Looking for some input on a new barrel for my F/TR rifle. Currently I am debating between choosing a longer barrel or a heavier barrel. I am looking at ordering either a 32" heavy palma or a 30" barrel with a heavy palma profile that will carry the 1.00 straight taper down to the muzzle. After running the numbers with my barrel maker the two choices would still allow me to make weight with my current setup.
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F T/R Competition Barrel Choice
- Thread starter cjmill87
- Start date
Re: Barrel Choice
I just received 4 identical barrels from Bartlein. With my own reamer from PTG, the plan is to have my two GAP Crusaders as close to identical as it's possible to get them. The barrel specs are 5R SS in 31" (30" finished length), .299/.308, 11-twist, MTU contour. One of these (unfinished) barrels weighed in at 7.86 lb. The Crusader it's going on currently weighs 17.25 lb competition ready with an LRA heavy bipod. It's about 1/2 a pound less with an Atlas V8. This rifle currently is wearing a Bartlein 28" barrel with the same specs as above, except it's in the GAP #7 (M24) contour.
In response to your question, these new barrels are some seriously thick and heavy pipes, I have to say. I'm going to be very, very close with regard to making the 8.25 kg F-T/R weight limit (~18.18 lb) with these new barrels. After talking with the fellas at Bartlein, the finished weight of one of these barrels is going to be very close to 7.6 lb. I may end up having to shed some tonnage elsewhere on the rifle to make weight if I want to use the LRA bipod. Fortunately, there are several places I can lighten it up a bit, if necessary. With the Atlas, overall weight won't be an issue. Based on the performance of the current 28" barrel, I expect to be pushing JLK 180s at very close to 2900 fps out of these setups, and somewhere near 2850 with Berger 185s. For me, that is more than enough speed. Anyhow, hope these numbers are useful to you with regard to your barrel decision. Good luck with it.
I just received 4 identical barrels from Bartlein. With my own reamer from PTG, the plan is to have my two GAP Crusaders as close to identical as it's possible to get them. The barrel specs are 5R SS in 31" (30" finished length), .299/.308, 11-twist, MTU contour. One of these (unfinished) barrels weighed in at 7.86 lb. The Crusader it's going on currently weighs 17.25 lb competition ready with an LRA heavy bipod. It's about 1/2 a pound less with an Atlas V8. This rifle currently is wearing a Bartlein 28" barrel with the same specs as above, except it's in the GAP #7 (M24) contour.
In response to your question, these new barrels are some seriously thick and heavy pipes, I have to say. I'm going to be very, very close with regard to making the 8.25 kg F-T/R weight limit (~18.18 lb) with these new barrels. After talking with the fellas at Bartlein, the finished weight of one of these barrels is going to be very close to 7.6 lb. I may end up having to shed some tonnage elsewhere on the rifle to make weight if I want to use the LRA bipod. Fortunately, there are several places I can lighten it up a bit, if necessary. With the Atlas, overall weight won't be an issue. Based on the performance of the current 28" barrel, I expect to be pushing JLK 180s at very close to 2900 fps out of these setups, and somewhere near 2850 with Berger 185s. For me, that is more than enough speed. Anyhow, hope these numbers are useful to you with regard to your barrel decision. Good luck with it.
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Re: Barrel Choice
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gstaylorg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just received 4 identical barrels from Bartlein. With my own reamer from PTG, the plan is to have my two GAP Crusaders as close to identical as it's possible to get them. The barrel specs are 5R SS in 31" (30" finished length), .299/.308, 11-twist, MTU contour. One of these (unfinished) barrels weighed in at 7.86 lb. The Crusader it's going on currently weighs 17.25 lb competition ready with an LRA heavy bipod. It's about 1/2 a pound less with an Atlas V8. This rifle currently is wearing a Bartlein 28" barrel with the same specs as above, except it's in the GAP #7 (M24) contour.
In response to your question, these new barrels are some seriously thick and heavy pipes, I have to say. I'm going to be very, very close with regard to making the 8.25 kg F-T/R weight limit (~18.18 lb) with these new barrels. After talking with the fellas at Bartlein, the finished weight of one of these barrels is going to be very close to 7.6 lb. I may end up having to shed some tonnage elsewhere on the rifle to make weight if I want to use the LRA bipod. Fortunately, there are several places I can lighten it up a bit, if necessary. With the Atlas, overall weight won't be an issue. Based on the performance of the current 28" barrel, I expect to be pushing JLK 180s at very close to 2900 fps out of these setups, and somewhere near 2850 with Berger 185s. For me, that is more than enough speed. Anyhow, hope these numbers are useful to you with regard to your barrel decision. Good luck with it. </div></div>
I'm just a Noob learning a little here and there so have no idea if this would help you or not, but couldn't you have the barrels fluted to shed some weight and possible help them cool off faster? Just something I read somewhere...RC
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gstaylorg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just received 4 identical barrels from Bartlein. With my own reamer from PTG, the plan is to have my two GAP Crusaders as close to identical as it's possible to get them. The barrel specs are 5R SS in 31" (30" finished length), .299/.308, 11-twist, MTU contour. One of these (unfinished) barrels weighed in at 7.86 lb. The Crusader it's going on currently weighs 17.25 lb competition ready with an LRA heavy bipod. It's about 1/2 a pound less with an Atlas V8. This rifle currently is wearing a Bartlein 28" barrel with the same specs as above, except it's in the GAP #7 (M24) contour.
In response to your question, these new barrels are some seriously thick and heavy pipes, I have to say. I'm going to be very, very close with regard to making the 8.25 kg F-T/R weight limit (~18.18 lb) with these new barrels. After talking with the fellas at Bartlein, the finished weight of one of these barrels is going to be very close to 7.6 lb. I may end up having to shed some tonnage elsewhere on the rifle to make weight if I want to use the LRA bipod. Fortunately, there are several places I can lighten it up a bit, if necessary. With the Atlas, overall weight won't be an issue. Based on the performance of the current 28" barrel, I expect to be pushing JLK 180s at very close to 2900 fps out of these setups, and somewhere near 2850 with Berger 185s. For me, that is more than enough speed. Anyhow, hope these numbers are useful to you with regard to your barrel decision. Good luck with it. </div></div>
I'm just a Noob learning a little here and there so have no idea if this would help you or not, but couldn't you have the barrels fluted to shed some weight and possible help them cool off faster? Just something I read somewhere...RC
Re: Barrel Choice
I think Bartlein is the barrel of choice for GA Precision and they know what they are doing, so that's enough for me
I think Bartlein is the barrel of choice for GA Precision and they know what they are doing, so that's enough for me
Re: Barrel Choice
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> have had the barrels fluted, but chose not to. In fact, I could still have it done, or get them turned down just a bit to lighten them up slightly, but either of those choices defeats the purpose of having the heavier barrel contour IMO. I researched this issue very carefully and went with the max contour/length dimensions I thought I could get away with and still make weight. If they end up over the weight limit, it will be by a very small amount, which I should be able to make up elsewhere as I mentioned. So I think they will do exactly what I want them to do.
As far as fluting increasing the rate at which a barrel cools, I have heard this before but don't really buy into that idea. As far as I know, the only way fluting can help a barrel cool faster would be by increasing the surface area/barrel mass ratio. I have a GAP Hospitaller with a fluted barrel (straight flutes) and in my estimation, the flutes are not nearly deep enough to significantly affect the surface area to mass ratio, so my perception is that flutes are predominantly for decreasing the overall weight. In any event, I mainly wanted to put up those numbers to illustrate the thought process I went through for the OP to think about, and possibly help him out making his barrel choice.
I <span style="font-style: italic">could</span> have had the barrels fluted, but chose not to. In fact, I could still have it done, or get them turned down just a bit to lighten them up slightly, but either of those choices defeats the purpose of having the heavier barrel contour IMO. I researched this issue very carefully and went with the max contour/length dimensions I thought I could get away with and still make weight. If they end up over the weight limit, it will be by a very small amount, which I should be able to make up elsewhere as I mentioned. So I think they will do exactly what I want them to do.
As far as fluting increasing the rate at which a barrel cools, I have heard this before but don't really buy into that idea. As far as I know, the only way fluting can help a barrel cool faster would be by increasing the surface area/barrel mass ratio. I have a GAP Hospitaller with a fluted barrel (straight flutes) and in my estimation, the flutes are not nearly deep enough to significantly affect the surface area to mass ratio, so my perception is that flutes are predominantly for decreasing the overall weight. In any event, I mainly wanted to put up those numbers to illustrate the thought process I went through for the OP to think about, and possibly help him out making his barrel choice.
Re: Barrel Choice
flutes mostly just look cool. After that they lighten the barrel a little.
A fluted barrel of weight X with contour y is stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of the same weight (x) and length with the required slimmer contour, the fluted barrel is not however stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of heavier weight with the same dimensions.
flutes mostly just look cool. After that they lighten the barrel a little.
A fluted barrel of weight X with contour y is stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of the same weight (x) and length with the required slimmer contour, the fluted barrel is not however stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of heavier weight with the same dimensions.
Re: Barrel Choice
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: XTR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">flutes mostly just look cool. After that they lighten the barrel a little.
A fluted barrel of weight X with contour y is stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of the same weight (x) and length with the required slimmer contour, the fluted barrel is not however stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of heavier weight with the same dimensions. </div></div>
They do look cool fluted'
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: XTR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">flutes mostly just look cool. After that they lighten the barrel a little.
A fluted barrel of weight X with contour y is stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of the same weight (x) and length with the required slimmer contour, the fluted barrel is not however stiffer than a non-fluted barrel of heavier weight with the same dimensions. </div></div>
They do look cool fluted'
Re: Barrel Choice
I went with the Ober which will be finished at 30. The flute cut down more than a pound
From their website
A typical 28-inch blank of this type
will weigh approximately 7.2 pounds if round, or 5.6 pounds if fluted.
I went with the Ober which will be finished at 30. The flute cut down more than a pound
From their website
A typical 28-inch blank of this type
will weigh approximately 7.2 pounds if round, or 5.6 pounds if fluted.
The 30 inch barrel is a good choice. Keep in mind that rifles get pretty front heavy which is why many long range target rifles have longer than normal stocks. Fluting barrels has its advantages and every ounce counts when total rifle weight has to be controlled. It also depends on how much you are going to shoot. Serious target shooters go through barrels in a short time. Unless you have deep pockets fluting does get costly.
30 / 31 inches is the sweet spot in my experience. It provides nearly maximum speeds for great stability and accuracy.
As you go longer Weight goes Up and Rigidity (Potential max accuracy) goes down.
The 308 case hits a limit where longer barrels cannot be optimally used due to limitations in powder capacity.
As you go longer Weight goes Up and Rigidity (Potential max accuracy) goes down.
The 308 case hits a limit where longer barrels cannot be optimally used due to limitations in powder capacity.
Longer barrel is free velocity! Assuming you meet weight with the max length. Fluting would not be something I would consider for weight loss. Chopping weight in the stock or going to a lighter bipod is the next step. 31" does seem to be a sweet spot as someone already mentioned.
I'm sure it gets them out there fine, but we're talking about a dedicated F-TR build here. An extra 100 to 150 FPS from a longer barrel will buy you a point here and there. I won or lost 3 matches last yr on X count, the difference between 1st and 3rd in the last match I shot was 1 point and 1X. I'll take whatever I can get.
