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Range Report 6GT Project/Range Report
- Thread starter NorCal Vu
- Start date
Awesome, thanks for the info. Should be getting my barrel anytime now.
Just because bored.
Left-Hornady 6gt
Middle-6x47 lapua
Right-Lapua 6gt
Left-Hornady 6gt
Middle-6x47 lapua
Right-Lapua 6gt
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6.5x47 through Gt die without bushing
Then with a .271 and a .268
Run though neck turning mandrel
Turn neck on lathe
Trim in giraud
Run in die with .265
Mandrel up with .242 mandrel
None of it was hard. I timed it. 3-5min per piece without optimizing any step yet.
I have a Henderson trimmer and an IDOD neck turning on order. Those combined should speed things up even more.
I might offer 6gt lapua brass in the future to anyone interested. Just need to test it out a bit. As it stands, 6% less case capacity than hornady.
I might offer 6gt lapua brass in the future to anyone interested. Just need to test it out a bit. As it stands, 6% less case capacity than hornady.
which will most likely result in a fuller case..better velocity with less powder and pressure...curious to hear what you think.
5 sacrificial/test lapua 6gt
Hornady on left for comparison. I’m not looking to go above 2950. So, *hopefully* it works fine.
Going to just load 31gr varget. Debating if I should barely jam lands or just jump .020. Just to get an initial fireform.
Hornady on left for comparison. I’m not looking to go above 2950. So, *hopefully* it works fine.
Going to just load 31gr varget. Debating if I should barely jam lands or just jump .020. Just to get an initial fireform.
Seems like a lot of work.
Interested in seeing what advantage/improvement
You find over the Hornady.
I'm sure the optimized process and equipment will help get the time down if you keep doing it from Lapua brass. With anything like that though, you gotta ask "what's my time worth?" Even if you could get that down to 2min per case (doubtful with all the touch time listed), that's only 30 pcs/hr. So if your free time is only worth $15/hr then you could charge $0.50/pc for the conversion. If it was me, I'd be charging $3/pc minimum, which no one would pay. And the thought of someone ordering 1000 cases to be converted would be enough for me to want to jump out a window lol
For reference, I think places like Hunts charge $0.50/pc just for a single hyrdoform op, and I believe IDOD was saying he might offer a single ID/OD neck turn for $0.75-0.95/pc.
Ya, it wouldn’t be $2-2.50 each if I supply brass and $1-1.50 for supplied brass. Somewhere in that area. Definitely wouldn’t be hydroformed price.
Like Jeff Foxworthy said: I'd rather slam my DICK in a sliding glass door than go back in that house, lol. Referring in this case to doing all that work on the Lapua brass!
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Seems like a lot of added time for possibly minuscule results. If you figure you usually need around 500pc or more for a good lot to shoot matches and what not. That’s almost 17 hours of work. I mean, if the only brass available was shit like Federal and Winchester it would be different but both Hornady and Alpha are quality brass makers. Me personally would rather save the time and shoot more. Beside, if the GT turns out to be as hot has it’s proclaimed to be in sure Lapua will jump on the wagon if they see the market for it.
A lot of people can’t get alpha to run without pressure. Hornady seems good so far.
This is why I’m “upgrading” to Henderson. I like my Giraud a lot. Bit when you do a ton of brass every year, holding the case by hand gets old.
Not to mention the setup. By the time you buy several cutter heads. You have spent as much or more than a Henderson in price.
With varget, I got extraction issues all the way down to 2780 or so with 31.7gr of varget. Same result across three barrels.
I didn’t keep track of the brass lot numbers (shouldn’t have to for $1.15 per). So it’s possible there’s a bad lot out there. There’s posts on FB weekly about similar issues.
I bought 700 Alphas late last year, didn’t record the lot #. Didn’t start showing any pressure until around 3060-3070fps with Varget & 109 Hybrids.
Settled on this load, it’s been consistent and a hammer. BC is .304, trued at 1200yds.
CCI 450 (BR-4 average about 15fps slower)34.9 Varget-109 Hybrids
Settled on this load, it’s been consistent and a hammer. BC is .304, trued at 1200yds.
CCI 450 (BR-4 average about 15fps slower)34.9 Varget-109 Hybrids
When I did initial ES testing from 34.0-35.0 in .2 increments I didn’t have any issues.
It showed up later. Have cleaned all barrels and made sure all prep is the same. This points more to a soft lot. I believe SamB is seeing similar pressure signs earlier. Several posting on FB about it.
It showed up later. Have cleaned all barrels and made sure all prep is the same. This points more to a soft lot. I believe SamB is seeing similar pressure signs earlier. Several posting on FB about it.
What are people running 108 eld’s at velocity wise with H4350?
I loaded 37.3, 37.5, 37.7, 37.9, 38.1 and shot them today. A few groups were great but had fliers (possibly me) the numbers were also not that great. Lowest SD I was able to achieve was 5.7
velocity was 2940 at 37.3 up to 3040 at 38.1.
29” barrel and Alpha brass.
I loaded 37.3, 37.5, 37.7, 37.9, 38.1 and shot them today. A few groups were great but had fliers (possibly me) the numbers were also not that great. Lowest SD I was able to achieve was 5.7
velocity was 2940 at 37.3 up to 3040 at 38.1.
29” barrel and Alpha brass.
Once fired Alpha, wet tumbled, Amp annealed , resized with Redding die with the expander.
I'm getting the same velocity, similar nodes, except out of a 26" bbl. Bbl only has ~250rnds through it.
37.75gr H4350, velocity avg 3040fps 108 ELD-M
Gents - can someone please let me know the recommended trim length for 6GT, or length of new Hornady or Alpha brass? I'm having to make my first cases from 6.5x47 and I've never seen a 6GT in the wild down here. I might have missed it somewhere. If so, apologies.
Here’s the print. I’ll try to remember to measure my hornady/alpha brass today. The lapua I’m experimenting with I have just been running it to same length as I do hornady (I go about .001-.002 under what factory hornady comes so they are all uniform length).
Thanks gents. Greatly appreciated. I’d looked at the reamer print but didn’t know what a safe margin might be.
@Dthomas3523 - on the steps you’re following to form 6.5x47 to 6GT, do you do a trim to length after the initial sizing down run?
I’m lucky enough to have a Henderson trimmer but I can see it taking quite a bit of time...
@Dthomas3523 - on the steps you’re following to form 6.5x47 to 6GT, do you do a trim to length after the initial sizing down run?
I’m lucky enough to have a Henderson trimmer but I can see it taking quite a bit of time...
Currently my steps:
Run into a 6x47 non bushing die (I run 6x47 as well so I have one) to take the neck down.
Then I run in 6gt die without bushing, halfway down, spin case and finish sizing.
Then trim to length and inside ream. Outside neck turn if its still too thick for the chamber.
Size with appropriate bushing and mandrel
Fireform/practice with 31.0 varget.
Neck turn to desired thickness if need be after.
I’m still experimenting with this process and it will likely change.
For saami specs generally the max case length will be .010 from the end of the neck before it transitions down.
So 1.732 minus .010 gives us 1.722 max. Then the spec will say something along the lines of -.020 meaning that up to .020 below that number is still in spec. So the trim length spec would be 1.722-.020 meaning anywhere from 1.702-1.722 is in the range.
Thanks - appreciate it. I’d thought to subtract about 0.015“ to 0.020” from the 1.732” figure so good to see I wasn’t completely off base.
Ok - this looks pretty different from where you started, process-wise? Did you go for inside reaming to cut out process steps of mandrel expand and outside turn, or were you finding latter wasn‘t getting rid of donut at base of neck?
The donut was really bad. So bad with my 21st century lathe, even after running the expander mandrel it would still bind on the turning mandrel.
Had a hand reamer for inside and then my IDOD showed up. So my process is gonna get a bit more efficient and I’m sure change again at some point.
Update on making lapua 6gt. Now that I have pretty much everything I need, I just spent a few hours perfecting the process. I think I have it down. It sounds like a lot, but with the right stuff, it’s not bad.
Run virgin 6.5x47 into SAC 6gt die without bushing. Twist 1-2 times in process in attempt to maintain some sort of concentricity.
21st turning expander mandrel (.240)
Inside ream with IDOD (just enough for the 21st turning mandrel to pass properly). Finding IDOD doesn’t do well with brass that isn’t concentric. Neck thickness was all over the place
Outside turn with 21st lathe (the strength of a mandrel and floating Chuck is when brass isn’t concentric)
Neck comes out at .012 and hugs a .241 pin gauge perfectly without any feeling of a donut.
From here is just trim/chamfer/deburr and load. I’ll probably add the trim/cham/deb after the IDOD reaming.
.012 neck wall works out to a .267 loaded neck diameter which is just about perfect at .006 neck clearance. .006 is what I shoot for on most everything.
Run virgin 6.5x47 into SAC 6gt die without bushing. Twist 1-2 times in process in attempt to maintain some sort of concentricity.
21st turning expander mandrel (.240)
Inside ream with IDOD (just enough for the 21st turning mandrel to pass properly). Finding IDOD doesn’t do well with brass that isn’t concentric. Neck thickness was all over the place
Outside turn with 21st lathe (the strength of a mandrel and floating Chuck is when brass isn’t concentric)
Neck comes out at .012 and hugs a .241 pin gauge perfectly without any feeling of a donut.
From here is just trim/chamfer/deburr and load. I’ll probably add the trim/cham/deb after the IDOD reaming.
.012 neck wall works out to a .267 loaded neck diameter which is just about perfect at .006 neck clearance. .006 is what I shoot for on most everything.
Neck still needs to be trimmed down. Just seated a 109 hybrid to double check loaded diameter.
just curious why you need to turn it more when your running a .273 reamer? or did i miss something when i didnt read word for word?
I run .006 clearance on most everything. .003 is fairly tight.
Not sure where/when “no neck turn” reamers with .003 or less clearance became standard.
I’ll leave this right here if anybody is interested ... My first moderate sized 6mm gamer setup and I‘m not going to Change a thing! This is shots 381-400. 28”, 7T, Proof comp cont., Hor. Brass, 205M... Should be to 800 rounds soon and ill keep eveybody updated. Having way too much fun out to 1400yds at pretty much sea level....
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gotcha...i ran .003 for a long time then started running .005 seems like a little loser runs more consistent.
S
Some dudes find out that the guys chambering their barrels, is using a tight neck diameter, Right @lte82 LOL
My 6x47L is a .2755...
Some dudes find out that the guys chambering their barrels, is using a tight neck diameter, Right @lte82 LOL
My 6x47L is a .2755...
How is the inside neck reaming operation done on the IDOD? I don't have the IDOD option down here (or justifiable need) but have just noticed the same donut issue on the prototype case I've made. Despite use of expander mandrel, case will not slip over 21c neck turning mandrel. Donut is visible under high mag loupe and also with gauge. I'm going to need to use a 6mm Wilson inside neck reamer as that's about the only option I have..
It’s just a cutter that’s inserted into the spinning cartridge.
The Wilson reamer may take too much out. If that was the only option, I’d probably try a larger mandrel first. Then get the neck turned and fired. Use the inside reamers on a fired case before sizing down.
