Hunting & Fishing Cayuga" Hunting Bullets

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

Can you post a picture of the bd2 expansion? Very interested

Also what is the overall length with those 205? Im thinking a 300 win mag in cip use them to shoot out to 1 mile and hunt with.

What is your 30 nosler load data? Speed?

I'll post some info on the 205 when I get off work.
I'm sending them at 3025 from a 24" 8 twist using H1000 and Peterson brass, I can get you specifics later with a few pics.

Basically the entire tip breaks off into pieces of shrapnel, I recovered pieces from a log and saturated clay
Looks like it'll do some damage, we'll be using the 125s for deer and elk this season for sure and maybe the 205s as well
I'll be sure to start a thread after the season ends

 

[Bangin]

I'll post some info on the 205 when I get off work.
I'm sending them at 3025 from a 24" 8 twist using H1000 and Peterson brass, I can get you specifics later with a few pics.

Basically the entire tip breaks off into pieces of shrapnel, I recovered pieces from a log and saturated clay
Looks like it'll do some damage, we'll be using the 125s for deer and elk this season for sure and maybe the 205s as well
I'll be sure to start a thread after the season ends

I plan on 205s for a 30 SM I’m building with a 20” barrel and 135s for a 6.5prc. .30 has a 1/8 and 6.5 has a 1/7.

 

[Schw15]

I'll post some info on the 205 when I get off work.
I'm sending them at 3025 from a 24" 8 twist using H1000 and Peterson brass, I can get you specifics later with a few pics.

Basically the entire tip breaks off into pieces of shrapnel, I recovered pieces from a log and saturated clay
Looks like it'll do some damage, we'll be using the 125s for deer and elk this season for sure and maybe the 205s as well
I'll be sure to start a thread after the season ends

And the g7 of .402 is holding up well? Can you mag feed?

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

I plan on 205s for a 30 SM I’m building with a 20” barrel and 135s for a 6.5prc. .30 has a 1/8 and 6.5 has a 1/7.

Right on
My 6.5 is a 7.5 twist so unfortunately I can't shoot the 135.
How far along are you with your build? I had a 30 SM for a bit but hated fire forming for the relatively marginal velocity increase so I sold it and built the 30 Nosler throated out for 230 bergers.
I'm actually slightly faster with the 30 Nos even with a barrel thats 2" shorter than the 30 SM.

And the g7 of .402 is holding up well? Can you mag feed?

Yes the bc is matching up out to 1200 yards.
One thing I will say is they seem to pressure up a bit faster than jacketed bullets in my barrel.
I'm sending the 220 lrht at 3000 with 2 more grains of H1000 than the 205, of course that's the only powder I've tried, accuracy is so freaking good I haven't even thought about trying anything else.

Here's a few bullets I recovered from saturated clay loam soil.
The one on the left was shot at 1000 yards and weighs 190 grains, the other was at 200 yards and weighs 156.
Bullet length is 1.825, I load to 3.715 so mag feeding is no issue since I can go to 3.85 ish

 

[Schw15]

Right on
My 6.5 is a 7.5 twist so unfortunately I can't shoot the 135.
How far along are you with your build? I had a 30 SM for a bit but hated fire forming for the relatively marginal velocity increase so I sold it and built the 30 Nosler throated out for 230 bergers.
I'm actually slightly faster with the 30 Nos even with a barrel thats 2" shorter than the 30 SM.

Yes the bc is matching up out to 1200 yards.
One thing I will say is they seem to pressure up a bit faster than jacketed bullets in my barrel.
I'm sending the 220 lrht at 3000 with 2 more grains of H1000 than the 205, of course that's the only powder I've tried, accuracy is so freaking good I haven't even thought about trying anything else.

Here's a few bullets I recovered from saturated clay loam soil.
The one on the left was shot at 1000 yards and weighs 190 grains, the other was at 200 yards and weighs 156.
Bullet length is 1.825, I load to 3.715 so mag feeding is no issue since I can go to 3.85 ish
View attachment 7627795View attachment 7627796

That looks pretty impressive. Very tempting bullet to try. Yes i read that about them pressuring up faster but people still got good speeds. Did you get any freebore?

 

[Bangin]

Right on
My 6.5 is a 7.5 twist so unfortunately I can't shoot the 135.
How far along are you with your build? I had a 30 SM for a bit but hated fire forming for the relatively marginal velocity increase so I sold it and built the 30 Nosler throated out for 230 bergers.
I'm actually slightly faster with the 30 Nos even with a barrel thats 2" shorter than the 30 SM.

darn. That’s disappointing to hear about the 30SM. Have not got the barrel yet. Bought the reamer and dies. Might have to change plans. I was hoping to get those 205s to 3,000 and I would be happy. I know a guy with his 22” 300 prc with suppressor gets the 230 Atips going at 2925, so I was hoping more for the SM. What kind of velocity were you getting with the SM? I knew there wouldn’t be a big gain.

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

darn. That’s disappointing to hear about the 30SM. Have not got the barrel yet. Bought the reamer and dies. Might have to change plans. I was hoping to get those 205s to 3,000 and I would be happy. I know a guy with his 22” 300 prc with suppressor gets the 230 Atips going at 2925, so I was hoping more for the SM. What kind of velocity were you getting with the SM? I knew there wouldn’t be a big gain.

I was shooting 215s around 3025 with a 26" barrel using H1000, the standard 300 prc would do 2975 so its only a 50 fps increase from what I saw. There was only a 1 grain h20 capacity gain after fireformimg with ADG brass, really not worth it in my opinion..
The crazy high numbers that Rich posts are with N570 and they're gonna wreck your brass in a few firings for sure!
Now that Peterson is making 30 Nosler brass its a tough one to beat, I love the 35 degree shoulder.

That looks pretty impressive. Very tempting bullet to try. Yes i read that about them pressuring up faster but people still got good speeds. Did you get any freebore?

I'm loading them. 040 off the lands

 

[Bangin]

I was shooting 215s around 3025 with a 26" barrel using H1000, the standard 300 prc would do 2975 so its only a 50 fps increase from what I saw. There was only a 1 grain h20 capacity gain after fireformimg with ADG brass, really not worth it in my opinion..
The crazy high numbers that Rich posts are with N570 and they're gonna wreck your brass in a few firings for sure!
Now that Peterson is making 30 Nosler brass its a tough one to beat, I love the 35 degree shoulder.

I planned on using n570. I will say I have used adg brass in a 28 nosler and a 6.5prc and have been very disappointed. Loose primer pockets in both after 2 firings. Nosler for the 28 and hornady 6.5prc were much better. Couldn’t get to the same velocity and didn’t hold up well. I ordered lapua 300 prc brass for the SM. If I’m not happy with velocity I might send the barrel to defensive edge for some +p action.

 

[Schw15]

I planned on using n570. I will say I have used adg brass in a 28 nosler and a 6.5prc and have been very disappointed. Loose primer pockets in both after 2 firings. Nosler for the 28 and hornady 6.5prc were much better. Couldn’t get to the same velocity and didn’t hold up well. I ordered lapua 300 prc brass for the SM. If I’m not happy with velocity I might send the barrel to defensive edge for some +p action.

I believe sherman numbers are a little inflated but small batch of 1 with a max. Adg brass has been great for me in most cals a few issues in some cals.

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

I planned on using n570. I will say I have used adg brass in a 28 nosler and a 6.5prc and have been very disappointed. Loose primer pockets in both after 2 firings. Nosler for the 28 and hornady 6.5prc were much better. Couldn’t get to the same velocity and didn’t hold up well. I ordered lapua 300 prc brass for the SM. If I’m not happy with velocity I might send the barrel to defensive edge for some +p action.

I can tell you that the Peterson brass I'm using for my 30 nos has super tough primer pockets.
I put some ejector marks in a few test cases looking for pressure, reloaded them hot over and over, and it was still hard seating a primer.
Lapua will be awesome for the 300 prc and that alone might make the 30 SM worth it

 

[Bangin]

I can tell you that the Peterson brass I'm using for my 30 nos has super tough primer pockets.
I put some ejector marks in a few test cases looking for pressure, reloaded them hot over and over, and it was still hard seating a primer.
Lapua will be awesome for the 300 prc and that alone might make the 30 SM worth it.

Peterson brass is good! I ended up using it when I still had my 28 nosler. No problems at all.

 

[Ks_Coyote]

I've been looking at getting some Cayuga's or some Barnes 190 LRX's for a 300 WSM elk gun.

Those PVA's look real appealing!

 

[Schw15]

I've been looking at getting some Cayuga's or some Barnes 190 LRX's for a 300 WSM elk gun.

Those PVA's look real appealing!

I had great results with the 151 7mm. My buddy has the 210 in 30 sherman but hasnt tested. He said they seated really long with his throat.

 

[Ks_Coyote]

I had great results with the 151 7mm. My buddy has the 210 in 30 sherman but hasnt tested. He said they seated really long with his throat.

I might now be able to use a short action if I have to seat them super far like the Seneca's I've used.

 

[Schw15]

I might now be able to use a short action if I have to seat them super far like the Seneca's I've used.

Which ones have you used?

 

[Ks_Coyote]

Which ones have you used?

No Cayugas yet. But the 6mm 100 Senecas I've used. Had to seat em out pretty far

 

[Xtremegunnr]

How was the bc on the 170?

#67
For the 170 grain .284, I did some testing at 3200 FPS. At 600 and 1100 they were landing right on the waterline with a .770 g1 plugged in. I’m just above sea level

 

[Graywolf.260]

I’m loading 122s to magazine length (~2.93”) in my .260 rem TRG. This is a 500 m three shot group, I’ve had a 5 shot group less than 1/2 moa at 1000 yds. Hopefully I can give a game performance report in a few months.

 

[Schw15]

I’m loading 122s to magazine length (~2.93”) in my .260 rem TRG. This is a 500 m three shot group, I’ve had a 5 shot group less than 1/2 moa at 1000 yds. Hopefully I can give a game performance report in a few months.

Performance is great on these bullets.

 

[st1650]

Thinking about trying these on a 7SAW Type 2. Seems like the 151 like a bit of a jump which would be perfect for my 2.88 coal limit.

Now why use theses instead of something like the Barnes LRX if they don’t expand like the Barnes ?

 

[Schw15]

Thinking about trying these on a 7SAW Type 2. Seems like the 151 like a bit of a jump which would be perfect for my 2.88 coal limit.

Now why use theses instead of something like the Barnes LRX if they don’t expand like the Barnes ?

Never used Barnes but from my understanding Barnes is made from a alloy copper that is harder I think and more speed to open up. The pva and even hammers are softer copper and open up with lower speeds. I had my pva open on elk ribs not sure Barnes would from stories I've heard

 

[st1650]

Never used Barnes but from my understanding Barnes is made from a alloy copper that is harder I think and more speed to open up. The pva and even hammers are softer copper and open up with lower speeds. I had my pva open on elk ribs not sure Barnes would from stories I've heard

So the PVA Cayuga will open up ? Why is PVA saying that terminal performance is achieved by tumbling ?

 

[Schw15]

So the PVA Cayuga will open up ? Why is PVA saying that terminal performance is achieved by tumbling ?

They know more than I do but there is articles about the bullets performing. For me the 3 animals that were shot with the 151 entrance hole then massive damage and big exits. They seem to be in line with a threw in threw. I've shot them from 200 yards to 472. 2 deer dropped and 1 elk ran 30 yards with poor shot to far behind

 

[coldboremiracle]

So the PVA Cayuga will open up ? Why is PVA saying that terminal performance is achieved by tumbling ?

I have never been able to recover one, so I cant say. Josh and I have joked that I'm gonna have to shoot an elk at 500+ with a 6mm in order for one to finally stop inside the animal. My 6GT blew right through a buck at 680 yards, and my 6.5 blew through an elk at 500, would have loved to recover them.

 

[st1650]

I have never been able to recover one, so I cant say. Josh and I have joked that I'm gonna have to shoot an elk at 500+ with a 6mm in order for one to finally stop inside the animal. My 6GT blew right through a buck at 680 yards, and my 6.5 blew through an elk at 500, would have loved to recover them.

Cool, I'll try the 151 on my 7SAW. I should be able to run them around 2750 fps. I also think that the fact that they seem to like the jump my coal with my 2.88in coal hawkins flush magazine.

 

[Schw15]

Cool, I'll try the 151 on my 7SAW. I should be able to run them around 2750 fps. I also think that the fact that they seem to like the jump my coal with my 2.88in coal hawkins flush magazine.

Somewhere I posted pics and explained performance on one of the pva bullet threads

 

[Anb618]

Cool, I'll try the 151 on my 7SAW. I should be able to run them around 2750 fps. I also think that the fact that they seem to like the jump my coal with my 2.88in coal hawkins flush magazine.

Saw your post in the 7SAW thread too.

What is your barrel length? I’ve got the 151 at 2760fps with Varget out of a 20” barrel. That said, I’m running close to the top end of reasonable pressure in my barrel. 2800-2800fps should be a cakewalk with a 24” barrel.

 

[st1650]

Saw your post in the 7SAW thread too.

What is your barrel length? I’ve got the 151 at 2760fps with Varget out of a 20” barrel. That said, I’m running close to the top end of reasonable pressure in my barrel. 2800-2800fps should be a cakewalk with a 24” barrel.

My smith is getting the reamer next week but I’m thinking 22in with a small 1 port brake since I hunt with ear pro. I want something light and compact since I already have plenty of 26in heavy rifles and my hunting range will be no more than 550 yards and the S&B 3-12 klassik only gets me enough elevation to 550-600 anyways.

What’s your load/coal ? If you don’t mind sharing. I was thinking to start at 40 and stop at 41.5

 

[Anb618]

My smith is getting the reamer next week but I’m thinking 22in with a small 1 port brake since I hunt with ear pro. I want something light and compact since I already have plenty of 26in heavy rifles and my hunting range will be no more than 550 yards and the S&B 3-12 klassik only gets me enough elevation to 550-600 anyways.

What’s your load/coal ? If you don’t mind sharing. I was thinking to start at 40 and stop at 41.5

Post #297 in the 7SAW thread shows my powder charge load work up. I thought I did, but apparently I never posted my OAL testing.

Clayton from WTO suggested a starting load of 41gr Varget and said he expected my max load would be between 43.5-44gr. My load development showed the man knew what he was talking about (not that I doubted it). I settled on 43.5gr with very minor pressure signs, no sticky bolt lift. I’m using binderless AICS mags, and started testing at the maximum length I could reliably achieve feeding for all 5 dummy rounds in a mag, 2.945”. This was well inside the Type II chamber’s BTO OAL for the 151’s.
I finished with an OAL test and decided on 2.935” as my final measurement. OAL determination was based mostly on cold bore consistency, this being 100% a hunting rifle. I found the 151 to be somewhat finicky in cold bore performance in my barrel; except at my final OAL and the two OAL groups on either side of it where it was the same POA/POI in all three with each test group, so I picked the middle OAL to give myself a buffer.

 

[st1650]

Post #297 in the 7SAW thread shows my powder charge load work up. I thought I did, but apparently I never posted my OAL testing.

Clayton from WTO suggested a starting load of 41gr Varget and said he expected my max load would be between 43.5-44gr. My load development showed the man knew what he was talking about (not that I doubted it). I settled on 43.5gr with very minor pressure signs, no sticky bolt lift. I’m using binderless AICS mags, and started testing at the maximum length I could reliably achieve feeding for all 5 dummy rounds in a mag, 2.945”. This was well inside the Type II chamber’s BTO OAL for the 151’s.
I finished with an OAL test and decided on 2.935” as my final measurement. OAL determination was based mostly on cold bore consistency, this being 100% a hunting rifle. I found the 151 to be somewhat finicky in cold bore performance in my barrel; except at my final OAL and the two OAL groups on either side of it where it was the same POA/POI in all three with each test group, so I picked the middle OAL to give myself a buffer.

I might end up running the 5 rounds binderless in lieu of the 4 rounds Hawkins flush mag. Appreciate the info

 

[coldboremiracle]

Somewhere I posted pics and explained performance on one of the pva bullet threads

I'd love to see that.

 

[Schw15]

I'd love to see that.

I will look for it and pictures I might still have them.

 

[Schw15]

Here are deer. I never did take pictures of my bull because it was dark then had to get him packed out because of heat (mid November 4th season colorado 10,500 feet 55 degrees) but the bull was shot at 372 he went to run and hit him in back ribs ran 30 or so yards in timber and died. I found liver parts in the pelvis and the damage was insane on the inside. Poor shot and did crazy damage. No meat loss to speak of. The deer dropped in there tracks 28 nosler 151 3228.

 

[st1650]

Here are deer. I never did take pictures of my bull because it was dark then had to get him packed out because of heat (mid November 4th season colorado 10,500 feet 55 degrees) but the bull was shot at 372 he went to run and hit him in back ribs ran 30 or so yards in timber and died. I found liver parts in the pelvis and the damage was insane on the inside. Poor shot and did crazy damage. No meat loss to speak of. The deer dropped in there tracks 28 nosler 151 3228.

Is the reported BC on the 151s pretty accurate ? Seems pretty high

 

[Schw15]

I think they said .310 g7 and I used .305 verified to 860 yards dead on. I haven't shot any since 2020 I sold all the extras I had and was going to try the 170 then sold them as well and was going to try a different bullet just to compare but never drew a tag last year. Going threw the rest like hammer bullets and then thought berger but to scared. I will be sticking with the 151 or maybe 170 but now in a 7mm-300 win mag. I'm waiting to see if I draw anything before I buy and test in new barrel.

 

[Xtremegunnr]

The Bc Josh posts for all of the bullets I have tried shoes true to 1200 yards. There will be some variability based on where you live, what twist barrel, velocity, etc, but should be close

 

[st1650]

Just an update, I ran my 151 at 2820 FPS with varget at 2.875in which fits the Hawkins mags and it grouped great. Seems like these are pretty forgiving for the jump, ended up with a 1/2 moa group on the ladder. I'll load another 10 to verify. Still pretty cool that these 151s can keep up balistically with the 162 ELD-M up to 900 yards or so and they look pretty impressive on game. Now if only Manners could deliver my LRH

 

[coldboremiracle]

Just an update, I ran my 151 at 2820 FPS with varget at 2.875in which fits the Hawkins mags and it grouped great. Seems like these are pretty forgiving for the jump, ended up with a 1/2 moa group on the ladder. I'll load another 10 to verify. Still pretty cool that these 151s can keep up balistically with the 162 ELD-M up to 900 yards or so and they look pretty impressive on game. Now if only Manners could deliver my LRH

Yes, they are VERY forgiving on jump, perhaps the best feature when it comes to loading them.

My experience using Josh's posted BC's have lined up perfectly to 1400 yds.

 

[coldboremiracle]

I forgot to post this here, I shot this young cow with the 151 Cayuga from my 7SAUM, from around 250 IIRC.

 

[Carlos0311B4]

Anyone trying them this year?

I’ll try the TUI’s from Fortis this year or I might try to load some of these up at a biddies place.

 

[coldboremiracle]

Anyone trying them this year?

This is from last season:

Great Basin Bucks: Hunting Pronghorn Antelope

Hunting pronghorn antelope in the dry desert of the Great basin proves to be an adventurous and extremely fun hunt

coldboremiracle.com

 

[Carlos0311B4]

This is from last season:

Great Basin Bucks: Hunting Pronghorn Antelope

Hunting pronghorn antelope in the dry desert of the Great basin proves to be an adventurous and extremely fun hunt

coldboremiracle.com

Read almost all of your articles. I think you’re one of the only ones that has any info on these.

 

[Schw15]

Read almost all of your articles. I think you’re one of the only ones that has any info on these.

I used then a few years ago they are great bullets. Not one issue with them that I seen.

 

[coldboremiracle]

Read almost all of your articles. I think you’re one of the only ones that has any info on these.

I dont think I posted this one here, has some very relevant info on this subject, as well more Cayuga data. I am very curious to ya'lls opinions on the theories and questions posed:

Bullet Penetration and Tumbling

A discussion on what happens when bullets hit living targets

coldboremiracle.com