, I'm going off a hope/prayer BO will actually deliver the fucking action sometime relatively soon. On one hand their delay(s) have really irked me. On the other hand, I have a background in design/manufacturing and know that it's difficult to make *anything*. Even more difficult to make something *good*. More difficult yet when you involve a beauracracy - especially a government one - especially when it involves guns.
Ultimately, BO has established the respected name in the industry for a reason. They're good people, with good product. They'll deliver, and it won't be too much longer.
Also, it works to my advantage I'm far down on the group buy list. Chad taking a week off to go hang out at the SHC is also good news for me!
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How much did Whidden get for altering the sizing die?
Any reason you didn't wait until you had some fireformed cases to send to whidden?
The 7mm version intrigues me as well. Being the self-proclaimed "Mr. 7mm" I feel like a jackass doing the 6mm and 6.5mm version instead of a 7, but when I shoot matches with my 284, I feel that I'd be better off *much* of the time with a lighter recoiling rifle.
I'm really curious to hear how your project goes. I understand Whitley's intent was no fireforming, or perhaps he would have applied the same improvement we're talking about. It seems worthwhile - just gotta get the extraction right.
Whidden is doing a new custom die. For a set (Bushing FL Sizer/Micrometer Seater Die) it was $169.99 plus shipping.
Whidden Gunworks
I asked them which would be better and I got the impression that there was no difference (although I always thought it was better to have a fire formed case supplied). I sent them the same reamer drawing that I am using for the reamer and they said they would create one from scratch from that. Plus I should be able to have everything together at the same time.
The fire forming should be just as easy as the 284 Shehane, just load up a lighter bullet and reduced power charge at an accuracy node. The 284 shoots bug holes with the suppressor on and sub moa without, so I expect this will perform similarly.
If I had been thinking I would have gotten three or so reamers with incrementally less taper so I could find one with the least amount of taper but still reliably extract, by just chambering with each reamer on a cheap barrel until I hit the wall on easy extraction.
I did a comparative spreadsheet that took several cartridges and compared total taper as a measurement and as a ratio of the case body length vs. the Taper, before settling on the Ackley minimum. I found the minimal body taper in Mr. Ackley's book... we shall see if I hosed it. Off the top of my head I don't recall what it was.
This will either be a home run or a swing and a miss.
The 6mm and 6.5 are extremely light recoiling calibers even when shooting the "heavy" 140 grain Bergers.
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I have a ton of 243 lapua brass, and can't beg borrow or steal any 243 win, so I guess I will be using the Laupa and neck turning it... Just one more step in my usual prep process.
Tag... Have a 6.5 I'm trying to figure out what to do with in the LRI group buy...
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