But then there would be no point, other than a gimmick, to use more than two lugs?
One lug would be worse, but load sharing wise, asymmetric lugs would be worse than two?
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Bolt guns with a 60 degree throw or less.
- Thread starter Prebanpaul
- Start date
One lug would be worse, but load sharing wise, asymmetric lugs would be worse than two?
Actually I’m pretty sure the 1.0 is 72 degrees and the 2.0, Archimedes and new mausingfield are 80 degrees
Right from ARC site and this thread.
Nucleus 1.0 - 72⁰
Nucleus 1.1 through 2.0 - 80⁰
Archimedes - 75⁰
Mausingfield - 83⁰
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I really like the original Nuke bolt throw.
Not like another 8 degrees is a deal breaker though.
This is from the Archimedes page:
"75-degree bolt rotation provides excellent knob to scope clearance and shortens bolt cycle."
And this from the Nucleus
"
80 degrees of bolt rotation
In order to improve the smoothness of the bolt cycle, maintain an appropriate level of cocking effort, and still provide adequate clearance between the shooter’s hand and the scope during bolt cycling, Nucleus G2.0 has 80 degrees of bolt rotation. The original Nucleus had 72 degrees."
"75-degree bolt rotation provides excellent knob to scope clearance and shortens bolt cycle."
And this from the Nucleus
- 80 degree bolt rotation
"
80 degrees of bolt rotation
In order to improve the smoothness of the bolt cycle, maintain an appropriate level of cocking effort, and still provide adequate clearance between the shooter’s hand and the scope during bolt cycling, Nucleus G2.0 has 80 degrees of bolt rotation. The original Nucleus had 72 degrees."
Nah, more like you don't have an answer...
You see, I don't mind not knowing, hence I ask questions to increase my knowledge. You, on the other hand, do not seem to know or have the capability to explain, even though you profess expertise in the area.
All rifles I have handled with more than three lugs (Sako, Sauer and Weatherby) have all had their lugs evenly distributed around the circumference of the bolt and I surmised that was practice (three legged stool and so on).
I was hoping you would provide me with an answer, or at least point me in the right direction, so that I could learn more about these asymetrical lug rifle actions.
Obviously I was mistaken.
The answers to all your questions were no. Do you want answers to different question? Ask them! Why should anyone read between the lines of a question with a very simple answer? Ask the questions you want answers to. Not different questions.
Evenly distributed lugs doesn’t mean 60° bolt throw. Many examples have already been provided to the contrary.
Evenly distributed lugs doesn’t mean 60° bolt throw. Many examples have already been provided to the contrary.
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Not wanting to waste time with someone who wants everything handed to him is not the same as not knowing or not knowing how to explain.
If you want to understand how axial thrust loads are shared through asymmetical arrangements, buy a book on engineering mechanics and study the sections on static loads.
Then spend your money on a CAD/FEA suite and get to work analyzing.
You're not owed a thing, particularly by those who spent time/money/efforts to learn on their own.
@Tokay444
Someone could just ask @karagias . He has a 2 and a 3 lug action. He's probably the most qualified to answer this.
Correct. But I'm sure it was by choice. Idk of anyone that understands toroidal geometry better than Ted.
Ted is a cool guy to talk to
He’s both normal guy and mad genius at the same time.
The toroidal lugs are a really cool feature of his actions.
I recall a video (MDS Summit, I think) where @karagias stated you do not want a 60* bolt throw, and to ask him if you wanted to know
why not.
Well, I do know. I just didn't know that some mfgs choose to produce asymmetrical lugs (And who they are. Or why).
Done that, though I must admit not on university level. I did my first static load calculations some thirty years ago.
Got that, though there might be better programmes than SolidWorks?
I'm not saying I am, other than maybe a bit of common politeness? "No" is not an adequate answer to any of my question and I guess having been given just a bit more information than that might have been enough to satisfy my curiosity?
Mostly I agree with you, which would be evident by the likes I've given you through the years. This time I do not.
"No" is a complete sentence.
It's usually a strong hint that others don't want to engage you further so it's best to drop it.
The lugs are not asymmetrical. No one asked about lug symmetry.Well, I do know. I just didn't know that some mfgs choose to produce asymmetrical lugs (And who they are. Or why).
Done that, though I must admit not on university level. I did my first static load calculations some thirty years ago.
Got that, though there might be better programmes than SolidWorks?
I'm not saying I am, other than maybe a bit of common politeness? "No" is not an adequate answer to any of my question and I guess having been given just a bit more information than that might have been enough to satisfy my curiosity?
Mostly I agree with you, which would be evident by the likes I've given you through the years. This time I do not.
Let's review then, my initial question:
...
Well good luck with your endeavour.
With the extensive reply:
My clarification:
Further replies:
...
Well good luck with your endeavour.
So the point of the exercise is information. I have owned Sako TRG's, tikka, Terminus, Remington, AI, Seekins and several other actions.
After playing with the Q FIX I loved the throw on the bolt. The gun is a just a little to light for what I want it in. I am considering looking for a new action. I am looking for a 60 deg throw or less. I am making a medium weight gun. Needs to shoot out to 1k. caliber 260. Shoot 3-4 PRS matches a year. May use for a back up gun hunting. I will run a stock and chassis for the build. It was just important to get the throw under 60 deg.
After playing with the Q FIX I loved the throw on the bolt. The gun is a just a little to light for what I want it in. I am considering looking for a new action. I am looking for a 60 deg throw or less. I am making a medium weight gun. Needs to shoot out to 1k. caliber 260. Shoot 3-4 PRS matches a year. May use for a back up gun hunting. I will run a stock and chassis for the build. It was just important to get the throw under 60 deg.
What you think is important, isn’t. It’s actually a detriment. The more work the bolt needs to do in less rotation, the harder it is to lift. Less than 60° of bolt lift, unless you get some heavy cock on close, is going to feel like shit and you’ll be pulling your gun off target in unstable shooting positions. The 70°-75° of lift seem to be the perfect compromise. There’s no free lunch.
Touché …… but how smooth will it be?
If it’s clunky or difficult to cycle slow (rumor about savage is it’s rough and heavy) then might as well stay with tried and true actions.
It’s been a while but my buddy had a Weatherby mark V action (~55-60* action I think) and the lift wasn’t too bad. He also had an A-bolt 2 browning that was smooth. Don’t remember how heavy the lift was on the browning.
Yes the str is damned smooth and fast.
The Sauer 90 however, is a whole other league of smooth.
You can add Sauer 80+90 and RPA to the list also
RPA International -
Yes the str is damned smooth and fast.
The Sauer 90 however, is a whole other league of smooth.
You can add Sauer 80+90 and RPA to the list also
RPA International -
rpainternational.co.uk
Is there a way to get those actions to the US? They look really cool and the bolt design interests me.
