Big Horn action question

[Jevaughn0823]

I’m looking at the Big Horn Origin action to upgrade my Savage model 12. I’ve been using this gun to get into some local prs style matches. I have already installed a Hawk Hill barrel and don’t have but about 350 rounds on it so that is why I’m looking at the Origin action to be able to still use my current barrel. My question is what kind of machining would have to be done to my barrel to get it to fit? My Smith did away with the barrel nut. Also what improvement in bolt manipulation would I see with the Origin? Working the Savage bolt has been a chore to say the least on my action.

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

If your barrel were a typical Savage pre-fit, it would fit fine as the thread pitch is the same and you could use the barrel nut.

Being there is a shoulder on it, I don't think it will work.

You could buy a set of Head space gauges and find out, or hopefully someone more knowledgeable than I can chime in.

 

[MangoFett]

They may have the same thread spec but I'm sure they are different enough to not headspace.

 

[mi223]

Like the others said. It will need to be properly fit by a gunsmith again.

I love my origin. I would bet you will feel the same

 

[Jevaughn0823]

I was hoping with this route to save some money and not have to get another barrel. I'm guessing my smith should just be able to re-cut the threads and adjust headspace. I might lose a little barrel length I guess. I'll have to do some research into this, I definitley have the time as the funds aren't quite to this point yet, hahaha. But thanks for the answers!

 

[Zermatt Arms]

I was hoping with this route to save some money and not have to get another barrel. I'm guessing my smith should just be able to re-cut the threads and adjust headspace. I might lose a little barrel length I guess. I'll have to do some research into this, I definitley have the time as the funds aren't quite to this point yet, hahaha. But thanks for the answers!

Send me an email and I'll get you a copy of the tenon print for the Origin that you can share with your smith. They should be able to tell you from the print what it will take to get you going with the barrel you have.

[email protected]

Thank you!

 

[Superjet]

You’ll love the Origin action. I upgraded from a 110 and wish I would have started with the Origin.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

Send me an email and I'll get you a copy of the tenon print for the Origin that you can share with your smith. They should be able to tell you from the print what it will take to get you going with the barrel you have.

[email protected]

Thank you!

Thanks Ray, I will send an email your way.

 

[TxWelder35]

If I’m not mistaken bighorn takes small shank savage threads. Your model 12 is large shank

 

[Steel head]

If I’m not mistaken bighorn takes small shank savage threads. Your model 12 is large shank

This is probably the case.
That does mean there’s plenty of meat to get it fit up.

 

[drbcolt]

Northland Shooters Supply has an way for you to tell if you have a large or small shank. You would need your old barrel nut for this to work. http://northlandshooterssupply.com/category/technical-information/ I love the Big Horn Orgin action and I currently run a Northland Shooters barrel with nut. The Big Horn is machined so precise you can order a shouldered barrel ready to go without sending in the action. I would recommend contacting Ryan Hunt with Hunt's Long Range to see if he could make your barrel work. https://huntslongrange.com

 

[IowaGeologist]

If I’m not mistaken bighorn takes small shank savage threads. Your model 12 is large shank

Not all 12s are Large Shank. If he had something like the Cablea's 12FV it's a small. If it's a 12 LRP it will be a large.

I try not to rag on Savage too much because I think they're great for what they are, a cheaper but accurate rifle. Having said that, their naming system is ****ed.

 

[PAYDIRT]

Just grab a barrel for the Origin from northland then you don't have a action laying around doing nothing.

 

[Steel head]

Just grab a barrel for the Origin from northland then you don't have a action laying around doing nothing.

Both the shilen and criterion barrels shoot awesome and he has factory take off barrels as well.

 

[domdoc]

Rethreading/shouldering/chamber modification will cost more than a Southern Precision or Northland prefit, and will take longer.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

Not all 12s are Large Shank. If he had something like the Cablea's 12FV it's a small. If it's a 12 LRP it will be a large.

I try not to rag on Savage too much because I think they're great for what they are, a cheaper but accurate rifle. Having said that, their naming system is ****ed.

Funny you mention this as this is exactly what I have. I remember when I sent it to my smith he pointed out it is a small shank which surprised me as I thought all 12's were large shank.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

I'm sure the northland prefits are great barrels, but i only have 350 rds on this Hawk Hill barrel and it is a tack driver so I would like to keep it running.

 

[Steel head]

I'm sure the northland prefits are great barrels, but i only have 350 rds on this Hawk Hill barrel and it is a tack driver so I would like to keep it running.

There’s a few options to get that barrel fit up.
No problem for your smith.

 

[spife7980]

Why not call it even and keep the current barrel on the current action and just supplement with another of both?

Youre going to pay 2-300 on retrofitting the shouldered barrel to fit the new action and doing so leaves you with either

• an unused bare action (so 2-300 in costs sitting on the shelf useless)
• spending even more money to barrel the savage yet again (3-400 in costs again)
• or selling the savage action which means youre trading the complete barreled action out for just the act of cutting anew shoulder on a used barrel and zero else

Investing any money into a savage is never an "investment", its sunk costs and spending another penny on it only sinks it further. Leave well enough alone and quit digging that indian burial ground up.

 

[b6graham]

keep barrel on current gun. it's not like the trigger/chassis transfer to an origin

build new origin

have two hammers

 

[King_beardsly]

Just do a fresh build since you’re essentially starting from scratch with an action, no messing around with getting an old barrel modified to fit a fresh action. Plus you’ll have a spare rig that you can have friends shoot if they want to dabble in long range stuff.

Now in regards to the bolt manipulation it’s a night and day difference, I came from a savage before my origin and I was blown away with how much better it felt/ran.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

Guys, how great it would be to just build another rifle! It's easy for you guys to sit back and throw that phrase out there not knowing another man's finances. It took me a while just to get this rifle together and while it is still a step child Savage it got me into the game and for right now will probably serve me for a few more competitions and learning curves. For me and the situation i'm in if I can sell the action, stock, and accurate mag bottom metal that would eat into the cost of an Origin, stock, and trigger. Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

 

[Steel head]

Guys, how great it would be to just build another rifle! It's easy for you guys to sit back and throw that phrase out there not knowing another man's finances. It took me a while just to get this rifle together and while it is still a step child Savage it got me into the game and for right now will probably serve me for a few more competitions and learning curves. For me and the situation i'm in if I can sell the action, stock, and accurate mag bottom metal that would eat into the cost of an Origin, stock, and trigger. Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

“Take you poors sorrows elsewhere”
The German 2020

As a member of the precision rifle poors club I have limited $$ to throw at rifles as I also have other hobbies the soak up fair amounts of $$$


While I do have a pretty nice custom action rifle now(2 months of no hookers n blow almost killed me!) I also run a savage that I shot a buttload over the years.

 

[King_beardsly]

Guys, how great it would be to just build another rifle! It's easy for you guys to sit back and throw that phrase out there not knowing another man's finances. It took me a while just to get this rifle together and while it is still a step child Savage it got me into the game and for right now will probably serve me for a few more competitions and learning curves. For me and the situation i'm in if I can sell the action, stock, and accurate mag bottom metal that would eat into the cost of an Origin, stock, and trigger. Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

Can you sell the complete rifle to offset the new build and could the new rig fill a multiple rolls, essentially being a do all rig?

Now I know it’s easy to say build an other rifle, and financially it’s not always possible. I’ve built two rig with in the last year one being a budget friendly origin and the other a TL3 that my wife might disown me for if she knew what I spent. In the process of building them I sold some stuff that either was sitting around or would be made obsolete by the rifle I was building. Btw even though I’ve got two custom builds, I’ve still got my original savage that started the whole long range addiction

 

[IowaGeologist]

Guys, how great it would be to just build another rifle! It's easy for you guys to sit back and throw that phrase out there not knowing another man's finances. It took me a while just to get this rifle together and while it is still a step child Savage it got me into the game and for right now will probably serve me for a few more competitions and learning curves. For me and the situation i'm in if I can sell the action, stock, and accurate mag bottom metal that would eat into the cost of an Origin, stock, and trigger. Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

Guess I'm not really sure why you're upset that people are recommending you just get a different barrel for the Origin. Without the info you just posted about selling the Savage setup (sans barrel) and cheap/free smithing services their recommendations were probably the correct ones when factoring in the cost of a new barrel vs typical smithing costs for the barrel.

 

[6brshooter]

Guys, how great it would be to just build another rifle! It's easy for you guys to sit back and throw that phrase out there not knowing another man's finances. It took me a while just to get this rifle together and while it is still a step child Savage it got me into the game and for right now will probably serve me for a few more competitions and learning curves. For me and the situation i'm in if I can sell the action, stock, and accurate mag bottom metal that would eat into the cost of an Origin, stock, and trigger. Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

I get it, I dont blame you. Most Smith's, dont know what yours charges, charge 250+/- to thread and chamber a barrel, plus 50-75 for muzzle threads. Obviously we don't know the deal you get from your guy. Have it set back, worst case you loose 1/4-1/2". I would be hesitant to spend more money on a 6creed that had more than 350rds(especially if it had been run hard). Did your smith true up savage threads, where the barrel is +.010 over standard. If it is true 1.060x20, you might get lucky and just need the tenon shorter and chamber cut to headspace correctly. If the shoulder needs moved forward, hed have to do that and carefully pick up threads and extend them, then recut chamber.

When I had savages, I never bothered with anything other than a trued barrel nut. If you are gonna be running a 6creed on a savage threaded action, I'd just roll with a criterion prefit, alot cheaper than having 350 blanks spun up every 1500rds.

Criterion 6creed on an origin, cant even see the barrel nut...

5rds of 105hybrids@3130fps

Chrony data from last outing

 

[PAYDIRT]

This comes to mind.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

Guy's i'm far from upset and i'm not playing the financial fiddle. My main question I asked back up top in the thread was the machining involved to put my current barrel on a Origin action and also how people liked their Origin action, no more no less. I'm very grateful to get a response from Zermatt Arms and this is the info I was looking for. If I was going to build a totally new build I would have asked for recommendations on different actions as I know their might be better out there. Thanks for some helpful answers.

 

[spife7980]

Again you guys don't know the facts because my smith does not charge me $200-300 that's the relationship I have with him.

Well then present those fucking facts to start with. "Hey, I have free labor so its no big deal" is a pretty big deal when that free labor is worth more than the savage action.

That said, if youre in that tight of financial straights that 3-400 bucks is going to make or break the deal... do we think investing in a custom action is a prudent path to take? Becaus ei doubt you get a whole lot back for the savage take offs.

And since we posted at the same time, getting an origin and having to recut the barrel for it is a "totally new build". The machining to do it is the same exact machining that will go into a new barrel only you get the added benefit of it already being used when youre done. Yippee.

 

[6brshooter]

Guy's i'm far from upset and i'm not playing the financial fiddle. My main question I asked back up top in the thread was the machining involved to put my current barrel on a Origin action and also how people liked their Origin action, no more no less. I'm very grateful to get a response from Zermatt Arms and this is the info I was looking for. If I was going to build a totally new build I would have asked for recommendations on different actions as I know their might be better out there. Thanks for some helpful answers.

Nothing wrong with an origin. I like it as much and maybe more, than my tl3. That's based solely on $ comparison. What trigger are you planning on going with? Be aware that you might have some cock on close, but that's easy enough to measure and stone or buy the appropriate sized cocking piece from zermatt. I've had 2 origins. The first exhibited about .030 coc with a bix 2 stage and proper top sear. The 2nd one was perfect and no coc with a giessele 2 stage.

 

[Jevaughn0823]

Nothing wrong with an origin. I like it as much and maybe more, than my tl3. That's based solely on $ comparison. What trigger are you planning on going with? Be aware that you might have some cock on close, but that's easy enough to measure and stone or buy the appropriate sized cocking piece from zermatt. I've had 2 origins. The first exhibited about .030 coc with a bix 2 stage and proper top sear. The 2nd one was perfect and no coc with a giessele 2 stage.

I've been seeing a lot of good things about Diamond triggers so I might give one of those a try.

 

[King_beardsly]

I lucked out when I got my bolt back after getting the revised version, no noticeable coc with the TT primary and I believe my diamond with the same way but that’s in a TL3 right now

 

[BWB]

If you let Ray and crew know what trigger you plan on running they will make sure and send out the matching cocking piece for that brand/model. Just FYI