http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=hY0w1c-gf18#
seems as though the proof is in the puddin....one shot one kill DRT.
seems as though the proof is in the puddin....one shot one kill DRT.
Hunting & Fishing check it out ethic patrol......
- Thread starter Killswitch Engage
- Start date
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
i was thinking the dead elk but you may require other things like a dug out bullet with wound channel pics or something.
i was thinking the dead elk but you may require other things like a dug out bullet with wound channel pics or something.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
Greybull Precision.......anyone who builds custom rifles and uses youtube as an advertising firm....amounts to being a tool.
I wish the video would show the entire setup, that way you can see the backup shooter. I don't have that much faith in a .243 on elk at long ranges. Elk are some pretty tough S.O.B.'s. I've seen 'em walk a few yards after a shot from an 06 through the heart and lungs. So to watch a .243 dunk an elk at that range is a little hard to believe. And the fact that I didn't see her pull the trigger or that shot wasn't louder(since the camera was right behind the shooter) leads me to think it's a sales gimmic. There's probably some other guy posted up about 50 yards away with a .300 doin' the dirty work.
Greybull Precision.......anyone who builds custom rifles and uses youtube as an advertising firm....amounts to being a tool.
I wish the video would show the entire setup, that way you can see the backup shooter. I don't have that much faith in a .243 on elk at long ranges. Elk are some pretty tough S.O.B.'s. I've seen 'em walk a few yards after a shot from an 06 through the heart and lungs. So to watch a .243 dunk an elk at that range is a little hard to believe. And the fact that I didn't see her pull the trigger or that shot wasn't louder(since the camera was right behind the shooter) leads me to think it's a sales gimmic. There's probably some other guy posted up about 50 yards away with a .300 doin' the dirty work.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 40gr Yote Pill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Greybull Precision.......anyone who builds custom rifles and uses youtube as an advertising firm....amounts to being a tool.
I wish the video would show the entire setup, that way you can see the backup shooter. I don't have that much faith in a .243 on elk at long ranges. Elk are some pretty tough S.O.B.'s. I've seen 'em walk a few yards after a shot from an 06 through the heart and lungs. So to watch a .243 dunk an elk at that range is a little hard to believe. And the fact that I didn't see her pull the trigger or that shot wasn't louder(since the camera was right behind the shooter) leads me to think it's a sales gimmic. There's probably some other guy posted up about 50 yards away with a .300 doin' the dirty work. </div></div>
Okay, first off YOUTUBE is an amazing way to get your name out. It's silly to think anyone would not use this as a sales tool.
2nd you can see the bullet trace come arching in and smacking the Elk.
3rd sounds like you're being a lil sexist about the whole thing. Like you don't think a girl can work the trigger.
I'm not saying I'm all for greybull, Although I do enjoy the videos. Your reply just makes me think of this.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 40gr Yote Pill</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Greybull Precision.......anyone who builds custom rifles and uses youtube as an advertising firm....amounts to being a tool.
I wish the video would show the entire setup, that way you can see the backup shooter. I don't have that much faith in a .243 on elk at long ranges. Elk are some pretty tough S.O.B.'s. I've seen 'em walk a few yards after a shot from an 06 through the heart and lungs. So to watch a .243 dunk an elk at that range is a little hard to believe. And the fact that I didn't see her pull the trigger or that shot wasn't louder(since the camera was right behind the shooter) leads me to think it's a sales gimmic. There's probably some other guy posted up about 50 yards away with a .300 doin' the dirty work. </div></div>
Okay, first off YOUTUBE is an amazing way to get your name out. It's silly to think anyone would not use this as a sales tool.
2nd you can see the bullet trace come arching in and smacking the Elk.
3rd sounds like you're being a lil sexist about the whole thing. Like you don't think a girl can work the trigger.
I'm not saying I'm all for greybull, Although I do enjoy the videos. Your reply just makes me think of this.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
Not a huge fan of Burns. Honesty and some questionable shots he bragged upon have stuck in my crawl a bit.
Not a huge fan of Burns. Honesty and some questionable shots he bragged upon have stuck in my crawl a bit.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
I happen to know some of the guys featured in a few of the older Best of the West videos before the "restructuring" so-to-speak of the Best of the West bunch. John Burns has plenty of attitude to go around, but it's a pretty safe bet the scenario went down just as depicted.
Berger "hunting bullets" are nothing more than their old thin jacket match bullets. They penetrate a little way then go off like a grenade. I shot 4 elk with 168 Berger VLDs out of a 7mm Rem Mag before deciding they aren't my cup of tea on elk. I switched to 160 Nosler Accubond bullets. I do use 140 VLD's in my 6.5-284 for deer and speed goats. Just my experience and personal decision, and guys who use Bergers on the big stuff are more than welcome to knock themselves out.
As we all know, with the right gear, a 688 yard shot on a broadside cow elk is no big deal if you have your dope right. But a .243 Winchester is too light for elk at any range, period. Again, that is just my opinion. I had this same conversation with the guys at the Best of the West (not Greybull Precision) and they told me they have shot several elk with a .243 and 105 VLD's but none of those shots have been aired. Yeah, I know the 105 grainer is heavy for caliber and has a decent sectional density , but still...
As far as ethics, that is a personal decision. If a person is going to shoot light for the game calibers and they will do the work required to recover a cripple, then I suppose that is better than crippling an animal with a flinch inducing ear-ger-splitten-louden-boomer off of the hood of a pickup then just driving away as the animal disappears into the sunset with a pinwheeling leg.
I happen to know some of the guys featured in a few of the older Best of the West videos before the "restructuring" so-to-speak of the Best of the West bunch. John Burns has plenty of attitude to go around, but it's a pretty safe bet the scenario went down just as depicted.
Berger "hunting bullets" are nothing more than their old thin jacket match bullets. They penetrate a little way then go off like a grenade. I shot 4 elk with 168 Berger VLDs out of a 7mm Rem Mag before deciding they aren't my cup of tea on elk. I switched to 160 Nosler Accubond bullets. I do use 140 VLD's in my 6.5-284 for deer and speed goats. Just my experience and personal decision, and guys who use Bergers on the big stuff are more than welcome to knock themselves out.
As we all know, with the right gear, a 688 yard shot on a broadside cow elk is no big deal if you have your dope right. But a .243 Winchester is too light for elk at any range, period. Again, that is just my opinion. I had this same conversation with the guys at the Best of the West (not Greybull Precision) and they told me they have shot several elk with a .243 and 105 VLD's but none of those shots have been aired. Yeah, I know the 105 grainer is heavy for caliber and has a decent sectional density , but still...
As far as ethics, that is a personal decision. If a person is going to shoot light for the game calibers and they will do the work required to recover a cripple, then I suppose that is better than crippling an animal with a flinch inducing ear-ger-splitten-louden-boomer off of the hood of a pickup then just driving away as the animal disappears into the sunset with a pinwheeling leg.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
Burns is arrogant and rubs some people the wrong way including myself.
If you can put a 105grain bullet in the right location it will kill and elk.
Those of you that say it can't be done are wrong. Those that say you should shoot something else bigger, well for you that is great and maybe YOU should. My wife thinks a 243 kicks too much. Some women just can't take much of a pop to the shoulder. If she can shoot the 243 well then more power to her.
Burns is arrogant and rubs some people the wrong way including myself.
If you can put a 105grain bullet in the right location it will kill and elk.
Those of you that say it can't be done are wrong. Those that say you should shoot something else bigger, well for you that is great and maybe YOU should. My wife thinks a 243 kicks too much. Some women just can't take much of a pop to the shoulder. If she can shoot the 243 well then more power to her.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Akeny</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As far as ethics, that is a personal decision. If a person is going to shoot light for the game calibers and they will do the work required to recover a cripple, then I suppose that is better than crippling an animal with a flinch inducing ear-ger-splitten-louden-boomer off of the hood of a pickup then just driving away as the animal disappears into the sunset with a pinwheeling leg.
</div></div>
^^^^^ I agree!
I was driving through Meeteetse Wy last summer, I called and talked to John about stopping by and maybe getting a look at his place, rifles, ect. He was a bit strange, he said he didn't want anyone seeing his place because of proprietary stuff he didn't want seen. Which left me wondering; what is Greybull doing that GAP and others aren't?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Akeny</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As far as ethics, that is a personal decision. If a person is going to shoot light for the game calibers and they will do the work required to recover a cripple, then I suppose that is better than crippling an animal with a flinch inducing ear-ger-splitten-louden-boomer off of the hood of a pickup then just driving away as the animal disappears into the sunset with a pinwheeling leg.
</div></div>
^^^^^ I agree!
I was driving through Meeteetse Wy last summer, I called and talked to John about stopping by and maybe getting a look at his place, rifles, ect. He was a bit strange, he said he didn't want anyone seeing his place because of proprietary stuff he didn't want seen. Which left me wondering; what is Greybull doing that GAP and others aren't?
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: coldboremiracle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I was driving through Greybull Wy last summer, I called and talked to John about stopping by and maybe getting a look at his place, rifles, ect. He was a bit strange, he said he didn't want anyone seeing his place because of proprietary stuff he didn't want seen. Which left me wondering; what is Greybull doing that GAP and others aren't? </div></div>
Greybull? I thought he lived in Meeteetse. Maybe he moved.
LOL.. He's doing nothing. How many smiths selling top dollar rifles don't let you see their set-up? You should have your doors wide the hell open to anyone spending that kinda coin with you. He claims to be a smith but ask him how many rifles he's built personally. The guy is pretty out there. Can he shoot. Yeah he can shoot. Well, matter of fact.
I was in Harrisburg once when he was talking to one of the forefathers of 1K br, 1K Br smithing and long range hunting. He baffled everyone with his song and dance and BS. We all left his booth scratching our heads wondering how people can actually buy this guys stuff.
Over the years he's aired skyline shots and questionable situations from a long way out. I just don't have time for that stuff.
I enjoy long range hunting but have no time for arrogance and risk taking.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: coldboremiracle</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I was driving through Greybull Wy last summer, I called and talked to John about stopping by and maybe getting a look at his place, rifles, ect. He was a bit strange, he said he didn't want anyone seeing his place because of proprietary stuff he didn't want seen. Which left me wondering; what is Greybull doing that GAP and others aren't? </div></div>
Greybull? I thought he lived in Meeteetse. Maybe he moved.
LOL.. He's doing nothing. How many smiths selling top dollar rifles don't let you see their set-up? You should have your doors wide the hell open to anyone spending that kinda coin with you. He claims to be a smith but ask him how many rifles he's built personally. The guy is pretty out there. Can he shoot. Yeah he can shoot. Well, matter of fact.
I was in Harrisburg once when he was talking to one of the forefathers of 1K br, 1K Br smithing and long range hunting. He baffled everyone with his song and dance and BS. We all left his booth scratching our heads wondering how people can actually buy this guys stuff.
Over the years he's aired skyline shots and questionable situations from a long way out. I just don't have time for that stuff.
I enjoy long range hunting but have no time for arrogance and risk taking.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cocadori</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Greybull? I thought he lived in Meeteetse. Maybe he moved.
</div></div>
Nope your right, I mis-remembered the facts. It was Meeteetse.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cocadori</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Greybull? I thought he lived in Meeteetse. Maybe he moved.
</div></div>
Nope your right, I mis-remembered the facts. It was Meeteetse.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done.
personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Killswitch engage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done. </div></div>
+1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Killswitch engage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done. </div></div>
+1
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
I revised this post because of another comment on here that makes an unbelievable amount of sense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Killswitch engage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done. </div></div>
This is a great perspective. I guess I am just anti Greybull Precision because John is an arrogant fuck and his vids amount to careless shooting techniques with questionable results. That's all. I have no problem with a woman pullin' the trigger, as someone else accused me of. Makes no difference to me what gender the shooter is. Sorry if my original reply lead anyone to believe I was being sexist.
I revised this post because of another comment on here that makes an unbelievable amount of sense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Killswitch engage</div><div class="ubbcode-body">personally, i have no clue who any of these clowns are you guys are talkin about and really don't care. i also could care less if the rifle was an off the shelf remmy or a gap or whatever flavor you like. the point is a great shot was made by that women with a caliber many say shouldn't be used. i could care less if there was ten guys in the background with a stand by follow up shot....who gives a shit and what does it matter. she got it done. </div></div>
This is a great perspective. I guess I am just anti Greybull Precision because John is an arrogant fuck and his vids amount to careless shooting techniques with questionable results. That's all. I have no problem with a woman pullin' the trigger, as someone else accused me of. Makes no difference to me what gender the shooter is. Sorry if my original reply lead anyone to believe I was being sexist.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">who gives a shit and what does it matter</div></div> I agree, to a point. Around here the people who give a shit are guys like game wardens, hunter safety instructors, and so forth who see the results of the "Yeah you too can shoot your critter at 1000 yards" message that is being spewed all over the place.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">who gives a shit and what does it matter</div></div> I agree, to a point. Around here the people who give a shit are guys like game wardens, hunter safety instructors, and so forth who see the results of the "Yeah you too can shoot your critter at 1000 yards" message that is being spewed all over the place.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
TOF is about .87 seconds for that shot. Seems like the bullet arrives a little fast in the vid but maybe it's the time it takes the sound to get to the camera.
TOF is about .87 seconds for that shot. Seems like the bullet arrives a little fast in the vid but maybe it's the time it takes the sound to get to the camera.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ankeny</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">who gives a shit and what does it matter</div></div> I agree, to a point. Around here the people who give a shit are guys like game wardens, hunter safety instructors, and so forth who see the results of the "Yeah you too can shoot your critter at 1000 yards" message that is being spewed all over the place. </div></div>
exactly, instead the message should be don't take a shot outside of your comfort zone....Make damned sure you can make a clean kill before your finger even starts toward that trigger....They should be stressing ethics and practice more than, this is how you do it now go forth and wound animals....
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ankeny</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">who gives a shit and what does it matter</div></div> I agree, to a point. Around here the people who give a shit are guys like game wardens, hunter safety instructors, and so forth who see the results of the "Yeah you too can shoot your critter at 1000 yards" message that is being spewed all over the place. </div></div>
exactly, instead the message should be don't take a shot outside of your comfort zone....Make damned sure you can make a clean kill before your finger even starts toward that trigger....They should be stressing ethics and practice more than, this is how you do it now go forth and wound animals....
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
I keep seeing these types of vid's and discussions that go along the line of "pick your caliber" is just fine because they can make the shot. I've been shooting/hunting for thirty years and still follow the same rule my father taught me. It went along the line of more common sense and a whole lot less arrogance. Nobody regardless of their background can always make the shot on a living mobile target. There are just too many factors. The right choice of rounds helps mitigate some of them, regardless .243 although a great round is not an elk caliber.
I keep seeing these types of vid's and discussions that go along the line of "pick your caliber" is just fine because they can make the shot. I've been shooting/hunting for thirty years and still follow the same rule my father taught me. It went along the line of more common sense and a whole lot less arrogance. Nobody regardless of their background can always make the shot on a living mobile target. There are just too many factors. The right choice of rounds helps mitigate some of them, regardless .243 although a great round is not an elk caliber.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
Although I'd not choose it for my "Elk Rifle" it is the minimum requirement in the state the video is shot in.
Although I'd not choose it for my "Elk Rifle" it is the minimum requirement in the state the video is shot in.
Re: check it out ethic patrol......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broadway</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I keep seeing these types of vid's and discussions that go along the line of "pick your caliber" is just fine because they can make the shot. I've been shooting/hunting for thirty years and still follow the same rule my father taught me. It went along the line of more common sense and a whole lot less arrogance. Nobody regardless of their background can always make the shot on a living mobile target. There are just too many factors. The right choice of rounds helps mitigate some of them, regardless .243 although a great round is not an elk caliber. </div></div>
i agree with this right here. within reason, i believe your caliber of choice should include the very real possibility that the shot is a little off perfection. a larger caliber than the absolute minimum you can get away with helps to mitigate the consequences of a slight error.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Broadway</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I keep seeing these types of vid's and discussions that go along the line of "pick your caliber" is just fine because they can make the shot. I've been shooting/hunting for thirty years and still follow the same rule my father taught me. It went along the line of more common sense and a whole lot less arrogance. Nobody regardless of their background can always make the shot on a living mobile target. There are just too many factors. The right choice of rounds helps mitigate some of them, regardless .243 although a great round is not an elk caliber. </div></div>
i agree with this right here. within reason, i believe your caliber of choice should include the very real possibility that the shot is a little off perfection. a larger caliber than the absolute minimum you can get away with helps to mitigate the consequences of a slight error.
