Best AR Platform for the $

#51
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: leprechaun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For a little more you can move up to the Ruger 556.You don't have to do anything to them out of the box. </div></div>Do yourself a favor and avoid the whole piston phase until it is standardized. Ive had both and the piston does run cleaner but parts are proprietary and usually hard to find. Theres nothing wrong with DI, all guns need maintenance just keep a DI gun wet and it will run for thousands of rounds without cleaning.
 
#53
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

For the premium you'd pay for RRA you can buy an upper and lower like BCM or LMT for much better, and have so much more value than a RRA, DPMS, Stag, bushy, etc. Though RRA are good guns i wouldn't pay over 650$ for one when i can build a BCM for around 800-900$.

The ruger 556 is notorious for carrier tilt, do yourself a favor and don't buy that overpriced thing. As said i wouldn't touch piston until it's standard. The stoner design just wasn't intended to have a OP rod and thats that. If carbon fouling in the chamber area was as big of a problem as some tout it to be semi automatics would be worthless, as they all have some amount of blowback into the system. Granted there are some piston sytems that work very well but they're way out of a budget AR range, and your subject to said manufacturer for parts, which are expensive.
 
#54
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blackops_2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For the premium you'd pay for RRA you can buy an upper and lower like BCM or LMT for much better, and have so much more value than a RRA, DPMS, Stag, bushy, etc. <span style="font-weight: bold">Though RRA are good guns i wouldn't pay over 650$ for one when i can build a BCM for around 800-900$</span>.

The ruger 556 is notorious for carrier tilt, do yourself a favor and don't buy that overpriced thing. As said i wouldn't touch piston until it's standard. <span style="font-weight: bold">The stoner design just wasn't intended to have a OP rod and thats that.</span> If carbon fouling in the chamber area was as big of a problem as some tout it to be semi automatics would be worthless, as they all have some amount of blowback into the system. Granted there are some piston sytems that work very well but they're way out of a budget AR range, and your subject to said manufacturer for parts, which are expensive. </div></div>

Strongly agree with both points! It never ceases to amaze me how many times someone will recommend a tier 3 AR when tier 1, with known QC, individual parts testing, and 100% mil-spec parts, can be purchased for the same or near the same price
confused.gif
! Last I checked RRA <span style="font-style: italic">still</span> did not offer properly staked carrier keys and only batch tested the major components...you might get a good one but why roll the dice?

As for piston ARs: As Ken Elmore says... "Jet engines don't have pistons and neither does my AR."
wink.gif
Name me one manufacturer that has truly solved the carrier tilt problem; even the vaunted HKs are known to have the issue.
 
#56
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: m_gale</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's always a good idea to buy a complete rifle. Piecing a rifle together increases the probability of buying a lesson. </div></div>

Respectfully: I just don't agree with that statement, at least when talkin' ARs...

To each his own, and if you don't feel comfortable building, by all means buy a complete rifle. BUT: I've built every one of my ARs without a single 'buying lesson', and I'd take even the least of them over a complete rifle from a tier 3 manufacturer... every time! The first "build" (loose usage of the term,
wink.gif
) consisted of sliding the charging handle and BCG into a complete BCM upper and snapping it onto an assembled lower to which I had added an Ace stock. Pretty hard to mess any of that up! The assembly of the above is really nothing more than what any AR owner goes through after a good field-strip/cleaning anyway, plus the stock install, of course. And...with the added benefit of not having to pay Uncle Sam for the 'privilege' (I thought it was a <span style="text-decoration: underline">right</span>..but we'll leave that for a different day...) of purchasing a firearm.

Since then I usually build from scratch and get exactly what I want the way I want at a much better price than I can buy the same quality complete rifle for, but I'm pretty-much a DIY-type for everything. As for tools: I assembled my first lower with only a carpenters hammer, nail set and a pair of regular slip-joint pliers. There are certainly simpler options for those not so DIY inclined.

My advice is not to be scared away from building (or at least "snapping together") if you have any such inclination; ARs really <span style="font-style: italic">are</span> incredibly simple devices.
 
#58
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: plong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

As for piston ARs: As Ken Elmore says... "Jet engines don't have pistons and neither does my AR."
wink.gif
Name me one manufacturer that has truly solved the carrier tilt problem; even the vaunted HKs are known to have the issue. </div></div>

PWS / Specialized Tactical

Next...
 
#59
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: truth</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: plong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

As for piston ARs: As Ken Elmore says... "Jet engines don't have pistons and neither does my AR."
wink.gif
Name me one manufacturer that has truly solved the carrier tilt problem; even the vaunted HKs are known to have the issue. </div></div>

PWS / Specialized Tactical

Next... </div></div>

I didn't say: 'Name me one(s) that <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">say</span></span> they've solved....' Report back after 5k rounds(or more
smirk.gif
). Next...
wink.gif


But, for the sake of the OP's thread, I won't further degenerate into a DI v Piston debate; to each his own, I guess. He did, however, ask about about "Best ... for the $" I hope we can at least agree that the 'better' piston systems carry a healthy premium versus DI.
 
#60
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: plong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I didn't say: 'Name me one(s) that <span style="font-style: italic"><span style="font-weight: bold">say</span></span> they've solved....' Report back after 5k rounds(or more
smirk.gif
). Next...
wink.gif


But, for the sake of the OP's thread, I won't further degenerate into a DI v Piston debate; to each his own, I guess. He did, however, ask about about "Best ... for the $" I hope we can at least agree that the 'better' piston systems carry a healthy premium versus DI.</div></div>

Read: http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3223782&page=1

I just grabbed a new in box unfired PWS mk114 off gun broker for $1400. Not really much of a premium when you factor in the Magpul stock, grip and BUIS it comes with.

The vast majority of the Specialized Tactical rifles which use the PWS piston upper are sold to LE and military. www.specializedtactical.com/
 
#61
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: truth</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Read: http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3223782&page=1 </div></div>

Have read (when originally posted), will continue to respectfully disagree. As I said: HK also claims to have conquered carrier tilt but there is clear evidence to the contrary (so much for 'purchased by military...' being an endorsement.) No more debate re. DI v Piston from me. All we'll do is frustrate each other and probably tick-off one or more of the mods, leading to nothing good...
blush.gif


Now as to the issue of the piston premium: I have exactly $933 in my BCM 16" middy with Magpul furniture and Troy sights (I refuse to use plastic sights, even if they are back-ups). $1400 - 933 = $467; $467/933 = 50% so yes, I do think 50% more is a significant premium! Especially when the OP asked about "Best ... for the $". YMMV!
 
#62
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

I think it's healthy to weigh the merits of each so long as the dialogue doesn't devolve into a pissing contest. One only need to read this thread to watch the Colt fanboys rage on incoherently. I have no working knowledge of BCM products other than the charging handle on my PWS, but a quick google search shows the mid 16 mod 2 selling for around $1300.
 
#63
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: truth</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One only need to read this thread to watch the Colt fanboys rage on incoherently.</div></div>

Well that's one point upon which we definitely <span style="font-style: italic">do</span> agree...
grin.gif
PL out for now...
 
#64
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

I would personally recommend Rock River Arms great platforms with moa or less accuracy guarantees and 2 stage triggers. But there is a back log for them.
Check Walmart out. Here in Texas they sell the Colt for about $1087.
 
#65
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

+1 for RRA (very pleased with mine)
+1 for Daniel Defense

I see your in the north Texas area, you might check the shows, they have one in the DFW area just about every weekend.
If you start watching them closely you should be able to get your hands on a RRA or a few of the other makes pretty easy, and once you start watching them you will be able to spot the better priced ones and just maybe you might be able to talk the price down a few extra bucks especially if you carry cash.

Its on you to do the homework there though.

Another option. A few of my fellow gunners that choose not to build their own. Have found that CCMG's bargain bin was a pretty decent way to get their hands a good starter, and that they made decent drill/CQB guns. Im not sure I would say they can hold up to the before mentioned makes out at Max Effective Range, but they served their purpose for them.
 
#66
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

I have both the RRA LAR-15 and LAR-8 A4's. I would say they are both very accurate. In fact, I do very well competing in F-class with the .223 though the bolt action guys usually edge me out. I can't say I don't ever have malfunctions but they suit my needs. Both are .5 moa capable with the right loads and shooting technique. I'll probably try the LAR-8 this year in f-class but I got the lead weight to put in the buttstock. It puts me over the weight limit but it makes shooting 178 hpbts feel like .223s.
 
#67
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

It really depends on what you are going to use it for IMO. If this is your first one and you just want something to take to the range and try out, take to the local gravel pit or woods and plink around with or even some light varmint or coyote hunting, and at the same time want the best bang for your buck without breaking the bank, then I think Rock River, CMMG, Stag are great options if you want to keep costs down but still want reasonable accuracy and performance. They will go bang all day and give you accurate shots for these types of functions. In other words, you'll get your monies worth.

Now if your going to be kicking in doors and doing raids on drug dealers for Law enforcement/military application type of work then of course you'd want to up it to Colt or LMT and even beyond to LWRC or something of that grade.

Prices can very widely with geography as well. If you can build an LMT for under 1k as some suggest here (by build i mean BCG and sights) then go for it but around where i live its not going to happen. Prices are higher. Nor can I find a complete Colt, out the door, for under 1k either. But if you can where you are at then good deal. Just my 2 cents.
 
#68
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

Depends on what you will use it for primarily. Will you use a can (if so, piston guns run alot cleaner).

Daniel Defense
Larue
POF
LWRC
Colt
FN Scar
Wilson Combat
Barrett
 
#70
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mackdrvr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I skimmed this thread, and did'nt see any mention of S&W. They make a great rig, and are worth looking at. Just sayin'.</div></div>

Third post s&w was mentioned.

For target range/hunting/Plinking. Nothing is wrong with rra, stag, cmmg.

If your life depends on it or if you have the budget I'd go LMT,Colt, DD, s&w

I chose a lmt mrp for a complete rifle but it was in my budget. I have 2 rra lowers with other custom uppers that have been Perfect at the range and a mega arms 6.5 build in the works. But In a pinch I'm going to grab my lmt.

From now on though,(after I get my woa service rifle upper) I'm building my ARs.
 
#72
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kvwpwr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mackdrvr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I skimmed this thread, and did'nt see any mention of S&W. They make a great rig, and are worth looking at. Just sayin'.</div></div>

<span style="text-decoration: underline">Third post s&w was mentioned. </span>
For target range/hunting/Plinking. Nothing is wrong with rra, stag, cmmg.

If your life depends on it or if you have the budget I'd go LMT,Colt, DD, s&w

I chose a lmt mrp for a complete rifle but it was in my budget. I have 2 rra lowers with other custom uppers that have been Perfect at the range and a mega arms 6.5 build in the works. But In a pinch I'm going to grab my lmt.

From now on though,(after I get my woa service rifle upper) I'm building my ARs. </div></div> <span style="text-decoration: underline"> </span>

I see said the blind man. Thanks.
 
#73
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

Basically it is going to be your own preference. I always recommend what I have personal experience with which most people do and is why you get such a large variety of manufacturers to choose from. Shooters here at sniper hide always buy top of the line.

My brother purchased a bushmaster carbine for less than $800. We went to Terlingua and unloaded over 900 rds killing every rock and cactus that tried to over run our camp ground. Never had a malfunction the whole time. We did oil the bolt every 3 or 400 rounds but thats it.

So from personal experience I could also recommend bushmaster.
 
#75
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: marduk185</div><div class="ubbcode-body">screw ar's, get a keltec and zimmerman the ones what has it cummin. </div></div>

^^ is that what your mall security SWAT team is issued now?
 
#77
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

The sale RRA has on the tactical rifles right now ($1000) can't be beat. Without breaking the bank, it is the most bang for your buck. Someone mentioned Palmetto State, but honestly everything I have seen from them was a very poor fit. The last few that have come across our dish had more play than an AK...
 
#78
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nfitton</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The sale RRA has on the tactical rifles right now ($1000) can't be beat. Without breaking the bank, it is the most bang for your buck. Someone mentioned Palmetto State, but honestly everything I have seen from them was a very poor fit. The last few that have come across our dish had more play than an AK...</div></div>

I respectfully disagree..may sound like a broken record but BCM > RRA in both price/performance. BCM, DD, LMT, Spikes, PSA, etc. are decent places to look for quality reliable mil spec rifles for a decent price. As i said earlier paying 1000$ and up for a RRA is well to be blunt overpriced, as harsh as it sounds it's just the fact of the matter. Especially when you can get something that's assembled with the proper parts elsewhere for less.

I'm not that familiar with PSA but have heard good things. Define play? Play between the upper and lower receiver? Or play in internals and exteriors reflecting build quality?

BCM upper 420$
BCM BCG 150$
BCM lower 350$ if you must go BCM as a lower can be had for 170-200$ easily and even less if you build it.

920$ at the most, completely mil-spec as he did mention reliability as a preference, and just as accurate in my experience.

Don't get me wrong RRA is not a bad AR by any means but they're certainly not the best bang for the buck, when for less he can have better. My friend owns a RRA that he paid 1200$ we've had no problems out of it, it's a joy to shoot. What he payed for that i could have my BCM and almost 400$ to spare on mags, ammo, or to put towards optics.
 
#80
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

In response to Blackops_2 and BCM, what I was referring to was the tactical rifle sale RRA has right now. I checked with BravoCompany and the basic $920 rifle you are referring to is the basic M4 style rifle that Delton or a lot of others have for 700-750. Check out the RRA sale http://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=461 and compare features. Once you add the flip up front sight, rear sight, free floating front quad or half quad, match trigger, stop mod stock and everything else, the BCM just became a lot more expensive. Only because of this sale do I bring up the RRA. I haven't found anyone with this many features at this price. If there is, please let me know as I would love to get them. I would prefer something shorter than the 6-8 week lead time from RRA. Granted I am at 3 months or so on just receivers from Spikes, so maybe 6-8 weeks isn't so bad after all...
 
#81
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

Ah my mistake, i was thinking it was just a regular RRA on sale for 1000$. Though RRA still isn't the quality BCM is, granted the RRA with all the extras is of very good value.
 
#82
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blackops_2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ah my mistake, i was thinking it was just a regular RRA on sale for 1000$. Though RRA still isn't the quality BCM is, granted the RRA with all the extras is of very good value. </div></div>

Can you get the same MOA accuracy guarantee that RRA offers with a BCM for the same price?
 
#84
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Imurhuckleberry</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Blackops_2</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ah my mistake, i was thinking it was just a regular RRA on sale for 1000$. Though RRA still isn't the quality BCM is, granted the RRA with all the extras is of very good value. </div></div>

Can you get the same MOA accuracy guarantee that RRA offers with a BCM for the same price?</div></div>

My 18" BCM is more accurate than my friends 16" RRA. Though we haven't tried much ammo through his because he is cheap. I haven't taken my carbine past 100yds, my aimpoint has a 50yd zero. Both will shoot. In my experience yes.
 
#85
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

I know they still need to earn some cred, but I purchased a Windham Weaponry as a cheep purchase. They are top notch rifles in my book. Look at the barrel under the hand guard, That is the thickest barrel I've seen on a stock rifle. Model # R16A4T
Keep an eye out. I love mine. (And I am in no way associated with WW in any way.)
 
#86
Re: Best AR Platform for the $

There's a lot of good advice here. For your first setup in that price range, and for not really knowing exactly what you want, I don't think you'll be making a mistake with any of the mentioned brands. Get into something that will leave you money for some ammo. Shoot the hell out of it and figure out exactly what you want to do... They're easy to customize and you WILL find yourself wanting to change this or that.

I'm sure you know good optics are pricey. There are some pretty decent budget optics that will more than likely serve your purposes if you're using it for plinking and having fun.
 
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