The tritium is fucken useless in an ACOG anyway except in pitch black??? unless the 3 I've had have all had dead tritium
I have a watch with tiritium and its the same, completely useless until dark.
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The tritium is fucken useless in an ACOG anyway except in pitch black??? unless the 3 I've had have all had dead tritium
The VCOG, Leupold MK6 and the Vortex Razor 2 are more than durable enough. Furthermore on the battery issue even if the batteries die you still have a usable optic just with a black reticle.
Actualy they usualy do it for free. Ive heard people quoted those numbers, but never seen anyone who paid it. Ive heard numbers closer to $200-300 if it was not covered under warranty.
Also, we aint talking about the TA31, its an obsolete optic. The TA11 and especialy the TA33 are much better with the eye relief.
What about the Acog did you not like? curious.
Still waiting to hear which mil units or governments are running the BCO.............
Something tells me you only think those in the military are the only ones who know anything when in reality that is quite false. While I have respect for those that have served in the armed forces they do not hold a monopoly on all experience related to firearms and optics. Lots of other people such as LEO's, competitive shooters, put their gear through hell as well. Also there are plenty of good three gun shooters who can beat your ass any day of the week with scopes that have no illumination what so ever. I prefer illumination myself but its not required to make good fast hits.One is brand new, the MK6 has it's own set of issues and the fact it costs $3k for fucking illumination and the Razor is a Heavy SOB with shitty reticles that is still a suspect vortex optic.
Something tells me you were never in the military as you have no idea what durable actually means. Truck to range and back to safe is not exactly what most have to go through.
The whole point of a 1-X is to be able to use it as a red dot/cqb sight and then being able to get some magnification for Target ID, surveillance, and engaging small target and shit at distance. Without illumination, its already failed. This is why the Fiber is crucial on the ACOGS.
Jihadists don't tend to stand up giving you a nice clean 100m silhouette for you to take time to get your sight picture. Well those that did, died about 10 years ago. The ones still around tend to be the smarter ones.
They don't do it for free I have had two friends find that out personally and they are both LEO's as well.
I doubt any government agencies are going to use BCO'S for a few reasons. 1. its old technology just like the ACOG and number 2 those that want the old technology already have ACOGS. When people buy new optics they generally are not ACOGS anymore.
Pat
The closer eye relief gives it the larger FOV. It's a trade off that on the battlefield is more advantage than disadvantage. That's why a lot of military love them and a lot of sport shooters hate them. Think situational awareness necessities.
And anyone that really wants a battery/LED version has a Trijicon option as well: https://www.trijicon.com/na_en/products/product2.php?mid=4 x 32 LED
Holy shit are there some drama queens around here... It's like the OP asked which Justin is hotter, Bieber or Timberlake and you women are bickering to high hell for your favorite.
OP, what exactly are you looking to do with this optic? This argument is useless without your application, and unless I completely missed it you haven't stated that.
And those with a clue that are worried about needing to be able to shoot when there are no batteries left available or tritium has expired are training to shoot with iron sights. The rest of you might want to look into that.
Holy angry-little-person drama, Batman!!!! WTF is going on in this thread? I read some of the Herp - derp but not all.
In regards to ta31 versus the bco, are the eye reliefs the same? Was curious because if I recall the idea behind the eye relief on the 4x acogs was to keep it simple in that all a shooter had to do is put his nose on/near the charging handle to get the right eye relief provided the optic was in the proper position. My understanding was it was deliberate.
If your targets aren't man-sized silhouettes, you're going to want more than 4x magnification. I'd recommend taking a serious look at the NF 2.5-10x32.
The ACOG (and similar) are great scopes for hunting and shooting 1/2 IPSC and larger targets out to those distances, so it would do you well. It's simple, durable, and dependable, that's for sure. I use an ACOG on my truck gun in personal application because I know when I need it, it will work and I know it will serve me quite well within the ranges I will ever "need" the rifle to perform.
But when I'm shooting targets I like to push the limits. We all do. That's why I say to seriously consider something with more magnification. I recommend the NF simply because they flat out work and are tough as most anything out there.
Look at the Vortex 2.5 to 10 ffp love it more than the night force 2.5 to 10 I used to have.
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Sub 10x scopes is the one category I prefer SFP. I've never bought Nightforce for the "glass", I've bought it for the durability and accuracy. Good for those that have had success with them, but when I stop seeing regular "My PST broke again" threads, I'll entertain them as an option. Divorces and NF cost more because they're worth it.The night force 2nd focal plane and the glass was only marginally for nearly twice the cost
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I guess I wasn't clear enough above. My work rifle has an Aimpoint, you take what you get in the contracting world. My personal rifle at home that hits the trails with me has a TA-01NSN on it. It wasn't exactly my first choice, was my buddy's Iraq scope I bought from him when he was hard up for money, and since he's no longer with us I will never sell that scope. It got him out of a couple nasty ambushes in the early years of the war and I'll never forget when he told me "Best Christmas ever, Santa got me an L-Shaped ambush and four confirmed". It's nice and accurate but I like the chevron reticle/BAC capable ACOGs more for <300yd shooting.
Sold my night force scopes. Vortex has them beat especially when you compare
The razor level glass. Sorry just the way it is
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Glass means dick when your optic spends 4 out of 12 months a year at the factory getting the "Best Warranty in the Industry"
Vortex dominates the competition circuit and when one does go down its replaced or fixed fast. You are a self appointed troll and your doing well in that roll. The way you talk I doubt you have any real world experience out side of the Internet.
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Wow. Based on average turn around times at Vortex, you're saying someone would actually send in their Razor scope 10-15x in a single year. That might be a bit of an exaggeration... While there may be a relatively high number of Vortex products taking advantage of the warranty (still a very low overall percentage given their market share), I'd be willing to bet that the number of those getting sent back more than once or twice is infinitesimal. And once the issue is resolved, it's usually fixed for good, so unless you only keep stuff for a year, implying that it will have a lifetime 33% downtime isn't even close to true.
Well I have owned 6 vortex scopes so far with no issues so I must be a lucky guy lol. The fact they dominate the market and our an innovator kind of proves your full of it
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Cool story, tell that to the thousands of other owners that have problems.
Once again, you must be a special little snowflake in your own little world.
I don't care what some elite unit wants or needs. I care about what I want or need. I am not a bootlicker like you seem to be. Vortex is thought well of by some very well respected people in the shooting community. Those stupid gun games are where gear is tested and developed and then later makes it to the Military and LEO world. We we shooting optics on our pistols well before tactical teddies were. We were running off set red dots in three gun well before anyone in a uniform decided to try it. Gun games are a great testing ground for gear and gear concepts. Also people shooting those gun games are the best in the world PERIOD at pulling a trigger and making hits. Far better than anyone in the most elite unit. The best shooters in the military are not in the SEALS or DELTA they are in the AMU. Also don't know how many matches you have dared try I doubt many as your ego probably could not handle the beating. But matches are not always held in perfect weather. We slam guns into barrels run over and around barricades etc. Its not a day at the beach.Here is a hint..... Certain units can buy/use WHATEVER they want.
Vortex wouldn't survive even the most mild military testing.
Bushnell makes a superior scope at almost half the price. The 5-20 is a good optic and a decent price, but is heavy as fuck and has a ton of completion in that price range.
You seem to think anyone gives a shit about some stupid gun game or how something works on a pretty little square range when conditions are favorable. I could make a simmons look good at the range.
Yea it sounds really rough, your safe queen could get a scratch or scuff....
Or, you could buy quality, and reduce the chance of every having to send it out for warranty work.
Addede benefit is that It probally wont fail you when you need it the most.
I might buy that except that the Vortex "failures" that I've heard about are primarily debris inside the scopes and illumination "bleeding," not catastrophic failures. Also, you seem to be lumping PST warranty issues with the Razors. "Thousands" of Razor fails? RIIIIGHT.
FWIW, (in keeping with the thread), I recently replaced my TA11 with a PST 2.5-10x32 and feel like (for my purposes) it was a serious upgrade. The FFP is probably not necessary, but I like the consistency with my other scopes. I certainly wouldn't complain about a Nightforce with the same mag, but there's a substantial price difference.
If my primary use was rapid acquisition of man sized targets between 100-200 yards, the ACOG would have been fine. (Well, aside from the fact that its line of sight was way too high for me). I never liked the brightness of the fiber optic in daylight either. WAY too bright. I wanted something more versatile, and I find the Vortex better at both shorter and longer distances. For precision it's no contest either. If I wanted something for man sized targets from 0-200 yards, I'd take an Aimpoint non magnified red dot over the ACOG any day.
When you're so OCD that you alphabetize it, yeah...I may be a little CDO.