Rifle Scopes Beginner here with a disappointing first day

[utopify]

Well seasoned with ballistics and SUT/military training but getting into long range.

Since 99.9% of my gear is all 5.56 I opted for Ruger Precision Rifle 5.56 to at least get going. I purchased a razor vortex 4.5-27x56 and a nightforce 20moa Mount.

I couldn’t get on paper at 25y, even with my elevation turret maxed “down”. I had to aim at the bottom edge of the paper to hit 8” higher. I sat down and googled on my phone. The Ruger is 20moa so I was at 40 moa give or take (rifle 20 + 20 from the mount). So I sat in my car for a bit and read that the moa should be no more than half of the scopes max elevation adjustment which according to Vortex 28.5 mil for me. I was within that, so I should be able to adjust to zero my scope. For kicks, and since I was at the range with my downward adjustment maxed already I shot at 100yds it was approx 3 feet high.
I then thought what the hell, I put the nightforce mount on backwards (guessing that would zero me(rifle 20, with now -20 from the backwards mount)) and was now about 5.5mil low and adjusted up to zero my rifle perfectly.
Am I doing something wrong? It would seem to me I need either a zero mil mount or at most a 3mil..... I was asking others at the range too and everyone was clueless.

My proposed solution is returning my 20moa nightforce unimount, and get a zero mount, or try to zero at 1000 yds lol. Maybe that will lower the drop enough sheesh.

Thank you for any insight.

 

[supercorndogs]

Are you hitting the zero stop or bottoming out the adjustment?

 

[pell1203]

How many mils of total up adjustment are you able to dial on the scope presently? I'm just wondering if the zero stop was set on your Vortex and that is what was keeping you from zeroing.

Are you able to physically spin your turrets the full 28+ mils or are you limited to less than that?

edit: supercorndogs beat me to it!

 

[utopify]

Are you hitting the zero stop or bottoming out the adjustment?

Bottoming out the knob. It’s factory setting and I haven’t messed with any zero stop or even removed the cap. I just pop up the knob and turn it. And in this case I pop it up and turn it until it stops.

 

[pell1203]

How many mils total up travel can you dial?

 

[supercorndogs]

How many mils of total up adjustment are you able to dial on the scope presently? I'm just wondering if the zero stop was set on your Vortex and that is what was keeping you from zeroing.

Are you able to physically spin your turrets the full 28+ mils or are you limited to less than that?

edit: supercorndogs beat me to it!

What he said check for your full adjustment. If you have it then its time to diagnose.

 

[utopify]

I have removed the optic, but in just turning the knob based on the numbers on the dial I get 18 mils exactly from all the way down to all the way up.

 

[blackblue]

Like what has been said above it sounds like your zero stop is is set, 18 is only about half of what you should have.

 

[supercorndogs]

Its always nice when solutions are simple.

 

[stello1001]

The zero stop is set

 

[Tnc]

If this is a gen2 razor Go to vortex website and watch the video on how to zero the razor. You don’t turn the turret at all. Loosen the sets screws and then You remove the top caps from elevation and windage and use a flathead or the provided tool to turn the internal dial for zero setting. Tighten the set screws back once zeroed and you’re done.

 

[utopify]

Sounds like it’s an easy fix. Just need to learn how to adjust it now. Back to the books. Thank you.

 

[utopify]

Apologies guys for the embarrassing situation and lame questions, but a huge thank you.

 

[hk dave]

Where do you live? If you're close by, i'd be happy to spot for you.

 

[pell1203]

utopify, unless you typically shoot a lot at super long ranges, you might consider going with a total of 20 MOA rail/mount adjustment instead of 40 MOA so your 100 yd zero is closer to the scope's optical center.

A 5.56 RPR with 20 MOA rail and the Razor scope on rings or a 0 MOA mount would still leave you enough elevation in your system to go beyond 1000+ yards.

 

[utopify]

I’m at fort Campbell. I was thinking about getting started in the tactical division. I doubt targets are over 1200 but I may be wrong.

 

[utopify]

Since the rpr is 20MOA, should I get a 3mil/10moa? Or just a zero? That’s IF I really need to hit 1200+....(mount, obviously)

Thoughts?

 

[pell1203]

If it were me I'd just keep the RPR rail and just zero. You'd be hard pressed to consistently make 800+ yd hits with 5.56, much less 1000 yards as you would be well subsonic by then.

Enjoy your latest toys.

 

[man32ahan]

As mentioned above, you need to go under the scope turret by loosening the theee set screws and sight in with your zero stop. Here is link/video that shows you exactly how to do it. Hope this helps!

 

[davsco]

and just fyi you can get all set up at home, before even going to the range. pull the bolt. look thru the barrel at a "target" 50-100 yds away (knot in a tree, top of fence post, etc). align the scope to that same target. that will get you on paper at the range. then you fine tune as necessary. had you done this at home (or in your case, tried to), you would have seen something wasn't right and would have saved you a range trip.

 

[utopify]

You are very right davsco! I was naive to think I could treat this like any other weapon system I've been trained on - and just throw the gear on and go. This is not an aimpoint and requires much more thought, and research. I'm learning. This thread here goes to show how rookie of a mistake I made. I was a fool! ha ha ha. ANY day at the range is never a wasted trip!

I appreciate the tips. FYI - while at the shops on the way home, I picked up one of those .223 laser bullet bore sight tools. Much better.

Now I'm off to see if getting into long range with 5.56mm is a waste of time. As mentioned ALL of my gear/ammo is 556 so it made it easy.

I have some 77gr sierra matchkings i'm going to use, but will i ever be effective in the tactical division of PRS? I see 556 in the top 10, so maybe so.

 

[davsco]

eh, return the laser bore sight and just do it how i recommended. i like having all the highest-tech stuff but in this case, not needed.
first rule of shooting, competition, etc is run what you brung. you can always upgrade and change stuff later. play with your stuff, practice with your stuff, make sure you chrono your loads in your gun and know your drops and wind calls, and you will do ok. just let them know you're new to all this and i'm sure they will take care of you.

 

[alpine44]

To see whether your scope adjustment is now sufficient and to save some ammo at the range, try to optically boresight the rifle.

1) Remove the bolt, look through the bore and aim the barrel at a target about 25 yards away (I have a tennis ball in a tree). The rifle should be in a vise or securely supported by a bipod and a rear bag.
2) Now, without disturbing the bore alignment, look trough the scope and note where the reticle is.
3) Adjust scope until reticle is where you aim at through the barrel

This gets me on paper at 100 yards any time after building a new gun or mounting a new scope.

Oops, just saw that davsco beat me to the punch here, suggesting the same procedure. However, a 25 yard target is far enough and you are zeroing on the point where the bullet crosses the sight line the first time while it still flies in a relatively straight line. If you aim at a 100 yard target you have to adjust a little bit for bullet drop.

 

[Qazwsx]

If you havent registered on post and got a membership at range 16 you should. there are lots of guys who shoot out there on the weekend that can give you a range card if you dont have a range finder.

 

[NewsShooter]

If it were me I'd just keep the RPR rail and just zero. You'd be hard pressed to consistently make 800+ yd hits with 5.56, much less 1000 yards as you would be well subsonic by then.

Enjoy your latest toys.

Really? My .223 is just over 10 mils at 1K and over 1300 FPS at 1k. I believe that is still supersonic.

 

[Qazwsx]

You are very right davsco! I was naive to think I could treat this like any other weapon system I've been trained on - and just throw the gear on and go. This is not an aimpoint and requires much more thought, and research. I'm learning. This thread here goes to show how rookie of a mistake I made. I was a fool! ha ha ha. ANY day at the range is never a wasted trip!

I appreciate the tips. FYI - while at the shops on the way home, I picked up one of those .223 laser bullet bore sight tools. Much better.

Now I'm off to see if getting into long range with 5.56mm is a waste of time. As mentioned ALL of my gear/ammo is 556 so it made it easy.

I have some 77gr sierra matchkings i'm going to use, but will i ever be effective in the tactical division of PRS? I see 556 in the top 10, so maybe so.

Also, if you are in the 101st, there are walk on slots available for 5th grp SOTIC you could inquire about to your coc.

 

[TheOE800]

Really? My .223 is just over 10 mils at 1K and over 1300 FPS at 1k. I believe that is still supersonic.

That's about the beginning of transonic range, where weird shit starts happening.

 

[A5scott]

Like others have said, pull the bolt out and use your eyes to bore sight, and you'll get good at it. I'm usually within 1 to 1.5 mils of the bull with my first shot. Then I use the reticle to measure the adjustments to zero it. Usually pretty straightforward, now that I've done it a bunch of times... assuming good ammo.

If you bought your Gen 2 razor used, and or think your elevation turret isn't quite where it needs to be, you can loosen the set screws, and then bottom out the brass screw inside the turret. THEN, back it out 1and 3/4 turns to reset it to factory spec. Scott at vortex told me to do this when I was worried my scope was buggered... but it was perfectly fine.

Scott

 

[utopify]

Qazwsx, I'm actually in group - but a SIG-O....and any "cool" stuff I've gotten to do, was predicated by relentless nagging, begging and justification. I'm willing to try again however! Now, if I wanted sharepoint or networking training...I automatically get ATTRS reservations....ugh.

 

[Qazwsx]

Yeah, that will require a big committment, or some finesse and scheming on your part.