Rifle Scopes Bighorn hunt: Z6i 2-12 vs LHT 4.5-22 vs March 1.5-15 vs…?

[gnochi]

Hi all!

I got phenomenally lucky and drew a Bighorn tag in California with a mere 6 preference points. Said hunt will be in December, but I don’t have a suitable rifle setup.

By virtue of “what was in stock” for both copper ammo (again, California) and barrels, I have components on the way for a ~6.25lb rifle in 7 PRC. But I need a scope that won’t break my back. (And yes, the next 6 months will be spent getting in the best shape of my life.)

Would y’all mind providing some thoughts and pointers? Which of these scopes would you recommend for or against and why, and is there something else that should be on my list?

• Swarovski Z6i 2-12: Love the weight, I’ve heard the clarity is phenomenal, I wish there were reticle options in FFP with subtensions
• Vortex HD LHT 4.5-22: The weight is pretty great, I like the reticle, I have one and I wish the glass were clearer. Not to say it’s bad at all, but it was a notable step down from the ZC527 in one of my other guns, and I’m more than a bit of a snob.
• March 1.5-15: The weight is great on 2fp, 1/dfp weight is still pretty good. I like the glass in my 1-10 dfp. I like the reticles well enough, and I really like March’s fiber illumination.

Most of my shooting to date has been making steel go ding at the range, with slightly more than zero positional shooting; my hunting successes so far have been shotgunning doves, and the occasional <75yd deer with a Marlin 336, so this is quite new to me.

Here’s the requested info:

• What is the platform for the scope? Bolt action
• What cartridge are you shooting? 7 PRC
• What is your intended use for the scope? Mountain hunting
• What type of conditions will you typically shoot in? Daytime
• What are the typical distances you intend to shoot? Up to ~600yd
• Are there any specific specifications you would like? FFP preferred, I’m a glass clarity snob, 30/34mm tube preferred since that’s what my preferred direct-mount rings come in, zoom range includes 5x and 10x, illuminated dot preferred
• What is the price range you can afford? Soft limit of $3000

 

[shields shtr]

I don't have the 1-15 March, but have the 4.5-28. I would say it is my favorite scope. I too am a glass snob and these don't leave much on the table for sure compared to my other high end glass. I would say 15x is plenty on the high end for your ranges as well. Also own the LHT and even though I despise Vortex, I think I prefer that one to the AMG I had.

I used @MOUNTIC for my March Purchase, not sure if he still is doing optics.

 

[Chris1972]

You might very well be hunting in some questionable weather and lighting. You stated you’re a glass snob and want FFP. I’m going out on a limb and saying the few extra ounces of the ZCO 420 will be worth the weight and money.

 

[UNRL Ghandi]

The March 1.5-15x dfp was a major fail in my opinion. Could've been awesome but the reticle wind hold dots were practically invisible and image quality above 8x was lacking in my opinion. They're fixing the reticle but it's going to take me up to three months to get my scope back after I send it in.

If this is a major hunt, get the best scope possible and save the extra 10-18 ozs on other pieces of gear. That weight won't kill you but missing a shot will haunt you forever.

 

[gnochi]

Lots of good food for thought, thank you. I read through the March thread, and while there’s probably something there in the future it’s probably not now.

I found a Z8i 2-16 for a great price, but I’m thinking I agree that I really should go FFP. I actually get an even worse weight hit from the ZC420 with the 36mm tube, because I’d then need to add the rail and larger rings to the Anti action I’m building off, while 30/34 has direct mount options.

So, anyone not been happy they stretched for a TT315H?

• FFP with subtensions and illumination: check
• I had a 25oz target, this is 27: light miss (vs Z6i at 19, Z8i at 22, LHT at 22, March at 25)
• Zoom includes 5/10: check
• Optical excellence: check
• 30mm tube: check

 

[shields shtr]

So, anyone not been happy they stretched for a TT315H?

If you are talking about the Marksman,I think you would be hard pressed to find many negatives for that scope. It certainly isn't an ultra light scope, but I think they weigh in right around 27-28 ounces. The glass is awesome, the turrets are a dream, truly an amazing optic.

When you buy one you can rest assured you have bought the best.

 

[Wyfox]

I have a TT 3-15 Hunter on my 300wm and love it. The popup turrets are amazing the reticle simple, its the perfect hunting scope. I've been on several sheep hunts and wouldn't hesitate using the TT for them.

 

[powdahound76]

There are a couple of those TT in the PX right now.

Im poor and dont know about normal prices vs asking there.

There is also an Swaro ATS 65 for $1900
A must for sheep country.

 

[Wyfox]

The TT3-15 in the PX are the Marksman with Gen3xr reticle, not ideal for hunting. That reticle is very thin at lower powers and the exposed non locking turrets are not ideal for backcountry hunts.

When the rifle is riding in a scabbard on a horse or slung or strapped to a backpack exposed non locking turrets can turn unintentionally, I've had it happen.

 

[powdahound76]

I dont have TT $ so I dont know those details.

I do carry an LRHS 3-12 and hunt crazy terrain.
Never had my elevation turret turn using my Kifaru gunbearer.

 

[Secant]

Tangent Theta 3-15 marksmen with Gen 2 Mildot reticle The Tangent hunter is a good option as well, but I personally like the marksman turrets better.

As has been mentioned, there is a TT315M with Gen3XR reticle in the PX right now for super cheap. Personally, I don't like how thin the reticle is for a 3-15 power, but it's a great deal if that reticle works for you.

 

[gnochi]

Yeah, if I planned to stick around 10x I’m sure I’d love the 3XR but I’ll be carrying at 3x, so the Hunter model looks best.

Speaking of, I just snagged said Hunter model at EuroOptic. I’m stoked!

@Wyfox it looks like the mountable section of scope tube is pretty short on a long action. I’d rather skip the rail interface, and stick with direct mount rings. Presumably the Talley extended rings would work; could you send me the diameter of the objective cap so I can figure out the right height?

 

[Wyfox]

Yeah, if I planned to stick around 10x I’m sure I’d love the 3XR but I’ll be carrying at 3x, so the Hunter model looks best.

Speaking of, I just snagged said Hunter model at EuroOptic. I’m stoked!

@Wyfox it looks like the mountable section of scope tube is pretty short on a long action. I’d rather skip the rail interface, and stick with direct mount rings. Presumably the Talley extended rings would work; could you send me the diameter of the objective cap so I can figure out the right height?

Congrats great choice!
Objective with cap 2.39"
Front mounting section is 1.5" long
For reference mine is mounted in Zeiss .850" rings

 

[gnochi]

Congrats great choice!
Objective with cap 2.39"
Front mounting section is 1.5" long
For reference mine is mounted in Zeiss .850" rings

Thank you!

 

[Wyfox]

What action do you have?

 

[gnochi]

I’m using a Defiance anTi! I’m not a big fan of titanium as an action material, and I think Defiance did a great job getting the weight down.

Here’s the full build:

• Defiance anTi, long, magnum, RH, nitride
• Proof prefit, Sendero, 7 PRC, 22”
• MDT HNT26, R700 LA, ARCA, folding
• Triggertech Diamond
• TT315H + Hawkins or Talley direct-mount rings, TBD
• Hawkins Hunter magazines Edit: looks like the LA specifically doesn’t fit in AICS CIP cuts, even with a flush bottom. I’ll fiddle a bit, and see what I can come up with. Worst case I’ll use the MDT mags I bought a while back.

Total weight without bipod/sling is 8.34lb, 6.46lb for the base rifle + empty magazine.

 

[Wyfox]

Mine is a Defiance Ruckus, pretty much the same action as yours

 

[ChrisAU]

NXS 2.5-10x42 or an NX8 2.5-20x50. Hunt is too special for anything less while keeping weight reasonable.

 

[robozebra]

I built a XM length 7 SAUM on the anTi action with Bartlein CFW barrel and XLR magnesium chassis. I‘m using Hawkins Long Range Hybrid rings and love them. Would highly recommend them.

 

[gnochi]

The TT315H has arrived… and holy crap. It’s magnificent. I can barely tell that there’s glass between me and whatever’s down range, the clicks are perfect, the alternating illumination and off…

Can’t wait to get out and shoot with it!

 

[Ronws]

I can't really tell you which particular brand or model of scope to buy. Maybe I can just give my ideas.

Obviously, weight is going to be a consideration for you. Try to get a scope under 2 lbs (32 oz.) Even though people have great success with SFP scopes, I personally like FFP because I like those reticles better. I like being able to range do math. I am kind of a math geek. If the laser range finder craps out, I can still estimate range.

Zoom - you may not need all the zoom in the world. One of the guys I watched is Western Desert Shooter and he was hitting a 1,000 yard target at 16x.

Some scopes, like some of the Vortex scopes, have a rev limiter for zero stop and it allows only two full rotations. Others, like Arken, do not have that limit.

So, the major consideration I would imagine is glass quality. How does the glass look to your eyes?

Great glass, managable weight, enough elevation to get you to 600 yards. I would hesitate getting a 20 MOA rail because you might just find closer targets.

In fact, I just watched Backfire hunt a bear with a scope that he likes that, with the zero stop, had only one revolution of elevation. So, that limited his effectiveness past a certain distance. He simply did not take shots past that distance. Instead, he waited for closer opportunity and got one with the 6.5 Creedmoor Sig Cross he had originally outfitted for one his sons. And yeah, that was a mountainous trek.

You can't go wrong with big brands. But these days, even the budget brands like Arken are offering no questions asked warranty on their items.

On precaution with Arken scopes. This happened to me and to others far more experienced than me. The set screws for the turrets can loosen after some time at the range. I got the answer from Arken tech support. Vibra Tite. It will hold the screws and you can back them out later, if you want.

 

[Glassaholic]

Gnochi, you got what I would have recommended given your situation, the TT 3-15x50 Marksman/Hunter is the best 3-15 on the market. As it stands, the other hunter/crossover scope that is winning me over is the new Steiner T6Xi 3-18x56. No it’s not a TT and it’s not light but it is the best 56mm low light midrange FFP scope on the market right now. I always fancied the venerable Hensoldt 4-16x56 but old world limitations (no zero stop and CW turrets) always kept me back. The T6Xi remedies everything I felt the Hensoldt was lacking, time will tell if this scope can hold up to rigorous abuse in the field.

 

[gnochi]

Gnochi, you got what I would have recommended given your situation, the TT 3-15x50 Marksman/Hunter is the best 3-15 on the market. As it stands, the other hunter/crossover scope that is winning me over is the new Steiner T6Xi 3-18x56. No it’s not a TT and it’s not light but it is the best 56mm low light midrange FFP scope on the market right now. I always fancied the venerable Hensoldt 4-16x56 but old world limitations (no zero stop and CW turrets) always kept me back. The T6Xi remedies everything I felt the Hensoldt was lacking, time will tell if this scope can hold up to rigorous abuse in the field.

I hope that makes it to one of your reviews!

 

[Jabberjaw]

What sort of paralax did the Z6i have?

 

[BJames]

I’m using a Defiance anTi! I’m not a big fan of titanium as an action material, and I think Defiance did a great job getting the weight down.

Here’s the full build:

• Defiance anTi, long, magnum, RH, nitride
• Proof prefit, Sendero, 7 PRC, 22”
• MDT HNT26, R700 LA, ARCA, folding
• Triggertech Diamond
• TT315H + Hawkins or Talley direct-mount rings, TBD
• Hawkins Hunter magazines Edit: looks like the LA specifically doesn’t fit in AICS CIP cuts, even with a flush bottom. I’ll fiddle a bit, and see what I can come up with. Worst case I’ll use the MDT mags I bought a while back.

Total weight without bipod/sling is 8.34lb, 6.46lb for the base rifle + empty magazine.

I think you’re in the perfect zone for all up rifle weight, can even gain a few oz’s. From one sheep hunter to another.

I was bitten by the ultralight bug this spring, I’m glad I went through it as I
learned a ton. Built a rifle that I got down to 5lb 9.9oz, all up. The biggest thing I learned is; that light of rifle will exploit every weakness in your fundamentals during the shot. F@*) me that thing is hard to drive consistently.

Are you going naked barrel or using a muzzle device of some sort?

 

[gnochi]

I think you’re in the perfect zone for all up rifle weight, can even gain a few oz’s. From one sheep hunter to another.

I was bitten by the ultralight bug this spring, I’m glad I went through it as I
learned a ton. Built a rifle that I got down to 5lb 9.9oz, all up. The biggest thing I learned is; that light of rifle will exploit every weakness in your fundamentals during the shot. F@*) me that thing is hard to drive consistently.

Are you going naked barrel or using a muzzle device of some sort?

I picked up one of the PVA ultralight brakes, though I’m not sure I’ll have it on the hunt. I’ll have to see how it feels on the range and getting comfortable with the rifle.

What’s your UL build?

 

[BJames]

I picked up one of the PVA ultralight brakes, though I’m not sure I’ll have it on the hunt. I’ll have to see how it feels on the range and getting comfortable with the rifle.

What’s your UL build?

I say “build”, more of a factory gun worked over. It started life as a kimber hunter in 6.5 cm. Factory barrel cut down to 18”, with the factory radial brake. Almost had the smith set it back an inch, but he said every mic’d out great. Took a saw to the stock, among other things specific to kimber‘s, lost almost a pound. Using a trijicon accupoint 3-9x40 mildot at 13.4 oz. Those little Kimber actions are hard to beat for weight savings. I wanted to prove the concept before I dumped a bunch of money into building it out as a semi custom.

In the end, I have a origin/XLR element mg/proof/ zeiss v4 300 wsm that’s right at 9/9.5 braked/suppressed respectively, that has went everywhere with me. That thing shoots lights out, had it out to 1165 with no problems, and 4 animals to its credit. With the extra weight, I won’t be as fast on the trail, might be heading back sooner.… But if I miss or can’t make the shot, it was just a backpacking trip. It’s all a trade off, I guess, lots of opportunities to lose weight elsewhere.

edited for additional comments.

 

[BJames]

Btw, that’s one hell of a tag you drew! I personally would love to read a write up/ thread of your entire process and the hunt. Good luck sir, I’m jealous.

 

[BJames]

I picked up one of the PVA ultralight brakes, though I’m not sure I’ll have it on the hunt. I’ll have to see how it feels on the range and getting comfortable with the rifle.

What’s your UL build?

Fwiw, I’m not a huge fan of brakes hunting, but the trade off of carrying foamie ear pro vs being able to spot the shot is pretty big for me. Especially if the chances of a shot beyond 300 yards is on the table.

Apologies for hijacking the thread. At the end of the day, if you choose a NXS 2.5-10 (20 oz) vs any other tier 1 optic under 32-33 oz, I think it’s players preference in your all up weight range.

 

[gnochi]

Btw, that’s one hell of a tag you drew! I personally would love to read a write up/ thread of your entire process and the hunt. Good luck sir, I’m jealous.

I still don’t quite believe I got the tag… and I’ll definitely do a writeup for posterity!

Fwiw, I’m not a huge fan of brakes hunting, but the trade off of carrying foamie ear pro vs being able to spot the shot is pretty big for me. Especially if the chances of a shot beyond 300 yards is on the table.

Apologies for hijacking the thread. At the end of the day, if you choose a NXS 2.5-10 (20 oz) vs any other tier 1 optic under 32-33 oz, I think it’s players preference in your all up weight range.

I’m with you on that, and especially because my uncle (who, lucky bastard, gets to hunt ~150 days per year, and has a ton of his sheep and goats and whatnot on his wall) will be guiding me. I don’t want to make things worse on him.

Though he would also be able to spot for me, so the brake is less necessary. I’ll need to noodle. No need to apologize!

 

[BJames]

Any of the optics mentioned will serve you very well, I know that’s not super helpful, but they will all work very well. Choose a reticle you like, along with a feature set you prefer, the weight will work itself out. As long as you’re in the all up weight range of your goal, it won’t make or break the hunt.

Personally, I have a new build in the works that will drop me from 8.25-8.5 all up. My hope is that, fitness levels and load out being equal, I can be that much faster and/or I can stay out longer. As long as accuracy and precision can be maintained in hunting scenarios (Shooting off a pack or UL tripod).

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Yeah, if I planned to stick around 10x I’m sure I’d love the 3XR but I’ll be carrying at 3x, so the Hunter model looks best.

Speaking of, I just snagged said Hunter model at EuroOptic. I’m stoked!

@Wyfox it looks like the mountable section of scope tube is pretty short on a long action. I’d rather skip the rail interface, and stick with direct mount rings. Presumably the Talley extended rings would work; could you send me the diameter of the objective cap so I can figure out the right height?

Congrats, it's a great hunting scope!! Here's mine, anTi XM with 22" bartlein CFW, 7SAUM by George and the crew at GAP...

 

[gnochi]

That’s an awesome elk!

 

[BJames]

Congrats, it's a great hunting scope!! Here's mine, anTi XM with 22" bartlein CFW, 7SAUM by George and the crew at GAP...

View attachment 8175444

This post rocks! What’s the weight on that rig? I love me some 7 Saum!

 

[XTREM HTR16]

Thanks! 9 lbs 12 oz all up as shown with suppressor and bipod

 

[bogey]

I have shot 3 sheep with my Lht. Has worked perfectly