Advice on Getting Bigger

[Rerun7]

Need some advice from guys who have successfully put on a decent amount of muscle.

Here’s my dilemma, I struggle to put on a meaningful amount of muscle on my workout programs. I can get cut and I also get stronger but I gain less than 1lb of muscle per month even when I’m being methodical about everything.

I’ve gotten in way better shape the last few years but I’m at a loss on getting bigger without getting fatter and looking to rethink how I’m going about this and could use some advice.

Things I’ve focused on previously so we can get the obvious stuff out of the way:
- diet -
I track all calories and stay in a surplus. I’ve done it with a little surplus and I’ve done it with a lot of surplus. Both have me very similar muscle growth but I quickly packed on fat when I went above about 200-300 calories surplus a day. Lots of protein, moderate fat and complex carbs.

- workouts -
I have mixed up rep ranges from low reps(5) to higher reps(15) and always focus on adding more weight as the determining factor of whether or not it works. I end up getting stronger to the point that it takes a toll on my joints/back and I usually plateau so I start into a new rep scheme. At 145lbs I was doing 405lb DL, 235lb BP and 315lb squat. It was taking a toll on me so I’ve had to back off a bit. Those numbers were double where I started and I’m still close to the same size.

- Intensity -
I go to failure on every exercise by my last set. Most times I cannot complete all the reps of my last set. I typically rest for 90 seconds between sets and a few minutes between exercises. Workouts don’t go longer than 1hr.

- Volume -
I’ve tried 3x a week full body, upper lower split 4 days a week, PPL 3x a week. All about the same results. I keep cardio low unless I’m cutting.

- Rest -
I get 7-8hrs sleep at night and take rest days of 1-2 days per muscle group depending on the workout scheme.


So what’s been the key for some of you guys that you think I may be missing out on? Also, I’m 40 so I know that plays some amount into it but this has been the cycle for the past 4 or so years.

No bro science like “eat big to get big”... see above, tried that.

 

[clcustom1911]

As far a workout programs go, I would really try a "German Volume Training" or 10x10 program. If done correctly, it will allow you to put on realistically 1-2 pounds a week. You may he able to up your calories because you honestly burn a ton of calories during the workouts as well.

When I was younger, like teens/early 20's, I wasn't able to put on size for shit and this program was the only one that actually helped me break past a few different plateaus during the last decade or so. I'm 35 now and mainly working cardio and bodyweight exercises mainly with some other weightlifting supplementing my calisthenic stuff.

I know for me, when I want to really bust through a plateau, GVT is one sure way to do it.


Oh..... and....

If you wanna get big, lifff big and eat big, bro. ?

 

[clcustom1911]

Oh, and also, after age 30 or so, men's testosterone, GH, IGF-1, LH, and FSH begin declining. Like menopause for women is treated with assorted hormones, the same hormone change known in some circles as "andropause" can be effectively treated in men with hormonal replacement therapy, or HRT. I've had my hormone levels tested every other year for the last 6 to establish a baseline so when they start to decline, my doctor and I can develop a plan to keep me shootin' turtle wax for many years into the future.

 

[One1Bravo]

Your best options are all the food and sleep you can get. If you're not happy with the results you get from that its probably time to consider getting on a cycle.

 

[clcustom1911]

...... getting on a cycle.

A legally prescribed cycle of HRT monitored by your doctor ?

 

[Rerun7]

Yeah, I’ve considered testosterone decline could be a factor but I haven’t gotten it tested. I may do that in the near future.

When you guys lift do you focus more on slower reps focused on the stretch and contraction or move a little faster and making sure you have decent form?

I’ve also wondered if maybe I’m just not doing something right in the “way” that I lift.

 

[Huskydriver]

A legally prescribed cycle of HRT monitored by your doctor ?

I think he was referring to tren

 

[clcustom1911]

I think he was referring to tren

I'm advising a perfectly legal HRT cycle.



If you wanna do a 16 week Sust/EQ/tren enan/primo cycle with an anavar kicker for the first 3 weeks with some femara/anastrozole sprinkles and a 6 week HCG/nolva pct, that's on you.

?

 

[Rerun7]

Ha. Let’s assume all legal...

 

[brianf]

1911 is right and using the right "gear" (thats what dorian yates used to call it, most guys call it "shit")

all joking aside, your not going to put on weight very fast

its genetics, metabolism etc

your also training way to much if your looking for size

the schedule you are training is like some one who is already taking stuff, and even then its too much for size

you cant train that schedule, be natural expect to see gains and not start falling apart

bunch of my friends compete on stage and one friend (my current training partner) turned IBBF pro about 10 years back

im also the only guy of the group who doesnt take anything extra, so i can tell you from experience you cant train like "they" do at the same intensity

you can for a while but i start breaking down in late winter (they/we start back up hard in September after the body cleans out over the late summer)

thats when the bulking stopped, change gear and reps start going up slightly and weights start dropping getting for ready for a show(s) in the spring-summer

 

[Kickin45]

5 days a week, 2 days on 1 day off, each body part twice a week. Lift slow and heavy and concentrate on proper form, flexing at the top of each rep. No cardio. Keep your heart rate below 125 for the entire workout.
Clean carbs and lots of them.
Minimum of 13-15gms of good clean carbs and 40gms of clean protein in 6 meals every day, 1&1-2 gallons of water everyday. Men’s daily chewable or capsule. NOT a pill. Omega fish oil

Once you accomplish that, you will grow, guaranteed.

 

[clcustom1911]

If you've never done it, or anything like it, GVT will smoke you. 3 day a week training program. Going natural, or uh... enhanced.... it will shock your body. For your main exercises, the compound lifts, you need to establish your 100% 1 rem max or figure out what weight you can do a 20 rep set and hit failure on the 20th rep. That's usually about 75-80% of your 1 rep max. The rest, or lack of it between sets is part of the gig. That's because if you wait 2-3 minutes between sets, your body can replenish its ATP to those muscles you just worked; with the 90 second or less reat between sets, your body will be forced to recruit other muscle fibers, causing them to get worked too. You may only be able to get 10 reps until the 6th or 7th set, that's fine, if you're going to failure on the last couple sets, make sure it's a "positive failure" where you fail at the top, without a spotter..... try the below program for just 6 weeks and see how you like it. Its deceptively simple. Notice the tempo? Slower on the eccentric (stretching portion, or "down" portion), so on bench press, 4 seconds down, no rest, 2 seconds up, 4 seconds down, no rest, 2 seconds up, etc.

 

[10000yards]

OP wanna look sexy for the ladies huh

 

[benchmstr]

Need some advice from guys who have successfully put on a decent amount of muscle.

Here’s my dilemma, I struggle to put on a meaningful amount of muscle on my workout programs. I can get cut and I also get stronger but I gain less than 1lb of muscle per month even when I’m being methodical about everything.

I’ve gotten in way better shape the last few years but I’m at a loss on getting bigger without getting fatter and looking to rethink how I’m going about this and could use some advice.

Things I’ve focused on previously so we can get the obvious stuff out of the way:
- diet -
I track all calories and stay in a surplus. I’ve done it with a little surplus and I’ve done it with a lot of surplus. Both have me very similar muscle growth but I quickly packed on fat when I went above about 200-300 calories surplus a day. Lots of protein, moderate fat and complex carbs.

- workouts -
I have mixed up rep ranges from low reps(5) to higher reps(15) and always focus on adding more weight as the determining factor of whether or not it works. I end up getting stronger to the point that it takes a toll on my joints/back and I usually plateau so I start into a new rep scheme. At 145lbs I was doing 405lb DL, 235lb BP and 315lb squat. It was taking a toll on me so I’ve had to back off a bit. Those numbers were double where I started and I’m still close to the same size.

- Intensity -
I go to failure on every exercise by my last set. Most times I cannot complete all the reps of my last set. I typically rest for 90 seconds between sets and a few minutes between exercises. Workouts don’t go longer than 1hr.

- Volume -
I’ve tried 3x a week full body, upper lower split 4 days a week, PPL 3x a week. All about the same results. I keep cardio low unless I’m cutting.

- Rest -
I get 7-8hrs sleep at night and take rest days of 1-2 days per muscle group depending on the workout scheme.


So what’s been the key for some of you guys that you think I may be missing out on? Also, I’m 40 so I know that plays some amount into it but this has been the cycle for the past 4 or so years.

No bro science like “eat big to get big”... see above, tried that.

You, my friend need to listen to Stan efferding!

I have been big before, I have competed in bodybuilding and have been classified as elite in several weight classes of raw powerlifting. If Stan would have been around when I was younger I could have done it faster, safer, and I would be healthier!

Check him out...he will not steer you wrong.

I settled on daily cardio and I cycle 6 weeks of German volume training and 8 weeks of Sheiko powerlifting...i don’t plan to compete anymore but I will likely workout this way forever.

I adhere to the vertical diet as well

Bench

 

[benchmstr]

If you've never done it, or anything like it, GVT will smoke you. 3 day a week training program. Going natural, or uh... enhanced.... it will shock your body. For your main exercises, the compound lifts, you need to establish your 100% 1 rem max or figure out what weight you can do a 20 rep set and hit failure on the 20th rep. That's usually about 75-80% of your 1 rep max. The rest, or lack of it between sets is part of the gig. That's because if you wait 2-3 minutes between sets, your body can replenish its ATP to those muscles you just worked; with the 90 second or less reat between sets, your body will be forced to recruit other muscle fibers, causing them to get worked too. You may only be able to get 10 reps until the 6th or 7th set, that's fine, if you're going to failure on the last couple sets, make sure it's a "positive failure" where you fail at the top, without a spotter..... try the below program for just 6 weeks and see how you like it. Its deceptively simple. Notice the tempo? Slower on the eccentric (stretching portion, or "down" portion), so on bench press, 4 seconds down, no rest, 2 seconds up, 4 seconds down, no rest, 2 seconds up, etc.

View attachment 7148111

View attachment 7148112

German volume training is worthless without a more stringent guideline..most people do not understand or cheat themselves when dealing with RPE and never accomplish anything.

German volume training like all powerlifting(because GVT was invented by and for off season powerlifters) is based off of percentages of 1 rep max...it is crucial!

The biggest downfall of GVT followers is saying “add 5lbs a week”...ok, how does that make any damn sense? Lol

Adding 5% perhaps? That makes since because it accounts for the variable of individualism.

GVT works...but in America it is usually done wrong outside of a powerlifting gym

Bench

 

[Rerun7]

I might give the GVT a try. My only concern is pushing my joints, etc into injury. As Mentioned above I also wonder if I am overtraining.

One thing I left out is that it never seems to fail that I will plateau at some point and I’ve ended up with a couple injuries that have put a damper on training.

Is it worth doing GVT with slightly lower weights so that it is easier on joints or do you just spin your wheels that way?

 

[Rerun7]

OP wanna look sexy for the ladies huh

Haha. Actually not really. I mean... who doesn’t want to look nice for the ladies??? But that’s not really my goal.

I can get cut with a six pack and look very muscular but I feel like with how hard I’ve worked I should be way bigger.

 

[benchmstr]

I might give the GVT a try. My only concern is pushing my joints, etc into injury. As Mentioned above I also wonder if I am overtraining.

One thing I left out is that it never seems to fail that I will plateau at some point and I’ve ended up with a couple injuries that have put a damper on training.

Is it worth doing GVT with slightly lower weights so that it is easier on joints or do you just spin your wheels that way?

you are not a pro athlete...you are not now or will ever be in danger of overtraining....

bench

 

[Rerun7]

Overtraining in the sense of not giving my body adequate recovery to grow and then injuring myself.

 

[Velocity Chad]

Without "help", genetics is the biggest piece of it. Obviously you have to eat right and put in the work, but a hard gainer is going to hit a wall, especially as you get older. Unfortunately, all of the good legal help has been taken from the market, so if you really want big gains you'll have to become a criminal.

 

[benchmstr]

Overtraining in the sense of not giving my body adequate recovery to grow and then injuring myself.

it will never happen. overtraining is not a myth. However, you will not see it.

I work out with several professional athletes who go beyond the realm of good taste in training...and i run and do GVT 6 days a week. Overtraining for the average person is a myth.

hell, I know guys who have trained 4-6 hours a day in preparations for the crossfit games....you will be fine

bench

 

[benchmstr]

Without "help", genetics is the biggest piece of it. Obviously you have to eat right and put in the work, but a hard gainer is going to hit a wall, especially as you get older. Unfortunately, all of the good legal help has been taken from the market, so if you really want big gains you'll have to become a criminal.

Bud, anti aging clinics are practically using people as dart boards these days...no need to be a criminal

bench

 

[--BLACKOUT--]

If you run a true hypertrophy block, you can put on a good amount of muscle in 12 weeks. It involves lighter weights, never going to failure and filling the muscles with blood... getting a pump... every workout. Eating clean, 7-9hrs of sleep and zero cardio is optimal. Also, taking the muscle through full range of motion and each rep is like a pendulum with same amount of time on the eccentric as well as concentric. Time between sets is when you catch your breath you are ready to go.

At 41, I added 15 pounds in 9 weeks with 4 weeks to go. Look up Jeff Nichols CSCS and RP Diet app. Both are no joke.

 

[clcustom1911]

@benchmstr

You referred people cheating themselves when dealing with "RPE".

Whats RPE? Ive never heard of that... or maybe cant remember right now.

Thanks for all the info you posted. Great stuff.

 

[benchmstr]

@benchmstr

You referred people cheating themselves when dealing with "RPE".

Whats RPE? Ive never heard of that... or maybe cant remember right now.

Thanks for all the info you posted. Great stuff.

Rating of Perceived Exertion (RPE), which is a fancy way of guessing....

its truly is almost impossible..but percentages are easy to manage

bench

 

[clcustom1911]

Ah haaaaa. Gotcha. Thank you for sharing. Very solid info.

 

[Rerun7]

Rating of Perceived Exertion (RPE), which is a fancy way of guessing....

its truly is almost impossible..but percentages are easy to manage

bench

Question on this. Do you ever hit a point that you can’t do the reps at a prescribed %? Let’s say it’s 80% of 1RM for 3 sets of 10 reps but you can only do 10, 9, 8.

Is that an indication you need to work on endurance training more?

 

[benchmstr]

Question on this. Do you ever hit a point that you can’t do the reps at a prescribed %? Let’s say it’s 80% of 1RM for 3 sets of 10 reps but you can only do 10, 9, 8.

Is that an indication you need to work on endurance training more?

Thats another problem with GVT, people assume GVT is hitting 10 reps every time....the sets are suppose to go down to 8 or so...you are suppose to struggle and occasionally fail...thats how you force muscle growth.

bench

 

[Rerun7]

I typically fail on every exercise on at least one set and sometimes two. I was doing a plan once that was programmed that way but couldn’t complete the prescribed reps at the % so wasn’t sure if that’s normal.

I’ve been working more endurance lately so running higher rep ranges 12-15 as opposed to the 6-10 range I’ve been training in for a while.

 

[HeavyAssault]

I'd give up 50lbs in muscle at this point in my life. Going "big' has disadvantages. Back in the day a little too late I discovered Tabata, converted it to use during my weight training. I never gained any significant size but by the Lord I was solid as stone, and strong as ever. Since you are 40....stay hard and lean....you will thank me later.

 

[Stive_Rogers]

aha, I agree that the rule "the more you eat the faster you will gain weight" does not work, because each person has a different metabolism. For example, like mine, I weigh 70 kg, but no matter how much I eat, I still don't gain weight, so other methods are needed here. I think you also tried proper nutrition, but if it does not work then I can advise you to try all sorts of supplements for increasing muscle mass, for example, one steroid SARM called YK11. It was recommended to me by a friend of mine who also had a problem with weight gain. This steroid also strengthens bones, so it's a good thing. But before using, read about the side effects.

 

[benchmstr]

aha, I agree that the rule "the more you eat the faster you will gain weight" does not work, because each person has a different metabolism.

That’s nonsense.

I have trained a lot of people over the years in bodybuilding and powerlifting. The guys that claim to have a “fast metabolism” never once have met their calorie goals when I have them chart them...they also never complete a workout if left on their own.

those same guys when they adhere to a consistent calorie surplus and progressive overload program grow fast...the problem is the lie of a fast metabolism.

bench

 

[postmabail]

Alright, one pound of muscle a month is extremely good especially if you can maintain that. You can’t expect to be putting on 3-4 pounds of muscle a month naturally. If you consistently do One pound of muscle a month that is fantastic. One pound of fat is equal to 3,500cals so if you want to put on muscle what I would suggest is a 100-200calorie surplus a day. However you can also lose fat and still build muscle. A safe bet is a 500 calorie deficit a day so that would be a pound of fat a week if you continue to progressively overload. I highly recommend Greg doucettes channel on YT he is one of the most informative people on the platform.

 

[hunting_fishing_addict]

I can humbly say I have put on some muscle in my time. The best thing that works is caloric intake at your AMR and doing it correctly. Find your BMR then find your AMR. Achieve that caloric intake everyday. Obviously your going to sling some weights too, but that’s a given. Results are 75-80% diet. Good luck with your gains bud.

 

[E-Tool]

More protein in your diet, or add casein.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Need some advice from guys who have successfully put on a decent amount of muscle.

Here’s my dilemma, I struggle to put on a meaningful amount of muscle on my workout programs. I can get cut and I also get stronger but I gain less than 1lb of muscle per month even when I’m being methodical about everything.

I’ve gotten in way better shape the last few years but I’m at a loss on getting bigger without getting fatter and looking to rethink how I’m going about this and could use some advice.

Things I’ve focused on previously so we can get the obvious stuff out of the way:
- diet -
I track all calories and stay in a surplus. I’ve done it with a little surplus and I’ve done it with a lot of surplus. Both have me very similar muscle growth but I quickly packed on fat when I went above about 200-300 calories surplus a day. Lots of protein, moderate fat and complex carbs.

- workouts -
I have mixed up rep ranges from low reps(5) to higher reps(15) and always focus on adding more weight as the determining factor of whether or not it works. I end up getting stronger to the point that it takes a toll on my joints/back and I usually plateau so I start into a new rep scheme. At 145lbs I was doing 405lb DL, 235lb BP and 315lb squat. It was taking a toll on me so I’ve had to back off a bit. Those numbers were double where I started and I’m still close to the same size.

- Intensity -
I go to failure on every exercise by my last set. Most times I cannot complete all the reps of my last set. I typically rest for 90 seconds between sets and a few minutes between exercises. Workouts don’t go longer than 1hr.

- Volume -
I’ve tried 3x a week full body, upper lower split 4 days a week, PPL 3x a week. All about the same results. I keep cardio low unless I’m cutting.

- Rest -
I get 7-8hrs sleep at night and take rest days of 1-2 days per muscle group depending on the workout scheme.


So what’s been the key for some of you guys that you think I may be missing out on? Also, I’m 40 so I know that plays some amount into it but this has been the cycle for the past 4 or so years.

No bro science like “eat big to get big”... see above, tried that.

Watch this, then watch again and Watch one more time.


"If you are low in testosterone and want to get bigger/faster/stronger..........forget about it"

Move to the vertical diet. You are probally eating shit and not enough Micronutrients. Eat more. You grow muscule with food. Your Diet should be mostly Steak.

Get on TRT. You can't fight genetics or father time. You will feel like you are 18 again.

Lift every other day. Your body needs rest to grow.

Get more sleep. Get a Sleep study done, you may need a CPAP.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

More protein in your diet, or add casein.

Most studies have shown you only need .8g protein per lb of lean mass to grow muscle.

Your body will also convert excess protien into carbs for energy, which is why you need alot more fat than Protein.

Protien comes from Meat. Eggs, Bacon, Steak, Salmon. You can easily hit your Macros and Calorie goals eating clean.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Grab some kettlebells, learn the techniques, you'll get ripped and stay a healthy lean and wicked strong.

Lifting weights is the least important /impactfull part of building muscle. Ignore everything else and you will lose muscle despite lifting hard.

 

[Rerun7]

You guys realize I posted this over a year ago right?

 

[benchmstr]

Watch this, then watch again and Watch one more time.


"If you are low in testosterone and want to get bigger/faster/stronger..........forget about it"

Move to the vertical diet. You are probally eating shit and not enough Micronutrients. Eat more. You grow muscule with food. Your Diet should be mostly Steak.

Get on TRT. You can't fight genetics or father time. You will feel like you are 18 again.

Lift every other day. Your body needs rest to grow.

Get more sleep. Get a Sleep study done, you may need a CPAP.

I have worked out and bullshitted with stan many times before. He is right about everything.

bench

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

There should be a warning when about to post in a thread over a month old.

You guys realize I posted this over a year ago right?

Howz the Gainz?

 

[Rerun7]

There should be a warning when about to post in a thread over a month old.



Howz the Gainz?

Bro... it’s been insane!! Like 70lbs of pure rip...

 

[Rerun7]

Haha. On a real note I tried all kinds of stuff and never really progressed at a rate I was happy with vs the input so I refocused on functional fitness. A lot more cardio and maintaining muscle.

I’ve won my last two 10k run n gun comps so it’s been pretty good results.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Chicks dig muscles not skinny little runners

 

[The D]

Watch this, then watch again and Watch one more time.


"If you are low in testosterone and want to get bigger/faster/stronger..........forget about it"

Move to the vertical diet. You are probally eating shit and not enough Micronutrients. Eat more. You grow muscule with food. Your Diet should be mostly Steak.

Get on TRT. You can't fight genetics or father time. You will feel like you are 18 again.

Lift every other day. Your body needs rest to grow.

Get more sleep. Get a Sleep study done, you may need a CPAP.

TRT should be a decision made after you’ve made decent progress and used as an enhancement only(strictly my opinion), but you should absolutely listen to everything Stan Efferding says. I mean, he trained The Mountain for fucks sake. I posted this in my “beyond keto” thread but I’ll re-post again. Listen to this a few times as well

How to become as strong as possible with Stan Efferding - Heart & Soil Supplements

Stan Efferding is an IFBB Professional bodybuilder and World Record Holding Powerlifter. He is one of only 10 men in the world to ever total over 2,300 pounds

heartandsoil.co

 

[Rerun7]

Chicks dig muscles not skinny little runners

My chick chasing days are long gone and I agree that no one is interested in looking like a marathoner. I’ve still got a decent build but now I can run 5 miles in full kit.

At 40+ I like the look on those 20 year old studs faces when I smoke em, lol.

 

[JRaven]

Most studies have shown you only need .8g protein per lb of lean mass to grow muscle.

Your body will also convert excess protien into carbs for energy, which is why you need alot more fat than Protein.

Protien comes from Meat. Eggs, Bacon, Steak, Salmon. You can easily hit your Macros and Calorie goals eating clean.

The minimal effective dose for building muscle in untrained individuals is around .8 grams per pound of body weight. All the cool protein overfeeding studies show that protein has a thermogenic effect and overeating protein is never problematic. Even when calories are in a surplus and the surplus comes from protein the effect is positive.

And I think you are referring to gluconeogenesis - a metabolic process where glucose is converted from non-carbohydrate precursors.

Everyone talks about gluconeogenesis like it is absolute effect - it is isn't. The chances of gluconeogenesis happening from protein overfeeding are rare and almost non-existent in athletes who carry an inordinate amount of muscle. Not to say it doesn't happen in untrained or people with lower levels of lean body mass but it is the nutritional abominable snowman.

Stan is a good dude. We had him on our podcast. I like that his Vertical diet focuses on micro-nutrients over macro-nutrients. I have long advocated for people to eat the most nutrient dense foods. His diet does an excellent job of making it simple.

 

[JRaven]

Lifting weights is the least important /impactfull part of building muscle. Ignore everything else and you will lose muscle despite lifting hard.

Are you saying that lifting weights is the least important aspect of gaining muscle?

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Haha. On a real note I tried all kinds of stuff and never really progressed at a rate I was happy with vs the input so I refocused on functional fitness. A lot more cardio and maintaining muscle.

I’ve won my last two 10k run n gun comps so it’s been pretty good results.

Was in the same boat. Only slow gained required lots of heavy weights and shit ton of supplements. I couldn't eat enough calories and protein in food. Got fit as fuck. No mass.

Now only gainz are from beer and bacon.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Are you saying that lifting weights is the least important aspect of gaining muscle?

Da