Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

[USSR]

The brown truck came today with the New Berger 140gr 6.5mm bullets that some of us will be testing and evaluating. First impression - long and sleek! I compared them vis-a-vis with a Lapua 139gr Scenar and a Sierra 142gr MatchKing. Using randomly picked bullets, I got OAL's as follows:

139gr Lapua - 1.370"
140gr Berger - 1.401"
142gr Sierra - 1.380"

Observations: Length of the boattail seems to be the same as the Lapua, that is, just a little bit shorter than the Sierra. However, the Berger appears to have a sharper angle on the boattail, as it terminates to a smaller, slightly beveled base. It's wintertime up here in the north country, so load development and testing will have to wait for spring. I'm sure somebody will be receiving these bullets down south, so I look forward to hearing what results you get in shooting them.

Don

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

Don

Post some pics for us.

JeffVN

 

[trigger time]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

Mine likes the lapua's better, but the bergers shot sub moa consistantly.

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Here ya go, JeffVN.

trigger_time,

These are a new Berger bullet, and not the same as the ones you shot.

Don

 

[ceylonc]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

What are the differences between the new 140gr. Berger and the 140gr. VLDs? I liked the way the VLDs shot but now shoot 139gr Scenars because they're aren't so finicky with seating depth out of my rifle...

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ceylonc</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What are the differences between the new 140gr. Berger and the 140gr. VLDs? I liked the way the VLDs shot but now shoot 139gr Scenars because they're aren't so finicky with seating depth out of my rifle... </div></div>

ceylonc,

The new 140gr Berger is NOT a VLD. So, hopefully, the bullet will be "jump friendly".

Don

 

[ceylonc]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Thanks for the reply USSR. Sounds like I NEED to try this bullet out.

Any idea of release date? Ballistic Coefficient?

Thanks

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Berger's marketing rep, Michelle Gallagher, said that she thought Berger was waiting to see how the testing goes before they calculate it, in order to avoid any biases. From the looks of the profile, I would be surprised if it was not in the neighborhood of the BC of the Scenar and MatchKing. No word on a release date.

Don

 

[Jeffvn]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Thanks for the pictures. Sometimes a written explanation is lost on my apparently thick skull.

JeffVN

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I just got mine yesteday and will try them in my 260 and also my 6.5x55. If the weather holds I may try some this weekend. A gentleman over on 6BR.com shot some and said they shot in the .2s in his rifle I don't know what he is shooting for a gun though.

My understanding was that these are suppose to be less sensitive to seating depth. The VLDs will shoot well but it takes some time to get them to that point. Hopefully these will fall into line quicker. I will post results as soon as I shoot some.

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I got a chance to get out an try the new Berger 140s yesterday. Not under ideal conditions by the way. It was only 18 degrees but no wind so I decided to head out to the range. Well by the time I got there an got targets set up the wind was coming up. But I decided to shoot them anyway since I was already to go.

I shot a 5 shot group at 100yds it went .450 I then shot a group at 200yds and it went .880 for 5 shots. I wanted to work my way on out but the wind was now at around 8 gusting to 12mph so I decided to shoot a group at 500yds and call it a day. I had shot four shots at 500yds when the gust blew my target off the backer, (I was shooting at a 6" paper plate) When I retrieved my target I decided it was to windy and called it a day. The 4 shot group was 2.3" in a nice cluster. I have no doubt that the 5th would have also been there if I had did my part.

My rifle is a 6.5x55 Remington. Its set up as a tactical rifle and has a "Sendero" contour Kreiger barrel. I did not clean the rifle or change the load I simply loaded the Bergers in place of my 139s and took them out and shot them. I was very impressed to say the least!! It took me about 400rds to find something this gun liked its been a very picky rifle. The bullets seem to match the 139s for elevation and wind drift so I would guess the BC will be about the same as the 139 to 142s. I used all my 139 data and it was dead on @ 500yds for both wind and elevation.

I hope to get some more rounds down range this weekend if the weather holds. I live in S.Dak so its always windy!!

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Sounds extremely encouraging. Please keep us in the loop.

If these end up being priced comparable to Sierra 142gr MatchKings, I will be very interested in putting these to the test.

I plan to be testing my 'hardware store' 'bignut' barrel tuner this weekend. It consists simply of a 1" i.d. hex nut, threaded onto a piece of skinny bicycle tube that's stretched over the front end of my .875" diameter muzzle. Very snug, I have to use water soluble lube on the rubber to get the nut to turn. I have already mounted and dismounted the nut and tube, and there are no, read 'none', marks left on the barrel after removal. I think it's a fascinating approach to making a barrel tuner, and it all costs well under $10 to fabricate and install. Yeah, it looks 'pretty unorthodox' to say the least, but if it works, and I'm pretty certain it will, it's well worth the try.

The concept is pretty simple. Mic the muzzle diameter, add about 1/16" and select the closest i.d. hex nut. Don't forget metric sizes.

Should make adapting my load to work with the Bergers an act of simple child's play. Might even make the load/barrel combo tuneable to match extreme environmental swings.

Greg

 

[mikecr]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Nothing wrong with 139s..
I'll stay with them unless Berger improves on them in some way.

Same with 123s

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Firehawk,
I can't argue with you about that but the thing that impressed me most was the bullet does "NOT" seem to be picky. Most of the Bergers I have shot will shoot well but it takes sometime to get them into the sweetspot.

Unless I was just lucky on my first go this bullet shot as well or better than the 139s that took me a bunch of time to get to where the gun would shoot them. For me this was a big plus.

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

raptor99,

Can you give us the COAL, and how far off the lands this is with your rifle?

Don

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Don,
I Will check it and let you know monday. The 139s were just kissing the rifling when I started shooting them and thats been probably around 600+ rounds ago so I can't say for sure now that its still kissing or just close.

I use a 6.5 bullet comparitor for measueing off the ogive. Will this measurment work or do you want the actual overall length???

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

A cartridge OAL length (cartridge base to bullet tip), and if you have the Stoney Point OAL Gauge and bullet comparator, how far off the lands you are. If you don't have the OAL Gauge, just confirm that you are off the lands. Thanks.

Don

 

[edpmedic]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

What twist are these good for.

Raptor99..How do you think they will do in the wind. After all 12MPH is not that ordinary where we shoot 1K

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Marc,

The box says 1-9" or faster.

Don

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Don,
Damn, I forgot my measurments at home but will get them to you tomorrow. I won't be going home for lunch today.

edpmecic,
I used the same exact data for the 139s on the 140 Bergers for both elevation and wind. It put all the rounds right into the center of the plate at 500yds so I am guessing it will be nearly the same as the 139s for a BC.

If my memory serves me correctly I did not change my die at all when I loaded these rounds and the overall length was the same as the 139s using the stonypoint bullet comparitor.

 

[rhinotalon]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

So, thats about a .595 bc.

RHINOUT!

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Don,
Ok, I got the OAL for you. With a 139 my OAL is 3.100" and with a comparator its 3.535" (My comparator is one that screws on to my calipers. I believe its a stony point)

With this setting I was just touching the lands in my rifle. Like I said earlier that was about 600rds ago so it may be off a tad now or still dead on. Hope this helps if you need anything else please give me a shout!!

 

[ceylonc]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

raptor99

Great report & updates. Thanks so much for taking the time to share your results.

I think I'd like to give these bullets a try out of my LSR .260 Rem. The barrel is an 8.5 twist 24" Broughton that LOVES 139gr. Scenars. These should run great, too.

On another note, many here have mentioned that the Berger VLDs make great hunting bullets too. I wonder if these new Bergers will perform as well on game?

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

ceylonc,
I hope they do. My son in law shoots the 168 Bergers in his 280 and loves them. He took an elk this year and about 4 deer. He shot his deer at 660yds by range finder. Two other guys used his rifle with him dialing it and telling them where to hold to kill two others at 420 and 500yds on the same day.

His gun with the 168s will plant 3 rounds in a pie plate at 600yds on a regular basis.

 

[Zak Smith]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Will these be cheaper than the 139 Scenars?

I shot the old 14 VLD's against the 139's and they were within a couple clicks at 1000 for me.

-z

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Zak,

Don't know how they will be priced, and that will be a big factor, atleast in my case. I don't know if anybody has noticed but, lately, the difference in prices between various makes of bullets is not as great as it once was (they're all expensive).

Don

 

[rhinotalon]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I certainly have.

So why not play with sorting and metplating when you spend $2.00 more and just load and shoot

RHINOUT!

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I heard from Michelle Gallagher today, and here is what she had to say:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I just wanted to let you know that we have calculated the BC of the 6.5mm 140gr. BT bullet. It's 0.593.</div></div>

This is pretty much as expected, and puts it in the same league as the 142SMK and the 139gr Lapua Scenar. Anybody got anything to report on these bullets?

Don

 

[nashlaw]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Very good thread.

I just ordered some .22 Bergers from Bruno and was looking for the 6.5's, but did not see any listed.

I am looking forward to getting a hundred or three.


david

 

[raptor99]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Hey guys just wanted to give you another quick update on the Berger 140s I was sent to try out.

I shot another group with them at 400yds yesterday. It was 20 degrees and damp cold but the wind was down to around 4 to 5mph which is calm for us out here.

I wanted to do some test loads with my 243XC so I took the 6.5x55 along and shot the group that I had left. I had shot them originally with just using my seating die the way it was set for the 139s. I didn't change a thing. The groups were all in the .4MOA range @ 100,200,300 and 500yds.

I then tried seating them into the rifling and they did not shoot as well for some reason. I took the 5 I had left and pushed them back to the original seating depth and shot them last night. @ 400yds, the 5 shot group was 1.675" or .418 MOA. 4 out of the 5 were in 1.25" so over all the 140s are a good shooting bullet in my rifle.

I did all my load testing off the hood of my pickup shooting off a sandbag and a rear rest. No fancy bench rests were used.

 

[ceylonc]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

That is great shooting! Thanks for the update.

I would love to know when these will be hitting the market...

 

[EricStecker]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

We have a run scheduled during the first few weeks of May. Most of the run is already sold to our dealers so if you want to get some contact your dealer soon.

Regards,
Eric

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Okay, here's the scoop regarding the new Berger 140gr non-VLD bullets Vis-a-vis the Lapua 139gr Scenars. Previous chrony testing of the Bergers and the 139gr Lapua Scenars with the same powder charge showed that the lighter Scenars were faster (no surprise), so I used a little less powder for the loads below which I now estimate at about 2950fps:

Lapua brass
139gr Lapua Scenar
46.9gr N160
Russian primer

Lapua brass
140gr Berger
47.1gr N160
Russian primer

Both bullets were seated to a depth that put them .010" off the lands. At todays 1000 yard F Class Match at Bodines, PA, both loads took about 25MOA to reach 1k from a 100 yard zero. The results with the Lapua Scenars was a 182-2X, while the Bergers produced a 182-3X score. Actually, the accuracy was a bit better with the Bergers, as the score does not take into consideration the much worse wind conditions that were prevalent when the Bergers were shot. The next shoot is in 2 weeks, and at that time I will match the Bergers up with the Sierra 142SMK's. The Berger's are a good LR bullet.

Don

 

[our gang]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

They are very accurate BUT will not magazine feed in a 260 Rem AR-10 Platform.

Single loaded with them, my DPMS LR 260 will shoot 1.5" 10 shot groups at 200.

In the DPMS, Hornady A Max are as accurate (tested to 300) and feed perfectly.

140 Bergers work great in my 6.5x55 1903 Springfield sporter (c. 1937) as in 10 in one hole at 200 yards.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Very encouraging. I'm looking forward to their more widespread availability, and intend to do my own testing in a 28" .260 with an harmonic barrel tuner. Cost will be an issue; and I am currently quite happy with my 142SMK load.

Greg

 

[our gang]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Availability is no problem, I bought mine (as well as many other obscure bullets like Woodleighs) from good old Midway.

 

[SmokingTRG]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

They're great... thats how they are!!

 

[forsyth793]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

I will be trying them in a 600 Yd Prone Match Sunday with a bunch of 4831sc. I will let you know

 

[forsyth793]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

600 Prone Match got rained out.

 

[Crazy Dog ll]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

Is the 6.5 mm X.284 win. and the 6.5mm X .284 Norma the same? My Redding dies says 6.5mm x .284 win. ,but the Lapua brass,the box said 6.5 mm X .284 Norma. I ran the "mike" over the the "Lapua" brass and it match thespecs in the Hornardy Reloading Manuel,which showns the 140 grain bullet at max only make about 2700 fps,doesn't it need 2900 or better to make 1,000 yards targets? I reloaded only a few rounds the brass neck collapsed on one ,mike the diameter of the bullet and the inside of the neck,it is .001 inch smaller than the bullet,is this correct? and why are the neck collapaed? Thanks.

 

[BOLTRIPPER]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

ok.......i sat on mine for months....compared to the vld's....they went into the same hole...did not test them yet out long....but i liked the way they fed out of my HS mags...will report back on the chrono diff if any between the vld and the BT

 

[JC Steel]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are they?

I have heard alot of hype about these bullets but do you think they are truly better than the 142 gr. SMK.

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jcvibby</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have heard alot of hype about these bullets but do you think they are truly better than the 142 gr. SMK. </div></div>

IMHO, they and the 139gr Lapua Scenars are slightly better than the 142SMK. YMMV.

Don

 

[bear458]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I shot about 50 at the team practice before the nationals. Used the std load I use with the VLDs. Only difference was the bullet and the OAL (-.020) I usually soft seat the VLDs.
Experienced very similar vertical POI as VLDs at 1K yds. So that might give a reasonable estimate of the BC. Shot 50 more at the home range under calmer conditions last week, avg group size the same as VLDs and better than (weighed and measured) SMKs.
I'm going to fiddle with the seating depth on the next outing and I'll let y'all know how that turns out.

Eric

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Eric,

I usually soft seat the 139gr Scenars and 142SMK's, but since this Berger is a non-VLD bullet, I seated them .010" off the lands. Hope everything is well with you.

Don

 

[badbot]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

'''I did all my load testing off the hood of my pickup shooting off a sandbag and a rear rest. No fancy bench rests were used.'''

IMHO 20K + pickup is a fancy benchrest

LOL

 

[behind bars]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

I've used the Speer 140gr spitzer-sp and the noseller ballistic tip 120gr i fired it from my mauser L96 and so far have not been impressed. what is the BC. on the Berger's 140gr 6.5mm

 

[USSR]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

kilo11,

The BC of the 6.5mm non-VLD 140gr Bergers is .593.

Don

 

[kyreloader]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Anyone have any information on the 140.5g Berger Hollow Point long range bullet listed as coming soon at Midway?

The bullet is listed with a BC of .618.

 

[dar1246]

Re: Berger's New 140gr 6.5mm bullets - How are the

Is Berger selling their bullets in Bulk now? If so how many in bulk?