Night Vision Bridging PVS14 and Thermal?

[NHPiper]

I love the idea of having passive thermal detection. Played with a COTI a few years ago and it was cool, but looking at other options. Has anyone had experience bridging a PVS14 and some other type of thermal monocular, like a SKEET? Is it possible to run both tubes at the same time without your brain going haywire? I know some guys on here are running dual thermal binos, but I would prefer to avoid that route since I spend time driving and don't want to lose the ability to see through glass.

Something like this...https://www.ultimatenightvision.com/DBNVG-14L-p/dbnvg-14l.htm

I am not super familiar with the thermal world, so any suggestions on the way to do it and what your experience has been would be great!

 

[Surgeon_Shooter]

Although the skeet is a tad smaller, it is also extremely expensive. The image of the IRay rivals that of the skeet and does it for roughly $4500 vs the tag on the skeet of about $15k. As far as running night vision on one side and thermal on the other, it works better than one would imagine. Your brain puts the image together pretty darn good!

Jay

 

[wigwamitus]

I'll post up some links to recent threads on this topic ...

Night Vision - Why dual helmet-mounted Skeets/ChinaSkeets crushes NV...

My name is TheHorta, and I'm a Thermaholic. I don't use NV anymore, unless it's in a fusion system or I'm driving something with a full windshield. I know to some of you that's blasphemy, but once you go dual helmet-mounted thermals -- and I'm talking SkeetIR-x's or CoronaSkeets here, not...

www.snipershide.com

Night Vision - New helmet mounted 640 scanners

So I'm looking at ultimate night vision after getting a text from a friend... And see a new little widget from a company I've never heard of IRay Mini MH25 Thermal Helmet Mountable Monocular 640X480 25mm I'm guessing this is an early leak from a shot show release, but at 4500 bucks for a 640...

www.snipershide.com

==
This ones not purely about dual band setups ... but at least 50% about such ...

Night Vision - Help Configuring Thermal/NV combination setup

Ok so I currently have an L3 filmless WP PVS 14. I am wanting to get into the thermal game for predator hunting here in Indiana and a once/twice a year trip to TX for Hog Hunting on a friends ranch. Here in Indy, I am limited to 300yrds max (if that), and most things being inside 100 yards. In...

www.snipershide.com

==
I've been doing dual band on head since Jan 2016 ... in those days it was ODIN, 1x, 17mm 320(30) on one side and PVS-14 on the other.

Then I added COTI (thermal overlay) on top of the 14, which enabled fast shots.

Then later got IR-Patrol and Skeet-L to upgrade the thermal dual band image. Now I can detect out to 1800yds on most nights ...

I use carbines with lasers and dual band helmet setups for walkin and stalk style critter control ... mostly in the warm half of the year (due to lots of vegetation blocking longer distance shots) ... and rifle on tripod ... overwatch style critter control in the cool half of the year ... when reduced vegetation allows longer distance shots ...

Current walkin and stalkin setup ... 5.56(10) carbine with 77gr smk, OTAL (w/ NDF) and ELIR-3. Skeet-L on head with PVS-14. We've had a coon activity explosion lately and my nightly patrols are about trying to keep the coons away from our chickens and guineas ... strategically (including all known neighbors with chickens/guineas) ... the coons are winning ... but on some other properties ... with primate assistance ... the coons are not winning

The skeet-l's are around $7k street price ... but are not so easy to find these days ...

The patrol is a good option ... new ones for around $6,500 street price ... the M300W ones anyway ...

I wear mine with the radius attached for us as a range finder ... and also carry the 3x magnifier for long distance spotting ...

And TBH, I don't notice the extra weight in the field ... but the radius can be removed, to make that setup much lighter ...

==
And then there is the breach ...

Those run about $2k street price ...

==
The Skeet 640 is definitely the bees knees ...

The breach has some good reports as a DETECTOR ... from some folks ... my own experience indicates there are surprising gaps in the breach ability to detect critters of interest, even at close distances ... like it couldn't see a deer at 150yds ... the deer was "behind" some small sapplings ... but the UTC-x could see it clearly.
Another night, the breach couldn't see a coon in the woodshed at 50yds ... ( mixed into the wood pile) ... the UTC-x could see it clearly ...
But apparently in truly open areas, the breach can get it done in terms of detection. Then you could put a thermal rifle scope on the critter for PID.

The iray is an option ... IDK the street price ... the shown price is $4,500 ... so maybe the street price is $4,000 ?
My own experience with Chinese thermals has not been good. They haven't stood up in the field ... and you'll see an image in the links I posted above ...of an Iray that came apart on one user ... but they do have some shock and awe with their image especially at short distances ... due to the hi-res display.

The patrol at around $6,500 for the "full bore" version ... is probably where I would go if I was buying today. USA made ... rugged enough for sustained field use ... including Noah's rains ... and lifetime warranty for original owner (as discussed in the above links) ... with 3 year warranty for the core ... and repairable (at cost) after out of warranty (if you buy a used one for instance).

 

[NHPiper]

View attachment 7373983
Although the skeet is a tad smaller, it is also extremely expensive. The image of the IRay rivals that of the skeet and does it for roughly $4500 vs the tag on the skeet of about $15k. As far as running night vision on one side and thermal on the other, it works better than one would imagine. Your brain puts the image together pretty darn good!

Jay

Thanks buddy! Good to know. Any experience with bad collimation issues for the setup or even bridged dual pvs14?

 

[NHPiper]

I'll post up some links to recent threads on this topic ...

Night Vision - Why dual helmet-mounted Skeets/ChinaSkeets crushes NV...

My name is TheHorta, and I'm a Thermaholic. I don't use NV anymore, unless it's in a fusion system or I'm driving something with a full windshield. I know to some of you that's blasphemy, but once you go dual helmet-mounted thermals -- and I'm talking SkeetIR-x's or CoronaSkeets here, not...

www.snipershide.com

Night Vision - New helmet mounted 640 scanners

So I'm looking at ultimate night vision after getting a text from a friend... And see a new little widget from a company I've never heard of IRay Mini MH25 Thermal Helmet Mountable Monocular 640X480 25mm I'm guessing this is an early leak from a shot show release, but at 4500 bucks for a 640...

www.snipershide.com

==
This ones not purely about dual band setups ... but at least 50% about such ...

Night Vision - Help Configuring Thermal/NV combination setup

Ok so I currently have an L3 filmless WP PVS 14. I am wanting to get into the thermal game for predator hunting here in Indiana and a once/twice a year trip to TX for Hog Hunting on a friends ranch. Here in Indy, I am limited to 300yrds max (if that), and most things being inside 100 yards. In...

www.snipershide.com

==
I've been doing dual band on head since Jan 2016 ... in those days it was ODIN, 1x, 17mm 320(30) on one side and PVS-14 on the other.

Then I added COTI (thermal overlay) on top of the 14, which enabled fast shots.

Then later got IR-Patrol and Skeet-L to upgrade the thermal dual band image. Now I can detect out to 1800yds on most nights ...

I use carbines with lasers and dual band helmet setups for walkin and stalk style critter control ... mostly in the warm half of the year (due to lots of vegetation blocking longer distance shots) ... and rifle on tripod ... overwatch style critter control in the cool half of the year ... when reduced vegetation allows longer distance shots ...

Current walkin and stalkin setup ... 5.56(10) carbine with 77gr smk, OTAL (w/ NDF) and ELIR-3. Skeet-L on head with PVS-14. We've had a coon activity explosion lately and my nightly patrols are about trying to keep the coons away from our chickens and guineas ... strategically (including all known neighbors with chickens/guineas) ... the coons are winning ... but on some other properties ... with primate assistance ... the coons are not winning

You got to stop making the rest of us jealous hahaha! You're down in Alabama right? I'm up a New Hampshire so if you ever end up this way let me try some of that gear.

 

[wigwamitus]

... You're down in Alabama right? I'm up a New Hampshire so if you ever end up this way let me try some of that gear ...

Dang, u r jealous of my dirty, muddy ole crap !!?? Nah .. check out "horta's" shiny new crap ... he's the one to be jealous of !!!

I'm over in Kansas ... for me to get to you without going thru "occupied territory" ... I'd have to head down to the Gulf and make the rest of the Journey by boat ... and land in Portsmouth, NH, right ? In my younger days ... I could've done it ... but now I live in Kansas (used to live in Jacksonville FLA) and I have no boat that could make the trip !!

But you might be able to rent an IR-Patrol from UNV ... and try one out !

 

[NHPiper]

Dang, u r jealous of my dirty, muddy ole crap !!?? Nah .. check out "horta's" shiny new crap ... he's the one to be jealous of !!!

I'm over in Kansas ... for me to get to you without going thru "occupied territory" ... I'd have to head down to the Gulf and make the rest of the Journey by boat ... and land in Portsmouth, NH, right ? In my younger days ... I could've done it ... but now I live in Kansas (used to live in Jacksonville FLA) and I have no boat that could make the trip !!

But you might be able to rent an IR-Patrol from UNV ... and try one out !

I lived down in Arkansas for a few years and wish I had gotten into NV shooting and hunting while I was there. We could sneak you into some shipping containers if we need to hahaha.

Good idea with UNV.

 

[Frog05]

It works pretty well for me!

 

[TheHorta]

You got to stop making the rest of us jealous hahaha! You're down in Alabama right? I'm up a New Hampshire so if you ever end up this way let me try some of that gear.

Interesting irony...

I live in Alabama but grew up in NH. My dad lives in Grantham.

 

[TheHorta]

We all need to meet-up somewhere. I mean like the whole forum.

 

[Choid]

Is New Hampshire still in the United States?

 

[NHPiper]

Is New Hampshire still in the United States?

Haha NH is the closest thing to TX in the Northeast. We have no restrictions currently on gun laws, NV, NFA items, etc. and are a consitutional carry state. Most other states, with the exception of ME have bans imposed on gun types, magazines, NFA items, carrying, etc.

Only thing NH doesnt have is lots of open distance for long range shooting and a surplus of hogs to hunt.

 

[NHPiper]

It works pretty well for me!


View attachment 7374048

Are you running them both at the same time?

 

[wigwamitus]

...
Haha NH is the closest thing to TX in the Northeast. We have no restrictions currently on gun laws, NV, NFA items, etc. and are a consitutional carry state. Most other states, with the exception of ME have bans imposed on gun types, magazines, NFA items, carrying, etc.

Only thing NH doesnt have is lots of open distance for long range shooting and a surplus of hogs to hunt. ...

NH also has at least a tiny bit of coast line !!

We here in the "central states area" ... Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, Missouri(?), Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Texas(?) might have a problem with a coast line, if we loose Texas, which seems inevitable at this point. Then our access is via the Missouri/Mississippi rivers to the Gulf ... and that would be pretty tenuous. And if you loose access to the sea ... you are in big trouble ...

 

[Choid]

Doesn’t Alabama have a swamp or two?

 

[WhereNow&How]

Thanks buddy! Good to know. Any experience with bad collimation issues for the setup or even bridged dual pvs14?

Quit thinking too much about collimation. It ain't as bad as its made out to be.

 

[newguy2k3v2]

It works. Been using a patrol/pvs-14 on a Wilcox bridge since 2015 or 16.

A good helmet, pads/suspension, and counterweight make a big difference.

White phosphorus is also easier on your brain then green since it's closer to the b&w of the thermal. I think there are some green filters that fit the back of the patrol though.

 

[wigwamitus]

... Any experience with bad collimation issues ...

... Are you running them both at the same time?

In case you missed this post in the links I posted above ^^ ... here it is again ...

Night Vision - Why dual helmet-mounted Skeets/ChinaSkeets crushes NV...

My name is TheHorta, and I'm a Thermaholic. I don't use NV anymore, unless it's in a fusion system or I'm driving something with a full windshield. I know to some of you that's blasphemy, but once you go dual helmet-mounted thermals -- and I'm talking SkeetIR-x's or CoronaSkeets here, not...

www.snipershide.com

 

[deersniper]

Anyone using a UTM X and PVS14 together ?

 

[Frog05]

Are you running them both at the same time?

Yessir

 

[Frog05]

View attachment 7375215
How about a 400 acre 2km night vision shooting range with night driving, skydiving, 17 different ranges, and 200 steel plates?

Just saying.

Sign me up!

 

[TheHorta]

Where dat bee?

 

[PlinkIt]

When... Where....
I'll put in for vacation now lol

 

[TheHorta]

View attachment 7375215
How about a 400 acre 2km night vision shooting range with night driving, skydiving, 17 different ranges, and 200 steel plates?

Just saying.

Get a Little Bird, and I'm there!

 

[WillHugh]

View attachment 7375215
How about a 400 acre 2km night vision shooting range with night driving, skydiving, 17 different ranges, and 200 steel plates?

Just saying.

I'm down, and I'm sure @NHPiper is as well. Let us know where and when!

 

[deersniper]

@RickyRodney

 

[Ironman8]

Question for the dual band bridge setups...

Do you gain any "depth perception" or "spacial awareness" like you would with a dual tube NVG?

I'm also wondering what is the ideal environment where this setup shines? Is it best for rural vs urban? Or does it not matter and it's just better all around?

Lastly, is there a particular NV configuration (ie: Unfilmed WP, Thin Filmed WP, or GP) that a bridged thermal plays best with?

 

[Jgunner]

5. WP is better for thermals. GP is harder on the brain.

that makes sense. Now I want wp pvs as well!!! Argh!! Lol. I hate this place, i love this place.

 

[Ironman8]

Thanks @The King good copy, I need to get behind this setup sometime soon to see how it works for me.

 

[TheHorta]

Question for the dual band bridge setups...

Do you gain any "depth perception" or "spacial awareness" like you would with a dual tube NVG?

I'm also wondering what is the ideal environment where this setup shines? Is it best for rural vs urban? Or does it not matter and it's just better all around?

Lastly, is there a particular NV configuration (ie: Unfilmed WP, Thin Filmed WP, or GP) that a bridged thermal plays best with?

Just to tack onto what the King said... you will NOT gain “depth perception”. You WILL gain spacial/situational awareness. As he said, thermal detects things that you’ll miss entirely with the best dual-tube 3000 FOM NV money can buy. I’ve seen rabbits at 20 yards with thermal that were missed entirely by world class NV. Seriously, those little motionless bass turds are invisible to NV.

I could list every disadvantage that either technology alone imposes. When it comes to stalking critters — large or small — in 90% of the world’s environments, thermal is the undisputed king. This is why, when I walk out my door at night, I have dual Skeets on my melon and a UTC-Xii on my rifle.

 

[NHPiper]

Im in @WillHugh for a trip to CO to see @The King and his range

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

IR Patrol on the way, it's my first foray into thermal.
I run a PVS 14 on a norotos dual dovetail adapter.
What is the best way for me to bridge the thermal and the 14? Will the wilcox duel dovetail interface with a norotos dovetail?

 

[wigwamitus]

Yes

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

So with the wilcox, I can slam the patrol right into it via the onboard dovetail and then stick the dual dovetialed pvs14 onto it and I'll be good to go, or will the difference in size mean one is stuck in my eye socket or something?

 

[wigwamitus]

You can slide the patrol into the bridge

I use IC bridge, it has adjustments for fore and aft.

If the wilcox does not, you might get cozy with the patrol eyepiece.

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

Is that the Integrated Components D-14?
It looks like to run the wilcox I would also need a wilcox j-arm to allow me the eye relief needed for the patrol.
Can the IC bridge integrate directly with the patrol and my norotos INVG mount + norotos dovetail?
Would love to not spend $200 on an additional doo-dad with a wilcox engraving

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

After looking, it seems it is a few mounting components to get bridged up. I may just run the patrol on a lanyard hand held fashion for a while.

 

[wigwamitus]

If the wilcox will slide forward, you should be able to achieve the same result with the wilcox.

This probably doesn't show what you need to see ... but here is 14 attached to IC bridge, using ic bridge provided "interfaces" for the 14 ... and the patrol is slide in to the oc bridge dove tail.

No "mounting components" required other than the interface piece for the 14 which comes with the bridge.

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

I saw a post regarding flipping a portion of the wilcox bridge to create appropriate offset.

PVS-14 and IR PATROL with the Wilcox Dual Bridge - AR15.COM

Firearm Discussion and Resources from AR-15, AK-47, Handguns and more! Buy, Sell, and Trade your Firearms and Gear.

www.ar15.com

This hobby's a damn rabbit hole of $200 items.

Appreciate your insights on all these websites wigwam. Was reading your posts from 2015 the other day
Thank you.
Once I have the thermal in hand, I'm sure I'll have more interesting questions for you.

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

Okay, I looked on the modarmory page at the bridge but was only seeing attachment options for the pvs14 and a breach.

 

[SnazSleepWalker]

Shit, I think I got it now, you just get the ic bridge with two pvs14 mounts, correct?
Sometimes I'm slow.