AR in 6.8 for small female??

[steve123]

My adult daughter is 95 lbs, 4'10", and she wants a """"compact and very lightweight AR"""" for hiking and self protection.

What brand and model is suggested for sub $1000?

 

[RyanScott]

Is 6.8 a requirement?

 

[346ci]

The 6.8 doesn't have much more recoil than the 5.56 which makes it a good replacement for the power gained.

As for factory rifles, high end; LWRC, Barrett, LMT. Mid range; RRA and Stag.

I would go this route and build your own lower. Contact Eric at Blackstone Arms. He uses ARP barrels and could get you an upper put together. https://www.blackstonearms.com/6-8-16-Scout-Upper-p/68sctuprbgt.htm

 

[hlee]

The best gun for self protection is one that you always have on you and that you can deploy quickly. I've done some hiking with rifles and they suck to carry over any real distance (even light weight rifles). That's a lot of weight not doing you ANY good unless you are shooting something. You can make them bearable to carry by putting them in/on a pack, but then they suck to get into action. In my opinion, a pistol (a REAL handgun, not an AR with a brace) is the right solution to this question. Something she can carry on her person as opposed to on her pack, but not something that gets in the way or is overly obtrusive.

But, if you and she are dead set on a light weight AR, check out the "What would Stoner do?" series of InRange videos- on YouTube- for some ideas on a lightweight AR build. They talk about all of the parts they used, along with why, and I'm pretty sure they wound up with sub 6 lb rifles.

 

[W54/XM-388]

If she wants an AR15 style rifle for hiking and protection I'd suggest you build a light one in .223 with a fast twist barrel in around a 16" barrel length.

Hiking sucks if you have to carry weight. You could build an AR to be about 5.5 pounds including a red dot sight and backup flip up sights.

Run hot heavy 5.56 loads and it will take care of all her needs.

The 6.8 is going to be a bit harder on the recoil and I think being able to pop off lots of aimed rounds quickly is going to be better for self defense than the 6.8 which may be a bit more punishing for her to shoot.

Otherwise like the poster above said, get her a good full sized pistol with a full length barrel and put hot 9mm rounds in it (possibly also a red dot sight) and some 17 or more round magazines and you are all set.

 

[W54/XM-388]

95 pounds and 4ft 10 is a pretty small frame, so you may want to see also how much weight they actually want to carry.

Here is one of my sisters shooting my 5.2 pound AR in 5.56
She is about 110 pounds and about 5ft 3in or so.
The weight and recoil were pretty much perfect for her to shoot comfortably.

 

[steve123]

She just bought a Sig P365 G2 in 9mm, it's one cool little pistol!! It's as easy to shoot as my wife's G42 in 380 and holds 11 rounds. She will carry that most of the time.

I know it's being a bit paranoid but she is concerned about bear, cougar and things like that and wants a carbine in a rifle caliber. She won't be shooting any more than 500Y with me just for fun and I'm interested in reliability and stopping power up close. 6.5G would be an option I suppose but I feel the 6.8 would be more reliable. I have experience with 6.5G, 6mmAR and 6mmFatRat, (might be the mags but there are few choices and I've read of bolts breaking??) all of those have malfunctioned in mine and friends rifles. Another friends 6.8 hasn't malfunctioned that I know of and is a major reason I'm considering it.

Thanks for the suggestions!

 

[W54/XM-388]

I know it's being a bit paranoid but she is concerned about bear, cougar and things like that and wants a carbine in a rifle caliber.

Bear and cougar while hiking she would be better off with something like a Sig P220 Elite in 10mm or Glock 40 in 10mm worn on the hip.

You have to ask how realistic is it that on her hike she will be carrying the rifle in her hands at the ready to get it on target in time, most cougar attacks are not sit around and wait while you get the rifle off your back and around front.

 

[steve123]

Ha, you should see her shooting my STI 2011 in 40, that pistol to her is like us carrying a Desert Eagle. Though of course the STI is still easier to hit with because of the long sight radius, the weight, and 2lb trigger compared to the Sig. She is a very good shooter! We have a 12" steel at 20Y with a 1" hole cut in the middle and a railroad spike put in it. She can hit the spike, knock it out by repeated hits, then shoot through the hole before the mag is empty!!! She had a good teacher, dear old Dad.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Ruger PC Carbine. Mine uses the available, but needs to be ordered, Ruger American Pistol magazine well and shares 17rd magazines. Some very effective Personal Defense ammunition is available. Recoils is negligible, and it's pretty accurate with a Dot Scope added.

I use 124gr loads. Defensive. Practice.

The rifle is a two-piece takedown rifle, very much like the 10/22 takedown. Mine fits snug in this carry option for less obtrusive carry.

The rifle and pistol are my tentative choice for 2-Gun Combat matches.

Greg

 

[steve123]

Bear and cougar while hiking she would be better off with something like a Sig P220 Elite in 10mm or Glock 40 in 10mm worn on the hip.

You have to ask how realistic is it that on her hike she will be carrying the rifle in her hands at the ready to get it on target in time, most cougar attacks are not sit around and wait while you get the rifle off your back and around front.

I don't know if she has the grip strength to withstand 10mm, her hands are tiny as well?? My 40 loads are 130 power factor so.... The grip is small on the Sig and it works out well for her hand size.

True, it's a dilemma on what would work best but half the reason for a carbine is just to have one. She's thinking of sowing up some kind of harness system for the carbine so it's supported by both shoulders.

 

[RyanScott]

Is an SBR an option? An 11.5” gun would rock.

I’d use 5.56 with TSXs and a lightweight barrel. Lightweight everything. No forward assist.

 

[Snuby642]

You might consider a 6.5 grendel.
Enough power for the job, still can go light and light on recoil .
Definitely a powerful upgrade to 5.56.

I do not have a 6.8 to compare that to.

Edit I missed the part about bear, cqb with bear the grendel may be light.

 

[Codiekfx400]

Doesn’t white oak do a 6.8 upper.

 

[LeadZeke]

I don't see any reason to not go 5.56, especially in that price range. Just use rounds built for more penetration (m855A1, etc.) around bears. Best idea is to build one with lightweight parts, again especially in your price range. Pistol/SBR to keep the weight down, Faxon 11.5in barrel probably a good idea.

If you want a true bear cartridge you'd need to step up to large frame, and that isn't happening at this price point. Closest you'd get is the Savage MSR10 hunter and that will be large and heavy for her 100%.

 

[W54/XM-388]

I don't see any reason to not go 5.56, especially in that price range. Just use rounds built for more penetration (m855A1, etc.) around bears. Best idea is to build one with lightweight parts, again especially in your price range. Pistol/SBR to keep the weight down, Faxon 11.5in barrel probably a good idea.

I don't think you'll be significantly lighter than going with a full 16" thin profile barrel on a normal stocked one that can come in around the 5 pound mark.
Also you probably want at least a 16" barrel to get more velocity and a bit less muzzle flash.

 

[LeadZeke]

You save several ounces, not to mention it gets handier (which is important here) and the weight is not as far out. Flash isn't a concern with quality ammo and a quality flash hider (or better yet suppressor). The few hundred fps isn't a concern for these uses, only if you were going for hits at far greater distances.

 

[W54/XM-388]

The few hundred fps isn't a concern for these uses, only if you were going for hits at far greater distances.

When you are trying to kill something that wants to eat you, 300 to 400 FPS makes a big difference in penetration, especially when you are already shooting something smaller, which is counting on velocity to make up for less mass.
Target shooting or even shooting humans is very different from defense against big predators who have thick bodies, You don't just need to hit it, you need to be able to drive the bullet through into something vital.

Now you can load or buy ammo specially designed for SBRs that has a fast burn if you need to.

 

[Snuby642]

 

[Constructor]

My adult daughter is 95 lbs, 4'10", and she wants a """"compact and very lightweight AR"""" for hiking and self protection.

What brand and model is suggested for sub $1000?

Yes it would be, recoils a little more but not near what a 30-30 or shotgun would. It also shoots the same weight bullet out of the same length barrel about 100fps faster than the Grendel when both use factory loads. A 16" 6.8 will push a 120gr bullet to the same velocity a Grendel hits out of a 20".

 

[steve123]

Last Wednesday my daughter shot a friends M1 30 carbine. She liked the weight of it and of course the recoil was a non issue.

I don't think shooting 6.8 would be an issue either. If at all possible I'd rather go bigger than 223.

Searched around and found some expensive light AR's. I might have to build one to stay close to budget.

 

[RyanScott]

You can build cheaper. Upper without forward assist, lightweight barrel, lightweight muzzle device, Centurion CMR rail. 6.8 magazines are going to be heavier because they are steel, as are the rounds.

 

[Redleg06]

A 10-12" AR pistol would be a great lightweight build. Just make sure you get a carbine length gas system. Super handy little guns.

 

[Mute]

The problem with 6.8 is getting good magazines. Just get a 5.56 and use 75 or 77gr rounds if you're concerned about terminal performance.

 

[steve123]

The problem with 6.8 is getting good magazines. Just get a 5.56 and use 75 or 77gr rounds if you're concerned about terminal performance.

I thought the PRI 6.8 was a good mag??

Which are the better 223 mags then?

 

[Forward543]

I thought the PRI 6.8 was a good mag??

Which are the better 223 mags then?

The pri 6.8 mags are good. A short barrel 6.8 should be badass for your requirement. Real bear deterent it is not, as a determined bear is a real bitch. But for everything else, a short barrel 6.8 should kick ass.

I would suggest having a custom build, or building yourself. I have had very good luck with ARP barrels and having very good reliability with good parts around it.

 

[Wormydog1724]

I thought the PRI 6.8 was a good mag??

PRI 6.8 mags are great. 15 rounders, 10 rounds, and the larger 25 rounders have all been great for me.

I coyote hunt with a 16" 6.8SPC with a 3-9x40 optic and a form1 titanium suppressor, right at 7lbs 11oz unloaded. It's lightweight, and accurate and knocks the hell out of coyotes, bobcats, and deer.

16" Wilson Combat lightweight barrel, midlength gas
titanium lo profile gas block
Midwest Industries lightweight m-lok handguard
Aero ULW 1" mount
Trijicon TR20-2 Accupoint 3-9x40

Without the suppressor and a lighter weight optic, like an Aimpoint T2 on a Scalarworks mount, that should be plenty lightweight for a smaller framed individual. Paired with an adjustable gas block or gas key (what I have) and you can make it nearly as soft shooting as 5.56.
6.8SPC is a great round and would be great for that scenario.

 

[Snuby642]

Magpuls are rock steady for 223.
Why they don't make conversion followers for different cals is beyond me.

I figure just lazy to be truthful.

I have dropped mashed and otherwise messed up many steel mags.
I have yet failed to ruin a magpul.

All my family runs them and have two sons that will exploit any weakness, every damn time in any gear.

 

[Wormydog1724]

Magpuls are rock steady for 223.
Why they don't make conversion followers for different cals is beyond me.

I figure just lazy to be truthful.

I have dropped mashed and otherwise messed up many steel mags.
I have yet failed to ruin a magpul.

All my family runs them and have two sons that will exploit any weakness, every damn time in any gear.

It’s more than just the follower. Because the 6.8SPC has a wider body than .223 and the pmag will bulge with 6.8SPC and will not fit in the magwell. You can fit about 7 6.8SPC rounds in a pmag and then it’s too wide to fit in the magwell.

Drop a loaded pmag and let me know how that works out. Hint: it doesn’t.

 

[Snuby642]

Unexperienced with 6.8 so will follow your lead on that.

But i will play baseball with any mag you have against the magpuls.

We have beat the hell out of mags over the years.
If you know of a tougher one please tell me as I can say I have not tested all.

That is my personal imho and not any kind of fan boy crap.

Allways open for improvement.

 

[bschneiderheinze]

I’m not saying that a 223/556 shooting 68 75 grain wouldn’t be just as good but the lighestest AR I have ever owned and I owned a lot was a 6.8. You really don’t give up that much weight difference. My son who was 6 at the time and probably around 55 lbs shot his first deer with it. I would lean more to the point that 223/556 are more reliable.

 

[Constructor]

Barrett 6.8 mags are good but maximum length is held to 2.275-2.8". PRI mags allow loading to 2.295-2.3". Both of those are made from a thicker gauge material. The ASC and C Products and all other re-branded mags are made from thinner material.
Wormydog is correct, You can't just change the follower in a magpul and use 6.8 or Grendel cartridges in them. Magpul can't make the material thinner to accept the wider cartridges. LWRC had to make a lower receiver with a larger magwel so Magpul could make plastic mags large enough to handle the 6.8.

 

[Mute]

PRI mags are great, but they're expensive (and worth it if you run 6.8 spc or .224 Valkyrie). However, there are plenty of .223/5.56 mags that are completely reliable and are much cheaper. You can generally find pmags in the $15-20 range easily.