Bighorn TL3 barrel advice needed

[SWWI Shooter]

I just placed an order for a Bighorn TL3 action and need to order a barrel. Please let me know what has been working well for you brand wise as well as nut vs. shouldered barrels. This would be a hunting rifle in 6.5 CM and probably heavy sporter profile.

On another note- I will be needing to sell my custom Tikka CTR and would like to put it on the PX. I read somewhere that I need a minimum of "100 threads" to put items on there. Is that 100 that I started myself or 100 times that I responded to other members posts?

Thanks in advance.

 

[spife7980]

Its 100 posts, not threads.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

Its 100 posts, not threads.

So since I have over 130 "messages" , I shouldn't have to pay the $40 to sell items? I appreciate the way this works as it should be safer to sell here than on Armslist but I'm just making sure I understand the rules.

 

[Sutherlandsd]

Shouldered to me is far better than the nut. I have had really good luck with the proof stainless tl3 prefits, if your a veteran or law enforcement they are priced nicely on the experticity website. Be aware they can take 10weeks+ though and if a hurry I would give keystone accuracy a call.

 

[spife7980]

I think so but the easy way to tell is to just go down to the part exchange and see if you can make a thread or not.

 

[Olen_4504]

i prefer shouldered prefit.


altus
paradigm
HLR

that's just skimming the surface of who makes shouldered bighorn barrels.

 

[padom]

So since I have over 130 "messages" , I shouldn't have to pay the $40 to sell items? I appreciate the way this works as it should be safer to sell here than on Armslist but I'm just making sure I understand the rules.

You're g2g

 

[SWWI Shooter]

Shouldered to me is far better than the nut. I have had really good luck with the proof stainless tl3 prefits, if your a veteran or law enforcement they are priced nicely on the experticity website. Be aware they can take 10weeks+ though and if a hurry I would give keystone accuracy a call.

Why do you like the shouldered better than the nut? Do you put on your own barrels or send them out to do it?

 

[padom]

Keystone Accuracy Kreiger shouldered prefit. I lost count how many I have... They are as accurate as anything else out there but probably the fastest turnaround of anyone else....

 

[SWWI Shooter]

I'm seeing Criterion and PVA which seem to be a bit cheaper than some of the others mentioned. Any feedback on those? Also, button vs. cut rifling. Keep in mind that this is a hunting rifle so if I can get it under 1/2 moa with handloads, I'll be happy.

 

[padom]

Why do you like the shouldered better than the nut? Do you put on your own barrels or send them out to do it?

You can do either yourself. Shoulder requires, less tools, easier to install... Put some grease on the barrel tenon threads, screw it on and torque it to 75ft lbs. Done.

A nut barrel you needs headspace gauges, and have to mess with the nut, barrel till it closes on a go and doesnt close on a no-go.... If you plan to swap barrels, then you need to make sure you headspace exactly the same each time so a witness mark or loctite the nut on is the go to.

Shouldered barrel is quicker and easier, Get a Bighorn action wrench and a $55 Viper barrel vise and your set. If you plan to do this once or twice you can use a vice with wood blocks and or leather and get away with install that shouldered barrel no problem..

 

[Sutherlandsd]

I put on my own. Shouldered is just much easier, don't have to fool with head spacing etc, not to mention it's repeatable whereas the nut isn't so much. Shouldered also looks much cleaner.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

Interesting. I thought that you would have to check headspace even if using a shouldered barrel.

 

[Sutherlandsd]

Criterion is going to be a nut. PVA makes an excellent barrel but it's not going to be a quick thing (that said I have 5 PVA barrels for my bighorns lol).

I prefer cut over buttoned just because I have had better luck on barrel life and accuracy.

 

[spife7980]

Interesting. I thought that you would have to check headspace even if using a shouldered barrel.

You dont have to but it sure as heck doesnt hurt to check it yourself for safety reasons. No one is immune to mistakes and if you dont check its just as much on you. Though, generally, todays work is quite good.

Personally I have gone with the barrel nuts but I guess thats mainly just because its not that intensive or difficult and I have the tools already and just like doing a bit of it myself. A bit of pride via tinkering on the cheap I guess but no argument from me that that a shouldered is fewer moving parts and simpler.

 

[b6graham]

Why do you like the shouldered better than the nut? Do you put on your own barrels or send them out to do it?

nuts are ugly and it limits the diameter (bugnut excluded). dont have to worry about headspacing.

just need an action wrench, barrel vice, and torque wrench to do a shouldered at home. easy peasy.

keystone. cheap quick hammers

 

[kthomas]

I'm seeing Criterion and PVA which seem to be a bit cheaper than some of the others mentioned. Any feedback on those? Also, button vs. cut rifling. Keep in mind that this is a hunting rifle so if I can get it under 1/2 moa with handloads, I'll be happy.

PVA has really long wait times right now. If you don't mind waiting many, many months for a barrel, PVA generally does pretty good work. Otherwise, I would go with another gunsmith.

Cut or button doesn't matter as the barrel manufacturer, either method is perfectly capable of producing a barrel that will at least be 1/2 MOA or better shooter.

If you get a blank from a proven barrel manufacturer, such as Krieger, Bartlein, Benchmark, Hawkhill, Proof, Brux, Rock Creek - you will be in good shape.

 

[bourbonbent]

I have a shouldered Heavy Palma Bartlein on mine, barrel work by Matt Stewart. Couldn’t be happier with it.

 

[kthomas]

I'll also add that I believe shouldered barrels to be superior to barrel nuts.

It's very easy to swap out a shouldered barrel - every bit as easy as a barrel nut one. You just need the right tools. For whatever reason there's a misconception out there that shouldered barrels are difficult to change out, or at least more difficult than a shouldered barrel, which is simply untrue.

 

[Codiekfx400]

If it’s a hunting barrel and you have deep pockets a proof carbon fiber would be nice.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

I'll also add that I believe shouldered barrels to be superior to barrel nuts.

It's very easy to swap out a shouldered barrel - every bit as easy as a barrel nut one. You just need the right tools. For whatever reason there's a misconception out there that shouldered barrels are difficult to change out, or at least more difficult than a shouldered barrel, which is simply untrue.

Yes, that was what I thought. I think that comes from the belief (in my case at least) that to have proper headspacing, every shouldered barrel needed to be cut by a gunsmith with the action in hand. Based on what I'm learning here, machining accuracy has gotten to the point that the action and barrel can be done in separate locations and still be within specs of headspacing. Out of curocity, what is the length difference between a go & no go gauge?

 

[spife7980]

Yes, that was what I thought. I think that comes from the belief (in my case at least) that to have proper headspacing, every shouldered barrel needed to be cut by a gunsmith with the action in hand. Based on what I'm learning here, machining accuracy has gotten to the point that the action and barrel can be done in separate locations and still be within specs of headspacing. Out of curocity, what is the length difference between a go & no go gauge?

About .004" difference between go and nogo.

Not every action can have a shouldered barrel fitted sight unseen. A bighorn TL3 is one of those that can though.

The typical remington that prior beliefs were founded on still needs to be measured. Unless you go with the remage barrel nut system which is really why they have gotten popular. You no longer needed to send your rifle off to someone for the inconsistent action to get a new barrel.

Something like the cheap ruger american, which is less expensive than a cheap remington, is getting shoulderd barrels as an option now though sight unseen via mcgowen. Machining is getting better and people are figuring out how to do it cheaper.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

If it’s a hunting barrel and you have deep pockets a proof carbon fiber would be nice.

I have been eyeballing them as well. The problem is this is my first truly custom rifle and the cost is something that I had to get past. I told myself that I would do it but try to start with a good action, then initially do everything else on an economy grade with upgrades as time went on. Unfortunately, everything that I want is on the upper price end and by the time I'm done, I'll be way over budget

 

[SWWI Shooter]

About .004" difference between go and nogo.

Not every action can have a shouldered barrel fitted sight unseen. A bighorn TL3 is one of those that can though.

The typical remington that prior beliefs were founded on still needs to be measured. Unless you go with the remage barrel nut system which is really why they have gotten popular. You no longer needed to send your rifle off to someone for the inconsistent action to get a new barrel.

Right. I suppose that the specs on many of the factory actions are such that the action front isn't always consistent or square and if a smith squares them, they are all a bit different. Based on what you're saying, I would think that most custom actions would be good for a prefit.

 

[kthomas]

I have been eyeballing them as well. The problem is this is my first truly custom rifle and the cost is something that I had to get past. I told myself that I would do it but try to start with a good action, then initially do everything else on an economy grade with upgrades as time went on. Unfortunately, everything that I want is on the upper price end and by the time I'm done, I'll be way over budget

A carbon fiber barrel is more of a luxury than a necessity of you want light weight. A thinner barrel profile and/or fluting will get you a lighter barrel for a much more affordable price.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

A carbon fiber barrel is more of a luxury than a necessity of you want light weight. A thinner barrel profile and/or fluting will get you a lighter barrel for a much more affordable price.

Right. That gray / black marbling they have on the carbon really looks sweet though and we all know that looking good will make them a better shooter........

 

[spife7980]

Right. I suppose that the specs on many of the factory actions are such that the action front isn't always consistent or square and if a smith squares them, they are all a bit different. Based on what you're saying, I would think that most custom actions would be good for a prefit.

Lots are, most customs you are looking at these days are. Impact, Bighorn, Curtis, Kelbys ARC and the list goes on and on.
Some still are not.
And even though some are now they have had variances through their history that leads to many smiths wanting their hands on one first so that they know what they actually have such as defiance. But once the smith measures any action he should be able to refer to those measurements to continue cutting future barrels for you without having to send the action back each time.

 

[Codiekfx400]

Here is a deal on a proof https://www.gahmenterprisesinc.com/...8-twist-4-groove-22-58-24-thread-carbon-fiber

 

[SWWI Shooter]

Here is a deal on a proof https://www.gahmenterprisesinc.com/...8-twist-4-groove-22-58-24-thread-carbon-fiber

I'm going to plead ignorance and ask "how much are they normally"?

 

[Codiekfx400]

I’m guessing that price is msrp you have to email Gahm for the best price. He is my local gun shop.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

I’m guessing that price is msrp you have to email Gahm for the best price. He is my local gun shop.

Ok, makes sense. I was thinking that price was about retail for them.

 

[Stellawood]

So anything that is a “savage pre-fit standard shank” should be good to go for a tl3, or does it need to specify as a tl3 prefit?

 

[SWWI Shooter]

So anything that is a “savage pre-fit standard shank” should be good to go for a tl3, or does it need to specify as a tl3 prefit?

Well, I'm not an expert but from what I understand from my research the Savage small shank will work on them.

 

[spife7980]

So anything that is a “savage pre-fit standard shank” should be good to go for a tl3, or does it need to specify as a tl3 prefit?

Savage prefit is a barrel nut configuration. The standard refers to the two different savage barrel tenon sizes. Standard (aka small) and large.

TL3 prefit description should be a shouldered.

 

[padom]

Yes, the thread pattern on a TL3 is 1 1/16-20 which is the same as savage small shank. It will take any savage small shank barrel with a nut or a headspaced, shouldered barrel.

 

[Bluewater132]

Gradous rifles just built me a shouldered prefit barrel in 6.5 and it took a week. They were great to deal with and the barrel is a shooter.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

Gradous rifles just built me a shouldered prefit barrel in 6.5 and it took a week. They were great to deal with and the barrel is a shooter.

Thanks. I reached out to them.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

This barrel buying is driving me crazy. The places that aren't three months out are $595 before CereKoat for a shouldered prefit. The nut style are at least $200 cheaper but you guys are saying go with the shouldered. With a nut I will have more cost in tools such as a headspacing gauge set (one time cost)........ I thought putting together a custom would be fun !

 

[Tokay444]

I don't have a Bighorn TL3, but I run a shouldered pre-fit PVA barrel on my ARC Nucleus and couldn't be happier.

 

[C_R_Slacker]

I think keystone does button rifled, shouldered prefits for less.

 

[padom]

I think keystone does button rifled, shouldered prefits for less.

Yep, $419 for a button shouldered prefit for a Bighorn TL3. Add $40 if you want muzzle threads... Their buttons are hammers too. I have 5 or 6.


Here's their button barrel in 224V on my TL3.




Here is their button in 220 Thunderbolt on my Origin





Here's their button in 6.5x47L on another one of my TL3's 5x5 @ 100yds





200yd 5 shot group





300yd 5 shot group






Here's Keystone's 26" Kreiger shouldered prefit on another one of my TL3's. First rounds down the barrel with 140 Hybrids and Varget

 

[SWWI Shooter]

I don't have a Bighorn TL3, but I run a shouldered pre-fit PVA barrel on my ARC Nucleus and couldn't be happier.

Right but they are approximately 14 weeks out on their prefits. In the future, will look at them but I want to get up and running in about 8 weeks (shortly after my action gets here).

 

[SWWI Shooter]

I think keystone does button rifled, shouldered prefits for less.

Thanks, will give them a look.

 

[98Vandal]

The shouldered vs barrel nut comparison continues.

To draw my own conclusions I decided to buy an ARC Nucleus and put a McGowen w/ Barrel Nut on it and also bought a Bighorn TL3 and put a Hawk Hill Shouldered on it. They are both in 6 XC and they are both extremely accurate. Prior to my adventure I asked a number of barrel manufacturers this very same question and the dominant answer was, "It doesn't matter." These were all big name manufacturers and my own experiment and experience has led me to the same conclusion.

For a shouldered pre-fit you're going to need a barrel vise, an action wrench, and a torque wrench (don't forget an action that is so precisely machined that a barrel manufacturer can make you a barrel without the action).

For the barrel nut system you're going to need a wrench for the nut (dependent upon brand it may be a specific type of wrench or it may be a standard combination wrench), a torque wrench, go/no-go gages, and a means of securing the action in a vise (there are myriad ways to accomplish this so I'm sure they're be plenty of feedback here).

I recognize that they are a significant number of perspectives related to torque but I will follow the recommendations of the people who made the barrel and action and torque to a specification versus the proverbial "One white knuckle," "Two white knuckle", et al. When I hear people say that, "Torque doesn't matter" I cringe because it does. If it didn't, be the one to barely screw a barrel in and go to the range. Just let me know when you're going to do it because I don't want to be anywhere near you.

The bottom line is that you're going to have some additional expenses that aren't related to the barrel and action (wrenches, go/no-go gages, vices, etc.) and that's the way it's going to be. I don't think that any of us are into firearms, shooting, reloading, gunsmithing, etc. solely for the purpose of doing something in the most economical manner possible. Venture out and take a chance on the thing YOU think will work and do it. If it doesn't work, sell the "experiment" and try again until you're satisfied with the end result.

 

[Codiekfx400]

If you don’t want to buy the tools to install the barrel. Have Bighorn ship it directly to Keystone Accuracy. Also if you want your trigger timed to the action ship the trigger to Bighorn.

 

[Bluewater132]

The shouldered vs barrel nut comparison continues.

To draw my own conclusions I decided to buy an ARC Nucleus and put a McGowen w/ Barrel Nut on it and also bought a Bighorn TL3 and put a Hawk Hill Shouldered on it. They are both in 6 XC and they are both extremely accurate. Prior to my adventure I asked a number of barrel manufacturers this very same question and the dominant answer was, "It doesn't matter." These were all big name manufacturers and my own experiment and experience has led me to the same conclusion.

For a shouldered pre-fit you're going to need a barrel vise, an action wrench, and a torque wrench (don't forget an action that is so precisely machined that a barrel manufacturer can make you a barrel without the action).

For the barrel nut system you're going to need a wrench for the nut (dependent upon brand it may be a specific type of wrench or it may be a standard combination wrench), a torque wrench, go/no-go gages, and a means of securing the action in a vise (there are myriad ways to accomplish this so I'm sure they're be plenty of feedback here).

I recognize that they are a significant number of perspectives related to torque but I will follow the recommendations of the people who made the barrel and action and torque to a specification versus the proverbial "One white knuckle," "Two white knuckle", et al. When I hear people say that, "Torque doesn't matter" I cringe because it does. If it didn't, be the one to barely screw a barrel in and go to the range. Just let me know when you're going to do it because I don't want to be anywhere near you.

The bottom line is that you're going to have some additional expenses that aren't related to the barrel and action (wrenches, go/no-go gages, vices, etc.) and that's the way it's going to be. I don't think that any of us are into firearms, shooting, reloading, gunsmithing, etc. solely for the purpose of doing something in the most economical manner possible. Venture out and take a chance on the thing YOU think will work and do it. If it doesn't work, sell the "experiment" and try again until you're satisfied with the end result.

I had the same experience with and without a barrel nut. One rifle is an Impact action with a shouldered barrel and the other is a trued Remington with a bug nut barrel. Both are 6 dasher and accuracy is about the same.

 

[SWWI Shooter]

If you don’t want to buy the tools to install the barrel. Have Bighorn ship it directly to Keystone Accuracy. Also if you want your trigger timed to the action ship the trigger to Bighorn.

So what is involved in timing the trigger? When I put in aftermarket triggers before, I just put in the Timney and it worked.

 

[b6graham]

So what is involved in timing the trigger? When I put in aftermarket triggers before, I just put in the Timney and it worked.

a little filing to eliminate cock on close. you just may not know the difference. but a before/after you can definitely tell the difference when cycling the bolt

 

[Sutherlandsd]

The biggest difference in barrel nuts versus shouldered other than the fact I change shouldered barrels at the range since I typically have flats on my barrels for a wrench is the fact barrel nuts look like shit. No offense to people who like the look..

 

[SWWI Shooter]

The biggest difference in barrel nuts versus shouldered other than the fact I change shouldered barrels at the range since I typically have flats on my barrels for a wrench is the fact barrel nuts look like shit. No offense to people who like the look..

So you have flats milled into the barrel so you don't need a vice?