Quick question, am I better off building as I go or buying something pretty much ready to go out of the box? I have been shooting a long time and i'm into reloading. I usually make it to the range at least once a week. I'm getting more interested in longer distance and I'm wondering what to do. I like to tinker so the appeal of buying a Tekka T3X CTR and adding as I go interest me but am I better off just getting something like the Bergara HMR Pro and just being done with it? I also have a racing background and its always cheaper to buy built than building yourself but for the most part I always built my stuff. Just seeing what peoples opinions are before I invest the money.
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Build or Buy Built
- Thread starter wera44
- Start date
nothing wrong with Tikka as there is good aftermarket support for triggers, barrel, stock but I would advise you look at building something off the Big Horn Origin action. it has a 700 footprint so any chassis/ stock that takes 700 will work and you can run trigger tech triggers. Most gunsmiths can cut barels for it without ever needing your action. If you buy a tikka or Bergera you will eventually want to sell and get a custom action no matter how much money you dump into to. Spend the 15% more and build the origin action
I appreciate the advice. I'll definitely look into that. Thats something that I didn't even consider. I'm not sure I'm up to that yet or where to begin. My plan was to buy a good gun and a better optic. Shoot the crap out of the gun to see if I was going to be into it like I think I would then pull the optic dump the rifle and upgrade. Any websites that you would advise to source parts for more of a custom build? Sorry very new to all this. Jut started reading the Ryan Cleckner book and coming up with game plan.
Dave tooley and Chad Dixon with (long rifles inc) to very popular gunsmiths that people on here like. Could discuss with one of them but a build like that is going to b 3k which is what you would end up putting in tikka if you did barrel and stock upgrade. But if you’re just getting into shooting a lot then can’t go wrong with either tikka or the Ruger precision rifle. Recommend something like 6.5 creed to start as it’s easier to come by than many other calibers. Can do a lot with those guns for 1k
Found a good deal on a new Ruger precision and the Bergara BMP in 6.5 locally I just don't know if Id enjoy an all metal gun. 6.5 is the route I'm going for sure. I guess the stock could be swapped out on it as well. Again thank you for your advice.
You cannot just swap the Ruger on to a stock. You may be able to on the beegera but I think there are very limited options of stocks for it? Good stock cost what those guns do so I wouldn’t plan on doing that’d off the bat. The all metal gun has a lot more adjustment and if you’re only target shooting will likely be much more comfortable than a stock with no way to customize length or cheek riser. I shot an rpr when learning to shoot a lot and reload and it was a terrific gun
After further poking around looks like magpul makes a synthetic butt stock that is more conventional. I think I would prefer that. Again thank you for the advice.
Unless you’re buying just an action I would not spend money on a stock upgrade. Good stocks cost 500+ dollars and still need gunsmiths to “bed” them. The magpul won’t be much better than the original and you can get farther spending money on ammo.
The Magpul part is just the butt end that folds. Just thought I may prefer the synthetic feel at the shoulder and cheek but I understand not dumping too much money on it.
Box ammo is slim here in Georgia but components are still readily available. Id probably get a few boxes of ammo then start reloading immediately or I won't be shooting.
6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds
6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds By Berger Item Description Midsouth offers the Berger 6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds. This ammunition will give you the precision and accuracy you need while hunting for that medium size game. Specifications &Features...
www.midsouthshooterssupply.com
My first bolt gun project I had the same thoughts, buy something cheaper and build it up or get something ready to run out of the box. I went the build it up route with a R700 and by the time I added the extra costs like threading the barrel, bolt knob, manners stock, I would have saved more money for ammo going with the Bergara ready to go out of the box. If I was going to do it all over again knowing what I know now, I would have got the Bergara. Also would have been at the range using it a year sooner when you factor in the wait time for the manners.
Best of luck either way you go with it.
Best of luck either way you go with it.
6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds
6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds By Berger Item Description Midsouth offers the Berger 6mm Creedmoor 105 Grain Hybrid Target 20 Rounds. This ammunition will give you the precision and accuracy you need while hunting for that medium size game. Specifications &Features...
Would be a decent route if I didn't have everything already to reload. Id have to look at cost closer to get an exact figure but I'm guessing I'd be at less than half that to reload. Thats based on cost for stuff I've had for a long time not off current prices.
either way you should be able to get a gun that will make you happy happy for a long time at least a few weeks till you find another to make you happier and repeat the process again and again till your wife kicks you out and takes all your guns leaving you to start all over again god its a vicious circle . lol
@wera44: The frame-up of your question resonates with me as I both live in Georgia and have an auto racing background. I completely agree with you that purchasing a ready to go racecar is FAR less expensive than building your own, however, there are many facets to any sport and if you are a person who enjoys the research, hunt, acquisition, testing and experience of building then, there is nothing wrong with that.
Like racing, an important early decision is: in what class am I going to race in. While your goals may change over time, it would be good to be right about what you are going to do with your new rifle. Is it for long range only or will it also serve as a hunting rifle and, what is the nominal distance you will likely shoot and what is the longest distance you will likely shoot. This is like setup on the racecar in that you have to decide which corner or corners to set the suspension up for.
There is a lot of good advice above about custom actions, barrels and stocks but let me relate a few things:
The Bergara action is fully Remington 700 compatible in every way (triggers, scope base and stock inlet). The HMR and HMR Pro are both very good target rifles with great (adjustable, pillar bedded and inner mini chassis frame) stocks and accurate barrels. Any gunsmith who can make a Remington 700 barrel and make a replacement barrel for the Bergara. This is a good option and one I have recommended to several folks starting out with longer range shooting. If you know you want to compete in the future, this is a great trainer to get started and something you can keep and upgrade for years to come. That said, there are other options if you know competition is in your future.
Remington 700s are far more accurate than most people give credit. As it turns out, the magic of accuracy comes from the the barrel first and then the bullet. After that comes a lot of pre-work to the brass, stock, scope base, rings & etc. That is like car race prep. The Remington 700 is the Ford Mustang of car world. There are limitless options for every single part of that action and some of the work to make it better can be done by the owner. Additionally, you can purchase Rem/Age barrels for a 700 now that allow you to swap barrels at home with minimal tools and they shoot pretty darn well.
Custom actions can be a good shortcut to improved accuracy and many renowned gunsmiths will chamber and thread barrels for numerous actions based on specifications alone. As a lathe owner and [very] amateur 'smith, I like to have the action in hand, especially for competition rifles, to set the headspace exactly where I want it and for other reasons of timing the barrel. Buying a custom action really commits you to an expensive finished product. At a high level you'll buy a $1000+ action, $600 barrel, $500 stock, $250 trigger, $200 bottom metal, $100 scope base, $40 recoil lug and, possibly, a new scope and rings. These are round numbers and the costs could vary wildly if you find sales, purchase used or substitute parts for less expensive ones but it is a reasonable guide.
Tikka makes a very good action but to swap barrels you'll want to cut a more pronounced shoulder on the action. This is no big deal but there are very few triggers for Tikkas and the barrel threads are metric. Again, not a big deal for a competent smith but different from most.
I have found that Ruger RPRs vary in consistency. After watching a guy at my range shoot a few .4 MOA groups with factory 140 grain ammo in his 6.5 Creedmoor RPR, I purchased one that would shoot no better than .75 with the same ammo. This was not a shooter issue
While there is good aftermarket support for this platform, I'd prefer to have a Remington 700, 700 clone or custom action to build from.
Without really knowing what your goals are, I would recommend an HMR or a Remington 700 unless you know you want to compete. I would have a different recommendation for that depending on what you are interested in. The reason for this recommendation is the universe of aftermarket parts that can really be put together to do anything you want it to do.
I have tried to stay away from the caliber discussion but it is worth mentioning. The 6.5 calibers are great as they and offer reduced recoil as compared to .308 and reasonably long barrel life as long as the speed is reasonable. 2700 FPS for 140 grain class bullets should give you 2500-3000+ rounds of very accurate barrel life. 6mm calibers offer even less recoil but in order to realize their advantage you have to shoot at speeds starting at 3000 FPS. This will diminish barrel life and in my experience getting to 2000 rounds while maintaining good accuracy is difficult.
Lastly, the current ammo and component shortage is pretty daunting. If this situation really is just the result of significantly increased firearms sales driving significant purchases of factory ammo AND hoarding by the reloading community then we should see some relief by the end of Q1 2021. If there is something more nefarious going on, buying a new firearm now might be silly. I wouldn't buy anything right now unless you get a screamin' deal.
Henryrifle
Like racing, an important early decision is: in what class am I going to race in. While your goals may change over time, it would be good to be right about what you are going to do with your new rifle. Is it for long range only or will it also serve as a hunting rifle and, what is the nominal distance you will likely shoot and what is the longest distance you will likely shoot. This is like setup on the racecar in that you have to decide which corner or corners to set the suspension up for.
There is a lot of good advice above about custom actions, barrels and stocks but let me relate a few things:
The Bergara action is fully Remington 700 compatible in every way (triggers, scope base and stock inlet). The HMR and HMR Pro are both very good target rifles with great (adjustable, pillar bedded and inner mini chassis frame) stocks and accurate barrels. Any gunsmith who can make a Remington 700 barrel and make a replacement barrel for the Bergara. This is a good option and one I have recommended to several folks starting out with longer range shooting. If you know you want to compete in the future, this is a great trainer to get started and something you can keep and upgrade for years to come. That said, there are other options if you know competition is in your future.
Remington 700s are far more accurate than most people give credit. As it turns out, the magic of accuracy comes from the the barrel first and then the bullet. After that comes a lot of pre-work to the brass, stock, scope base, rings & etc. That is like car race prep. The Remington 700 is the Ford Mustang of car world. There are limitless options for every single part of that action and some of the work to make it better can be done by the owner. Additionally, you can purchase Rem/Age barrels for a 700 now that allow you to swap barrels at home with minimal tools and they shoot pretty darn well.
Custom actions can be a good shortcut to improved accuracy and many renowned gunsmiths will chamber and thread barrels for numerous actions based on specifications alone. As a lathe owner and [very] amateur 'smith, I like to have the action in hand, especially for competition rifles, to set the headspace exactly where I want it and for other reasons of timing the barrel. Buying a custom action really commits you to an expensive finished product. At a high level you'll buy a $1000+ action, $600 barrel, $500 stock, $250 trigger, $200 bottom metal, $100 scope base, $40 recoil lug and, possibly, a new scope and rings. These are round numbers and the costs could vary wildly if you find sales, purchase used or substitute parts for less expensive ones but it is a reasonable guide.
Tikka makes a very good action but to swap barrels you'll want to cut a more pronounced shoulder on the action. This is no big deal but there are very few triggers for Tikkas and the barrel threads are metric. Again, not a big deal for a competent smith but different from most.
I have found that Ruger RPRs vary in consistency. After watching a guy at my range shoot a few .4 MOA groups with factory 140 grain ammo in his 6.5 Creedmoor RPR, I purchased one that would shoot no better than .75 with the same ammo. This was not a shooter issue
While there is good aftermarket support for this platform, I'd prefer to have a Remington 700, 700 clone or custom action to build from.Without really knowing what your goals are, I would recommend an HMR or a Remington 700 unless you know you want to compete. I would have a different recommendation for that depending on what you are interested in. The reason for this recommendation is the universe of aftermarket parts that can really be put together to do anything you want it to do.
I have tried to stay away from the caliber discussion but it is worth mentioning. The 6.5 calibers are great as they and offer reduced recoil as compared to .308 and reasonably long barrel life as long as the speed is reasonable. 2700 FPS for 140 grain class bullets should give you 2500-3000+ rounds of very accurate barrel life. 6mm calibers offer even less recoil but in order to realize their advantage you have to shoot at speeds starting at 3000 FPS. This will diminish barrel life and in my experience getting to 2000 rounds while maintaining good accuracy is difficult.
Lastly, the current ammo and component shortage is pretty daunting. If this situation really is just the result of significantly increased firearms sales driving significant purchases of factory ammo AND hoarding by the reloading community then we should see some relief by the end of Q1 2021. If there is something more nefarious going on, buying a new firearm now might be silly. I wouldn't buy anything right now unless you get a screamin' deal.
Henryrifle
I have done all three. Bought my first GA precision used for $2500 and I am on the second barrel. Amazing shooting rifle and would hate to ever sell. Great for the daughter now. Second gun started shooting competition in a .25 Creedmoor and MPA stock now moving on to 6BR also in a MPA stock. Will keep the 1st MPA for back up and probably go .25 Creed again or .22 dasher. Your tastes will begin to get picky the more you get into it. The best advice is buy quality and you will never be disappointed. I am pulling the pieces on the 3rd build from the hide and local and saving quite a bit. Impact, Bartlein, Tangent Theta, Triggertech, MPA and all the fixings and will put it together myself. Its a journey....enjoy
@wera44: The frame-up of your question resonates with me as I both live in Georgia and have an auto racing background. I completely agree with you that purchasing a ready to go racecar is FAR less expensive than building your own, however, there are many facets to any sport and if you are a person who enjoys the research, hunt, acquisition, testing and experience of building then, there is nothing wrong with that.
Like racing, an important early decision is: in what class am I going to race in. While your goals may change over time, it would be good to be right about what you are going to do with your new rifle. Is it for long range only or will it also serve as a hunting rifle and, what is the nominal distance you will likely shoot and what is the longest distance you will likely shoot. This is like setup on the racecar in that you have to decide which corner or corners to set the suspension up for.
There is a lot of good advice above about custom actions, barrels and stocks but let me relate a few things:
The Bergara action is fully Remington 700 compatible in every way (triggers, scope base and stock inlet). The HMR and HMR Pro are both very good target rifles with great (adjustable, pillar bedded and inner mini chassis frame) stocks and accurate barrels. Any gunsmith who can make a Remington 700 barrel and make a replacement barrel for the Bergara. This is a good option and one I have recommended to several folks starting out with longer range shooting. If you know you want to compete in the future, this is a great trainer to get started and something you can keep and upgrade for years to come. That said, there are other options if you know competition is in your future.
Remington 700s are far more accurate than most people give credit. As it turns out, the magic of accuracy comes from the the barrel first and then the bullet. After that comes a lot of pre-work to the brass, stock, scope base, rings & etc. That is like car race prep. The Remington 700 is the Ford Mustang of car world. There are limitless options for every single part of that action and some of the work to make it better can be done by the owner. Additionally, you can purchase Rem/Age barrels for a 700 now that allow you to swap barrels at home with minimal tools and they shoot pretty darn well.
Custom actions can be a good shortcut to improved accuracy and many renowned gunsmiths will chamber and thread barrels for numerous actions based on specifications alone. As a lathe owner and [very] amateur 'smith, I like to have the action in hand, especially for competition rifles, to set the headspace exactly where I want it and for other reasons of timing the barrel. Buying a custom action really commits you to an expensive finished product. At a high level you'll buy a $1000+ action, $600 barrel, $500 stock, $250 trigger, $200 bottom metal, $100 scope base, $40 recoil lug and, possibly, a new scope and rings. These are round numbers and the costs could vary wildly if you find sales, purchase used or substitute parts for less expensive ones but it is a reasonable guide.
Tikka makes a very good action but to swap barrels you'll want to cut a more pronounced shoulder on the action. This is no big deal but there are very few triggers for Tikkas and the barrel threads are metric. Again, not a big deal for a competent smith but different from most.
I have found that Ruger RPRs vary in consistency. After watching a guy at my range shoot a few .4 MOA groups with factory 140 grain ammo in his 6.5 Creedmoor RPR, I purchased one that would shoot no better than .75 with the same ammo. This was not a shooter issue
Without really knowing what your goals are, I would recommend an HMR or a Remington 700 unless you know you want to compete. I would have a different recommendation for that depending on what you are interested in. The reason for this recommendation is the universe of aftermarket parts that can really be put together to do anything you want it to do.
I have tried to stay away from the caliber discussion but it is worth mentioning. The 6.5 calibers are great as they and offer reduced recoil as compared to .308 and reasonably long barrel life as long as the speed is reasonable. 2700 FPS for 140 grain class bullets should give you 2500-3000+ rounds of very accurate barrel life. 6mm calibers offer even less recoil but in order to realize their advantage you have to shoot at speeds starting at 3000 FPS. This will diminish barrel life and in my experience getting to 2000 rounds while maintaining good accuracy is difficult.
Lastly, the current ammo and component shortage is pretty daunting. If this situation really is just the result of significantly increased firearms sales driving significant purchases of factory ammo AND hoarding by the reloading community then we should see some relief by the end of Q1 2021. If there is something more nefarious going on, buying a new firearm now might be silly. I wouldn't buy anything right now unless you get a screamin' deal.
Henryrifle
My idea is to just have fun shooting various distances. I have access to 500 yards fairly close with farther distances available but not real convenient. I would love to at some point get into some sort of production based competition but I'm still researching available opportunities in my area. I'm just out side of Athen GA. If I catch the fever during that who knows where that will take me. I'd consider myself extremely competitive, I raced motorcycles for almost 15 years before cars. I go through phases with my hobbies so they stay in a rotation if that makes sense. I hunt during deer season, tournament fish during the spring and fall and race cars in-between
I thought one of my boys was going to UGA and scoped out Athens for shops and places to shoot. I found several good stores with knowledgeable staffs/owners. You are in a good part of the state for shooting sports.
I have found long range shooting to be a sport that depends on a set of skills just like some of the others you have mentioned that can only be developed and mastered through experience and repetition. Would it be great to have a first rifle that shoots in the .1s and .2s? Sure but, for what you are wanting to do, .5s to .7s are sufficient. 500 yards is enough to gain experience with wind, the most challenging element of mid to long range shooting to understand and consistently resolve. If you love long range, there will be many rifles in various calibers in your future.
There are some amazingly accurate and relatively inexpensive factory rifles today that can be even more accurate through hand loading. Keep researching and reading advice from here an other places. There are some very accomplished dudes on this site who enjoy seeing new blood come into the various disciplines and are eager to mentor them to success.
You have fun choices ahead. Make sure you have fun with them...
Henryrifle
I have found long range shooting to be a sport that depends on a set of skills just like some of the others you have mentioned that can only be developed and mastered through experience and repetition. Would it be great to have a first rifle that shoots in the .1s and .2s? Sure but, for what you are wanting to do, .5s to .7s are sufficient. 500 yards is enough to gain experience with wind, the most challenging element of mid to long range shooting to understand and consistently resolve. If you love long range, there will be many rifles in various calibers in your future.
There are some amazingly accurate and relatively inexpensive factory rifles today that can be even more accurate through hand loading. Keep researching and reading advice from here an other places. There are some very accomplished dudes on this site who enjoy seeing new blood come into the various disciplines and are eager to mentor them to success.
You have fun choices ahead. Make sure you have fun with them...
Henryrifle
I'm looking forward to learning more during this process. I have a Remington 700 in 22-250 and have been really impressed with it. I have shot it pretty often over the last month working on mechanics with great results but know its going to be reaching its limits at distances I'm considering. Again thank you for taking the time to answer questions.
There are definitely a lot of routes to take. I think an MPA rifle would be hard to beat. With that said, if you really get into it, you may end up upgrading whatever action you buy anyway.
I started with a .308 Rem 700 SPS Varmint with a 26" barrel. The stock is terrible, but it is surprisingly accurate, definitely sub-MOA. I started by just adding a NF NXS 3.5-15 scope on a NF 20 MOA rail and a Harris swivel bipod, so the initial cost was minimal. It's been a great rifle to learn on, plus it gets you out there immediately. I definitely recommend this for anyone looking to get into longer range shooting.
I recently bought an MPA comp chassis, Triggertech Special trigger and a Vortex Razor 4.5-27 to upgrade the setup. After I shoot this for awhile, I'll replace the r700 action with a different caliber aftermarket barreled action and have very capable precision rifle. I can also turn my r700 back into a hunting rifle, without any sunk costs, although I may upgrade the stock to a used HS Precison.
The benefit of an r700 based platform is being able to use all your parts with the abundance of aftermarket actions. The r700 still shoots better than I do, so going this route has allowed me to make sure it is something I like, without investing a lot of upfront money. Plus, as a tinkerer myself, learning and upgrading is enjoyable. Just something to think about.
I started with a .308 Rem 700 SPS Varmint with a 26" barrel. The stock is terrible, but it is surprisingly accurate, definitely sub-MOA. I started by just adding a NF NXS 3.5-15 scope on a NF 20 MOA rail and a Harris swivel bipod, so the initial cost was minimal. It's been a great rifle to learn on, plus it gets you out there immediately. I definitely recommend this for anyone looking to get into longer range shooting.
I recently bought an MPA comp chassis, Triggertech Special trigger and a Vortex Razor 4.5-27 to upgrade the setup. After I shoot this for awhile, I'll replace the r700 action with a different caliber aftermarket barreled action and have very capable precision rifle. I can also turn my r700 back into a hunting rifle, without any sunk costs, although I may upgrade the stock to a used HS Precison.
The benefit of an r700 based platform is being able to use all your parts with the abundance of aftermarket actions. The r700 still shoots better than I do, so going this route has allowed me to make sure it is something I like, without investing a lot of upfront money. Plus, as a tinkerer myself, learning and upgrading is enjoyable. Just something to think about.
