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Autotrickler V3
- Thread starter Mando
- Start date
Based on this picture from his recent video with Ultimate Reloading, it looks like there's a new base for the trickler motor that has a 3-point contact setup and easily adjustable tilt via the single screw at the back.
Also, because the thrower portion is encased in a bag there may be other improvements he doesn't want to disclose quite yet or are still being finalized...
Also appears the drop tube portion for the thrower has been improved, no more bendy straw.
He says all the V3 stuff will be available as upgrades, so I would expect several incremental improvements. We'll see in a few weeks.
Adam is a really good dude, he was great to work with a couple of years ago when I built my own servo controlled Harrell's thrower to integrate with his trickler before he started making the autothrow.
Also, because the thrower portion is encased in a bag there may be other improvements he doesn't want to disclose quite yet or are still being finalized...
Also appears the drop tube portion for the thrower has been improved, no more bendy straw.
He says all the V3 stuff will be available as upgrades, so I would expect several incremental improvements. We'll see in a few weeks.
Adam is a really good dude, he was great to work with a couple of years ago when I built my own servo controlled Harrell's thrower to integrate with his trickler before he started making the autothrow.
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Please, do tell about the Harrell's thrower! I've got one collecting dust, and would like to throw ball power on the 120 (which the Lee thrower does not do well without making a mess).
Neat! Nicely done, Adam. $290 is a very reasonable upgrade cost for existing owners of a V1/V2 setup.
I've been wanting to add a keypad or touch screen to my setup for a while now but just haven't had the time to do it. What I have works just fine, but as he mentions in the video having a keypad to punch in charge weights makes loading multiple weights for a ladder test much faster than the current setup of manually trickling to the target weight then pressing the print button on the scale. Bluetooth and an app makes it even easier and cheaper than trying to add a keypad & display or touch screen since the end user can use their already owned tablet, phone, etc.
One thing I'm surprised he didn't do in the V3 is to move control of the trickler final ramp down speed to the app-- that's still controlled by the slider on the board. Although, keeping the final ramp down speed adjustment on the slider means the system is still fully functional and adjustable without needing the app and bluetooth connection.
I also like that he changed to a glass measuring cup and ditched the bendy straw drop tube-- after dealing with static buildup on my old RCBS chargemaster where almost everything was plastic I'm not a fan of plastic for the powder cup or having a lot of plastic around the scale platform. If I kept my chargemaster wiped down with static-free endust everything was OK, but in the winter if static built up it caused false scale readings and drift. That's why on my own setup I built everything is metal and conductive to dissipate static-- drop tube from the Harrell's is copper, powder pan is aluminum & stainless, register for the powder pan on the scale bed is aluminum, etc. No static cling or drift.
One thing he mentioned in that video is an issue I ran into when building my automated Harrell's setup. Since the Harrell's can cut kernels occasionally, it needs a lot of torque applied to "power through" a kernel if needed. If you didn't care about speed you could use a standard stepper motor with a very low drive ratio via gears or pulleys to provide the necessary torque, but then the cycling speed is extremely slow. My solution was to use a $125 high torque / high speed Hitec digital servo that had ample power to cut kernels but also be extremely fast (it can fully cycle the powder measure from handle up to handle down to handle up in <0.3 seconds at full speed, although that's actually too fast for the Harrell's to dump the complete powder charge especially if it's a larger charge.) Adam and I bounced some emails back and forth and decided the cost of the high torque / high speed servo plus the cost of the Harrell's throw was way too expensive for the targeted price point he had in mind for the Autothrow. He picked up the cheapie Lee throw to play with, and turns out that the Lee throw with the wiper doesn't cut kernels and thus requires much less torque to operate-- so he was able to use an inexpensive stepper motor and get the Autothrow to market at a much more reasonable price than my Harrell's based setup. Of course, the drawback of the Lee measure used in the V2 is it's a bit finicky and can leak ball powders, while the Harrell's I'm using works great with anything with no leaking and having the micrometer adjustment on the powder drum makes it very easy to instantly dial back to your preferred charge weight. The new V3 thrower looks like it will solve the ball powder leak issue of the Lee thrower, and be the equivalent of my Harrell's based setup in terms of performance at a lower cost.
I'm very tempted just to upgrade to the new V3 setup... be much easier and faster than spending the time finding the right touchscreen to add to my current setup and then writing new code to support it.
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Yeah, I saw it in the other thread and went ahead a placed the order. The BT and the ability to run ball powders were enough improvements for me to jump on the upgrade kit.
I agree on the surprise the ramp down does not seem to exist within the app, but also agree as to why he likely did as he did in V3. I will say... It could have work both ways assuming the controller design would allow it. He could have kept the adjustment on the controller for those who don't use the app AND included logic/user input in the app. For example, the app could override the manual slider setting. Conceptually you could have the app track the history of trickling and dynamically tune (i.e. learn) the rampdown settings. Maybe that might show up in the future as the nice thing about a software solution is the potential for easy upgrades!
Regardless, I have been waiting on this update. It looks very nice overall. I ordered the V2 to V3 upgrade a few minutes ago.
On a related note... Given handloading is about consistency and that we strive for accuracy and precision... Can an admin/moderator edit the thread title to fix the spelling error? It is driving the OCD part of my brain nuts.
Agreed, with some more code the app could override the physical slider setting-- and that's something he could add before shipping if he chooses to do so. Even if the app only had a display to show the final ramp down speed I would be OK with that-- because then I could quickly adjust the slider back to a previously tested setting for a given powder.
Main reason I was hoping to see the trickler ramp down rate shown in and controlled by the app is so I could easily dial it right back to a previous setting for a given powder. Some powders can tolerate a faster ramp down, some powders need a slower final ramp down to avoid overthrows.
A slight sidetrack... I've seen some pics over on Accurate Shooter of another automatic trickler setup that someone has built for themselves and is selling in small quantities that uses a Promethus-type "notched wheel" trickler so it can accurately dispense only a single kernel at a time without an overthrow as the rotary tube tricklers can, but I'll be damned if I can find the thread now. It was all controlled via a small touchscreen interface. Supposedly the builder is on a facebook group somewhere and has a waiting list. One of my thoughts to even further refine my modded Adam-based setup was to build a "notch type" trickler to add those last 4-5 kernels and never have another overthrow again. The process flow I imagined was bulk drop via the powder throw, trickler to within about 5 kernels using the rotary type trickler, then add the last 4-5 kernels with the "notch-type" trickler. I wanted to minimize the amount of powder dispensed by the final "notch-type" trickler since they're rather slow and I wanted to maintain the current ~6-7 second per charge speed of my current setup. Another one of those things that would be fun to experiment with but I haven't had the time for.
Anyways, about ready to order the V3 upgrade myself... I just don't have the time at the moment to devote to tweaking my own setup and the V3 takes care of nearly every improvement I had in mind.
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Always the safest course of action if you can be patient... Which is a challenge for some of us.
I'm confident Adam is good to go on the Bluetooth integration and matching app, I'm more interested in the repeatability of the new thrower and how it handles large kernel and ball powders. Also would like to see if there's any powder splashing issues with the new drop tube and glass cup arrangement.
I have the V2 to V3 upgrade on the way. Ball powder compatibility and bluetooth app for precise charge weight changing especially for load development were the biggest things missing for me. Looking forward to getting this in hand and putting it through its paces
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I’ve got friends that have the v1 and 2 and I’ve had the scale and done it manually for quite some time. With this version though, I couldn’t pass it up. Order placed as well.
Exactly. I'm wanting to load some 2000MR based Valkyrie loads, so the ball powder compatibility really helps with that.
Same here. I've been using a manual powder throw and then transferring to the fx120 for final trickle with cfe223 for my Valkyrie loads. The v2 powder throw was just a disaster with ball powders
Just bought the bluetooth upgrade and trickler housing.
Anyone know where i can get a replacement motor with pulley wheel and trickler tube with the handle/pulley wheel?
I asked Adam "ask the seller" during check out.
Wondering if anyone else may have another source
Anyone know where i can get a replacement motor with pulley wheel and trickler tube with the handle/pulley wheel?
I asked Adam "ask the seller" during check out.
Wondering if anyone else may have another source
I have everything but a thrower, and I think for myself I'm going to just buy the bluetooth upgrade electronics and continue with my lee scoopers. Just my .02 I don't reload the quanity that some of you seem too.
That's my exact setup. Just ordered the V3 autothrower with the bluetooth electronics, hope it all works with the Area 419 accessories.
I just ordered the electronics, will be a lot easier changing charge weights and being able to prime the trickler tube.
I just received the V2 setup, like 2 days before he announced this. I was a little miffed at first, but really all I want is the BT connectivity. so $60 for an electronics upgrade is well worth it! the whole, hand trickle your desired load to program it each time is my only complaint with V2 so far.
Loading last night
Dang now I want the V3
Ordered the board upgrade.. Don’t think the thrower will work with the Area 419 Acrylic top plate and funnel..
To trickle for setting new values my work around was the 2nd yellow trickler that is manual to quickly add a kernal or .1gr whatever
Dang now I want the V3
Ordered the board upgrade.. Don’t think the thrower will work with the Area 419 Acrylic top plate and funnel..
To trickle for setting new values my work around was the 2nd yellow trickler that is manual to quickly add a kernal or .1gr whatever
That’s the question. Is it the poor mans option or is it the money wise choice. I’ve asked this on other treads. No one has as of now explained to me the benefit of the Prometheus over the AT. Can’t wait till my V3 gets here.
Its been stated already that the new V3 thrower will work with the Area419 acrylic lid and should work with their funnel. Area419 stated they worked with Adam when the V3 was being designed.....
Years ago Prometheus was THE hot ticket.
Fast and super accurate.
The V3 seems like it’s gonna change that doing the same for far less.
According to the Area419 website, the V2 top plate is compatible with the V3
Area 419 - LID for A&D FXi Scales
This is only compatible with Area 419 V2 Auto throw Housings or V3 Thrower housings. Since we released the upgraded Auto-Throw Housing and the Hopper, people have been unsatisfied with the rigidity of that junk plastic lid that comes with the A&D scale. We get it, our wives have tupperware with...
www.area419.com
I have been contemplating the upgrade myself for the V3.
Not to mention the V3 powder thrower looks suspiciously like 419's handy work... <raised eyebrow>
Having the V2 Area419 setup already, I am eagerly waiting until shipping starts for the V3 'upgrade' board to place my order! This will complete my needs...
Not a partnership based on my discussions. My experience is that Area 419 was as surprised about the updates as any of us.
Looks like Area 419 has a V3 upgrade kit already. V2 upgrades retrofitted to V3.
Anyone have an issue clearing all the powder out of the the thrower? I take the hopper off shake it all out and manually throw until no more powder comes out but the next time I use it I still have some kernels left over from the previous powder. Using all the area 419 upgrades. Any one got some tips?
i do like you, but also use a painters brush to help get the loose kernels out. No issues for me.
