Buying First Safe Need Advice

[AngryKoala]

I currently have a gun cabinet for my guns but I was looking to get something a little more secure. I have one major issue.
1. I am not in my forever home so I really do not want a 1200lb safe that I bolt to the ground (moving in a few years).

I was originally looking at liberty but they seem to be hit or miss. Fort Knox looks good but they are quite pricey and I feel a lot of that price goes into their look vs. function.

I plan on buying during black Friday and would like to keep it in the 1-2k range if possible (under 1k would be amazing).

Looking for advice, thank you in advance!

 

[want2learn]

i wonder if something like the Zanotti Modular Safes might work out well for your purpose. While i've never owned one I have heard them favorably mentioned in other forums. Reportedly nice quality and being modular in design they come apart so you can build one in your closet for a little extra stealth....and when you move it might be easier to take apart and bring with you to your next home.

 

[anginaprinzmetal]

Whatever you're budgeting you probably need to spend a little more. Zanotti, Surdy, AmSec, VaultPro, Grafunder (used if you can find) all make good safes. All a bit pricey compared to the "features" you get with other crappy ones. It all comes down to the amount of steel (thickness) they use. I wouldn't buy any big store crap

 

[Woodland_Wolf_M81]

i wonder if something like the Zanotti Modular Safes might work out well for your purpose. While i've never owned one I have heard them favorably mentioned in other forums. Reportedly nice quality and being modular in design they come apart so you can build one in your closet for a little extra stealth....and when you move it might be easier to take apart and bring with you to your next home.

My friend did exactly this. He stuck his modular safe (SnapSafe) in his closet. Not sure how SnapSafe compares to Zanotti though.

 

[BuLLet]

I now have two Zanotti safes. The biggest they make. I had researched them against SnapSafe. I actually made the order for a SnapSafe first but after further looking canceled that and went with Zanotti instead. My main safe is a 1700 pounder, the Zanotti's were purchased to install myself in my basement and act as overflow. Sort of what I would work out of, guns that I shoot on a regular basis. Wanted everything I owned to be locked up.

Main reason for not taking the SnapSafe was that the wall thickness was determined by sandwiching two pieces of metal, not a single solid piece. Also, I had some concerns that the bolts holding the safe together would not be as good as the pins used on the Zanottis.

 

[Jigstick]

The best advice you’re going to get is this.

Determine what size safe you think you need to fit all your shit. Then double it

 

[salks]

Yes get bigger than what you think. I had a break in. I keep my guns in a liberty safe. I was glad I had it. They didn't even try mostly because they were in and out very quick and probably didn't have the means to even try. Something is better than nothing IMO.

 

[nn8734]

I currently have a gun cabinet for my guns but I was looking to get something a little more secure. I have one major issue.
1. I am not in my forever home so I really do not want a 1200lb safe that I bolt to the ground (moving in a few years).

I was originally looking at liberty but they seem to be hit or miss. Fort Knox looks good but they are quite pricey and I feel a lot of that price goes into their look vs. function.

I plan on buying during black Friday and would like to keep it in the 1-2k range if possible (under 1k would be amazing).

Looking for advice, thank you in advance!

I have a Fort Knox and it’s a solid safe. Recessed 3/8 steel plate door and 1/4 plate steel body with 4 way bolt work. Would likely buy me at least 4-5 hours maybe more before someone with the right tools was able to breach it.

At 1k, I’d almost recommend you just keep your money and wait until you move to buy a proper safe if you think a move in your near future.

Alternatively, if you buy a proper safe now and move later, you can just hire a safe moving company to move the safe, esp if it’s weight exceeds 1000 lbs.

Like others have mentioned, don’t cheap out on the safe.

 

[sam4886]

4-5 hours is fantasy land. More like 4-5 minutes. I've personally broken into a mid level safe, liberty or cannon I think. It had a busted key pad that couldn't be fixed and my buddy didn't want to pay for a smith and also had a lot of beer. Two drunks and 2 pry bars had it open in less than 5 minutes. Now, that's obviously less well built than a fort Knox, but not hours worth. We figured we would start with the pry bars then work up through skinny wheels and torches if we needed to. A skinny wheel will eat 1/4 steel quick.

 

[nn8734]

4-5 hours is fantasy land. More like 4-5 minutes. I've personally broken into a mid level safe, liberty or cannon I think. It had a busted key pad that couldn't be fixed and my buddy didn't want to pay for a smith and also had a lot of beer. Two drunks and 2 pry bars had it open in less than 5 minutes. Now, that's obviously less well built than a fort Knox, but not hours worth. We figured we would start with the pry bars then work up through skinny wheels and torches if we needed to. A skinny wheel will eat 1/4 steel quick.

4-5 minutes? Not for your garden variety burglar, that’s for sure. Cheap ass USLs are breachable in that kind of time frame with basic tools. It takes a while longer to breach an actual safe. Even if we’re talking an hour of time, assuming you have an alarm, cameras and a responsive PD and/or security patrol it could mean the difference between keeping your shit vs loosing it all. Most dedicated safe retailers will replace your safe for free if a break in occurs and the safe is damaged, even if it’s not breached.

 

[AngryKoala]

I could swing spending more. I don't have enough gear to need a 50 gun safe (2 ARs and 5 pistols) so maybe that's where I can get my savings in is buying a smaller safe.
There's so many brands and models out there is Fort Knox the way to go? If so which model?
The Zanotti seems a little expensive for what it is but maybe I am just out of touch.
I like the idea of a moving company because I will need one to help with moving it.

 

[nn8734]

I could swing spending more. I don't have enough gear to need a 50 gun safe (2 ARs and 5 pistols) so maybe that's where I can get my savings in is buying a smaller safe.
There's so many brands and models out there is Fort Knox the way to go? If so which model?
The Zanotti seems a little expensive for what it is but maybe I am just out of touch.
I like the idea of a moving company because I will need one to help with moving it.

If you haven’t done so already, check for specialty lock and safe retailers in your area. You will definitely get some sound advice here but there is nothing better than actually being in front of a row(s) of safes from various makers and price points with a professional who knows them inside and out helping/advising you based on your needs.

Fort Knox is a reputable company, Summit is another good company. Though not likely that you’d spend this much money but Graffunder is another well regarded manufacturer but they are very very pricey.

 

[Lawrence60]

I currently have a gun cabinet for my guns but I was looking to get something a little more secure. I have one major issue.
1. I am not in my forever home so I really do not want a 1200lb safe that I bolt to the ground (moving in a few years).

I was originally looking at liberty but they seem to be hit or miss. Fort Knox looks good but they are quite pricey and I feel a lot of that price goes into their look vs. function.

I plan on buying during black Friday and would like to keep it in the 1-2k range if possible (under 1k would be amazing).

Looking for advice, thank you in advance!

I don't know if you can get Ultimate cabinets over there but check them out online I have just bought one for £125 for a 4 rifle cabinet

 

[AnschutzNerd]

There is a lot of reading that can be completed on this subject via a search.

Cliff Notes -
How much you spend depends upon how much you want to protect your gear.
Fire was and is my main concern.

Read all you can about RSC containers. Thats what BassPro sells and 'sheet rock' is their common fire insulation.
An ax will open a RSC that costs $1000.
Then read all you can about TL rated safes. There are several levels to the TL rating.
A lock-smith is not getting in. A SAVTA tech can.

Then, go buy an Amsec BF-series container. Great compromise.

A SAVTA tech with retail space once told me:
Essentially:
10% of the locks he sell are digital.
90% of his service calls are related to digital locks.

Buy once, cry once and if it weighs less than 1000-lbs, bolt it down!

AN

 

[Baron23]

I currently have a gun cabinet for my guns but I was looking to get something a little more secure. I have one major issue.
1. I am not in my forever home so I really do not want a 1200lb safe that I bolt to the ground (moving in a few years).

I was originally looking at liberty but they seem to be hit or miss. Fort Knox looks good but they are quite pricey and I feel a lot of that price goes into their look vs. function.

I plan on buying during black Friday and would like to keep it in the 1-2k range if possible (under 1k would be amazing).

Looking for advice, thank you in advance!

I have a Champion safe and I'm very happy with his. Rotatory dial and NOT a key pad.

Champion Safe Co. | Top-rated gun safes for sale on wholesale prices | Fireproof safe deal

Are you looking for Gun Safes? Champion Safe Co. manufactures the highest grade gun safes, fire safes & home safes in the USA! Featuring 3 gun safe lines with fire rating options to choose from.

championsafe.com

And I agree...get a safe twice as large as you need....damn guns reproduce at night in there or something.

My understanding is that all fire proof gun safes (well, all may be a stretch so how about most) contain gypsum layered in there and its the release of water vapor from the gypsum that keeps things cooler in there...until it drys out. Hence the different fire proof time ratings.

Perhaps difficult to do with scoped rifles, but a friend of mine had a huge house fire and this guy had a LOT of collectible shotguns. After the fire, when they got into the safe, all of the guns that were in silicon impregnated gun socks were fine. The ones that were not were rusted to hell from all of the particulants combining with the water from putting out the fire. Just something to think about.

 

[MCHOG]

Former locksmith here. I've been called on many occasions to open damaged high-end and low-end safes after attempted break-ins. Almost every instance involved a half-hearted and short-lived attempt. They almost always hit the dial or handle, break one or both off, and then leave or move on to low hanging fruit. That leads me to the conclusion that 95%+ of the time you don't need high security. A heavy (or bolted down) fire safe is all most people need, especially if they have an audible alarm system that will put some pressure on intruders to move quickly. If they don't have time pressure and are properly motivated, even a high security safe will not protect its contents.

 

[_Windrider_]

Former locksmith here. I've been called on many occasions to open damaged high-end and low-end safes after attempted break-ins. Almost every instance involved a half-hearted and short-lived attempt. They almost always hit the dial or handle, break one or both off, and then leave or move on to low hanging fruit. That leads me to the conclusion that 95%+ of the time you don't need high security. A heavy (or bolted down) fire safe is all most people need, especially if they have an audible alarm system that will put some pressure on intruders to move quickly. If they don't have time pressure and are properly motivated, even a high security safe will not protect its contents.

It’s true. You just need something to deter. It’s a time issue. Given more time they would have kept going.
I don’t recommend traditional safes, you bang your rifles up getting them in and out. Get a locker style like secure it offers or gallow tech. Holds less but they stayed in better condition.

 

[TriggerJerk!]

I have a Sturdy brand safe, and I am pleased with the quality.

I do differ with some of the above advice. I would rather have 2 safes than one big safe— makes it twice as much trouble for the bad guys. And two safes in different locations can improve the odds of surviving a fire (depending on where you place them).

YMMV. But definitely get a safe of some type.

 

[AngryKoala]

got some great advice in here. I think I know which way I want to lean. I'm thinking a 20-30 (lean towards 30) gun safe with a 45-60min fire rating (fire department is 5min away) that weighs a considerable amount. Avoid digital locks and get a dial lock. Make sure the safe is only a second determent method (primary = security system). Thank you guys!

 

[nn8734]

I have a Sturdy brand safe, and I am pleased with the quality.

I do differ with some of the above advice. I would rather have 2 safes than one big safe— makes it twice as much trouble for the bad guys. And two safes in different locations can improve the odds of surviving a fire (depending on where you place them).

YMMV. But definitely get a safe of some type.

I actually use this strategy but one of the safes is in very visible location and contains stuff that’s low cost and easily replaceable while the other (my primary, heavy duty safe) is tucked away out of sight.

 

[SourMash]

Another thing to consider when thinking about the chances of a fire in your home is, How hot is the fire? My uncle was a Captain in the fire dept. and he told me that the hottest place in a home fire was on the interior of the house which made sense. Think about a fully engulfed house with the roof collapsing. I put my safe on an exterior wall of the house. Also worth mentioning again is the fact that any safe can be broken into depending on how much time the criminal has to work. Buy bigger than you expect to ever need

 

[bghartm]

OP, any chance you live in the midwest? I have two safes for sale.

 

[TxWelder35]

The only thing I would care about on a safe is fire rating. Every residential safe on the market that I can get into in under 10.

after people try and steal ATMsand screw up the lock mechanism, the atm service companies call me to cut them open to get the cash out. I can get into a bank ATM in under 15 min.

point being, all safes can be cut open very easily. Don’t blow your budget on one you think will resist burglars better. Fire rating would be #1 consideration

 

[rustyinbend]

I have two safes from "2nd Amendment" ... a pistol safe and a large one for rifles and ammo. They are super well-made, and come with dials instead of electronic locking. Highly recommend this brand. MUCH prefer dial-locks ... guaranteed to work every time.

 

[AngryKoala]

The only thing I would care about on a safe is fire rating. Every residential safe on the market that I can get into in under 10.

after people try and steal ATMsand screw up the lock mechanism, the atm service companies call me to cut them open to get the cash out. I can get into a bank ATM in under 15 min.

point being, all safes can be cut open very easily. Don’t blow your budget on one you think will resist burglars better. Fire rating would be #1 consideration

Agreed but I would want a safe that is heavy enough they just cant drag out. It will be in my basement which has a sharp turning stairwell so that would be my second emphasis. I am not adding the extra steel in front of the door, or fancy coatings. I Just want a heavy enough safe with a good enough fire rating for my fire department to get there.

 

[TxWelder35]

Agreed but I would want a safe that is heavy enough they just cant drag out. It will be in my basement which has a sharp turning stairwell so that would be my second emphasis. I am not adding the extra steel in front of the door, or fancy coatings. I Just want a heavy enough safe with a good enough fire rating for my fire department to get there.

Bolt it to the concrete, weight doesn’t necessarily matter

 

[gnochi]

Agreed but I would want a safe that is heavy enough they just cant drag out. It will be in my basement which has a sharp turning stairwell so that would be my second emphasis. I am not adding the extra steel in front of the door, or fancy coatings. I Just want a heavy enough safe with a good enough fire rating for my fire department to get there.

As @TxWelder35 said, bolt it to concrete.

Barring that - if you live in an apartment with a post-tensioned slab floor and might kill someone if you drill, for example - bolt it into a corner of a pedestal that’s a few inches thick of plywood, and a foot longer and wider than the width of the first door between your safe and the garage. Then, shove that into a corner and bolt through the side and back of the safe into wall studs.

Also, don’t have any of your portable power tools - angle grinder, cut-off wheels, etc. - easily accessible. No reason to make a thief’s job easy.

Finally, most gun “safe“ fire ratings are crap. If it’s not “certified to UL 72”, it’s a fake number that won’t pass UL 72, and passing UL 72 is about the only thing that matters for actual protection of safe contents in a house fire.

Plus, the stuff that won’t pass UL 72 usually uses chinesium drywall, which includes all sorts of formaldehyde and other corrosives, and just the day to day temperature changes will let that start corroding your guns. Then, if there’s a fire, you’ll be bathing your guns in steam until there’s no water left in the drywall, then you’re bathing your guns in superheated steam because your thermal protection is gone before the fire department arrives.

If you can’t afford a good safe, get an insurance policy on your collection for a couple hundred bucks per year. I know a few people who use Collect Insure, which is specifically for collectible items (which may, unlike most policies, include firearms) and the theft or destruction thereof.

 

[sam4886]

As soon as you drill holes through the walls to bolt it in, you've ruined the fire rating.

 

[elwarpo]

Look for a used TL safe, they can be found for not much more than a new RSC. The difference is night and day. they weigh a lot more but it is worth it.

 

[James Abram]

Buy your second safe first! Spend a lot of time figuring out exactly how large a safe you need...then add 50% to that, then buy the next bigger one.

 

[TriggerJerk!]

Bolt it to the concrete, weight doesn’t necessarily matter

You can epoxy it to the floor as well. Just don’t plan on moving it afterward.

On a former home I put on safe in a basement corner and then built a closet around it. Hide the safe a bit, made angle of attack a bit more problematic for the bad guys, and the concrete board walls provided some additional fire protection. A determined thief can eventually steal anything... I just wanted to make their job a little harder

 

[AngryKoala]

I really just need something to last 10-20minutes. The police department is less than 5minutes from my house with nothing better to do. Fire department is close by so I think fire protection is my main goal. Might look into modular safes just for ease of use.
Really like the posters idea about building around the safe.

 

[local_dirt]

I have a Fort Knox and it’s a solid safe. Recessed 3/8 steel plate door and 1/4 plate steel body with 4 way bolt work. Would likely buy me at least 4-5 hours maybe more before someone with the right tools was able to breach it.

At 1k, I’d almost recommend you just keep your money and wait until you move to buy a proper safe if you think a move in your near future.

Alternatively, if you buy a proper safe now and move later, you can just hire a safe moving company to move the safe, esp if it’s weight exceeds 1000 lbs.

Like others have mentioned, don’t cheap out on the safe.

Another vote for Fort Knox. Buy once cry once.

 

[flylo]

Don't buy a gun safe. Watch this Liberty cut open like a tuna can Mine is Mosler out of a bank. Had a time lock. Made with 1.25" pressed metals of several kinds, some torch. drill, saw proof etc weighs 4400#. Paid $150 locked open. Called all the locksmiths & all sade if I brought it to then they'd recode if for $75 until I told them the lock brand, non could do it. New lock was $300. Found a nib lock the guy ordered wrong for $15+$9 shipping on ebay. $175 of wonderful. Look at this ebay ad & see what you can buy for $150. I'd snatch this if I was closer & put a cs gas unit in it. https://www.keepshooting.com/clear-out-6oz-tear-gas-grenade.html
eBay item number: 233684318368

 

[jac68984]

I like my ProSteel (Browning) safe. When I bought it, it was way more than I wanted to spend and way larger than I thought I needed. It fills fast. I like a taller safe so you can store pistols or valuables beyond just guns. As everyone seems to agree, but bigger than you currently need, pay attention to fire ratings, and hire a safe mover when you move if you can’t or don’t want to move it yourself. Good luck!!

 

[OutThere]

This article is a pretty good overview of safe-buying info: https://www.accurateshooter.com/technical-articles/gun-safe-buyers-guide/. The linked articles are interesting,too.

I've had a Zanotti for 20 years. No issues.

I suggest buying the biggest one you can fit in your allotted space.

 

[OutThere]

The only thing I would care about on a safe is fire rating. Every residential safe on the market that I can get into in under 10.

after people try and steal ATMsand screw up the lock mechanism, the atm service companies call me to cut them open to get the cash out. I can get into a bank ATM in under 15 min.

point being, all safes can be cut open very easily. Don’t blow your budget on one you think will resist burglars better. Fire rating would be #1 consideration

You mean I just can't rub my fingers on sandpaper and listen for the "clicks"?

 

[79steeler]

I just got the secure it ANSWER gun cabinet/Safe and really like the way that each rifle sits in it own place and it is very organized. Not alot of wasted space because its totally modular. Check them out.

 

[flylo]

I hate safe damage on guns & have bought some from the same guy & the blueing is damaged at the same place on each by the carpet gassing so I put each gun in a silicone closth gunsock & gently stack them in with a tag on top of each one. Nice wood stocked guns I put barrel down so any oil doesn't get into the wood & doesn't smash the recoil pad. The non wood stocked go barrel up & everything fits nice.

 

[StLPro2A]

I currently have a gun cabinet for my guns but I was looking to get something a little more secure. I have one major issue.
1. I am not in my forever home so I really do not want a 1200lb safe that I bolt to the ground (moving in a few years).

I was originally looking at liberty but they seem to be hit or miss. Fort Knox looks good but they are quite pricey and I feel a lot of that price goes into their look vs. function.

I plan on buying during black Friday and would like to keep it in the 1-2k range if possible (under 1k would be amazing).

Looking for advice, thank you in advance!

Under $1000 will keep your little kids out. $1-2K will keep teenagers, junkies, your wife, stupid brother-in-law, and honest friends out. Safes....Residential Security Containers unless you spend serious cash for Grafunder, Mosler, etc.....are like locks....feel good illusions of security. Harley budding is a professional gunsmith. His favorite observation is that "locks keep honest or terminally stupid people out." Any RSC....even 1/4" thick body...... will be breached quickly by $12 Harbor Freight 4" grinder or small ox/acet cutting rig going through the top or side.....not even try the door. Many RSCs can even be opened by picking the backup key lock with $20 EBAY tools. While a good security illusion is important, a safe that no one finds to even attempt breaching is critical to real security. Buy whatever safe makes you feel good, meets your needs. Then, hide it behind a quality hidden door/wall. Consider a Safeguard from Lockdown ($110) for a breach/temperature/humidity cell phone alert....requires wifi. Place a cheap metal cabinet.....Sentinel, Snap-On, etc.....from big box store in an easily found location. Place a few worthless cheapy sacrificial guns in it with barrels leaded to prevent successful firing......blow up in their face is fun.....not a booby trap....artifact de-milled for safety. They will find the tin box, easily beach, take the guns and run, not even finding your well hidden real RSC. I and many gun buddies follow this tactic Has actually saved guns in several burglaries. THEN, DON"T BRAG AND SHOW EVERYONE YOUR HIDDEN SAFE!!!!! And, dump the NRA, gun brand decals, hunting/shooting hitch covers, etc from your vehicles. They only entice "follow me home, I'll show you where my guns live." I bought a used UltraLift (capacity 1500lbs) powered stair climber to move our safes......part of the don't know, can't breach philosophy. We pick up and move our own safes rather than hiring a "bonded" safe mover. Saves a little money, but avoids stranger having knowledge of where the safes reside. We pay cash...no credit cards and no receipt addresses.

 

[AngryKoala]

Don't buy a gun safe. Watch this Liberty cut open like a tuna can Mine is Mosler out of a bank. Had a time lock. Made with 1.25" pressed metals of several kinds, some torch. drill, saw proof etc weighs 4400#. Paid $150 locked open. Called all the locksmiths & all sade if I brought it to then they'd recode if for $75 until I told them the lock brand, non could do it. New lock was $300. Found a nib lock the guy ordered wrong for $15+$9 shipping on ebay. $175 of wonderful. Look at this ebay ad & see what you can buy for $150. I'd snatch this if I was closer & put a cs gas unit in it. https://www.keepshooting.com/clear-out-6oz-tear-gas-grenade.html
eBay item number: 233684318368

So maybe a couple secure it safes with a dummy safe in plain site that has junk in it. Then I can hide the other safe.