I have been searching for a bolt action for the past several years that will satisfy my accuracy dream in a hunting rifle without having to spend $5,000 on a full out custom rifle. If I could afford it, there would be no hesitation on a GAP rifle. I have been reading for the past 3 years on this forum and am blown away with the knowledge that each of you provide for noobs like me. I have been shooting since I was a kid, started in 4-H and Boy Scouts, but have never shot past 400 yards. I currently own about a dozen firearms that fill all of my needs (shotgun, rimfire, ccw, AR-15, lever action) except for a bolt action hunting rifle. From what I have read, there is no doubt that custom rifle would suffice my needs. I am looking for a rifle that I will keep forever and handle my needs from the pine thicket of Louisiana to the Texas hill country. I do not handload ammunition, so I feel that this will leave me at the mercy of having to purchase something like .308 in order to have many options in ammo so that I can find something that my rifle will "like". I have gone back and forth on my options from a Remington 700 AAC (already have AAC 762SDN6), Weatherby Vanguard S2 or Back Country in .257 Mag, or going with a semi-custom option like Hill Country Rifles Harvester in 270 WSM. Hill Country Rifles also offers the accurization option on whatever bolt action you have already purchased. I really like the ballistics of the 270 WSM especially with the new Nosler LR ammo. I'm afraid to purchase a production gun and just hope for sub MOA accuracy. Don't be confused and think that I am wanting the magic rifle for $400 either. I would be willing to spend around $1500-$2000 on the rifle alone and about $1000 for glass. And with that being said, I feel like I should just save for another year and order a GAP. Saving another year wouldn't kill me and I plan on keeping it forever, so I just don't want a rifle that will get the job done, (already have a couple of BLR's in 7mm-08 and 30-06 that accomplish this). From my rambling, I assume that I will convince whoever reads this post that I have been driving myself nuts for the past 3 years trying to figure this out on my own and this is why I am reaching out. All comments are welcome.
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Accuracy vs Cost, Please Help
- Thread starter jsnspck
- Start date
I just built a hunting rifle in 308 with phoenix custom rifles (Keith built it). The cost was about 3k but I have to say it is the most accurate and handsome rifle I have ever owned (groups in the 1s and 2s are standard when I do my part). The trigger is a dream, the weight and balance are perfect, and man she looks good.
I say wait a little bit and consider building with a smith other than Gap (I personally highly recommend PCR).
Feel free to let me know if there is anything else I can help with. Best of luck with your decision,
Adam
I say wait a little bit and consider building with a smith other than Gap (I personally highly recommend PCR).
Feel free to let me know if there is anything else I can help with. Best of luck with your decision,
Adam
Oh yes, the build for accuracy dilemma, I know it well. I have not owned a GAP (but have shot a few) and they are VERY good rifles but there are lots of great smiths out there that can build you a sub MOA gun. There are also guns that will fire sub MOA out of the box, Savage is know for MOA out of the box and you can get a nice rifle for $700 and do most of the work yourself. I have a FN SPR that shoots in the .5-.6 range all day and its sweet spot is 400-600 yards where its closer to .3 MOA. Not sure why but I am sure someone here can data that out. I also have a Howa that only has a stock upgrade to the XLR and shoots 1-.9. Now with that said I dropped close to $4000 on my build from X-Ring accuracy and do not regret it for a second. It shoots .3-.4 when I do my part so the question may be is + $3000 over a factory Howa or $2000 over the FN worth it? Yes, yes and yes, but its not all about accuracy. My mony bought me the EXACT action, barrel, base, trigger, stock etc. that I wanted. The entire rifle is a thing of beauty and its all mine! It feels so good to the touch that its like being in the dark with a porn star, no matter how you touch her she just feels gooooodddddd!!!!!!!! So is a build worth it? Yes, but don't build just for accuracy. Know what you like, have an idea about your wants and needs and go from there. Good luck and don't forget to post photos when you get it down. We all love gun porn.
Sully
Sully
are you looking for a lightweight hunter? or a heavier PR gun?
260 or 308
out of the box, anything below it in price is sub par....
.5 or less moa, crazy good 2 stage triggers, short throw bolt, good, but ugly stock
Tikka T3 Sporter, 20" bbl .260 Rem JRTN421 for Sale! - EuroOptic.com
at 3k to 3500,
Sako TRG22 308 Sig Dark Grey Finish Cerakote on sale - EuroOptic.com
at 3600-4600
Accuracy International AE Rifle - AI AE Rifle - for sale! - EuroOptic.com
and u can find GREAT deals on these used for way less....
i can tell you in one of the big threads, with guys that own BOTH a AI or a TRG and a GAP or similar high end custom, 99% pick the AI - TRG over the GAP
260 or 308
out of the box, anything below it in price is sub par....
.5 or less moa, crazy good 2 stage triggers, short throw bolt, good, but ugly stock
Tikka T3 Sporter, 20" bbl .260 Rem JRTN421 for Sale! - EuroOptic.com
at 3k to 3500,
Sako TRG22 308 Sig Dark Grey Finish Cerakote on sale - EuroOptic.com
at 3600-4600
Accuracy International AE Rifle - AI AE Rifle - for sale! - EuroOptic.com
and u can find GREAT deals on these used for way less....
i can tell you in one of the big threads, with guys that own BOTH a AI or a TRG and a GAP or similar high end custom, 99% pick the AI - TRG over the GAP
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If you are looking for a bolt action hunting rifle, you should ask yourself a few questions.
Like how much are you going to carry the rifle? If you are going to be carrying it for long periods of time.
There is a huge difference between a 6.5 lb rifle and a 10 pound plus heavy barreled rifle.
How much long range shooting do you plan on?
A heavier barreled rifle, will have less recoil than a lighter rifle in the same caliber. A heavy barreled rifle typically holds tighter groups as the barrel begins to heat up.
What caliber do you want?
If you don't reload. .308 is a descent round. But what do you plan on hunting? Through this whole ammo shortage mess, I have almost always been able to find 30-06 and .300 WM in stock.
If you want a bolt gun to hunt with and plan on carrying it a bunch, I would go with a Tikka T3 Lite in 300 WM. Put a nice Nightforce 2.5-10 scope on it and you would be set with a fantastic hunting rifle.
If you want a heavy barreled target type rifle in your price range, I would look at the Tikka Sporter. If you could track down a Tikka Scout, I would go that route. Many on here have had great success with the remington 5R. For glass, I would save a little and get a 5.5-22X56 NXS.
Like how much are you going to carry the rifle? If you are going to be carrying it for long periods of time.
There is a huge difference between a 6.5 lb rifle and a 10 pound plus heavy barreled rifle.
How much long range shooting do you plan on?
A heavier barreled rifle, will have less recoil than a lighter rifle in the same caliber. A heavy barreled rifle typically holds tighter groups as the barrel begins to heat up.
What caliber do you want?
If you don't reload. .308 is a descent round. But what do you plan on hunting? Through this whole ammo shortage mess, I have almost always been able to find 30-06 and .300 WM in stock.
If you want a bolt gun to hunt with and plan on carrying it a bunch, I would go with a Tikka T3 Lite in 300 WM. Put a nice Nightforce 2.5-10 scope on it and you would be set with a fantastic hunting rifle.
If you want a heavy barreled target type rifle in your price range, I would look at the Tikka Sporter. If you could track down a Tikka Scout, I would go that route. Many on here have had great success with the remington 5R. For glass, I would save a little and get a 5.5-22X56 NXS.
Tikka t3 perhaps in that price range.
That said, with factory rifles, you just have to get lucky.
I know a rem 700p that shoots just as accurate as my AI AE, but there are plenty that barely shoot moa.
I agree with the guys saying: save up. I did the same, I figured what I would do with a rem700 (stock, trigger, smithing work, barrel), then figured how much more is an AI AE (or GAP or whichever custom you prefer). It wasn't that much.
The waiting sucked, but now I'm really happy to have the AI.
That said, with factory rifles, you just have to get lucky.
I know a rem 700p that shoots just as accurate as my AI AE, but there are plenty that barely shoot moa.
I agree with the guys saying: save up. I did the same, I figured what I would do with a rem700 (stock, trigger, smithing work, barrel), then figured how much more is an AI AE (or GAP or whichever custom you prefer). It wasn't that much.
The waiting sucked, but now I'm really happy to have the AI.
Order the GAP will only cost you 1000 when you order then you will have 6 to 8 months to save for the balance.
Tough to beat LRIs offer right now as far as budget builds go. I would also think of your resale (that itch you are feeling doesn't go away when you scratch it, ha ha). A used GAP is near to unbeatable for protecting your money. The classifieds are running over with great deals on awesome rifles, it's a buyers market.
My vote.
Model 70 Extreme Weather SS, Ultimate wet weather Bolt Action Deer Elk Big Game Rifle hunting whitetail mule -- Winchester Repeating Arms -- Product Model
With this in 2-12x
SWFA Riflescopes Leupold Hunting Riflescopes Leupold VX-6 Riflescopes
Held by these, medium height
Talley Lightweight One-Piece Alloy Scope Mounts
Carry it with this
RifleCraft
Model 70 Extreme Weather SS, Ultimate wet weather Bolt Action Deer Elk Big Game Rifle hunting whitetail mule -- Winchester Repeating Arms -- Product Model
With this in 2-12x
SWFA Riflescopes Leupold Hunting Riflescopes Leupold VX-6 Riflescopes
Held by these, medium height
Talley Lightweight One-Piece Alloy Scope Mounts
Carry it with this
RifleCraft
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This is exactly what I was hoping for when I posted this question, knowledge from experience to guide me on my journey. Thank you so much for the advice, it is well taken. My idea of the rifle was more away from the custom heavy action with heavy barrel and rails to keep the weight down since I do want to hunt with it. Very good advice, I appreciate it.
I recently got a 260 hunting rifle. Sent a 700SA to Longrifles INc for a true up job. Bought a Brux #5 fluted bbl that finished at 22". Put it in a Manners MCS-SL hunting stock. Completed the pkg with a Rifle Basix trigger set a 2.5lbs. Topped off with a Leupold 4.5x14 scoped in Dual dovetail base and rings. Rifle shot in the .4's last wkend with 120gr Barnes TTSX. A very nice pkg in a rifle I don't have a fortune in.
If you want something out of the box with good accuracy, buy a Tikka T3. Now I wouldn't compare it to a custom 700 or anything but for what you describe, it would be perfect. Light, 3 shot MOA guarantee and a fair price. Just my 2 cents. I don't own one buy know many who do. I have shot more than a few and if I was just looking for a quick buy, that's what I would get.
I couldn't agree with you more and this is why it is so hard to make a decision. I have searched and read a lot about the FN SPR (300WSM) and have heard all of the Savage stories of great accuracy out of the box. And like you state, it is not just about the accuracy. I have deer hunted since 2008 with a Springfield M1A Loaded, it killed everything I pulled the trigger on, but it was heavy as hell and not that easy to climb a tree with. A slick action, perfect trigger and perfect balance are something that I now am aware of and it is hard to ignore. But these are the reasons on how I am trying to justify a semi-custom or custom rig. I also am aware of the cry once theory. Thanks
Thanks for the advice on the AI/TRG. I have looked at Tikka's T3 line, but not the upper end rifles. Really looking for a rifle that will be a little lighter than 9-10 pounds before accessories. I know about hunting with heavy rifles as I have hunted with a Springfield Loaded M1A since 2008, not the most fun. If I ever get into long range plinking, I will definitely consider these.
These are some of the questions that I have considered into picking my next rifle. Like I stated before, I have carried a Springfield Loaded M1A since 2008 and have had about enough of that. But saying that, I wouldn't be afraid of packing a complete rifle with scope that weighed 10 pounds. I am really afraid of my shooting technique if I were to shoot a 300WM offhand with a 6.5 pound rifle. Since I don't reload, I am willing to purchase Nosler custom ammo, the price won't hurt that bad because I won't be shooting thousands of rounds a year through my hunting rifle, probably 4-5 boxes per year between hunting and plinking. As a hunting rifle, if I were to go .30 cal, it would be 300 WM or 300 WSM, I do plan on shooting long range with it also, and the .308 doesn't have the power I would like to have at those further distances. Tikka and 5R keep coming up in this thread, haven't had a response to the Weatherby question I originally posted. I guess they are overpriced or unpredictable??? Would like to know what is wrong with the Weatherby line. Thanks again.
Have been hearing this over and over and it is starting to sink in. Still wonder what y'all think about the 270WSM as a do-it-all (hunting and long range) as a poor man's replacement for the GAP 6.5SAUM Xtreme Hunter.
Hunting rifles don't have to be all that accurate. 1.5 MOA is more than enough for short to medium range hunting. You could buy a cheap box-stock hunting rifle. But it sounds like your tastes are a little more high-end.
I'd consider these rifles for hunting rifles:
M48 Trophy Grade? Rifle ? Nosler
Model 70 Super Grade, Bolt Action Deer Elk Big Game Rifle -- Winchester Repeating Arms -- Product Model
Centerfire Rifle - Model 700 Mountain SS - Remington Centerfire Rifles
SAKO 85 Finnlight
SAKO 85 Hunter
It will depend on what you want to spend and what you want to value. Some guys like nice wood and blue carbon steel, especially for heirloom rifles. Some guys prefer functionality in adverse conditions, and will want stainless (perhaps even Cerakote) and synthetic.
My hunting rifle is a Rem 700 stainless, Timney 510 trigger, Shilen select barrel in a custom contour, and a B&C Alaskan Ti stock. I bedded and contoured the stock myself to match the barrel profile, painted it and all that. I had Bart Baldwin Cerakote the metal in graphite black. I topped it with a lightweight Zeiss scope. It shoots consistent 1/2 minute with my handloads. The cost of my rifle was $400 for the donor rifle, $120 for the trigger, $330 for the barrel, $200 for chambering the barrel and truing the action (the smith used a custom reamer my friend and I split the cost of), $230 for the stock, and about $40 in supplies. I forget what Baldwin charged for the Cerakote, but it was reasonable and the work was excellent. Then I sold the stock, barrel, and trigger off the donor rifle and recovered about $150 back. You don't need to spend $4000-5000 for a custom hunting rifle. When it was all said and done, not counting the scope, bases, and rings, I was in for under $1200. I'd wager to say you could replicate these results.
Now if you want a target gun, I'd have a different set of suggestions altogether. This is assuming you want a hunting rifle.
I'd consider these rifles for hunting rifles:
M48 Trophy Grade? Rifle ? Nosler
Model 70 Super Grade, Bolt Action Deer Elk Big Game Rifle -- Winchester Repeating Arms -- Product Model
Centerfire Rifle - Model 700 Mountain SS - Remington Centerfire Rifles
SAKO 85 Finnlight
SAKO 85 Hunter
It will depend on what you want to spend and what you want to value. Some guys like nice wood and blue carbon steel, especially for heirloom rifles. Some guys prefer functionality in adverse conditions, and will want stainless (perhaps even Cerakote) and synthetic.
My hunting rifle is a Rem 700 stainless, Timney 510 trigger, Shilen select barrel in a custom contour, and a B&C Alaskan Ti stock. I bedded and contoured the stock myself to match the barrel profile, painted it and all that. I had Bart Baldwin Cerakote the metal in graphite black. I topped it with a lightweight Zeiss scope. It shoots consistent 1/2 minute with my handloads. The cost of my rifle was $400 for the donor rifle, $120 for the trigger, $330 for the barrel, $200 for chambering the barrel and truing the action (the smith used a custom reamer my friend and I split the cost of), $230 for the stock, and about $40 in supplies. I forget what Baldwin charged for the Cerakote, but it was reasonable and the work was excellent. Then I sold the stock, barrel, and trigger off the donor rifle and recovered about $150 back. You don't need to spend $4000-5000 for a custom hunting rifle. When it was all said and done, not counting the scope, bases, and rings, I was in for under $1200. I'd wager to say you could replicate these results.
Now if you want a target gun, I'd have a different set of suggestions altogether. This is assuming you want a hunting rifle.
This is the guidance I was looking for. I do want a little custom (good barrel and trigger, bedded stock), but want to keep it in check and keep weight and balance at the top as this is a hunting rifle project.
You don't have to spend big $$$$$ to be accurate. Sometimes you gotta just get lucky other times right place at the right time rings true.
Another Howa in .308 which is my bench gun. A custom alluminium stock (picked it up cheap as a one off from a bloke makes stocks for a living here who made it for his gun here but went a different route), 30" tube I picked up from one of Australias FClass Team 300 rounds old, t36 on top. its a 1/2" gun for 10 shots @ 100. total cost including optics of $1700
Another Howa that I had built into 338-375Ruger Improved. Which I'm into about $2k + optics(tho did the cerakoting myself). Still load testing as its only been out for a shoot 3 times. I'm at 30mm @ 200 and I'm sure I can improve on that. (probably drop a couple hundred bucks off those costs in the US if not more)
I have a couple good factory rifles (I got pretty lucky not getting dud yet) but I've seen a few bad ones as well anywhere from $500-$2500 worth of 3moa gun = junk.
Plenty of good smiths and good components in the world to limit your options. I don't own any but a few mates have $5k+ guns with $3k optics on em. Sure they are a nice guns. They all shoot lights out but I'll never own one (at least not the forseable future). To do so I'd have to sell off a few I have already but I couldn't choose which to sell first which means they are all gonna stay
I guess all I'm throwing into it is consider all options as there are a bloody lot of em. Keep an open mind and don't rule out used. Especially for stocks or optics especially those with life time warranties. Can save some serious coin if you get a deal on one and if you decide you want to go a different route at some time your likely to be able to sell it near your cost.
food for thought.
Another Howa in .308 which is my bench gun. A custom alluminium stock (picked it up cheap as a one off from a bloke makes stocks for a living here who made it for his gun here but went a different route), 30" tube I picked up from one of Australias FClass Team 300 rounds old, t36 on top. its a 1/2" gun for 10 shots @ 100. total cost including optics of $1700
Another Howa that I had built into 338-375Ruger Improved. Which I'm into about $2k + optics(tho did the cerakoting myself). Still load testing as its only been out for a shoot 3 times. I'm at 30mm @ 200 and I'm sure I can improve on that. (probably drop a couple hundred bucks off those costs in the US if not more)
I have a couple good factory rifles (I got pretty lucky not getting dud yet) but I've seen a few bad ones as well anywhere from $500-$2500 worth of 3moa gun = junk.
Plenty of good smiths and good components in the world to limit your options. I don't own any but a few mates have $5k+ guns with $3k optics on em. Sure they are a nice guns. They all shoot lights out but I'll never own one (at least not the forseable future). To do so I'd have to sell off a few I have already but I couldn't choose which to sell first which means they are all gonna stay
I guess all I'm throwing into it is consider all options as there are a bloody lot of em. Keep an open mind and don't rule out used. Especially for stocks or optics especially those with life time warranties. Can save some serious coin if you get a deal on one and if you decide you want to go a different route at some time your likely to be able to sell it near your cost.
food for thought.
Not being a guy with lots of money I've done this...
I'm glad I sold the guns, scopes, knives, bikes, etc, that were sitting around collecting dust and bought what I friggen wanted. And yes I even charged some $ on the CC.
Then I enjoyed my quality and expensive equipment to the fullest, YAHOO! My trend continues, LOL...
The years have gone by and I'm "gleeful" I spent the money then, cause now it'd cost me up to twice as much to replace this new awesome gear, heck I've even made a profit on a bunch of that stuff I sold. I have a feeling things will continue to increase in price, wink.
Don't be afraid to buy a quality used rifle "but" do your best to make sure the rifle is not being sold because it's screwed up.
HCR's Harvester??? I wouldn't be paying $2000 for a factory rifle with few enhancements, in a fancy stock. Most of the time a quality aftermarket barrel will shoot sub half moa, the reverse is usually true with a factory barrel.
This might be worth considering. Build your Own
The problem with .270 caliber is the lack of hi BC bullets. Better off with 6.5 or 7mm. I recommend 6.5 Creedmoor because it's got enough power, low recoil, good barrel life and good ballistics.
Last but not least is to get a decent scope with target style turrets and learn to use them. I bet even George at GAP dials past PBR with his mighty 6.54S. I'd be trying my darnedest to get one of those new Bushnells he's specked out in the 6.54S thread.
I'm glad I sold the guns, scopes, knives, bikes, etc, that were sitting around collecting dust and bought what I friggen wanted. And yes I even charged some $ on the CC.
Then I enjoyed my quality and expensive equipment to the fullest, YAHOO! My trend continues, LOL...
The years have gone by and I'm "gleeful" I spent the money then, cause now it'd cost me up to twice as much to replace this new awesome gear, heck I've even made a profit on a bunch of that stuff I sold. I have a feeling things will continue to increase in price, wink.
Don't be afraid to buy a quality used rifle "but" do your best to make sure the rifle is not being sold because it's screwed up.
HCR's Harvester??? I wouldn't be paying $2000 for a factory rifle with few enhancements, in a fancy stock. Most of the time a quality aftermarket barrel will shoot sub half moa, the reverse is usually true with a factory barrel.
This might be worth considering. Build your Own
The problem with .270 caliber is the lack of hi BC bullets. Better off with 6.5 or 7mm. I recommend 6.5 Creedmoor because it's got enough power, low recoil, good barrel life and good ballistics.
Last but not least is to get a decent scope with target style turrets and learn to use them. I bet even George at GAP dials past PBR with his mighty 6.54S. I'd be trying my darnedest to get one of those new Bushnells he's specked out in the 6.54S thread.
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I know there is not a lot of love here for Thompson/Center rifles but I have a Venture .308 Weather Shield that sits in an XLR chassis and it is definitely sub-moa. Very nice adjustable trigger, 5R rifling too. Fitted out with a SWFA fixed 16x scope and Harris bipod, right around $1700. Or you could look around for a T/C Icon, already comes in a metal bedded factory stock, similar to the Savage Accu-stock. T/C's website doesn't show them anymore but there are probably some out there for sale. Guaranteed .5 MOA out of the box.
The equation for my approach to rifles has become satisfaction:cost. Accuracy is part of that satisfaction. My recommendation is to design the rifle of your dreams and then have it built. As you said, this site is full of resources. Scour the threads and reach out to the builders. My favorite is Accurate Ordnance, my dad's is Short Action Customs, you will find tons of great info on GAP, and so on. All of them will accommodate every detail, and you should require no less. Whatever the cost I suggest you save up for it and do it. Eat peanut butter and Ramen noodles for the next 6 months, or year, or whatever. You will not be more satisfied by going any other route.
It's funny you say that. 3 of the 4 or 5 Tikkas I have shot are 270WSM. Its a sweet little round. Can be hard to find though. There is very little kick and very little drop over longer distance (comparatively to other .30 cals).
I have been looking at ballistics at different hunting rounds and really was swung towards that round when Nosler came out with it's new LR ammo line.
Trophy Grade Long Range ? Nosler
I know that this caliber is hard to find, but in my case it is easier to use google than to reload.
I own a Browning A-bolt in 270 WSM and have had it since they were first introduced. It's a fantastic all around hunting round, fast, flat and plenty of oomph.
HOWEVER I must warn you most barrels aren't going to make it a long time. If you're just running it as a hunting rifle it will last a lifetime, but in my case, I started playing with load development and kept chasing a better load (it shot great with most loads but kept looking for more) and burnt it out in about 1500 rounds. This is somewhat unusually low round count for torching a barrel but it's partially due to the ridiculously deep throating of a stock Browning barrel. There's pretty much no 270 bullets out there that you can touch the rifling on it and fit the magazine on it.
That said, I'm going to re-barrel it in the same caliber with a Lilja #3 contour, work a single good load for it, and keep it as my hunting rifle only. I love the caliber and I think with a new barrel it will do exactly what I want it to do for the long haul. I've since built up a shooter for target shooting and matches so this one can remain for hunting.
Berger VLD 140's and 140 Accubonds have been the best so far in mine. Both very close to each other and sub moa I'd say about .8 ish but I can't load the VLD's to my magazine length and get them to shoot their best. With factory ammo (MANY different flavors but not Nosler) about the best it got was 1.5 moa, I attribute that to the long throat in the Browning barrel. I plan on having the chamber throated accordingly for the magazine with the VLD's even though I'll be giving up a touch of case capacity and velocity to do it. But after all it is a hunting rifle and single shot while getting the job done 99.9% of the time, just isn't acceptable to me.
I plan on giving the Nosler LR's a shot once the re-barrel is done this winter as if it works as advertised it should be exactly what I'm looking for, if not I'll probably end up with the VLD's. We'll see, I won't really be able to start playing with it until spring as my recently reconstructed collar bone has me not shooting anything with more recoil than an AR and I'm going to wait on the re-barrel until after the first of the year to keep from tempting myself. It's not a very heavy rifle and currently has no brake on it, and probably won't so it bucks a bit, although no where near what the 325 WSM I had did, that thing was rough.
I plan on giving the Nosler LR's a shot once the re-barrel is done this winter as if it works as advertised it should be exactly what I'm looking for, if not I'll probably end up with the VLD's. We'll see, I won't really be able to start playing with it until spring as my recently reconstructed collar bone has me not shooting anything with more recoil than an AR and I'm going to wait on the re-barrel until after the first of the year to keep from tempting myself. It's not a very heavy rifle and currently has no brake on it, and probably won't so it bucks a bit, although no where near what the 325 WSM I had did, that thing was rough.
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I would highly suggest the Savage 10 series with a more traditional style stock. Great accuracy out of the box and ease of maintenance at home. The 10fp would be a great rifle to shoot beyond 400 as well as a joy to carry.
Please show me a link of this rifle, have been hunting for 6.5 creed also. As I don't reload, I have heard that Hornady loads from factory very well and most shooters are getting very close velocity numbers when testing with chronograph.
I think ur going at this ass backward....any factory rifle can be made to shoot for only a little extra money...If u only have 3k to spend Spend around a grand on the rifle and put the rest of the money toward the scope. A better scope will increase your accuracy way more than a custom gap rifle and a cheaper scope
I couldn't agree more. Went the same route by getting a 5-R and was amazed at it's accuracy. Couldn't stand the X-Mark Pro trigger but a new Timney was only $125.
Shot sub .5 MOA for almost 10K rounds. Now has a new Benchmark barrel on it and shoots even better.
Just beware of the temptation to "accessorize". A high end scope here and a nice "Varmint/Tactical" stock there will run the cost up pretty quick.
I had gap build me a 270 wsm back in 09 and it is a fine rifle, shoots flat and hits deer hard. I run the 140 gr accubond and it smokes deer. With that being said I do have a 7saum being built at Bryant customs now that will be a little lighter and I will have a larger selection of bullets to load for hunting. (these are hunting rifles). If you do not reload I would look at the 280 rem. I guy can pick a stainless rem for 1100+/- put a good scope on it and be set for whatever. then if you do start to reload then u can really make that thing shine! Less ammo options but the 6.5-06 would be a fine rig but then ur getting semi custom there.
jsnpck,
For the $1500-$2000 you'd be willing to spend you can build your own:
Brownells has Rem 700 SA receiver on sale for = $389.99; BDL bottom (trigger guard, box, spring follower = ~$150; recoil lug = $30; quality barrel Bartlein/Kreiger = ~$350 (Grizzly Industrial, Bug Holes, Brunos have barrels in stock, the question is in a contour & caliber that will work for you or pick some other quality barrel...); Stocks = Bell & Carlson ~ $270, HS Precision ~$350, Manners/McMillian $550 up. Using a BC or HS stock you'll have ~ $1200-$1300 in parts with cash left to pay your gunsmith and you build your own 6.5 CM. Might even have a little left out of the $2k to upgrade trigger. For the remaining $1K you'll be able to get bases, rings and a decent scope.
For the $1500-$2000 you'd be willing to spend you can build your own:
Brownells has Rem 700 SA receiver on sale for = $389.99; BDL bottom (trigger guard, box, spring follower = ~$150; recoil lug = $30; quality barrel Bartlein/Kreiger = ~$350 (Grizzly Industrial, Bug Holes, Brunos have barrels in stock, the question is in a contour & caliber that will work for you or pick some other quality barrel...); Stocks = Bell & Carlson ~ $270, HS Precision ~$350, Manners/McMillian $550 up. Using a BC or HS stock you'll have ~ $1200-$1300 in parts with cash left to pay your gunsmith and you build your own 6.5 CM. Might even have a little left out of the $2k to upgrade trigger. For the remaining $1K you'll be able to get bases, rings and a decent scope.
So much internal conflict, instant gratification versus waiting on what I really want. I think you just nailed it, just had to hear it. No sense in buying a rifle that I am not content with when I am willing to spend more than $800 on a factory rifle. I do have other rifles to suffice my hunting needs currently, so I shouldn't rush on this.
One thing nice about the 5-R is that first it comes with a Stainless Steel Action rather than a "carbon steel" one's that Brownell's offers. The 5-R's get a little (maybe a lot) more attention at the factory. My 5-R had all the signs of having been accurized from the factory judging by the tool marks on the bolt face, nice even contact on the locking lugs, and nice smooth bolt rails (milling marks polished down).
Makes for a nice action down the road when you decide to change calibers or just plain shoot out the barrel.
Please show me a link of this rifle, have been hunting for 6.5 creed also. As I don't reload, I have heard that Hornady loads from factory very well and most shooters are getting very close velocity numbers when testing with chronograph.
Tikka T3 Lite Bolt-Action Rifles – Stainless Steel Barrels : Cabela's
May not have the 6.5 in stock, but others might. I know Sportsmans Warehouse carry's them as well. Good luck. If you can't find the 6.5 creed then a .260 would be it's equal.
Tikka T3 Lite Bolt-Action Rifles – Stainless Steel Barrels : Cabela's
May not have the 6.5 in stock, but others might. I know Sportsmans Warehouse carry's them as well. Good luck. If you can't find the 6.5 creed then a .260 would be it's equal.
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Sendero with a muzzle brake or a Rem 5R. Adjust the trigger yourself. ~$1200-1400.
Leupold or NF scope. Something that goes up to 20x or more and has target knobs. $1000-1800
$500-700 for a reloading setup and make your own ammo.
Leupold or NF scope. Something that goes up to 20x or more and has target knobs. $1000-1800
$500-700 for a reloading setup and make your own ammo.
WHo "needs" a custom rifle to use for hunting? You'll just scratch it up. Find a decent used 700 or buy one of Dick's which are on sale til Sat I think. Just get it in a size that will fit the caliber you really want. Send it off for a custom barrel (I don't mean a 2nd tier barrel, stick to Hart maybe Shilen select, Kreiger, Brux, Bartlein, Rock etc) and bedding job. Put a decent scope on it (no cheapy). Add a good trigger if needed, if you can't make it fire when on target, it doesn't matter how accurate it is. New 700s usually need one, older 700s have a trigger that can be adjusted. You mentioned you had a lever gun so you really don't need a long range accurate rifle for brush hunting. $400 for the donor and approx $600 for the barrel installed, another 150 -200 for bedding.
I've owned custom high end long guns in the past, and I have found that I tend to prefer high end factory offerings. (Generally) you'll get 90% of the performance for much lower cost.
Are they as refined? No. Are there some features the customs may have? Yes. Can you pick and choose any of those to have done to your factory gun? Usually.
For instance, my (new to me) Rem 5r is a half minute rifle or better with 175GMM. I found it locally for $700.
Now, that deal isn't typical but even at retail or slightly used for $1000-$1200 you are getting a lot for your money IMO. My older Savage 10 provided similar down range performance.
If it were me, I'd spend $1200 on a rifle, your choice on optics (there are a lot of functional options for $1k these days), and spend the rest on ammo and hunting trips. I can kill a lot of game for the $3500 savings.
Everyone's tastes are different. I like high end gear, but I find that I am happy with high end factory options. There are a lot of guys here with custom sticks that are awesome rifles but I think the number of them represented gives a false sense of need to newer shooters. At this point in my life, traveling and shooting is more important than sinking those funds into the rifle itself.
Are they as refined? No. Are there some features the customs may have? Yes. Can you pick and choose any of those to have done to your factory gun? Usually.
For instance, my (new to me) Rem 5r is a half minute rifle or better with 175GMM. I found it locally for $700.
Now, that deal isn't typical but even at retail or slightly used for $1000-$1200 you are getting a lot for your money IMO. My older Savage 10 provided similar down range performance.
If it were me, I'd spend $1200 on a rifle, your choice on optics (there are a lot of functional options for $1k these days), and spend the rest on ammo and hunting trips. I can kill a lot of game for the $3500 savings.
Everyone's tastes are different. I like high end gear, but I find that I am happy with high end factory options. There are a lot of guys here with custom sticks that are awesome rifles but I think the number of them represented gives a false sense of need to newer shooters. At this point in my life, traveling and shooting is more important than sinking those funds into the rifle itself.
IF you are looking for hunting and long range shooting, why not buy 2 rifles? I have had a couple 1903 sporters that have given me 1" or so at 100yds. Plenty enough for most big game to 300-400yds. I never paid over $200 for them. I picked up a rem 700 sporter in 30-06 for $300 that shot 1-1.25" with Federal fusion hunting ammo. IMO you need to spend some time learning how to shoot at longer ranges before you can hunt well at longer ranges.
Is what I would do is buy a decent hunting rifle like a savage or pony up a few more bucks for a Tikka T3 Lite. The Tikkas are an underrated rifle. Very smooth, nice and accurate to boot. Its a bit of a crap shoot with a used gun, but if you get the crown cleaned up on most hunting rifles, they will give you good results. Then I would buy a heavy/varmint barreled rifle in 308 to learn the long range stuff. You could still hunt with the heavy barreled 308, its not ideal but can be done. Like said above, if you take your time with a savage in 308, break it in and do some simple work to it, you can easily get to 1k yds for under $1k. I have a friend that bought a savage mod 10 of some sort and chopped and threaded the heavy barrel to 16 or 18", put on a 20moa EGW rail, Warne 1" rings and a bushnell elite 10x fixed scope and was ringing 2ft square steel plates at 875yds with out any effort using Fed GMM ammo. 1k yards was a little more difficult, but he was still hitting the steel with annoying regularity.
So it can be done done for not a lot of dough. You don't need a $4-6k worth of rifle to shoot longer ranges. Sure the cheaper guns aren't as cool with all the fun toys on them, but they can still do a lot of the same things as the big money guns.
Is what I would do is buy a decent hunting rifle like a savage or pony up a few more bucks for a Tikka T3 Lite. The Tikkas are an underrated rifle. Very smooth, nice and accurate to boot. Its a bit of a crap shoot with a used gun, but if you get the crown cleaned up on most hunting rifles, they will give you good results. Then I would buy a heavy/varmint barreled rifle in 308 to learn the long range stuff. You could still hunt with the heavy barreled 308, its not ideal but can be done. Like said above, if you take your time with a savage in 308, break it in and do some simple work to it, you can easily get to 1k yds for under $1k. I have a friend that bought a savage mod 10 of some sort and chopped and threaded the heavy barrel to 16 or 18", put on a 20moa EGW rail, Warne 1" rings and a bushnell elite 10x fixed scope and was ringing 2ft square steel plates at 875yds with out any effort using Fed GMM ammo. 1k yards was a little more difficult, but he was still hitting the steel with annoying regularity.
So it can be done done for not a lot of dough. You don't need a $4-6k worth of rifle to shoot longer ranges. Sure the cheaper guns aren't as cool with all the fun toys on them, but they can still do a lot of the same things as the big money guns.
Kind of like guy's who carry guns for a living. A LEO or "Grunt" would be perfectly happy with a good reliable pistol on his belt. Now if he were to go to a lot of BBQ's in Texas, he'd need one that's a lot more "pimped out"
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