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77 gr Sierra SMK’s deer hunting
- Thread starter B Man
- Start date
For you TMK purest. If my rifles shoot them accurately, I may make a switch
He’s in the 500’s now.
All that aside, what’s the magic sauce load here? I wanna give these a try for my first foray into reloading and they look like they’ll do nicely on the feral hog population.
Tried the 77TMK's with Ramshot TAC, 23.3 gr. out of a 12.5" barrel and they were just ok at my lowest (tested) powder charge with a velocity average of 2399fps. Anything above that was worthless. I have Varget, 4046, H335 and Benchmark to try as well. Everything's a bit faster than TAC at the lowest charges. Any suggestions for those powders out of an SBR? Wouldn't I want something faster-burning or no? CFE 223 seems to get great velocities but it's even slower-burning than Varget.
With the Berger 77 grain pills and TAC, I was averaging 2480 with a much lower SD, much tighter groupings using 24.1 grains. Same brass/primer/everything else. No pressure signs.
With the Berger 77 grain pills and TAC, I was averaging 2480 with a much lower SD, much tighter groupings using 24.1 grains. Same brass/primer/everything else. No pressure signs.
I had fantastic results with the 75 grain Gold Dots om deer, black bear, coyote and ground hogs. i have since switched to 300blk but was never disappointed by 223. My son and my wife have both been successful with the same load.
I haven’t tried to load 77 TMK yet, but the Black Hills loads average 2518 from my 11.5” Criterion Core and 2652 from my 14.5” Rainier Mountain barrel. And it seems to group in the 3/4 - 1 1/4” range.
What do you mean by worthless for the higher TAC powder charges? Bad groups? What’s your seating depth?
I don’t think you can compensate for short barrels by going to faster powders, when using heavy for caliber bullets. Faster powders with heavy bullets leads to pressure spikes.
I’ve heard 8208 XBR is a favorite, but 2000-MR does well too. Kind of on opposite ends of the acceptable powder burn rate.
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23.5gr N135. Trust me!
Clone the Clone: IMI 77gr Razor Core
IMI 77gr SMK Razor Core is some great shooting factory ammo. I haven't loaded 5.56 in 15yrs but saved my IMI brass. Gave it a go with the following best performing powders: (Velocities and group sizes practically identical to IMI 77SMK Razor Core) WOA 18" SPR 2-10X36 Trijicon Credo in ARC rings...
www.snipershide.com
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exploded lungs/heart quit working all the same regardless of what caliber hit them.
I cannot recommend highly enough Staball Match powder at Hodgdon online load data book max load. Works very well in my gun.
If penetration is king for you, use the 64gr Nosler Trophy Bonded Bear Claw. I have gotten 2 ft of penetration while going through 3 bones on animals at close range before.
Staball match is 2820 fps out of my 18" WOA AR with the 75 BTHP.
You always get a perfect shot? No bone or tissue in the way ever?
You guys are all genius. People using anything bigger than 223 and 77smk are idiots up to the big 5. No reason for anything else. Bunch of mensa up in here.
Calm down , no need for you to get banned again over you thinking you are powerful enough to influence people .
I have a stock pile of those. Its a shame they quit making them
Don’t take a bad shot.
You think that hunting with a 223 and tmk is any less ethical than bow hunting? You should tell all them guys they need ballistas to hunt deer with or it’s unethical.
Killing a deer with a 223 smk/tmk is miles easier than killing one with a bow.
What about killing a bear with a blow gun?
You hit the vitals and they die. End of story.
223 WoNt KiLl a DeEr reeeeee
Quartering towards
Bang flop
77smk 11.5 barrel
Quartering towards
Bang flop
77smk 11.5 barrel
No one ever said .223 won't kill deer in fact go back and I said it's great on deer.
A 140 lb deer and a 1000 lb elk are not the same thing.
Don't let facts get in the way of your bullshit hyperbole. Some of you would make great Democrat politicians.
Is a .223 creating a 7/8- 1.25" wound cavity cutting artieres, tissue, organs, ect along the way?
To be honest alot of people who bow hunt should not be. They are shitty shots and we would find animals wounded and never recovered becuase they ran miles before dying. Ethical is not taking marginal shots, not taking shots past your capabilities. Just becuase you can hit the Amimal doesn't mean you should...be it a rifle, bow or whatever.
The chance of a .223 hitting the vitals and doing enough damage to drop the animal is less than a bullet that is bonded with higher sectional density.
People overestimate their abilities and when long time experienced hunters who drop animals every year have bad shit happen, how often you think it happens to newer guys?
You can kill an elephant with a .22. Why not use that?
lol.
I better get my waders cause it’s getting deep when ppl are arguing a arrow has more terminal performance than. A 556
Some people have
#noexperience
Hunting deer with SMK is retarded and cruel. Even at closer ranges SMK doesn't always frag. The thought of one shooting a deer with what could amount to a FMJ to in non vital region is extremely, well, it's just shitty and you shouldn't do it. There are few things in life that feel worse than walking up to a suffering animal on the ground due to your lack of proper ammunition or shot placement.
If you have to deer hunt with 5.56 then choose a real hunting bullet like TSX or even Gold Dot
I've taken down white tail with 77gr TMK before, she was DRT. Still, it's not my first choice for a white tail deer.
I now only hunt deer with 70gr TSX. All of my shots are within 100 yard from the deer stand. Incredible penetration, lead free and it retains 99% of its mas upon impact meaning I don't lose any meat from frag.
If you have to deer hunt with 5.56 then choose a real hunting bullet like TSX or even Gold Dot
I've taken down white tail with 77gr TMK before, she was DRT. Still, it's not my first choice for a white tail deer.
I now only hunt deer with 70gr TSX. All of my shots are within 100 yard from the deer stand. Incredible penetration, lead free and it retains 99% of its mas upon impact meaning I don't lose any meat from frag.
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IMO a mono of bonded bullet has a greater potential to "pencil" through or cause less trauma than a cup and core "Match" bullet. Those of us that use match hpbt bullets will clear tips on not clear tips depending on the bullet. I haven't hunted deer with them but I've seen them frag and cleanly kill chucks, badgers, and coyotes. I have no issues using them on deer.
Yes see above
No shit Sherlock.
Lol see above
A miss/bad shot with a 7 mag is still a wounded animal that ran for miles and may or may not have died. I’d argue it might be MORE ethical to have a bad shot with a 223 they might actually live and recover
maybe all you magnum hunters are the assholes taking unethical shots because “MuH 3O0 WiN MaG St0pPiNg PoWaAaa” injuries the animal without killing it immediately, it is disfigured and maimed, can never recover, and dies a slow agonizing death. Maybe if the hunter used a 223 it would have lived and recovered. So sir maybe we should argue for LESS powerful hunting guns
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A whole lot of people have in real life, not in therory, not on an internet forum, proved you wrong.
Don’t get too high on your pedestal now. I’ve had two experiences of Barnes bullets failing to expand. 25-06 TSX (recovered curved like a banana) and 264 win mag ttsx tip broke off never expanded, curved like the tsx. With bullets/arrows hunting enough weird shit just happens at times.
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A marginal shot with a large energy caliber gives you.......Margin of error. You don't need a perfect shot with something like a 300wm or 338. The golden BB theory is great, except no one is perfect.Yes see above
No shit Sherlock.
Lol see above
A miss/bad shot with a 7 mag is still a wounded animal that ran for miles and may or may not have died. I’d argue it might be MORE ethical to have a bad shot with a 223 they might actually live and recover
Look if you are an experienced hunter with the skills and knowledge to take them with a smaller caliber, that is one thing. VERY few people are. There are guys with way more experience than most of us who still wouldn't risk it, its a unnecessary risk. For what? To wave your dick around and brag you killed an animal with a marginal caliber. IMO that makes someone sound like more of an asshole that a skilled hunter. Maybe they got lucky, maybe there are lost animals no one knew about, ect. Hunters been telling hunting stories since the beginning of time. Rarely do guys tell you about their failures and those that do, are probally the guys you want to listen and learn from.
I dont need a perfect lung/heart shot with a 300wm. I can be off on my wind call by a good amount and still get a hit in the vitals. I told the story about the experienced hunter having to put 5 6.5 creed ELD-X into a bull at about 550 before it went down. All hits in the vitals.
Out of every shot on a Elk, how many are great shooters and perfect shot opportunities? Its called hunting not farming. The animal has a say where its going to be.
The point of this thread is 77 smk for deer. Yup completely appropriate and "ethical". Deer are thin skinned, small, easy to kill animals. A shoulder shot on a deer is not the same thing as a shoulder shot on an Elk.
Assholes like you always respond with "a Bad shot with a 50 cal is still a bad shot" Yea no shit. Its intellectually dishonest to say a marginal shot with a 77gr smk is the same as a 200gr accubond. One will crush bone and one will fragment on it.
My grandfather (RIP) killed A LOT of animals with his .22
Everything from squirrels to bobcats to a mountain lion. Granted he died in '88 when times were simpler
Nothing is perfect. It still remains your responsibility to mitigate that risk as much as possible.
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Hmmm...guess I won't mention dropping a 240lb Russian black boar with a XM-177S and green tips...at 55yds...running broadside to me from right to left... (circa 1996)
One shot. Punched it through the neck, and ripped the jugular out on the right side. Fucker dropped like a light switch (didn't even roll over, just piled up with all four legs under itself).
The game guide just stood there with his mouth opened...
One shot. Punched it through the neck, and ripped the jugular out on the right side. Fucker dropped like a light switch (didn't even roll over, just piled up with all four legs under itself).
The game guide just stood there with his mouth opened...
Completely ruined the pig with that combo. Probably had nothing left to eatHmmm...guess I won't mention dropping a 240lb Russian black boar with a XM-177S and green tips...at 55yds...running broadside to me from right to left... (circa 1996)
One shot. Punched it through the neck, and ripped the jugular out on the right side. Fucker dropped like a light switch (didn't even roll over, just piled up with all four legs under itself).
The game guide just stood there with his mouth opened...
You just outed yourself man:Hmmm...guess I won't mention dropping a 240lb Russian black boar with a XM-177S and green tips...at 55yds...running broadside to me from right to left... (circa 1996)
One shot. Punched it through the neck, and ripped the jugular out on the right side. Fucker dropped like a light switch (didn't even roll over, just piled up with all four legs under itself).
The game guide just stood there with his mouth opened...
Living in a state that allows 12 deer tags per season, yearly crop control on friends farms, and takes hogs regularly. I have a good idea of what works, I prefer, and my gear. But, I’m also glad you have a preference that works for yourself.
So you completely proved my point. You are okay with taking marginal, less than ideal shots just because you have a bigger gun. A miss to the vitals with a 223 is still a miss to the vitals with a 300wm. You hit something in the lungs/heart with a high velocity round and it’s going to die. 1 shot. 5 shots with a 6.5cm to the vitals is completely overkill. Animal would have died all the same with 1 shot.
A marginal/shitty shot with a magnum is still a wounded animal that runs away. You absolutely still need to hit the vitals with whatever round you use. You have a ton of experience gut shooting elk with a 300wm that you recovered to prove otherwise? You gut shoot ‘em with a 223 hell maybe they have a chance at living. Same with an arrow. Lots of evidence of deer with battle scars from bad arrow shots that lived. Seems more ethical to me that gut shooting them with a 300wm so they die 8 hrs later in an unrecoverable area.
You are right, lots of shitty ass deer hunters that can barely hold minute of pie plate at 100. Maybe they should shoot 22 mag so when they inevitably take a bad shot the animal might still make it.
I demand in the name of ethics we limit hunting rifles to 22 mag.
The issue is animal presentation. You don't always get a full broadside. Sometime you need to take quartering shots and a pussy 223 will not punch through and shatter a shoulder the way a 300wm will. This shit shouldn't have to explained to an experienced big game hunter but here we are.
Go look at what guides reccomend. Show up to a guided hunt with a .223 and let me know how it goes.
Go look at what guides reccomend. Show up to a guided hunt with a .223 and let me know how it goes.
Then don’t take a shot you shouldn’t. Bow hunters know this well. Guess everyone that bow hunts elk are idiots.
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