I'm thinking about something along the line of the .243 lbc, 6 fat rat, 6 predator. What say you???
Best ar-15 for prs type matches
- Thread starter coach4christ
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I've shot a 224 Valkyrie in a PRS type match before. It was a fun challenge but I wouldn't suggest it to anyone serious. It was just too underpowered past say 500 yards and became difficult to spot hits on steel. If the range had flashers that might be a different story. I've seen several 6.5 Grendels and I'd probably suggest that. My 224 Valk is much lighter than my PRS match rifle so I liked that. I don't like shooting Semi-autos in a match because I have to chase my brass further and I always end up missing some in the grass. I might lose 5 in a small match vs losing 1 with a bolt rifle.
I'm inclined to suggest 224AR with 88gr H eldm. You are likely to get 2900 fps in a longer barrel and the .545BC is good.
Though the 95SMK in my 6mmFatRat doesn't do too bad. .5BC at 2870 fps.
I highly suggest getting a premium barrel vs Wilson, etc.
Though the 95SMK in my 6mmFatRat doesn't do too bad. .5BC at 2870 fps.
I highly suggest getting a premium barrel vs Wilson, etc.
I'm going to shoot a PRS with 5.56 (competing with myself) this winter... 
I'll let you know how it goes. Typically my 5.56 struggles past 600 in the wind. As another poster mentioned, it's hard to see steel hits with small calibers.
I have not yet shot the 6.5 Grendel; would anyone care to chime in? I'm considering re-barreling my AR to it at a later date.
I'll let you know how it goes. Typically my 5.56 struggles past 600 in the wind. As another poster mentioned, it's hard to see steel hits with small calibers.I have not yet shot the 6.5 Grendel; would anyone care to chime in? I'm considering re-barreling my AR to it at a later date.
There is no comparison in effect on steel between 6.5G and normal AR mag length 223 loads. You can get 223 to shoot flatter, and maybe similar in the wind, but it'll never hit steel like the Grendel.
I’ve got an 18” 6.5 Grendel AR and I absolutely love it. Great cartridge, shoots flat, great downrange and plenty of power for hunting if you so choose.
I'd add 22 Grendel to that list then put them all in a hat and pick one. But asking which AR is best for PRS is kinda like asking which 45 ACP shotshells are best for shooting clays with your 1911...
LOL It's only money, I make more everyday. Might as well spend it on something I enjoy. Joined over here to try and figure this PRS stuff out.
I'm going to shoot a PRS with 5.56 (competing with myself) this winter...
I have not yet shot the 6.5 Grendel; would anyone care to chime in? I'm considering re-barreling my AR to it at a later date.
I shoot an 18" 6.5 Grendel and love it. 2nd round hits at 1,100 yards on a few occasions during competition. It won't win any matches, but it's most definitely a capable round.
hahaha, I think you answered your own question there my friend.
The best AR15 for PRS is an AR10. I got a Valkyrie barrel because I have more 5.56 suppressors than 30cal and a 308 bolt gun. I am interested to give the Valkyrie a try at a match and see how it goes.
I have used .223 before and it was rough. They had a spinner target at 340yds and I hit that target as fast as possible and never had a chance to spin it. That was with 69gr Black Hills ammo in a 20” barrel.
I prefer to use AR platforms because it’s ergonomically the same as my other 16” carbines. Now with a 260 AR10, I placed in the top 10 first time out with it. It’s a damn shame I sold it.
I have used .223 before and it was rough. They had a spinner target at 340yds and I hit that target as fast as possible and never had a chance to spin it. That was with 69gr Black Hills ammo in a 20” barrel.
I prefer to use AR platforms because it’s ergonomically the same as my other 16” carbines. Now with a 260 AR10, I placed in the top 10 first time out with it. It’s a damn shame I sold it.
Pushing the 105 jlk 2900 fps out of an ar15 platform is very tempting right??
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When I tried that in my 26" 6mmAR T40 the pressure was severe enough that it affected reliability. I assume the case walls stuck to the chamber too hard because when I backed the load down to the high 27's the rifle functioned nearly perfectly. Another consequence was that over about 500 rounds the barrel extension came loose from the barrel which was a total PITA to identify while in the process of loosening. Also to get to 2900 fps I had to use AA2520 powder which is horrible temp sensitive. That's another story in it's self.
I've since gone to 95 SMK which is better suited to this cartridge at mag length. It's not intruding on powder space as much and can be driven 100 fps faster than the 105's which makes the drift about the same. Recoil is lighter as well.
Are you talking bolt gun series?
I've NEVER seen anyone do even remotely well with a gasser at a bolt gun match. I've heard of some placing decently at smaller club series matches, but I haven't seen it myself.
If it's just what you had and you just want to get out and get your feet wet, absolutely go for it, but setting up an AR for the purpose of shooting bolt gun or club series is just foolish. Especially considering that it will cost you more to build a precision gas gun that what you can get a decent 6 or 6.5 creedmoor bolt. $800 will get you a Gen 2 RPR in 6mm Creed or a little more and you can get a CTR 6.5, Bergara HMR, Howa KRG Bravo, etc.
If you're talking gas gun series you need to decide if you want to shoot open class, tac, or tac heavy. Lots of good shooters place high and even win matches in tac shooting 223. Personally I like the smaller 223 platform more than the large frame. I'd stick to 223 or 224 Valkyrie. I recommend staying away from the Grendel based rounds unless you just like buying bolts. Regardless of how good of a bolt you buy and if you keep the pressure mild you will still eat bolts, yes even the JP high pressure bolts fail. 224V with a 95gr SMK will beat all the other AR15 sized rounds in wind drift, it's very very repeatable to 1K. Even the 90gr SMK factory load is great which I've shot to 1350... I still wouldn't take it to a bolt gun match though.
I've NEVER seen anyone do even remotely well with a gasser at a bolt gun match. I've heard of some placing decently at smaller club series matches, but I haven't seen it myself.
If it's just what you had and you just want to get out and get your feet wet, absolutely go for it, but setting up an AR for the purpose of shooting bolt gun or club series is just foolish. Especially considering that it will cost you more to build a precision gas gun that what you can get a decent 6 or 6.5 creedmoor bolt. $800 will get you a Gen 2 RPR in 6mm Creed or a little more and you can get a CTR 6.5, Bergara HMR, Howa KRG Bravo, etc.
If you're talking gas gun series you need to decide if you want to shoot open class, tac, or tac heavy. Lots of good shooters place high and even win matches in tac shooting 223. Personally I like the smaller 223 platform more than the large frame. I'd stick to 223 or 224 Valkyrie. I recommend staying away from the Grendel based rounds unless you just like buying bolts. Regardless of how good of a bolt you buy and if you keep the pressure mild you will still eat bolts, yes even the JP high pressure bolts fail. 224V with a 95gr SMK will beat all the other AR15 sized rounds in wind drift, it's very very repeatable to 1K. Even the 90gr SMK factory load is great which I've shot to 1350... I still wouldn't take it to a bolt gun match though.
My intent is the gas gun division, which I believe at the range in question has shorter ranges and larger targets.
Ok, not looking for the 2 day prs matches, I have a 6 dasher and 6.5 creed for those. I'm talking club series. 830 yards max. Something accurate enough to compete with, but not putting more rounds on my dasher..
Why can’t an AR compete with bolt guns? I’m curious? I am trying to recall an article I read on precision rifle blog maybe about accuracy and first round hit probabilities. Based on his reasoning a gas gun shouldn’t limit your ability to hit targets fast in prs?
I’ll have to go back and re-read the article maybe.
I’ll have to go back and re-read the article maybe.
From prone an AR can compete. From every other shitty position you'll ever contort into its not even close. Literally every time I start thinking about another precision AR build I go shoot one back to back against a bolt gun off a barricade or tank trap. I've saved a lot of money this way.
You can be the one to prove everyone wrong that has actually used both in matches that it’s just as easy to shoot an ar as it is a bolt gun in a field type precision rifle match ???
I’m not saying it is. Was asking the question. I only have three things preventing me from trying though.
1. I can’t afford the JP.
2. I have no where to shoot beyond 100 meters within two hours
3. I can’t afford the prs bolt guns either.
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1. I can’t afford the JP.
2. I have no where to shoot beyond 100 meters within two hours
3. I can’t afford the prs bolt guns either.
.I haven’t been in the conversation but I can answer the question I have a very nice 6.5 creedmoor that runs like a sewing machine with 123’s and varget also acceptable accuracy for PRS. I have shot it in PRS matches even though I have four other PRS rifles. It worked wonderful prone accept getting that last round out if you didn’t load the exact amount (I always load 1 extra ) removing the mag collecting your brass and not taking an hour. On barricade stages there is to much moving mass the rifle will not stay on target even with a high dollar tuned brake or can. I will probably still use mine in some matches because it’s fun. One last thing the brass is hotter the hell compared to a bolt gun when you go to pick it up.
If set on a AR15, i'd be looking at factory ammo. Best shooting AR15 choices shooting factory ammo are 6.5 Grendel or 224V.
It's not clear to me if you have a bolt gun or not. If not, i'd forget the AR idea and look at a RPR and enroll in a shooting class to learn proper fundamentals to shoot distance.
It's not clear to me if you have a bolt gun or not. If not, i'd forget the AR idea and look at a RPR and enroll in a shooting class to learn proper fundamentals to shoot distance.
So. This isn’t my original post. But an interesting topic. So the issue as summed up (2 posts up) is the recoil and brass? Stupid question. Do you have to collect your brass? Is the magazine harder to eject than on a bolt?
And on recoil would an arca mounted bag like the drc fortune cookie help mitigate recoil problems on barricades?
And on recoil would an arca mounted bag like the drc fortune cookie help mitigate recoil problems on barricades?
Ah. That makes a lot of sense. Are there ways to decrease lock time? The bolt carrier reciprocating should be after bullet exits barrel I think so would have more impact of spotting your shot? Is lock time really the issue or is it more the messy break? And are there no fixes that mitigate that issue.
I just wonder if a top level shooter competed with a top shelf gas gun. How big of a disadvantage would he be at? If both guns were same caliber etc.
I just wonder if a top level shooter competed with a top shelf gas gun. How big of a disadvantage would he be at? If both guns were same caliber etc.
I haven’t shot an ar since I was in the army 20 years ago. And you know how shitty army rifles are! I remember the odd recoil impulse of the bolt group moving back and forth after the actual recoil. Was hoping modern captured buffer springs, and low mass bolt groups and modern triggers would have made it better!!
Daniel Horner would kick my ass with his 6 creedmoor gas gun against me shooting my 6 creedmoor bolt gun.
So which is it? Because gas gun series have all been 2 day matches thus far. It hasn’t gained traction anywhere near what the bolt gun matches have so it’s probably going to be a while until you see a club gas gun series.
If you want to shoot club series matches and save your barrel then I’d suggest building/buying a 1:7-8 twist 223 bolt gun and running the heavies or just get a 223 barrel and bolt for your match rifle and swapping them around which will save you a lot of money over setting up another rifle.
If you want to shoot gas gun series I’d stick to the small frame and run 224 Valkyrie with either 95gr SMK’s or 80.5gr Fullbores.
If you want the answer from one of the best shooters in the sport contact Tyler Payne on the Precision Rifle Series public facebook page.
Tyler holds championships in both PRS gas gun series and bolt gun series. He'd be happy to answer your questions. SSG Payne is an awesome ambassador for both the US Army (AMU) and PRS.
Tyler holds championships in both PRS gas gun series and bolt gun series. He'd be happy to answer your questions. SSG Payne is an awesome ambassador for both the US Army (AMU) and PRS.
In a recent precision class I did one of the guys in my group ran a .224 valk with a yhm suppressor and had not issues out to 820yds wind or no wind. His dope was not much different then that of the guys shooting .308 I was so impressed I grabbed a couple of 224 barrels the following week.
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