If you have both in same caliber and the gas gun is shooting on par with precision bolt gun, which do you keep?
Bolt Gun and Gas Gun
- Thread starter FredHammer
- Start date
Target rich environments mandate a gas-gun. 
Target rich environments mandate a gas-gun.
Well yes of course, but at greater distances of 800yds and further getting back on target and putting down well aimed fire the two actions can get pretty close. I’m thinking hand loading one good aspect of bolt gun.
Much more latitude in powder selection with a bolt gun and possibly more velocity (flatter trajectory) that way.
Define your accuracy and your goals and that will which one
I have never seen a gas gun at an extreme long range event and I have never seen a bolt at a 3 gun...
In some arenas there is overlap but do you need light weight or mag capacity
I have never seen a gas gun at an extreme long range event and I have never seen a bolt at a 3 gun...
In some arenas there is overlap but do you need light weight or mag capacity
If the gas gun is shooting on par with the bolt gun (same precision, and same velocity) why keep the bolt gun? You don't see gas guns at long range precision events because they tend not to shoot as well. But, in this scenario, the gas gun IS shooting as well.
Gas gun.
All.
Day.
Long.
Gas gun.
All.
Day.
Long.
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My 6.5 CM AR10 shoots groups with the bolt guns no problem. I feel I am giving up a little velocity, with all things being equal. But that can be compensated for. The rifle fairly new to me, so I'm still doing load development. Where I struggle is with pressure signs.
You don't get a sticky bolt with a gasser. In my bolts, I would get that before I would get other signs. i'm intentionally keeping the loads a bit lower that I would with a bolt because of that.
That being said, I had it out over 1000 Saturday in about a 10mph wind. I did as well as anyone else there.
You don't get a sticky bolt with a gasser. In my bolts, I would get that before I would get other signs. i'm intentionally keeping the loads a bit lower that I would with a bolt because of that.
That being said, I had it out over 1000 Saturday in about a 10mph wind. I did as well as anyone else there.
Have 260 Rem in both. Both are used in PRS matches for different prize tables. Gas gun will get you a top 5 place at most 2020 PRS matches because there are only 5-6 national level guys shooting gas guns.
depends on the fps to me...I sometimes need a rifle with more torque downrange for hunting.
It doesn't mean a lot to most people, but if I can carry 1000ft/lbs another 200 yards? Thats my rifle.
This isn't always the case, but it is something I consider in an ar10 platform usually.
bench
It doesn't mean a lot to most people, but if I can carry 1000ft/lbs another 200 yards? Thats my rifle.
This isn't always the case, but it is something I consider in an ar10 platform usually.
bench
I found the best of both worlds sorta. I have a 18.5” bolt gun with a reflex suppressor. It’s close the same overall length as my suppressed AR15 SBR with the stock extended.
I thought about doing a 14.5” AR10 or 16” but you can’t use reflex suppressors with those due to the gas block being too close to the threads. I’d rather have a more compact rifle that still reliably shoots 1000 then one I can rip rounds faster but it’s a bigger rifle.
I thought about doing a 14.5” AR10 or 16” but you can’t use reflex suppressors with those due to the gas block being too close to the threads. I’d rather have a more compact rifle that still reliably shoots 1000 then one I can rip rounds faster but it’s a bigger rifle.
Bolts Gun vs Gas Gun?
As many have already pointed out, this all really comes down to intended use. From a competitive point of view bolt guns are king because applying the fundamentals of marksmanship is generally easier. Gas guns have some technical aspects and often ergonomical issues that prevent most folks from really getting the most accuracy and precision out of the systems.
That said, in a practical situation most precision gas gun (fired by a fundamentally sound shooter) can go toe to toe with a bolt gun. What do I mean by practical? Well yes, practicality is subjective, but I would define practical as something that's useful to the actual purpose you're tasking.
Most of my background shooting is working within Mil/LEO/OGA sniping. Most of this shooting takes place between 200-1000m, with targets sizes normally between 3-2 MOA. Qualification courses generally reflect this and also incorporate prone as well as alternate positions such as tripods and barricades.
My point here is that a good gas gun paired with a good shooter...within a certain set of parameters...can hold their own. BUTTTTTTTTT, step outside of either end of those parameters and you'll see why the two separate systems exist. Gas guns excel in multi-round, multi-target engagements in extremis. Bolt guns can be run as fast as gas guns in terms of precision applications and allow the shooter quite a bit more fudge factor when applying the fundamentals but the moment you need to run a bolt gun in a multi-round engagement byound 10 rounds, things get spicy. Also bolt guns in the extremis of surprise close proximity engagements don't leave you with a lot of wiggle room to burn somebody down.
All this to say, use the right tool for the job. If you're going to be competitive in the PRS or whatever precision rifle discipline, grab a bolt gun. If you want something with a little more marital intent, grab a gasser...take a class or two or three and then log some serious training hours.
As many have already pointed out, this all really comes down to intended use. From a competitive point of view bolt guns are king because applying the fundamentals of marksmanship is generally easier. Gas guns have some technical aspects and often ergonomical issues that prevent most folks from really getting the most accuracy and precision out of the systems.
That said, in a practical situation most precision gas gun (fired by a fundamentally sound shooter) can go toe to toe with a bolt gun. What do I mean by practical? Well yes, practicality is subjective, but I would define practical as something that's useful to the actual purpose you're tasking.
Most of my background shooting is working within Mil/LEO/OGA sniping. Most of this shooting takes place between 200-1000m, with targets sizes normally between 3-2 MOA. Qualification courses generally reflect this and also incorporate prone as well as alternate positions such as tripods and barricades.
My point here is that a good gas gun paired with a good shooter...within a certain set of parameters...can hold their own. BUTTTTTTTTT, step outside of either end of those parameters and you'll see why the two separate systems exist. Gas guns excel in multi-round, multi-target engagements in extremis. Bolt guns can be run as fast as gas guns in terms of precision applications and allow the shooter quite a bit more fudge factor when applying the fundamentals but the moment you need to run a bolt gun in a multi-round engagement byound 10 rounds, things get spicy. Also bolt guns in the extremis of surprise close proximity engagements don't leave you with a lot of wiggle room to burn somebody down.
All this to say, use the right tool for the job. If you're going to be competitive in the PRS or whatever precision rifle discipline, grab a bolt gun. If you want something with a little more marital intent, grab a gasser...take a class or two or three and then log some serious training hours.
Slow lock time always loses when shooting for maximum accuracy.
A bolt gun's bullet is 50 -75 yards down range before an AR's EVEN LEAVE THE BARREL with both triggers pulled at the same time. (1-2 millisecond lock time for striker fired bolt gun vs. 6-8 MS for AR)
So you have to hold the AR PERFECTLY STILL for 4 TIMES longer after you pull the trigger to get the same practical accuracy if shooting in any unstable condition. Which, of course, is impossible.
I have several AR's that are 1/4-3/8 MOA capable, BUT, in field conditions, over the long run, a 3/4-1 MOA bolt gun will still win most of the PRS style field courses shot today vs. those guns (with shooters of equal ability).
Obviously, if multiple, extremely fast shots are required (3 gun, etc) the AR rules, BUT, those disciplines always have appropriately sized targets.
They are both excellent tools, but don't take an AR to a PRS match and expect to win, same as you can't take a bolt gun to a 3 gun match and expect to win.
A bolt gun's bullet is 50 -75 yards down range before an AR's EVEN LEAVE THE BARREL with both triggers pulled at the same time. (1-2 millisecond lock time for striker fired bolt gun vs. 6-8 MS for AR)
So you have to hold the AR PERFECTLY STILL for 4 TIMES longer after you pull the trigger to get the same practical accuracy if shooting in any unstable condition. Which, of course, is impossible.
I have several AR's that are 1/4-3/8 MOA capable, BUT, in field conditions, over the long run, a 3/4-1 MOA bolt gun will still win most of the PRS style field courses shot today vs. those guns (with shooters of equal ability).
Obviously, if multiple, extremely fast shots are required (3 gun, etc) the AR rules, BUT, those disciplines always have appropriately sized targets.
They are both excellent tools, but don't take an AR to a PRS match and expect to win, same as you can't take a bolt gun to a 3 gun match and expect to win.
I had the same dilemma years ago. Kept the gas gun, you can single feed it with long bullets for long range or precision shooting and achieve great deal of accuracy and have the option to shoot fast out of a mag. I'm happy with my choice. Fortunately my gas gun is very accurate.
Bottom line is most people can't shoot a Large frame AR worth a shit, or even a AR-15 for that matter so people will always favor the easiest path of least resistance which is a bolt gun.
Kind of like the old "how many guns is "too many"? My safe is out of space. Just means I need another safe.
It's a TRAP! Sounds like Libtards trying to get your guns any way possible...
Which one do you Keep? Yea right...
Which one do you Keep? Yea right...
I do not believe a Aero gas gun will keep up with a bolt gun. Unless your groups are terrible.
Lets see some pics of groups for both guns.
Lets see some pics of groups for both guns.
I wish the AR platform had a robust gas regulator like the FAL has. That would make it a no brained.
I would keep both I love bolt guns and I love semi auto's differently but the same cartage lets you shoot 2 different guns while only needing to buy one type of ammo then Its just up to finding one that works in both guns to your standards . but I am a gun whore and keeping both might be me just not wanting to let anything go so what ever works for you is probably the best derision . keep em you know you want both one for the weekends and one as a back up .
I put a bleed off design adjustable gas block on my Aero M5 build. Damn that thing is sweet! Superlative Arms is the brand.
The 5 shot groups from each. Both guns shoot 168 FGMM .63 and .77 MOA. The bolt loves 175SMK 42gr 4064 Lapua case. Doesn’t shoot anything else that good consistently.
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(One each of) .308/7.62x51 NATO and Wylde/5.56x45 NATO (five 5.56/Wylde, and one 5.56 bolt).
Greg
Greg
I need to bring my chronograph out on my next outing....
Yesterday my AR10 16” Carbine would put dents on the steel I was shooting at.
At the same distance, while shooting the same ammo through a 20” bolt gun - it punched right through it.
I didn’t realize the velocity difference would be that great.
Yesterday my AR10 16” Carbine would put dents on the steel I was shooting at.
At the same distance, while shooting the same ammo through a 20” bolt gun - it punched right through it.
I didn’t realize the velocity difference would be that great.
If your bolt gun cannot out shoot the gas gun, I would replace it. Simple physics suggests the bolt should win. You have a heckuva gas gun!
I think you read it wrong....
Gas gun just dents it.
Bolt gun punches holes.
But seems like a pretty big spread in velocity to me.
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