Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and Auto Trickler

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Baron85XSergeant
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Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/07/2017

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I just sold my chargemaster after picking up a fx120i and auto trickler. Before i sold the chargemaster I did a few tests. First was an accuracy test. I threw 20 charges Of varget with chargemaster set at 40 gn. I then measured each charge on my fx120i. I found the chargemaster was pretty inconsistent, atleast to me. The lowest charge thrown was 39.92gn and the heaviest was 40.08. All of those showed 40gn on the chargemaster. I had 1 overthrow that the chargemaster showed was 40.02 and the fx showed 40.14.

Both scales were allowed approximetly 30 min to warm up, both were plugged into the same outlet on the same bench with no flourecent lights around. The chargemaster has been reprogrammed, and using the insert that the forum member makes here. Both were also calibrated with the exact same check weights.

As far as time goes I tested by loading 2 batches of 50 6.5x47 lapua.
I believe my load was 40.2 gn of IMR 4451 ( at work and load data is at home) i was able to load all 50 rounds including seating bullets in 23 minutes. With the A&D it took me 29 minutes. This was also my second time using the auto trickler and took me a few tries to find the right scoop and get the unit adjusted properly so not exactly a fair test but it is what it is. My technique with the chargemaster is throw a charge and seat the bullet while the next charge is being thrown. I'm usually waiting for the chargemaster to finish. With the A&D I throw a charge, dump powder, set pan back on scale, move funnel to next case while scale settles, use Lyman powder scoops to dump bulk charge into pan, a few seconds later dump charge and repeat. It is increadable quick and varied mostly .02-.04 grains with s couple over charges I dumped back. With the way I was doing it I had to charge all cases then come back and seat bullets. I have since refined my technique some by slowing down the speed on the auto trickler which has done 2 things for me. First, it has made it more consistent. Second, it has allowed me to seat a bullet while it is finishing up a charge. I have not timed my new technique but I'm pretty sure I'm around 15 minutes per 50 cases.

I upgraded not due to accuracy problems with the chargemaster, even though it seemed I would have an occasional flyer, I upgraded for speed. I have very little free time and would rather be shooting than loading. I usually had a SD of mid teens. So far I am very happy with my new set up and with some more practice feel it will be much faster than my chargemaster setup

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ZiaHunterX50 MONTHS
Premium Member
Gunny Sergeant
Rating: 3.3/5 this site
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/07/2017

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Ran a similar test a while ago checking the CM 1500 with a Sartorius Entris 64. Both scales were calibrated with test weights prior to the test. I will leave conclusion up to the reader. Results are as follows:

Chargemaster 1500 Accuracy Test
Test Charge 42.0 Gr. H4350
Measured on Sartorius ENTRIS 64-1S
Sample	Weight		Results
1	42.066		Mean Weight	41.981
2	42.034		Minimum Weight	41.886
3	42.046		Maximum Weight	42.066
4	42.042		Spread	0.180
5	42.008		Standard Deviation	0.050025593
6	41.954		95% Confidence Level	0.02192428
7	42.030		Median	41.987
8	41.956		Mode	41.954
9	41.886
10	41.996
11	41.994
12	42.006
13	41.930
14	41.954
15	41.944
16	41.912
17	41.928
18	41.980
19	42.026
20	41.924

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gunsnjeepsXFirst Sergeant
Rating: 3.2/5 this site
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/07/2017

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I think RCBS states +/- .1 grain accuracy.

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Baron85XSergeant
Rating: 3.1/5 this site
492 posts this site
Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/07/2017

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Ziahunter, thanks for posting your test. What was your real world results at the range? Do you have before and after chrono data? Better groups at distance?

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nexusfireXFirst Sergeant
Rating: 2.6/5 this site
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/08/2017

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Tag

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SheldonN

XFirst Sergeant
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/08/2017

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Thanks guys for sharing, helpful info.

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ZiaHunterX50 MONTHS
Premium Member
Gunny Sergeant
Rating: 3.3/5 this site
876 posts this site
Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/08/2017 Last edited 01/08/2017 by ZiaHunter

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Baron85 wrote:
Ziahunter, thanks for posting your test. What was your real world results at the range? Do you have before and after chrono data? Better groups at distance?​

I was able to to obtain sub 10 SD's with with larger capacity cases with the CM 1500. Shooting steel at longer distances out to a 1000 yards was not an issue but did have more vertical dispersion as compared to weighing charges on the Entris 64. Entris weighs to a .001 grains and will weigh accurately within one kernel of powder. Average kernel weight for H4350 is approximately .023 grains. With good case prep Entris will consistently produce sub 3 SD's with very low ES. For most rifles the CM1500 will keep you within the node. Shooting F Class would be a different story.

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padom

XFirst Sergeant
Rating: 3.8/5 this site
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/08/2017
(1 vote)

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Yes, the CH has +/- 0.1g accuracy so your tests show the CH's accuracy is within spec.

As long as your performaning proper losd development picking a charge weight in the center of your node 0.1-0.2g +/- isnt going to change anythint downrange. Thats the whole point of OCW load development.

All my loads for my rifles have repeated 0.5moa or better accuracy and single digit SD's all dropped on 2 Chargemasters...

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ZiaHunterX50 MONTHS
Premium Member
Gunny Sergeant
Rating: 3.3/5 this site
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/08/2017 Last edited 01/08/2017 by ZiaHunter

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Just a note when doing the test on the CM 1500. The unit had a straw inserted into the tube and quarters placed under the front feet. No modifications were made to the programming.

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Aimsmall55XFirst Sergeant
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/13/2017

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Here's what I did... I simply bought an extra pan to terre onto the A&D FX 120 i. I run three charge masters and when the charge master is done throwing, I simply use a omega power trickler to add the remaining weight as I go .1 grains below my target weight. Works FAST and gives me single digit Es and Sd.

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mijp5XFirst Sergeant
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Re: Chargemaster vs A&D fx120i and auto trickler. Test with
01/14/2017

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The guy who made the auto trickler wrote an excellent essay on range precision vs charge precision. It really hits home. If the goal of charging with this method vs the CM is speed, then go for it. However, if you think it will make you shoot better, you should reconsider.