AT-XC bolts are not compatible with AT/AW bolts

Adam B

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    I just picked up an AT-XC and was going to have Bugholes do a 223 conversion. I was able to find a complete bolt, but when I went to put it into the gun, it was a no-go. After comparing the two bolts, it is clear that the changes they made for the AT-XC are significant. Unless I am missing something, I will have to wait for the AT-XC bolts to become available.
     
    When asked about the possibility of retrofitting, AI informed of the new model coming in the fall of 2026 (specifically for civilian sales): The AT-FU.

    It allows the end user to retrofit the old sticker to his/her gun safe. You still have to pay $126 for the sticker though.

    Expect a price hike on the rifle.
     
    I just picked up an AT-XC and was going to have Bugholes do a 223 conversion. I was able to find a complete bolt, but when I went to put it into the gun, it was a no-go. After comparing the two bolts, it is clear that the changes they made for the AT-XC are significant. Unless I am missing something, I will have to wait for the AT-XC bolts to become available.

    No shit they said that back at the release
     
    Would you mind providing a link which describes the design differences between the AT-XC and earlier short action AI's? I did a search and couldn't find anything about design differences. Just a lot of opinions on bolt lift feel.
     
    Chances are bugholes won't do an ATXC 223 bolt, Greg mentioned a while back once the last couple of AX/AT 223 bolts are gone he's probably going to stop offering them because too much fiddling is needed to make them run. If he's going to hang up the AT/AX 223 bolts I doubt he'll go through the effort to design a 223 bolt for the ATXC.

    AI should have theirs out by the end of the year... They never said what year though. :ROFLMAO:
     
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    Chances are bugholes won't do an ATXC 223 bolt, Greg mentioned a while back once the last couple of AX/AT 223 bolts are gone he's probably going to stop offering them because too much fiddling is needed to make them run. If he's going to hang up the AT/AX 223 bolts I doubt he'll go through the effort to design a 223 bolt for the ATXC.

    AI should have theirs out by the end of the year... They never said what year though. :ROFLMAO:
    I was set up to have him do one, and he did mention that he is not planning on doing any more after this due to overall reliability issues.
     
    Would you mind providing a link which describes the design differences between the AT-XC and earlier short action AI's? I did a search and couldn't find anything about design differences. Just a lot of opinions on bolt lift feel.
    I would also like to see this since I have been out of AI rifles for a few years.
     
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    I would also like to see this since I have been out of AI rifles for a few years.
    (IIRC)...

    The ASR bolt had some modest tech/design upgrades. The XC bolt is now getting that 'ASR' treatment. As a result, next-gen (XC) bolts aren't backward compatible with the legacy (AW) actions.

    FWIW, SAUM bolts will be released, but only with the new tech (XC). So no SAUM for the AW or ATX platform guys.

    Make of that what you will.
     
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    Would you mind pointing us to which post out of the 524 posts describes the changes? I spent some time looking through them but couldn't find any description,

    Click the link.

    Screenshot_20241005-193508_Chrome.jpg
     
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    Would you mind pointing us to which post out of the 524 posts describes the changes? I spent some time looking through them but couldn't find any description,

    I don’t believe there’s been any more information given beyond that the cocking geometry has changed.

    I just wanted to post a link to the post from AI directly stating that they aren’t compatible.

    It’s yet another reason why I won’t be buying one as I have too much invested in the AT style bolts to switch.

    The AW style lasted for 30ish years, the AT style for 10ish years, so how long will this style last…5ish years?

    The best thing about AI used to be that things didn’t constantly change and parts compatibility for the last 30+ years of rifles for major components was guaranteed. Sadly, that’s no longer the case.
     
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    I don’t believe there’s been any more information given beyond that the cocking geometry has changed.

    I just wanted to post a link to the post from AI directly stating that they aren’t compatible.

    It’s yet another reason why I won’t be buying one as I have too much invested in the AT style bolts to switch.

    The AW style lasted for 30ish years, the AT style for 10ish years, so how long will this style last…5ish years?

    The best thing about AI used to be that things didn’t constantly change and parts compatibility for the last 30+ years of rifles for major components was guaranteed. Sadly, that’s no longer the case.
    AI does not care about the shooting community. Flex Culture is huge in the gun community and AI will continue to sell as people want validation that they're doing it right.
     
    Maybe, maybe not. What percentage of guys do you think are on here to validate what they can/could afford. When it comes to trucks, bikes and gears, guys are insecure as shit.
    I just find it dumb as fuck when people run their mouth about products they don’t own; never experienced; never has intentions or means to own/experience due to high price point of entry. There are a lot of products i find over my budget or in my means but don’t convince me a value. I don’t waste time on them because i either can’t afford them or don’t think they present a value to me; none of those which suggests i should go pick up fights on the internet to feel better about myself.
     
    I just find it dumb as fuck when people run their mouth about products they don’t own; never experienced; never has intentions or means to own/experience due to high price point of entry. There are a lot of products i find over my budget or in my means but don’t convince me a value. I don’t waste time on them because i either can’t afford them or don’t think they present a value to me; none of those which suggests i should go pick up fights on the internet to feel better about myself.
    Yes, I agree that it's super annoying to see guys talk about things that they don't own. Yes, the whole self validation thing is real. I had, have and will continue to buy AI products to support them, as I do not wish them to be where Sako and Steyr are with the M10 and the SSG M1.

    I did not say that AI is junk, I said that AI does not care about the shooting community. There is a diffrent. From my own experiences over the last few years, getting simple info like torque specs and replacement parts from AI is unnessessary difficult. We can be fans/customers but why not be honest about how they're operating.

     
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    Yes, I agree that it's super annoying to see guys talk about things that they don't own. Yes, the whole self validation thing is real. I had, have and will continue to buy AI products to support them, as I do not wish them to be where Sako and Steyr are with the M10 and the SSG M1.

    I did not say that AI is junk, I said that AI does not care about the shooting community. There is a diffrent. From my own experiences over the last few years, getting simple info like torque specs and replacement parts from AI is unnessessary difficult. We can be fans/customers but why not be honest about how they're operating.


    I also love my AI’s, however, I can’t see myself supporting them by buying their products beyond the 2 AT’s that I currently own.

    Like you I’ve grown tired of hunting for parts as well as with the direction their rifle designs have taken over the last couple of generations.

    If they’d have made an ATMC I’d own one of them rather than the TRG-42 that I wound up buying, however, they had no interest in making one and I had no interest in the AXMC nor the AXSR.
     
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    AI


    I also love my AI’s, however, I can’t see myself supporting the by buying their products beyond the 2 AT’s that I currently own.

    Like you I’ve grown tired of hunting for parts as well as with the direction their rifle designs have taken over the last couple of generations.

    It they’d have made an ATXC I’d own one of them rather than the TRG-42 that I wound up buying, however, they had no interest in making one and I had no interest in the AXMC nor the AXSR.
    After being in the motorcycle business for decades I learned that having supports from the manufacturer is key if you want to use and "lightly" abuse your gears. I would own Trumphs and Ducatis but would not push them as hard as I do on my Gixxers and Yamahas. Now, the Ducatis and the AI are both sexy as hell but I'm not one of those guy who only go to the range once every few months. Me and my family are member at a private range with steels out to 1k so we shoot on a weekly basis. Having a bunch of good rifles with a bunch of good glass where we can get spares/replacements is the only way that works for us. I do wish that AI direction to their US civilian market will be different in the future. At the end of the day, I'm a customer and not just much a fan.
     
    Never heard of a pierced primer damaging a firing ping or bolt face?

    Currently your only option is a trip to AINA (maybe MHSA) and at least a week of downtime since there aren’t any complete bolt assemblies available for purchase anywhere.
    I bought 2 of them when euro had them in stock. One sent for wsm conversion and the other as a SFP spare to my LFP 2014 AT’s
     
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    As much as people complain about not being able to buy spare parts. I haven't read much about Milehighshooting.com or AINA not having them in stock for service work.

    I've used both places and both have got me back up and running in days, not weeks.

    Things unfortunately evolve over time and get upgraded.

    AI for the most part seem to change their system when they are going after big contracts that demand it.

    I don't have an issue with AI and parts availability. You can buy a bolt for piece of mind but for the most part they still offer solid support for legacy guns.
     
    To be fair, AI is a much smaller company than most people believe so CS and parts availablity or lack thereof is expected. AI has less than 100 employees so they are similar in size to MDT, Seekins or Proof.

    For example, companies like Daniel Defense or Bergara are twice as big (100 to 200 employees) and have 2x the revenue ($30M to $50M). I would still consider those as small companies.

    Medium sized companies would be something like Tikka (200 to 300 employees, ~$100M), Savage (300 to 500 employees, $100M to $200M). A large company woud be a Ruger (1800 employees, $500M), Sig (2000 employees, $500M) and Beretta (4000 employees, $800M). And yes, I know that Beretta owns Tikka/Sako.

    Just want to put things in perspective for people.
     
    For what it’s worth, I never had a single issue with getting replacement parts for my ATX from AINA (which like MxTexas said is a small company), I had to replace several screws and a piece for the folding hinge and they all took less than 2 weeks to get. I probably put 9-11k rounds of m118lr/ab39 through 2 barrels on that atx and over 1500 6.5cm over a 2 year span and it was absolutely a workhorse. Now I have an AT-XC and I’ve already got close to 3k m118lr/ab39 through it and only about 400 black hills 140hybrid 6.5 but you can tell how much more work went into the XC. The action is much smoother, camming is nice, and overall just a sweet rifle. I don’t think AI has the reputation they have because insecure guys buy it to flex on snipershide. I think they have built that reputation by building not only the best sniper rifle ever designed but now in my opinion (don’t tar and feather me) the best competition rifle ever designed. I’ve had impacts, surgeons, zermatt, and defiance rifles that were great and some were close to the 6k mark as the AI but for the money and ease of support from the company I don’t think you can do better than AI. Now I get it not everyone has that kind of money to spend on a rifle and that’s perfectly okay, most people in all reality don’t use their rifle enough to justify spending 6k on it and I get that. But those who use AIs how they were designed to be used I think would all agree you can’t beat them.
     
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    For what it’s worth, I never had a single issue with getting replacement parts for my ATX from AINA (which like MxTexas said is a small company), I had to replace several screws and a piece for the folding hinge and they all took less than 2 weeks to get. I probably put 9-11k rounds of m118lr/ab39 through 2 barrels on that atx and over 1500 6.5cm over a 2 year span and it was absolutely a workhorse. Now I have an AT-XC and I’ve already got close to 3k m118lr/ab39 through it and only about 400 black hills 140hybrid 6.5 but you can tell how much more work went into the XC. The action is much smoother, camming is nice, and overall just a sweet rifle. I don’t think AI has the reputation they have because insecure guys buy it to flex on snipershide. I think they have built that reputation by building not only the best sniper rifle ever designed but now in my opinion (don’t tar and feather me) the best competition rifle ever designed. I’ve had impacts, surgeons, zermatt, and defiance rifles that were great and some were close to the 6k mark as the AI but for the money and ease of support from the company I don’t think you can do better than AI. Now I get it not everyone has that kind of money to spend on a rifle and that’s perfectly okay, most people in all reality don’t use their rifle enough to justify spending 6k on it and I get that. But those who use AIs how they were designed to be used I think would all agree you can’t beat them.
    Cool story.

    I can go to any major manufacturer and buy replacement parts. Trying to get a spare bolt body and/or spare firing pin assembly is a fuckin nightmare since I'm left handed. My AT-LE/AT-308 was manufactured in 2019. It's 6 years later, I know there are other left handed rifles, but AINA won't sell me a complete bolt assembly or any spare parts, they tell me to go through mile high.

    Fine. I'll go through them. They then tell me they can't get any.

    You know what's nice about ANY custom 700 action? I can overnight anyfuckingthing I want if I need it, from almost every major manufacturer/custom manufacturer.


    I also put in a deposit with Eurooptic for a left hand AT-XC which was SUPPOSEDLEY coming Q2 of this year, and now I can't get an answer from fuckin Anyone other than "they might be delayed until 2026".

    I clawed my deposit back, because that's fucking dumb.
     
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    At this point, if you're buying an AI you are going in with full knowledge that trying to obtain any replacement part is going to be easy at best, require a long wait and backorder most of the time, and possibly impossible to get at the worst. Lots of stories about the continuing difficulties obtaining parts. They sell the rifle as a "system" and are set up for service at Mile High or AINA, and while the service department usually has most spare parts in stock for quick turnaround when you send a rifle in for work they can be reluctant to sell certain parts like fire control components so end users can't mess with the rifle; for certain repairs or parts like a lock ring it's service department only and they will not sell the parts.

    There are some parts that AI will not sell you as an individual, but even worse there are other parts that the dealers can't even obtain from AINA because AINA doesn't have part numbers for them on the parts diagram/listing. Other parts like LH rifles or bolts seem to only be rarely made in batches and sell out quickly. On top of that AI only takes orders from their dealers on a quarterly basis so if you need a part and the dealer doesn't have in stock and you just missed that quarterly ordering window you automatically have 3 months added to your wait time until the next quarterly order window opens.

    I just went through this trying to get a couple of spare firing pins for my AXMC. Neither mile high nor euro optic could get them from AINA because the part number I wanted wasn't listed on the parts diagram, and AINA couldn't find or provide a part number to Mile High to order just the bare firing pin and told me I had to buy a complete bolt assembly or a firing pin and shroud assembly. Sporting Services UK managed to get a part number for the bare firing pin from AI UK after a week of back and forth with AI UK and got them ordered for me, but it's a minimum 16 week lead time. Luckily I got the order placed 2 weeks before AIs quarterly order deadline closed or I would have had another 12 weeks added to my wait time until the next quarterly order window opened. It should not be so difficult to source a spare firing pin.

    With all the info out there, buying an AI means you are knowingly getting into an abusive relationship. AI hits you because they love you, lol. I have 3 of them and every time I have to deal with AI trying to source spare parts it makes we want to sell them. Luckily it's very rare that something breaks, otherwise I would have sold them long ago because no way would I tolerate a rifle being down for months while I'm waiting for parts. I've actually never had any of the 8 AIs I've owned over the years go down, but I like to keep a few common spare parts on hand that I can easily replace myself (firing pin, extractor, ejector, etc) and it's been a pain in the ass to try to buy them nearly every time, as most of those parts have no part numbers published on the customer facing side of things because they're all typically service department only parts they want you to send the rifle in for.

    I guess you need a different mindset for buying an AI; where most R700 style action makers are happy to sell you any part to do the job yourself, AI prefers you send in the entire rifle for any action related work and prefers not to sell service parts to end users. If you're not ok with that approach, you may want to consider something else.
     
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    I guess you need a different mindset for buying an AI; where most R700 style action makers are happy to sell you any part to do the job yourself, AI prefers you send in the entire rifle for any action related work and prefers not to sell service parts to end users. If you're not ok with that approach, you may want to consider something else.


    That's insanity. They 100% sell .mil/.gov/LE agencies these parts, because no one is shipping a work rifle back to AI unless the action is fucked. The FP assembly is super easy to service, and an overpressure round can nuke it in no time flat.

    The fact that it's 2025 and you cannot just buy a bolt assembly + FP assembly is a straight up failure on their part.

    I should be able to order, even if outside of the "quarterly" window, a FP assembly and bolt assembly and have it within 3-4 months.

    And yes. It's an abusive relationship I will 100% continue and support unfortunately 🤣
     
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    At this point, if you're buying an AI you are going in with full knowledge that trying to obtain any replacement part is going to be easy at best, require a long wait and backorder most of the time, and possibly impossible to get at the worst. Lots of stories about the continuing difficulties obtaining parts. They sell the rifle as a "system" and are set up for service at Mile High or AINA, and while the service department usually has most spare parts in stock for quick turnaround when you send a rifle in for work they can be reluctant to sell certain parts like fire control components so end users can't mess with the rifle; for certain repairs or parts like a lock ring it's service department only and they will not sell the parts.

    There are some parts that AI will not sell you as an individual, but even worse there are other parts that the dealers can't even obtain from AINA because AINA doesn't have part numbers for them on the parts diagram/listing. Other parts like LH rifles or bolts seem to only be rarely made in batches and sell out quickly. On top of that AI only takes orders from their dealers on a quarterly basis so if you need a part and the dealer doesn't have in stock and you just missed that quarterly ordering window you automatically have 3 months added to your wait time until the next quarterly order window opens.

    I just went through this trying to get a couple of spare firing pins for my AXMC. Neither mile high nor euro optic could get them from AINA because the part number I wanted wasn't listed on the parts diagram, and AINA couldn't find or provide a part number over the phone to order it and told me I had to buy a complete bolt assembly or a firing pin and shroud assembly. Sporting Services UK managed to get a part number from AI UK after a week of back and forth with AI UK and got them ordered for me, but it's a minimum 16 week lead time. Luckily I got the order placed 2 weeks before AIs quarterly order deadline closed or I would have had another 12 weeks added to my wait time until the next quarterly order window opened. It should not be so difficult to source a spare firing pin.

    With all the info out there, buying an AI means you are knowingly getting into an abusive relationship. AI hits you because they love you, lol. I have 3 of them and every time I have to deal with AI trying to source spare parts it makes we want to sell them. Luckily it's very rare that something breaks, otherwise I would have sold them long ago because no way would I tolerate a rifle being down for months while I'm waiting for parts. I've actually never had any of the 8 AIs I've owned I've the years go down, but I like to keep a few common spare parts on hand that I can easily replace myself (firing pin, extractor, ejector, etc) and it's been a pain in the ass to try to buy them nearly every time, as most of those parts have no part numbers published on the customer facing side of things because they're all typically service department only parts they want you to send the rifle in for.

    I guess you need a different mindset for buying an AI; where most R700 style action makers are happy to sell you any part to do the job yourself, AI prefers you send in the entire rifle for any action related work and prefers not to sell service parts to end users. If you're not ok with that approach, you may want to consider something else.

    100%.

    You buy and AI, because you want an AI. There is a pride of ownership that you don't get with an Origin build (I own an Origin build too). The AI comes with all of the cool benefits of ownership/membership (like an immediate 2" extension to your internet penis). AI's are slick, they are cool-looking, they usually run like a top, and they are a pretty bomb-proof setup that the end user didn't have to piece together themselves.

    If things like customer service, aftermarket support, cost and availability of factory parts, and ease of repair are higher on your hierarchy of needs...you go elsewhere and build your rifle yourself with parts from (hopefully) reputable companies. The good side of that: It is usually far less expensive. The downside: No more 2" extension to your internet penis.

    I have and enjoy an AT-X. I scratched that itch as I wanted an AI for 20 years. I will not sell my rifle. I also will not buy another.
     
    I also put in a deposit with Eurooptic for a left hand AT-XC which was SUPPOSEDLEY coming Q2 of this year, and now I can't get an answer from fuckin Anyone other than "they might be delayed until 2026".

    Well that does suck... I was kind of hoping that the AT-XC support/availability of parts was going to be a step up from the AT-X.
     
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    That's insanity. They 100% sell .mil/.gov/LE agencies these parts, because no one is shipping a work rifle back to AI unless the action is fucked. The FP assembly is super easy to service, and an overpressure round can nuke it in no time flat.

    The fact that it's 2025 and you cannot just buy a bolt assembly + FP assembly is a straight up failure on their part.

    I should be able to order, even if outside of the "quarterly" window, a FP assembly and bolt assembly and have it within 3-4 months.

    And yes. It's an abusive relationship I will 100% continue and support unfortunately 🤣


    When the latest batch of complete SA bolts came out last year I got 2 of them from EO. When I got them 1 of them wouldn't work right in either my 2014 AT so I did some troubleshooting and tested every combination of bolt body and firing pin assembly between my 2014 and 2015 AT's (so 4 bolt bodies and 4 firing pin assemblies). I narrowed it down to a single firing pin assembly from one of the new complete bolt assemblies.

    I contacted AINA asking them to swap the complete bolt assembly out (or at least the firing pin assembly) and they refused unless I sent my 2014 AT to them along with all of the complete bolt assemblies (original to the 2014 and both of the new bolt assemblies).

    That's right...they wanted me to send them a complete *working* rifle and all of my spare bolt assemblies when I already figured out the issue and just wanted a replacement firing pin assembly since it had an issue.

    I said screw that and asked EO if they'd just swap it out instead and they agreed with no hesitation. I got the replacement complete bolt assembly within a week from EO and moved on.

    All of this was after AINA refused to sell me a couple of spare lock rings the previous month just because I wanted to have them and made me resort to getting them through Sporting Services UK instead. I'm also at 30 weeks waiting for a couple of triggers purchased through MHSA which is just stupid.

    A few years ago I tried to get a manual for my newly acquired AE MKIII that didn't come with one and once again AINA was no help whatsoever. I've never experienced that from any firearms manufacturer...ever.

    Needless to say I'm not a fan of AINA and I've pretty much ruled out any AI purchases in the future even though I love AI rifles.
     
    All I want from AI is their promised AT-XC in left hand, with two full bolts, and a spare trigger.

    That's it. I'll pay full fuckin retail. It's not a difficult thing. I want to give them like, 8k, and they won't take it.

    The magnum bolts for the AT-X as promised when it was released would be nice too but that’s never going to happen since that would eat into AT-XC sales, however, I’ll believe the AT-XC will get them when they’re actually available for purchase and not not vaporware like they wound up being for the AT-X.
     
    Not to dog pile but I had a brand new AT-X show up with a broken stock retaining nipple (the little plastic piece). AINA and Mile High both told me to talk to the other party, a month later and finally Mile High got me the part I needed but made it sound like they were doing me a favor by "taking apart one of their kits". Sheesh.
     
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    Not to dog pile but I had a brand new AT-X show up with a broken stock retaining nipple (the little plastic piece). AINA and Mile High both told me to talk to the other party, a month later and finally Mile High got me the part I needed but made it sound like they were doing me a favor by "taking apart one of their kits". Sheesh.

    I'm surprised AINA didn't want you to ship the rifle to them so they could replace it :rolleyes:🤣
     
    I'm surprised AINA didn't want you to ship the rifle to them so they could replace it :rolleyes:🤣
    I went back and looked at the emails and at one point Mile High said "I do not think we have the parts or the permission to fix it.". This was an AT-X that I purchased with the additional folding hardware, which Mile High had installed prior to shipment. It was very frustrating when it came out of the box broken and I had to haggle to get the part I needed to fix it.
     
    @Mile High Shooting , I love your guys stuff, order a lot of shit from you guys, but ya'll need to send this feedback to AINA. We are spending upwards of 4k on just the rifle and can't source parts sometimes. I know it's not on you guys necessarily, but maybe some pressure from the two largest civilian sellers in the USA, you guys and eurooptic can make them see the light a little bit.

    We want their shit, tell them not to be like HK and actually take our money.
     
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    I went back and looked at the emails and at one point Mile High said "I do not think we have the parts or the permission to fix it.". This was an AT-X that I purchased with the additional folding hardware, which Mile High had installed prior to shipment. It was very frustrating when it came out of the box broken and I had to haggle to get the part I needed to fix it.

    Yeah it makes no sense.